Any of you guys working on a libreboot-thinkpad type project for the PSP/Vita for a libre console...

That's worse than a Vita since it's fucking single core.

Kill yourself then

PSP is "low end" now but still a great device.

pretty gross, the pi is so bad you would probably have worse performance than the original PSP

The raspberry pi contains binary blobs and non free firmware

How does that make it bad? Just fuck of newfag. ThinkPad are very low-end (especially the ones we use here) but they're still great devices that use because they respect muh freedums.

Hey it's not nice to sage a thread for no reason
I'll give you a free triforce if you appoligise
‌>▲

your aids

No, why would anyone be working on that? BIOS and the hardware probably requires so much proprietary shit to function it is probably impossible. And anyone who would even have the knowledge to do so would probably not be concerned with playing vidya.

Maybe look up the Pyra/Pandora, that's the closest thing to a "libre" handheld "gaming" device you are going to get, even though I'd guess the BIOS also is proprietary.

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Why not? It's a handheld console. It's a modular, sexy piece of older technology which the FLOSS and FOSS community love. And we haven't got any >>>/lv/ consoles yet do we?

What's wrong with the Pi except muh freedums?

The Vita is just underrated and overrhated as the Wii U. both great consoles that didn't deserve what they got

Well, the hardware itself is super proprietary and all the software relies on it heavily, that is why a libre BIOS is not really feasible, if it even was possible. Consoles back then were more than glorified PCs like the PS4 and Xbone, they were designed to capitalize on the hardware to render things in specific ways. Sure you could do fun things like run GNU/Linux on a PS3, but it had no access to the RSX GPU, for example. If you were to get anything to run on something that didn't have a stock BIOS, then it would probably be super limited.

Maybe I'm wrong and there are BIOS mods out there, but considering how long the PSP and Vita and such have been out, with regards to the BIOS, a libre BIOS probably won't happen unless it has already. It's was a piece of work to get a libre BIOS on a crusty 10-year-old laptop like a ThinkPad, a console would be much harder. Excluding the people who really want to have fun hacking, homebrewers and console modders usually stay contemporary, and after while when the modding environment reaches a point where there isn't really any more work to be done on a console. Homebrew software for the PSP and 3DS and such are almost always free software though, so that's a nice thing.

Have fun with the PSP and stuff the way it is, and don't worry about the BIOS. As you know it's a super versatile console. For a portable catch-all emulation bitch that can also be used as a PC, maybe take a look at the GPD Win or Pocket. Or maybe as Switch modding advances there'd be a reliable way to run a GNU/Linux distro on it.

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Everyone here is spamming Raspberry Pi as the best option yet no one has suggested a Libre Raspberry Pi? OP check out libre.computer/

I'm sick of everybody recommend gay SJWpis for everything. I think they miss the point. Is there anything stupider than using some armshit board to emulate a classic computer for example? I would just use an emulator on my desktop if I wanted that.

A meme. The SoCs they use need proprietary GPU drivers or custom manufacturer kernels to work well.

This. You can get a used PC that's even cheaper than many SoCs and will be tons better for emulation and able to emulate many more systems. ARM is awful for this.

Sjw? Haven't been to interested In pi's lately but what if they do to fuck up?

I have an old Thinkpad, Mr. pretendo oldfag. It's not great because of the shit processor, the 1GB RAM, the slow WLan, the unnecessary BlueTooth, the case which looks way more durable than it is but because of it's solid trackpad, keyboard, and screen (1400x1050).
What I'm saying is that it's not worth the effort. You would be better off making a new one or connecting a controller to some tablet or phone where you'd get more software because of more users.
However I'm not a fan of those in general. If I would wanted something portable, why not a laptop? There you could boot whatever you want because it has a BIOS/UEFI.

This.

I even called it a memepi.
I just used it as lowest common denominator reference to shot that the hardware is really outdated and not that great anymore and was always tailored to just the main purpose. See

*show

The PSP is handheld, a laptop is just portable

on topic of handhelds, what ever happened to the Pandora? was it any good? it claimed to run n64 emulation and had a linux desktop pre-installed. i remember reading about it years ago on wikipedia and then heard nothing about it afterwards.

