Since the last thread hit it's bump limit (btw someone fucking archive that shit, it's hillarious), here is a new one. Here we will pick apart what the hell just happened.
Also fuck #FBPE wankers.
LeftyBritPol - Local Election Autopsy Edition
Grayson Morales
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Cameron Myers
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Camden Lewis
From what I get it was basically what happened in the general election but on a local level. Tory's doing well in the Midlands and gaining most of the UKIP vote Labour doing well cities in the south and London. They will be pretty pissed they haven't gained control of Wandswroth and places like that, but it was pretty unlikely anyway they could do anyway. As John said it was more important for Labour to get its percentage vote up than it was to gain seats as this puts it in a good position to win the seats at the general Election.
These elections are fucked though because Labour did really well in them last time and should have probably won the General election off the back of them in 2015 but lost badly. So Labour doesn't have much room to gain. As I type this they do have a net gain of 37 seats which is okay but should be better tbh.
I'm hoping this is a wake up call that they still have a serious problem with connecting to white working class in the Midlands and in the North East and hopefully they can get there act together and stop pleasing the London middle class. I would expect the Media will try and paint this as a Labour lost even though it looks like they will gain about 50 seats
John Johnson
I agree with this, I think one issue too is the once place they have gained t'nurth is Trafford: the most middle class region of Greater Manchester.
Something else Labour needs to look into is the towns, being a townie I have a few ideas, may even write something for Labourlist.
Xavier Stewart
Oh and one thing, I actually hope this gives the centrists enough balls to go ahead and split already.
Angel Moore
Good God the BBC laying on the so called anti-Semitism smears thick.
Literally zero talk about gains or losses and the seats themselves. When did this fucking channel turn into the Sun?
Kevin Clark
Any details on these ideas? The main problem is not their manifesto its how they are presenting it, They need to explain why Capitalism is making peoples and that they will change it. The leadership really needs to sit down and look at the locals and realise it cant be seen as a divided party anymore and do a re-selection process. This wouldn't end up kicking all Blairites out but would mean that they would have to start keeping the party line better or risk loosing their jobs.
James Ward
There is also this really annoying thing they do when they keep talking about marginal seats that "Labour needs to gain". They still haven't learnt from the snap election that seats which were marginal aren't marginal anymore; eg Nuneaton was traditional a marginal seat now its a safe Tory. Still they are kind of right that this suggests if there was a General election today there would only be a few gains by Labour. Then again there are still over 1000 wards to declare. If Labour gets a net gain of 100 seats then that would be pretty good news, anything less is meh
Ian Myers
Most interesting thing is that if this was a general, the lib dems would have 26 seats.
Adrian Ross
the lib-dems always do better in locals though. Tbh they still have failed to get anywhere near where they were in 2010 which will piss off the #FBPE wankers who were expecting massive lib-dem gains.
Lincoln Brown
The absolute state of the labour party.
Bentley Scott
Whats going to fuck up the Tory's is Brexit they wont be able to go as hard as the UKIP vote wants them too so I would expect the current 65/35 split Tory labour ukip vote will end up moving towards 50/50 by 2019
Adrian Gonzalez
Image description:
Possibly the worst vagina on the planet.
Kayden Fisher
At least voter ID will most likely get scrapped now
Parker Turner
Not a Brit, I'd really like to support Corbyn but the media in my country tells me he's an antisemite/hates Jews. Is this true? It already sounds suspicious to me.
Carson Lee
He hates Israel you fucking knocker.
Jace Long
Also the media seems to think a small group of Conservative Jews represent the whole Jewish population which is hurting Labour. However people learning about Jewdas is great
Eli James
This whole antisemitism clusterfuck first started because he opposed the censorship of some anti-capitalist painting, people claimed that it was antisemitic because one of the capitalists depicted in it was Jewish. People were demanding that he meet with a bunch of zionists to discuss how horrible it was and how antisemitism is supposedly prevalent in the Labour party because of him, only for them to get even more pissed off because he met with a left-wing, anti-zionist Jewish group instead.
