Right Wing Channels With An Actual Understanding of the Left

the problem is that their arguements are the strawmen and the human nature. that's what their beliefs are based on and that is the arguement and all it is. the right is based on group harmony and unity, which involves copying the beliefs of those around you without question, so the arguements involved are appeals to the same characteristics that got them sucked into the right in the first place.

plenty of older right-wing thinkers are former left-wing radicals.
The reverse is much more rare.

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who?

Are you the same orc raiders who made that stupid thread about matriarchy and crapposts in made by person who asks how to stop being racist.

If they are American odds are they were never left wing

Most “former left-wing radicals” turn out to be idiots who figure they were “left-wing radicals” because they used to vote for succdem Democrats or went to a protest once or maybe even attended a Students for a Democratic Society meeting. Maybe they even thought Che Guevara was cool once. I’m unaware of any of them who were ever anything more than liberals or actually read any theory.

Christopher and Peter Hitchens were both Trots before eventually becoming absolute retards. Insert your Trot joke here.

so nothing changed then?

Many right-wing intellectuals have a better understanding of Marxism than liberals.You can even find many fascists who agree with Marx on alienation, commodification, etc. You won't find them on YouTube though and certainly not on donkeybrained Zig Forums.

In Germany, there is a fascist intellectual movement trying to incorporate Marxist ideas into fascist ideology.
jungle.world/artikel/2018/40/gebrauchsfertige-theoriebausteine

Peter was only your average student activist 'radical' just in a trot party and not for all that long. He was never actually versed in marxism and he's still got more insight and familiarity into the actual left that any other right-wing commentator in spite of his 'blairites are the real radical communists' shtick before he went all religious and dismissed material reality as a stopgap to the kingdom of heaven.
Christopher seemed more serious although his leftism throughout as more 'anti-bad things' than anything to principled and he may be the only genuine example of a trot becoming a neocon, even though supposedly he remained anti-capitalist at the core to his death but who knows.

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I really, really love this image.

thanks, have the rest

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PJW looks like such a hysterical snot-nosed manlet bitch. Absolutely repulsive. Why did he think that becoming a talking head while looking like that is a good idea?

he knew his audience

Thank you.

He's a manlet but I honestly think he doesn't look that bad and most leftist YouTubers are hyper uglos

why are his fucking lips and nose so red
he looks like a tumblr drawing

I always thought he looks like a Dr. Who character.

that's just called being anglo

YOU FUKIN RACIST CUNTS BANNED ME AGAIN I FUCK ALL YOU CUNTS AYE

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all trots are neocons

I've read some stuff by Wolfgang Leonhard (relatively well-known in Germany as somebody who left the Eastern Block and wrote about that, often taught in schools) and others. And I never got the impression that they analysed Marx and found that wanting. Those stories are all starting with emotions, being very upset and sad about the world, blahblah, sometimes they are thirsty for a person in the movement, they get tugged along by their dick and/or history, they get upset by the cynicism of comrades around them (understandably); and then they get into a situation where they have the chance to play for the other team – and the pay is much better, and they take it, and then they write books giving advice to people they think must be sentimental dipshits like they used to be themselves.

Not really. That article is about some silly book by some micro-publisher. The rag you link to is a bunch of liberal idpol spastics who don't care about economics and class issues, and it's necessary to be ignorant of that to even entertain the idea that the AfD will shift to appeal to poor folks. Just look at the demographics of what the party is made of, then compare that to the NPD (which is now only 1/7 of the size of AfD). Germany's far right has shifted almost entirely to control by yuppie assholes.

I M A G I N E M Y C O C K

I'm sure there are right wing channels that have an understanding of the left. However every single one of them that does are grifters who are paid by TPUSA. I believe Blaire White had a video on the subject, but this was common sense before then.

No you weren't you dumb fuck

I'd bang PJW.

There is not a single YouTube channel that understands much of anything except the ones that upload academic lectures.

if they agreed with Marx on these issues, they wouldn't be right wingers.

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Christophers last words were supposedly "Capitalism…..downfall".
I actually didn't know about his Communist past until I read that.

No wonder Trotskyists turn into neocons, the shitty theory already sets you up.