I think the main problem was it contained non-free binary blobs, and it had more delays then the librem 5. And it's keyboard just made it a pocket pc and not a handheld console. Although if you made a DE/Repository center you could make a console OS

There actually is an attempt to port Linux to the Vita. But it's basically a novelty. Realistically, you own one to play its games (for genres like VNs and dungeon crawlers, and generally Japanese games, it's the handheld to have though) and optionally a bit of emulation with physical controls.

github.com/xerpi/vita-linux-loader

I would say it did, but it was in no way thanks to Sony, if anything they were sabotaging its potential. What really makes them is their modding scene.

The system at its core is ARM-based, but after getting burned with the PSP and PS3, they clearly took those as harsh lessons. So the Vita actually has a really impressive security system. It was not possible to pirate games on it for almost 4 years. It didn't get a decent dumping standard for a couple more.

Now though, the system is pretty thoroughly 0wned and if anything, the hackers fixed pretty much every shitty aspect of the system. The proprietary memory cards can be replaced with SD card adapters. Game copying is trivial and even downloads from PSN à la freeShop on 3DS. Game modding is possible and there are some notable ones like the Neptunia Re;translations and various de-censor mods. Overclocking is possible which really helps with certain lousily ported games. You can also play the majority of PSP and some PS1 games which otherwise you're limited to re-buying a handful of them digitally. Someone even figured out how to stream video through the USB port so you can do clean video (and audio through the headphone jack) capture. And of course the usual homebrew stuff. I would in no circumstance recommend the system without jailbreaking it. You lose so much.

For reference, 35c3 is a talk to watch related to the most recent exploits against its F00D security co-processor. There's a couple more than that though.

Oh god, the fucking OpenPandora. That was my introduction and lesson never to fall for crowdfunding since that's basically what it was. I pre-ordered to several hundred dollars, and got nothing.

What is the point of a libre console when all the games for it are proprietary. I deleted my N64 collection recently has it was the last proprietary software I had left. Yes, its just a ROM, but its software and has unavailable source. Find better games to play. Consoles restrict what you can do with your computer. But to answer your question, libreboot doesnt work on amy console hardware. The only libre SBCs are the ones based on iMX6 SoC and Rock3328 I think and a few others. If you need gpu acceleration, you should look at iMX6 and etanaviv. Pi requires proprietary operating system to boot the GPU and then Linux. Its non-free and the Pi is too expensive for the hardware anyways, Rock64 is better value.
Try a libreboot desktop or try to give up your ROMs and childhood toys and contribute to a better future by getting involved in a libre project.

this guy said it better than me anyways. the people that fuck with hardware and have an interest in liberating users are not wasting time fucking with consoles and videogames. playstations usually have proprietary unpublished bios required anyways to work. emulation is so heavy on cpu too. give it up user.

Oh and since I missed OP's question a bit, in terms of boot process, you can on 3.60 and 3.65 get start-up execution through HENkaku Ensō but it's not particularly used for custom OSes. It purely subverts parts of the main Vita OS such as for disabling things like signature checking, and allowing homebrew to access kernel privileges. Also a plug-in framework for doing various things like break DRM or video streaming. It's pretty cool.

Tangentally, the 3DS framework? ntrboot on all models (requires compatible DS flash card and a magnet) takes execution immediately, and a signature checking fault in the bootROM means it loads Sighax extremely early, even before things like the OTP registers (for deriving keys) are disabled. Again, there aren't generally custom OSes, you'd usually chain-load Luma3DS to do all the standard CFW stuff to the main 3DS OS, but it is also used to load certain programs at boot such as for dumping cartridges.

Except for all of the people utterly gutting their DRM systems you mean, and some of the work done for these consoles has been pretty impressive.