Xavier Rivera
Well buses are a big thing: not just the buscards but the cocking things being any use in the first place. Self-employment is also a big thing (and remember artisanal production is not at odds with socialism). And finally making socialism in one town about communiterianism rather than 'muh taxes and spending': big problem with shutting pubs, how about we cooperativise them instead? Gonna write a labourlist thing on it.
(Ironies of ironies the lab party in my town did quite well).
James Martin
I'm completely illiterate about Britbong politics post 1815 so please be considered. I know he's anti-Israel, I just like to know on what basis they claim this
Gabriel Thomas
The media gave a huge amount of attention to a tiny protest by conservative Jews made up of about 30 people outside parliment.
Whereas the fact that the overwhelming majority of Jews within the Labour party support Corbyn goes overlooked.
Austin Perez
The few english people I know over the internet, hate Corby because he hates Israel, and that is basically the only reason they say that May is better, for fucks sake, why are brits like this?
Asher Wood
Ah okay, so it's basically philosemitism, saying that if you are against bankers you are against Jews? That's some stupid fucking narrative and actually reveals antisemitism in the people saying this, because nobody would equate Jews with capitalists unless you are already buying into antisemitic cliches.
Isaiah Edwards
Pubs are a big deal. I'm hoping Labour pushes more with their plan to integrate labour into local communities. Taking over dead pubs and making them more community driven/ border line community center would work. I think the Labour work in with the "Preston Model" where councils try and encourage local spending as well as only outsourcing to smaller local builders is an encouraging start in regaining working class towns. Hopefully momentum will have gained some councils and will shake up a few areas.
Eli Wilson
Corbyn is not an atnisemite, however there are pockets of anti semitism (divided between memeri tier muslims and those who believe conspiracy theorists). Problem is the labour party is so big it is hard to get rid of these wanks, so some of them get nommed to be cllrs and oh dear…
Austin Hill
Community centres or coops would have labour win most of the rural countryside, and it even fits with the citizen's bank idea. If we took it up we could win.
Momentum will never win in the countryside or towns for one reason, they are socially liberal.
Samuel Mitchell
Momentum do need to become more open to working class. I have seen a certain shift in stance on the Eu among young-lefties, going from strong remain support "your racist if you vote leave" to "the EU is bad and I want to leave it but it will probably go bad" If labour can make its self the Breixt party for the people it can win General elections
Jaxson Lopez
brits have brain cancer, they genuinely think showed how disgusted they were at racism in the uk by voting for the party that illegally deported black people
Thomas Gray
With this Aflie Evans shit, I am afraid to say that the neoliberal propaganda might be piercing through the leftist defence of the NHS, and we might lose it to private insurance companies in the future. I even see people blaming the doctors and Alder Hey for his death, when he clearly would never had have survived in anyone else's hands. And I'm sorry to be a utilitarian, but that baby's parents wasted a LOT of money keeping that useless sack of meat alive, plunging us even more into debt and corruption as the tories drain away the budget from the NHS, and situate it in defence in the war against Russia. I wouldnt be surprised if all of this controversy was manually levered by the corporate oligarchs.
I dont care about ONE baby, in the entire world, I don't exactly think that this is socialism's fault, MAYBE fate just doesnt always bend to our bourgeois attachment to sentiments like this, kids die all over the world everyday, the NHS actually kept him alive longer than nature intended for him to survive, so YOU'RE WELCOME you ungrateful twats, fuck off.
Xavier Wright
Aflie Evans shit is just a thing which happens once a year. The media jumps on the case of some kid dying in hospital with parents who feel like they know better than doctors. It got more attention than normal probably because the media want to try and move away from windrush
Caleb Walker
parents do know more than doctors since they have the legal right to refuse medical treatment if the children in their care cannot refuse for themselves
Jackson Lewis
The fact that it got so out of hand and caused so much damage is a problem. Labour need to sort out their spin team.
Jacob Clark
Nah Momentum should continue with their thing, what we need is a Middle English Momentum: perhaps coming from Blue Labour (like how Momentum came from the CLPD). Momentum works as an org in the Metropole and the cities for the reason that there you don't need to be "LOCAL", in a town like mine unless you are from our half of the county you will not know what is going on. Labour needs policies aimed at towns, a recruitment drive in them and a national network of town CLPs to exchange experiances, but Momentum brigading win't work.