Fuck off ☭TANKIE☭ retard Trotsky literally published pamphlets calling for the defense of the USSR against nazi germany and attempted to rally workers in Germany against Nazis

The bourgeoisie agree with Marx on most issues. They're rightwing because of their class interests, not because of ignorance.

Not all right-wingers belong to the bourgeoisie.

if you can find that, then I can find a fucking unicorn

oh wow, a pamphlet. that changes everything about how he literally worked with the Nazis to coup the USSR and gave Goebbels speeches to cause uprisings in addition to his followers working with the Japanese to conquer China.

i've been trying for an hour i can't think of any

What would a right-winger who understands leftism but for some reason stays a right-winger even sound like?

That's like a flat-earther who fully accepts scientific evidence for Earth not being flat but continues to state the contrary. So a deliberate liar or a very confused person who will eventually break either way.

He could believe that market economies are more economically efficient than planned economies, and believe that the greater economic efficiency is worth the exploitation.

That's a very easy question to answer: they're a beneficiary of capitalism and they're arguing for their continued prosperity. They could be thinking in the short-term but rationally it wouldn't matter to them if their descendants suffer, as they wouldn't be around to see it.

Many right-wingers on the internet are petty-booj so they DO benefit off the continued repression of the working class.

Would Socialism be achieved if Neoliberalism caused the Rate of Profit to reach zero and so money had no value?

So in this scenario you couldn't counter their arguments that capitalism is in their interests. You would have to expose their solipsism to the audience and have them form their own conclusions. Tough this is a very particular sphere of the internet, almost entirely comprised of suburban western white guys, so you'd probably get a lot of people agreeing with the guy.

Yeah but I'm kind of trying to specifically imagine a "honest" ideologue who understands leftism, doesn't outright lie about it to advance his own class interests, but still somehow remains right-wing…guess it is impossible.

I don't think money has no value if the rate of profit goes below zero, I don't think that's how it works

marx lowkey shilled for free trade because he saw it as a necessary evil to abolishing borders in the way he saw fit .

We need the means of production to exist in order to seize them

You don’t have to agree with leftism in order to understand it. For instance lots of liberals dispute the concept of exploitation by arguing in favour of the concept that market transactions are by definition mutually beneficial.

well that just proves they do not understand leftism because these two things lie in different dimensions?

What do you mean by honest ideologue? Someone being honest about their class interests doesn't negate them promoting capitalism.

There's an entire book (PDF attached) that deals with the strange case of Christopher Hitchens, I recommend it. His initial attraction to Marxism seems to have come from the grand explanatory power of the materialist conception of history, but his understanding was vulgar and stageist from the start (IE, celebrating the US conquest of native nations as a "progressive" impetus to the Capitalist stage of history). After the revolutionary fervor of 1968 started to fade out, a disappointed Hitchens, consciously or not, realized his writing talent could make him a lot more money in the Liberal than the Leftist press. He then shifted over to a Whig History view of capitalist triumphalism, with U.S. imperialism as its "revolutionary" actor.

Is this all Moscow Trials bullshit? I'm familiar with Trotsky and how things like his support for Ukrainian Self Determination, etc. might be misconstrued, but this is ridiculous

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STUFF THAT NEVER HAPPENED YOU ☭TANKIE☭ RETARD

Check yourself

marxists.org/history/usa/parties/cpusa/anti-trotsky/Trotsky the Traitor - Bittleman.pdf

orientalreview.org/2011/01/11/episode-6-leon-trotsky-father-of-german-nazism-v/

marxism.halkcephesi.net/Grover Furr/Furr tortsky japan.pdf

Goebbel's diary entries:

”Our clandestine radio transmitter from eastern Prussia to Russia is creating an enormous sensation. It operates in Trotsky’s name, and is causing Stalin plenty of trouble”

”Now we work with three clandestine radio stations in Russia: first Trotskyist, the second separatist, third Russian-nationalists, all criticise Stalinism. They are an example of cunning and subtlety.”
Inb4 muh propaganda:
After July 1941 Goebbels moved the volumes of his diary from his study into the vaults of the central Berlin Reichsbank due to the risk of air raids. From that point the rest of his diary was not written by his hand but dictated to someone who wrote it down and later typed it. It was no longer entirely personal and secret after that.