I play a lot of crappy games and enjoy them but there are actually quality console games. It's not all grey-brown military shooters and diversity shitfests. Additionally, consoles have two major advantages of sorts. One, I'm segregating proprietary code from my main laptop which is running Libreboot and outside of Intel microcode updates (stability makes it necessary sadly) is running purely FOSS. Two is even with DRM, it's homogenized and once broken, is broken for all games. The 3DS and Vita communities also tend towards being the nicest people and also heavily FOSS. All of the really important stuff is. It's only tosh like old 3DS flash cards that are proprietary and those are totally irrelevant now.

PC gaming, not only are the majority of modern games borderline malware, they're also rife with people inserting actual malware such as Bitcoin miners. One of my side projects at the moment has been trying to start a culture of SHA256 hashing of PC game installers in the /v/ share threads. Because console dumping communities are often amazing. If you see NoPayStation it has a very thorough list of PSN game download links, hashes, filesize, ZRIF (fake license to decrypt and play) and more. The culture of verification and databasing is strong. Similar stories for things like No-Intro or Redump. PC? Sweet fuck all, and sweet fuck all people even interested in doing it.

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like i said, the games have nonfree source code. youre running unethical software when you could be supporting ethical alternatives.

So use the FOSS alternatives for the things that exist and keep the ones without a FOSS alternative in a jail unto someone you create one.

If people gave up on backwards compatibility and vidya everyone could be running busybox+muslc on hardened gentoo with grsecurity and a sanely configured for security browser with a desktop based on wayland without and dbus/gdbus/systemdick malware/crapcode. Which would kill 99% of malware even if you downloaded that bitcoin miner and ran it yourself as root since GRSEC's RBAC stops shit like that in its tracks unless you flip a bunch of flags and add it to a whitelist, which is a huge pain in the ass for an idiot just wanting to web browse on a ISO they downloaded.

That's contradicting. If you just wanted to web browse you wouldn't download shit and run it as root.

It makes perfect sense, you are just too much of a retard to see the threat profile/model for the idiot that is downloading such a ISO containing such tools. Instead of say, compiling it themselves or writing the software out by hand from paper they printed onto known safe/secure hardware, it just depends. In the above scenario the user knows they are insecure and knows of tools/ISO containing OS's that claim to be secure. But doesn't understand the intricate details like disabling SMP on certain architectures or such shit for security's sake.

Also I neglected to mention the bitcoin miner could just be javascript run in the background of the browser.

There's a few more console benefits actually now I think about it.
- Vastly smaller install base than PC and mobile, and even smaller percentage of those that jailbreak them, and no important information on them so the incentive to put malware on them is virtually nil.
- For Vita specifically, the current game copying standard, ironically, turns its DRM system into a validation process. Without rePatch you cannot modify the game's executable or data, and regular games do not have kernel privileges anyway. Also given people usually install games through PSN downloading like freeShop on 3DS, it's much less often you'll run into game copies that solely brick you. This happened with older dump standards, and is in theory possible with game mods, I think, it may actually not allow kernel access, but I haven't seen any such examples anyway since very few mods even do executable modification. It's usually data-only.

PC's utter lack of standards, and general distrust of Windows, means that my one laptop with it is kept off the Internet in its entirety. Generally it only runs GOG copies of games too. The majority of my PC games though are FOSS ones like Doom on my main laptop.

Then you create a game engine for the new OS and most Libre games should port to the LibrePSP, because a project like that should be a big well known one

I bought the 4GB ram model of the pandora, I think. It broke within a month by a drop of like 2 feet. The reason was bullshit too, as the LR buttons are even shittier than the DS' and so it dislodged the battery and fucked up the internals somehow. I never bothered to get it fixed and sold it for parts. It was nice, but during 2011 i could've gotten an xperia play or other decent android device for 200 and played most emulators just fine.

As another user pointed out, there's a project for linux on the vita that largely will be for non vidya purposes, and the CFW for vita known as enso which to my knowledge replaces the bootloader too.
If you want a portable libre console, your best bet is one of those community sponsored android handhelds. However, if you wish to have a handheld computing experience, I can't really help you there outside of reccomending some abandoned PDA type computers or a smartphone.