Sebastian Ortiz
You're probably right, momentum is a good at getting young people into politics, especially at uni so hopefully when they leave they spread out and do some good. Looking at these results if it was a general election Labour and Torys will probably do the same. But Labour needs to win and win good if they have any chance of doing what they want to do, so they really do need to sort out the midlands UKIP vote
Brayden Powell
They need to learn some theory, read more, go on QT and sound like they have a cohesive plan, etc. It's about story telling, and the right are better at it they have a whole array of think tanks feeding them great sounding bullshit like the "househould theory" of govt spending
Angel Powell
Yeah there are loads are good up and coming MP's but they need to read more
Aiden Jones
Which is what I plan to address in the lablist article (if they take it), but yeah omentum is a good org but on't work in the shire towns and towns north of the Watford gap, something else is needed. There are towns labour controll that could be a perfect testing ground for this, if they only tried.
In other news, Heidi Alexander (a blairite remainer) is likely resigning, we may get another Momentum MP lads.
Adrian Bennett
I hope this is sarcastic
Joshua Cox
It isn't. Why should a doctor, the state, or the drug companies they represent force medical treatment upon someone?
Caleb Rivera
because the child is deemed incapable of giving consent you retarded nonce
Ayden Stewart
Don't cut yourself on that edge
Bentley Harris
my plan to fix london
purple: new train tunnels
red: new social housing
dark green: gulag and videoarcade
Caleb Brooks
It happens to chemo patients in America all the time because kids don't want to bankrupt their family. How is this a bad thing? Resources should go to people who aren't just going to die at 10 because of shit genes.
Jason Gutierrez
nothing new here
Camden Sanchez
Nice psychopathy you got there, bucko. No wonder you like capitalism.
Angel Evans
doctors shouldn't waste their time with things their parents have already given up on. They still have to be paid for every hour they work, their time should be used for the best result for society as a whole not edge cases.
Nolan Gonzalez
Here's my plan to fix it.
Ethan Gomez
Dylan Williams
You're not going to convince anyone here that you give a fuck about society.
Ryder Myers
One thing that is not being reported is that Labour did quite well in very rural reas: even winning a cllr in Witney (Cameron's old seat). There is something there too.
Nolan Hughes
If children want to die for the greater good, why stop them? If their parents don't give a shit why should anyone else.
Oliver Howard
Is reddit astroturfed???
Many people say something like "Momentum and corbyn are too far-left, I am usually hard-labour and consider self leftist but I vote libdem/tory this election".
I don't use reddit so often so maybe it's just how they talk there………..
Samuel Phillips
redditors consider idpol more important than economic issues or class. These are people who would gladly vote Conservative if May came out against Brexit.
Brayden Hernandez
Curtice predictions based on locals results:
Lab 283 (+21)
Con 280 (-38)
Lib Dem (+10)
Others 65 (+7)
Levi Russell
1. that has nothing to do with your assertion that parents know more than doctors, which is what I was replying to
2. yes, the state should force medical treatment on minors even when their parents refuse it, like a parent refusing care for their child's broken arm
Nathan Barnes
Thats better than what I was expecting.
Adam Diaz
I don't understand………..
Why are they voting for idpol exactly??? They say things like libdem are better and labour is bad, is this because they think the liberal center has "rational" policies in contrast to extremists???
Also how is the dead baby related to labour???
Cameron Lopez
the tories are astroturfing and reddit seems an obvious place so it wouldn't surprise me
Joshua Fisher
For starters stop writing like you're a 13 y/o girl, GCHQ may get ideas. Secondly they vote for idpol because in essence it's the easiest to grasp ideology along side standard conservatives (Not the party). In all to understand idpol you only have to look at the surface of a problem and only fix the surface whilst most of politics is based on economic theory, foreign affairs, and western philosophy. They say vote libdems because they're the only major party that is in the "Anti-Brexit" camp fully. Now the dead baby thing is just silly because in the mind of Tories and the tabloids anything bad related to the NHS was caused by/will be caused by Labour because it is a Labour institute, however whenever something great about the NHS comes out it's a British institute.