Yeah but just because Germany was funding Trot cells in the USSR to try to undermine Stalin does not mean that Trotsky Himself was complicit or supported it
and as a previous post pointed out he himself was vocal in defense of the USSR agains germany

I'm pretty sure that the Goebbels entries could just be saying that they operate by declaring themselves Trotskyist, not that they were vetted and approved of by Trotsky.

Tortsky was a political opportunist who switched between supporting and attacking on a regular basis. He is a hypocrite of the worst kind.
Regardless the diaries are not the only thing as I linked.

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NOT SURPRISED THAT A ☭TANKIE☭ REGURGITATES LIES THAT HAVE BEEN DEBUNKED ALREADY YET CONTINUE TO BE SPREAD BY SHITTY ☭TANKIE☭ BLOGS

YOU'LL NOTICE NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THE QUOTES CITES A SPECIFIC PAGE IN THE ACTUAL GOEBBEL'S DIARY. WHY? BECAUSE IT'S A FORGERY YOU DUMBFUCK.

Using b-ok.org I have access to the entire second half of Goebbel's Diary in English. Using babel.hathitrust.org I have access to his entire first half. Cntrl-f'd through both parts searching for the terms trotsky and Trotsky.

Here are the results: NO SUCH WORD FOUND IN EITHER PART OF HIS DIARY. GOEBBEL'S DIDN'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT TROTSKY.

tl;dr KILL YOURSELF ☭TANKIE☭ LIAR DUMBFUCK

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Yeah, Grover Furr is lying.
marxism.halkcephesi.net/Grover Furr/Furr tortsky japan.pdf

Also his followers aren't the best sort
rationalwiki.org/wiki/Lyndon_LaRouche
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyatt_Kaldenberg
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zbigniew_Brzezinski

this is why no one takes tanktards seriously

this is why the radical left is such a joke

I don't need a photo of polemicizing, as I've had that set of responses and rebukes posted as response to me, before. The sources you posted leave much to be desired, as well. The first is a American retelling of the state line towards the "Case of the Trotskyite-Zinovievite Terrorist Center" and the varying other late-30's trials of left-opposition.; the second is a massive contentious mess of accusations and suppositions; the third is Grover Furr - about whom I will not traduce, but to say that his academic honesty should be suspect when it comes to any earnest inquiry into the nature and theory of opposition groups in the Soviet Union.

There is a great deal to rebuke Trotsky for, choose worthwhile points of inquiry

There’s opportunism and then there’s opportunism. Switching from a Menshevik to a Bolshevik is one thing, but switching from a communist to a fascist is something else entirely.

Keep shrieking, just remember that while Mussolini was brutally repressing socialists, Trotsky calmly strolled its streets. Antonio Gramsci, a great Italian Marxist, described Trotsky as "the prostitute of Fascism"
Oh and the date of that little quote? April 22, 1938, check it, though i wouldn't be surprised that you "couldn't find it", just like Nazis can;t find evidence of the Holocaust.

sure, brilliant argument
Also They aren't his followers at all, He's a socialist, they're right wing, not to mention the Brezizinski is one of the principle slanderers of the USSR.
Larouche is a questionable figure, but not a stupid one.

Oh. My. God. Zig Forums has finally taken over Zig Forums.
Seriously I have not seen a single person outright debunk his literature with any coherent argument, only nigglings and nit-picks on small details.

Not really m8, I really dont get why people would find it that surprising, some Nazis were originally Communists.

Maybe you could elaborate what is deficient about Trotsky's theories instead of piling on baseless guilt-by-association attacks? The people you cherry picked aren't even that good. Brzezinski appears to have never been affiliated with leftism at all. If you want to play the apostate leftist game I have a fuckton more MLs I could pull out.

of fucking course

*dogmatist handwringing intensifies*
I didn't even slander your historian deity, only commented on his general tendencies.