As it's tangentally related to trust issues that consoles do a lot better at to PC, just saying, the list of GOG installer hashes just exploded thanks to some random user. It started at 60-something and he put another 360-ish, and replicated 3 of the existing hashes. Whether that becomes a trend, I certainly hope so. In any case here in case anyone finds it useful. Might for people who run things in DOSBox or with source ports, there are a few Linux installers in there.

gitgud.io/Blank/stv/raw/m/GOG.sha256

No it's Linux, but it's just not something I see as actually useful. Again, it's a system you buy for playing its games, like with the 3DS. Similarly I had one of the old Archos 5 media player tablets, and at some point the makers opened it up to alternative OSes. So I had a bit of a run with one of the main distros (Ångström) and while it was neat and I could use it for music, it was not really the way.

Also I'll keep it brief but the primary Vita jailbreaking guide is vita.hacks.guide, and generally the exploits are as follows:
- HENkaku (3.60 browser exploit, also offline one with the official E-mail app)
- H-Encore (3.65 and 3.68 application exploit)
- Ensō (installable startup entrypoint for 3.60 and 3.65)
There is a 3.69 and 3.70 one demonstrated but not disclosed since the system is approaching end-of-life and it would be reckless to do so when there's still a trickle of games.

Also your story just reinforces my general annoyance at how OpenPandora went. It really is proto-kickstarter bullshit.

It doesn't "contain" them, it loads blobs, and it hasn't needed the blobs in years if you're content to forgo the GPU and Wifi. People have been running blobless OpenBSD for years on the Pi now.

gogdb doesn't provide hashes?

Thanks for the link, but even though it does have installer hashes in a few cases, it seems a lot of them are for the installed file tree, which doesn't help when the installer is the thing that may require admin privilege and could be tampered with.

bump

My friend has a game shop and happened to have a PSP with some games.
I played with it just couple hours ago, i have only one thing to say, its horribly outdated hardware wise.
The graphics are just awful, there is no future in it.

chop your balls off and choke yourself trying to swallow them you impotent faggot

Cool your jets because he's not that wrong. Most 3D stuff looks bad on PSP solely because of its low internal resolution, and it's totally valid to say that even the Vita is a weak platform in terms of power. The only reason either get a pass is for its games, and for having real controls unlike a phone.

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Would be nice if GOG start signing them like they do for windows binaries.
They could then publish the key on their website.

The resolution isn't too great, but it's fine for the screen on handheld devices like that. Most games developed for the system took that into account and actually look pretty decent, though higher resolution still provides a noticeable upgrade to the graphical fidelity of the game. The real issue is that the system apparently lacks a MMU, so you'll have to learn the PSP os instead of developing for stripped down linux or whatever.

The DS had no MMU and there was a linux port.
Does it really not have a MMU though? I don't remember that being the case.

ucLinux, not the linux kernel proper if I remember correctly.
Everything I've ever read on the topic seems to indicate that.
linux-mips.org/wiki/PSP

The kernel had to be modified to run on weird hardware but it's still linux more or less.

Newfig
󠛡 󠛡 ▲
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The Pi wasn't made for gaming. It was meant to be a useful little machine to use in projects.
It runs everything like shit.

That was done intentionally by Sony to prevent people from making games for GNU/Linux. They didn't want to miss out on that sweet money they got from developers.

OtherOS was a tax evasion (or something else evasion) scheme by sony. It's only natural they gimp it in some way.

Don't forget they took it out of later revisions as well as later firmware versions. There was a snit about them for that slimy behaviour. Also while PS3 started life with some downright retarded security faults, notably no RNG used for cryptography keys, they tightened it up significantly after that humiliation and it's fairly solid. PS4 has generally been hard. Xbone, probably survives out of lack of interest.

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PS4 security is pretty faulty too, there were webkit and freebsd bugs. One vita hacker also said it's far worse than the vita's.
The scene for the PS4 is just shitty.
xbox security has been pretty good even since the 360 days (most hacks are hardware hacks) so maybe it's actually secure.

One bit of irony I will point out with Vita recently. Remember the PS3 RNG issue? One of the master keys on Vita was just a string of 0xA. Worse than that though is that even though they fixed that in a firmware update, they forgot to change any of the keys it was protecting so it was effectively meaningless.