Elijah Myers
The dead baby "wouldn't have happened if the parents had free choice over treatment" to which the counterargument is that the law considers what is best for the kid, not the parent. This is big govbmunt (or socialism, as we all know) getting in the way of the rational free market you can definitely engage in when your kid's life hangs in the balance. This thread gets weaponised by the more ardent scumbags on the deregulation right, and is hepped up by American talk-radio loons and European Catholic traditionalists - often including the pope - to argue against the NHS existing.
Lincoln Baker
I wonder how much of this was remainer splitting? I'm Canadian and don't know the full story
Also Corbyn should just use this as an opportunity to rip the Brexit bandaid off at once
Alfie Evans connects to middle class parents because they project their own fears re: their kids onto the vegetable. People will do fucked up things to secure even a marginal advantage for their progeny and the corrupt media spun it wondrously
gov't should have just let them go to italy and pay out of pocket for their prayer hospital or whatever
Eli Bennett
I'd be behind this if social liberals wouldn't immediately try to hijack them and turn them into tranny rainbow play pens
Nathan Ward
Well one way to stop that is to link them with local churches.
:^)
Jeremiah Barnes
Just FYI, remember that the catholic church is technically America's largest private healthcare provider through all the insurance companies, hospitals, and clinics they own and operate. Government healthcare actually competes directly against their own business.
Landon Rivera
t. Jehovah's Witness
Alexander Powell
most JWs have money so they don't run into the problem of doctors recommending expensive treatments for their children that parents can't afford
Samuel Flores
Why do people even vote lib dems?
Kevin Hernandez
I've seen Brits who don't buy that, but the amount of Brits on shitty vapid social media who somehow think that Corbyn's labour is more antisemitic than the actual right-wing parties somehow is pretty astounding. While they were flipping out over this, neo-Nazis were rallying a few miles south of here. I want to shake some sense into the Brits - for fucks' sake. The people who used racism to push Brexit and the people who gleefully helped America destroy multiple 'barbarian' countries are teaming up to accuse the other guy of having a problem with bigotry. I thought Britain was supposed to be smarter than this.
Hudson Bell
They do tend to run into the problem of doctors recommending transfusions their religion commands them to refuse.
Liam Reyes
they're:
Brandon Myers
My boss is the only person I know who votes libdem. So I'm assuming people who are rich but more "liberal"
Brody Sullivan
I really hope that the Corbyn gang in Labour doesn't fall into idpol shit. I'm glad Labour haven't suffered, but depressing to see so many people still voting Tory or Lib Dem. I hope /ourguys/ can keep power in the party.
Honestly, people need to be reminded about Jewish terrorism in 1930s Palestine, seems like it's been wiped from the national consciousness
It was wrong of the courts to force him to die against the wishes of the parents, they should've let him go to Italy if they wanted it that much, what ultimately happened was senseless
This
I utterly despise Lib Dems, bunch of fucking pseudo-Tories who aren't brave enough to actually be a Tory
Lincoln Evans
My mates vote lib dem because they think the tories are shit for their internet laws but labour stupid because 'hurr durr magic money tree'.
Christopher Roberts
The neolibs won didn't they?
Caleb Hill
Nah most of the are the sons pof petit-boojies: lib dems makes perfect sense.
Robert Butler
Has anyone been reading the stuff the Progress lot have been shitting out. They're arguing that we need to be anti-Brexit even though its pandering to remainers which is stopping Labour from winning.
I hope the NEC gets around to kicking them out
Adrian Watson
corbyn is a cuck
Joshua Wright
Hes a Soc-Dem but thats ok
Sometimes treating the Symptoms is fine while you prepare to perform surgery to deal with the cause
Elijah Taylor
The real /ourguy is John McDonald who is a self proclaimed Marxist. To see much good out of his economic policy would need 2 successive labour governments though
Anthony Reyes
Yeah, it also seems Chuka is trying to make some powerplay right now, which is fucking stupid but w/e. I think the Blairites might fake some shit inquiry, everyone will tell them to fuck off then they maymsplit. This is going to happen since they just lost three allies: Woodcock is gonna get kicked for being a perv, Heidi Alexander is going to City Hall and Dan Javis (who isn't that blairite per se but is a good figurehead for them) is now mayor of South Yorkshire. Their reselections will see leftwingers come in, so Chuka and Jess Phillips are the only ones left. Chuka realises he either takes power now or they have to split now.