Götz Kubitscheck might be a small publisher but he does have somewhat ideological influence among Germany's new right. He was one of the main forces for a new intellectual right-winger distinct from the NPD and for a rebranding of völkisch positions. I would say people like Höcke and Poggenburg are definitely influenced by him.
True, the leadership of the AfD is right-liberal (Meuthen, Weidel and Gauland being somewhere in between) but there is also a völkisch faction, especially in the east, who resent the cold liberalism of the party leadership, and want to push for economic left-wing positions (trade unions and welfare, for Germans only of course), and are currently using Gauland, who is somewhat ambigous about that, as a bridge to the party leadership. Remember that years ago, when Lucke was leading, nobody thought that the AfD is going to shift this much to the right, then he got ousted, and then even Petry and her husband left because of an even greater shift to the right. It is entirely possible that we get a even more right-wing AfD in 5 years, when Weidel and Meuthen loose the power struggle, that would openly advocate for a "conservative revolution" and völkisch ideals. It's really scary because I don't really see anything that would stop it, now that aufstehen also doesn't get off the ground and we probably going to have a GroKo forever.

Also
I know what Jungle World is, but they actually did talk about class in that article. It was one of their better ones.

Can you check again? Trotsky's name is written Trotzki in German, and a Trotsky follower would be a Trotzkist. Maybe a translation from German would keep the words like that.

>>Just look at the demographics of what the party is made of, then compare that to the NPD (which is now only 1/7 of the size of AfD).
>True, the leadership of the AfD is right-liberal
…What are the demographics as in class composition? How did the parents of these people make money and how are they making money (Petry had a small firm, Weidel is in business consulting, and so on). The answer tells you where the thing is going.

Most of the original ((Neocons🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

Pretty much all trots I know don't really have an actual understanding of anything beyond

It's impossible to know which ones understand the left, because the ones that do will lie and slander regardless, because saying the truth about the left would harm their cause. So all of them will say the same bullshit. and the only difference is, the ones who know jack shit about the left actually believe the imbecility they themselves spread.

Its quiet simple.
The far left is anti straight white male.
Social issues for the right are more important than economics.

Jokes aside, you're giving them too much credit. They don't care about social rights except when theirs are on the line. Their mentality revolves around hierarchy, and consequently the privileges of rank. Hierarchies are, by definition, spooky, but if you live in a hierarchical society, climbing to higher ranks does translate into some measure of material privilege.

nah I'm cool. non-interventionism is cool though.

Found the problem. Petit-bourj trot cults aren't socialist.

That’s literally entirely false

No we’re not. The Left is pro-worker anti-capital, every other struggle is subsumed by that struggle against capitalism.

in every thread where the kavanuagh case has been mentioned, you believe that he was raped. You have no plausible ground to say that. The antifa that you support harass random whites with racial slurs

/thread

What objective and non-biased Stalin book did you get this from?

A) Lots of people here hate Antifa.
B) Antifa isn’t a single organization, so what some members may or may not do is not indicative of the broader movement.
C) Things that totally happened.

I'm anti-myself?

youtube.com/user/Styxhexenhammer666

He's somewhat bias, sure, leaning to the right. But a lot of what he says actually does make sense. Give him a chance.

Is this sarcasm? :DD I don't get it :DDD

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No, he's independent, speaks his mind, researches a lot of what is going on. He's not PC at all, he just gives his honest opinion while covering what is going on.

He's a good one, and most recent:

youtube.com/watch?v=Q6n3iv_BmGg

Styxhexenhammer is a bona fide retard who thinks America is a socialist country and that the Gilded Age was the last time America had "true capitalism". Fuck off, moron

OK, so he obviously offends you. But OP asked the question and I'm giving him an answer, may not be the answer you guys are looking for. Whatever.

He offends me? Is pointing out that someone is retarded me being offended? Literally no one outside of crazy far-right wingers thinks America is socialist by any sense of the term. It's obvious he literally has no idea what socialism is therefore he does not "understand" the left

i was actually reading about him and thinking that
Despite his stupid anticommunism and mutt memes(pizagate etc) he is not that shitty
Tho he is one ungly shit
In general he is atleast not as shit as other ameretard rightards
wait
Are you trolling?

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You're confusing me for someone else buddy.

No, I'm trying to be fair. I'm a bit conservative myself on many issues but I really do think this guy is a lot more fair at covering many issues. We may not agree with everything, but thats the way we learn from one another, right?