Also the 360 was basically Microsoft's learning after the utter trash that was the original XBOX and definitely impressive for some of the hardware mitigations. The XBOX talk is one of my favourite console hacking talks if only because two of the critical faults date back to hardware hack-arounds from decades prior. Specifically, memory address wrap-around, and the A20 gate.

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The key was in bootrom so no updating can change that.
I haven't kept up with vita stuff for a pretty long while though, mine is just sitting in my drawer these days.

I didn't think that was in ROM. This is some video stream where the guy is breaking the 3.70 key that changed.

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programs aren't even well optimized and if we stopped caring about the dull mindset "better hardware in 20xx will support this bloated program implementation"
it did nothing wrong and is TOO old but would you look at its performance?
even your modern hardware can't emulate PSP iso properly and needs to take up 2GB RAM and sacrifice stability to be just as fast (lol that audio tearing).
the "better hardware" is just a meme, so many wasted potential every year and it just promotes writing shitly bloated programs and friendliness to proprietary optimizations that force devs to pay for what their hardware could already do and it's still fucking bloated everywhere.

how do you know that though
they're not open source so it's not like you can analyze it
what if they're simply more advanced thus more intensive

Oh trust me, it's bleeding obvious with some Vita games, especially ones ported from full consoles. vsh/oclockvita and LOLIcon are very popular for this reason because they can force the system to max performance scaling, the last can allow a bit further overclocking to the CPU too.

its not about the hardware not being good enough. its that the programmers do not know how to make a working emulator for the proprietary systems

where do they even hide the decryption key so well that someone with physical access to the device cant find it?

Tiny ROM inside the SoC/CPU
Arrays of eFuses inside the SoC/CPU
You need some fancy electron microscope to read them out physically.

For F00D specifically watch 35C3 - Viva la Vita Vida.

But as an couple of other examples, the Game Boy boot ROM was embedded in the CPU, and once it had done its work, it executes some instruction to shut access off to it. The workaround was to trigger a clock glitch at that moment to make it skip the instruction, and then it was possible to read the boot ROM out.

In the case of the XBOX, I just recommend watching the talk "Deconstructing The Xbox Security System" it's good for a laugh to watch it in full, but for the main point skip to the 34:04 which deals with the A20 hack. The original method of dumping its boot ROM was fancy reading data off a high speed bus.

Also, an interesting but somewhat related case happened with the SNES, specifically with the custom processors on some game cartridges. They somehow attracted the attention of Christopher Tarnovsky who is primarily known for breaking TV set-top boxes, but also did a lot for MAME. More importantly, is one of the few with the capability to do so since the necessary tools are in the seven figures. Ultimately he dumped internal ROMs for a bunch of the DSP-type coprocessors.

archive.fo/wsl8

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Lets see, a soldering iron, flash rom tool, buspirate, and the FOSS for it and a logic analyzer cost like less then 500 euros if you include the osciliscope and the one time usage of a electron miscroscope for the picture. What the fuck are you talking about? Maybe 7 figures in yaun or whatever the venezulians are using.

Not a ROM chip. A ROM that is embedded into something like a processor to control how it works, and one that cannot actually be read out electronically. At a certain level de-capping becomes inaccessible at the hobbyist level (it has been done for certain NES chips though), and requires specialist tools. Scanning electron microscopes are expensive but I was possibly off a bit with the "seven figures" it's only certain types that are.

Why don't try dumping the protected bootrom of something remotely modern then?

Addendum: It should be said that isn't 100% true either. As in the article about the SNES coprocessors the C4 actually has a coding exploit to dump its ROM, and the ST018 has a dedicated instruction to do it, which is definitely unusual since usually the ROM is usually something to keep secret. Another fun one was how the GBA BIOS was dumped.

mgba.io/2017/06/30/cracking-gba-bios/

Also while only tangentally related to the topic, there are other blog posts there with a lot of really interesting information about weird emulation edge cases, and hardware quirks. Perhaps the best ones relate to DMA caching, and a ridiculous bug in MMBN4 that even tripped up Nintendo with the DS. "debugging" tag.