This post is correct, the next leader is not important as longmas McDonnell is still chancellor.
Brandon Rogers
twitter.com
twitter.com
twitter.com
"Ms Tweedy, the chickens are up to something…"
Eli Russell
Where are we on the scale
Evan Roberts
...
Gavin Johnson
"You asked for this", because we are asking for the Blairites to leave.
Henry Lewis
No, we're still at "you asked for this". The crash starts in October as companies report shit tier Q2s due to supply chain disruption caused by trade actions, and continues through the new year until next April when the losses are made plain and obvious to investors during tax season. This is when capitalists panic sell and the market goes from a slump to a nosedive.
Image very related, notice how the two drops occur in October and April - the end of Q2 and Q4 respectively.
Julian Morgan
Just fyi: remember that investors themselves drank the kool aid and are hoping beyond hope that they are somehow not affected by any of this and that Trump will reverse it or some other magical thinking. It will take quarterly earnings reports to shake them back into reality.
Jordan Reed
newstatesman.com
good and old article someone posted forever ago
that constituency is basically the lib-dem constituency now that students have largely fucked off.
on top of them there are some actually good reasons to vote or have voted lib dems
1. you're in a stupidly tory seat that will sooner float into the sea than go labour, so you vote tactically
2. pre-clegg they could kind of vaguely look more left wing than New Labour and were definitely better on civil liberties so you kind of get a pass if you voted lib-dem in 2001 or 2005
tbh it's unexpectedly progressive that the UK actually took the interests of the child into account and said "no, it's not going to work, if he can feel anything he's feeling pain, it's inhumane to drag this out." in such situations rather than just treating them as glorified pets of their parents like murray rothbard.
Aaron White
I voted for Labour because there was no other leftist alternative in my ward, but I live in a working-class constituency and the local Labour council (only two tories hold seats in it) is useless
I might vote for green party or or any lefitst party that decides to field a candidate next time because our current MP is a faggot
Lincoln Adams
Better yet join Labour and get that MP deselected
Jordan Jones
why would I waste my time in a socdem party?
Jaxon Sullivan
they give you a laminated card
Austin Ortiz
Tbh at-least on a local level we should push these people towards the greens… (the greens actually did alright these local elections because they took #FBPE voters and even made alliances with the lib dems, we could utilise that to create a friendly oppsition.
This: OR EVEN BETTER STILL join Momentum/establish a chapter to get rid of them.
Jordan Fisher
are there actually constiuencies outside of northern ireland with no labour? surely labour is big enough to stand a candidate in every possible seat
Gabriel Fisher
I mean I could try but the guy and his cronies are pretty much control the whole thing, his wife is head of local council
Ryan Sullivan
Because Labour has a lot of new left-wing people joining but they lack a lot of theory, So as socialistic we can try and educate them. Labour is the best bet at re building the left in Britain
.>>2513416 Yeah Momentum is even better
They do but its more places which Labour will never win but the lib-dems are close. North Cornwall is one example. However considering the shape of politics is changing a lot old safe seats are becoming new marginals
Jayden Baker
You would be suprised how willing people would be to join momentum when it says 'we are going to try to get this unpopular politician deselected'. Especially if your area is urban working class and the council is shit.
Btw we need to sort Sunderland the fuck out blow me.
No, but often the presence is tiny and FPTP sponsors two party marginals. Labour always stand a candidate in every GB constituency and never make alliances for Westerminster, which is sensical IMO.
Andrew Flores
The only down side about momentum is its more focus on internal party politics rather than the bigger picture. Once blairites have been purge Momentum needs to try and work on building community support for Labour and for socialism
Lincoln Jones
I think that is what is going to happen in Haringey now, we will see how that turnsout.
Bentley Foster
I thought the momentum bunch don't have control yet?
Brody Collins
Momentum is in control behind the scenes, and hopefully will be a drip feed of far leftism into labour