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Holy crap you are larping so hard. The faggot you quoted as having done the reversing gives a step by step guide for idiots using winblows if you have any ability to search. Have some spoon feeding though faggot.

Those techniques do not apply to the DSP-x chips. For a start, decapping was necessary to even know what it was. But again, the embedded ROM is not accessible except within the chip itself, nor was there some external way of tricking it to leak it. It basically came down to reading the ROM manually since it's a mask ROM.

The last time I've heard of anyone decapping a chip is back in 33c3 with that canadian dude who had to decap a chip inside a set top box to extract the key. It was doable with a optical microscope since it's ancient technology from the 90s IIRC.
Modern chip decapping is probably too expensive to afford for hobbyists. I remember when the 3DS wasn't hacked, there were discussions of raising fund for a decap, which was quoted at $400 per layer from some lab. It was a 45nm chip from 2011 though idk if anyone ever figured out how many layers there were. I wonder how much it would cost for modern chips.

Lucky they didn't because the 3DS boot ROM has also been dumped, supposedly. The hackers didn't release the ROM, just a checksum. The talk for that is pretty dry but it's towards the end of "33c3 Nintendo Hacking Talk 2016 - GAME OVER! 3DS & WiiU" 37:17 I'll also point out that the initial 3DS boot process is a total trash fire security-wise, it has 3 critical flaws.

This was back in 2011 or so, long before 3DS hacking gained traction. It was never realized because the guy managing the money ran away with it.
Also funny how that so-called trashfire boot process took a good half a decade before it actually started to hit them directly. This always seems to be the case for early boot flaws, only exception I could think of was the switch. No idea why.
People always seem to make jokes about dumb bugs in some parts of the system but never think of the work and other parts of the system that had to be circumvented to reach those bugs.

It's true that there were lots of mitigations in place. The fact handhelds are at the point of ring protection is testament to that. But it's not enough to paper over that all 3DS models are irrevocably compromised and the responsible faults are stupid. They even failed to patch arm9loaderhax (early 2016) out of the N2DS even though they should have been able to, and while they were at it, audit their code. Also while the system wasn't quite as thoroughly owned until the last couple of years, flash cards and game piracy became possible around 2 years into the 3DS, I have an old Gateway collecting dust actually, that was responsible for bricking my first system, but ntrhax actually allowed me to unbrick it recently.

Vita's security is by all means much more impressive and thought out and it held out for over 4 years until the release of HENkaku. About another year passed before a clean game pirating standard that worked well, and it's only been within the last month that white whales such as downgrading became a reality but even then it's only somewhat useful.

I'm way outta my league in the topics of exploitation. I would like to add, to the user who brought up the Xbone, it is normally supported to sideload applications to the Xbone with developer mode. This has made it so one can run all the shit you want and then switch back to retail mode. It's fine, and likely the reason there's no Xbone exploits being attempted. I'm not entirely sure that's why, but it could be a part of it.

jet's don't melt steal beems

lol but what if the aluminium hull was disintegrated into molecules on impact and converted to thermite and then it burned really hot?

OK genius, try and explain this then, if you're so smart:
If you replace the W’s in “when where and what” with T’s, you get the answer to every question.

Okay you got me there, that's not an easy one like 9/11.

What we know is that the letter 'T' looks like the T-cross of the gnostics.
We also know that gnostics are satanists and therefore freemasons and templars have nothing to do with them.
Therefore the only logical conclusion here is that conspiracy theorists corrupted our language back in the day so that you could use this argument now to discredit my authority.

t. coincidence theorist

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I'm time traveling Tasmanian devil bitch

dymo

Fixed it for you.

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best insult ever recorded in the history of this earth

Now this is autism

Holy shit, it's already been 10 years?

The PSN cracking was 2011 and resulted in the service going dark for a couple of weeks. I pity the fools that rely on digital.

It'd be autistic if he actually bothered to typeset it correctly.

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10/10 quality thread

I believe you need to pay to unlock developer mode, and it blocks signed code so no piracy

...

I don't understand any of those words