German families were starving under hitlers prewar rule

Nathan Taylor
Nathan Taylor

The excelent book wages of destruction by adam tooze had given us a nice chart on how the average german family ate 2 years before ww2 under hitlers rule.
I complied all the food stuffs with on the chart in 1937 and found the average german proletarian family had approximately 1.96 million calories each year. This then translates into at least 5,361 calories each day.
I then check the average size of a german family which was 4 people 2 parents 2 kids using the fertility rate to get to my conclusion on this.
I check that the average male requires at least 2,500 to maintain his bodyweight For women this = 2,000 and for children 1600~2200 calories but this can be averaged into 1,900 calories each day. Combined this means the average german family needed to have 8,300 calories daily to maintain their weight and most likely their optimal health.
Taking in the account the average familial calorie consumption of 5,361 calories a day to the required 8,300 this means
==The average german family had only meet 64.6% of their required amount of calories in order to maintain their weight and most likely their health as well== added with the fact that hitler was destroying the german reserves and accumulating massive debt to fund the army this means that if the germans didnt go full lebensruam and conquered most of europe by the 1940s by the least the german economy would not only be in shambles but the german population would be starving too creating a famine that would make the holodomor look like a fucking cakewalk.

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Other urls found in this thread:

lefty.booru.org/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=9254#
cesifo-group.de/DocDL/cesifo_wp800.pdf
reddit.com/r/CBTSmod/comments/acor1y/how_will_socialists_work/
archive.org/details/HitlersRevolutionByRichardTedor_383

Jaxson Flores
Jaxson Flores

this means that if the germans didnt go full lebensruam and conquered most of europe by the 1940s by the least the german economy would not only be in shambles but the german population would be starving too creating a famine that would make the holodomor look like a fucking cakewalk.

A shame he didn't go through with it.

Julian Gray
Julian Gray

Wasn't the Nazi government already rationing food by early 1939?

Levi Powell
Levi Powell

OP take a screenshot and upload it on leftybooru

Liam Butler
Liam Butler

Will do give me a sec user

Samuel Sanders
Samuel Sanders

shows graph involving gold but knows nothing of the currency and hitler getting germany off gold

please

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Eli Bailey
Eli Bailey

imagine how fucking wild it would be when nazi germany would be in a state collapse in the 1940s whilst being faced with a soviet invasion

Blake Campbell
Blake Campbell

Screenshot and leftybooru link: lefty.booru.org/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=9254#

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Brody Moore
Brody Moore

Hell yeah

Jason Gutierrez
Jason Gutierrez

Some liberal centrist HOI4 mod developer was using that book to explain why the fascist German focus tree in his mod was shit and only gave debuffs. (He did the same but to a lesser extent with every tree that wasn't the centrist liberal one until people started to complain about his centrist bias)

Nicholas Kelly
Nicholas Kelly

lemme guess was it the "rise of italia mod"

Jose Flores
Jose Flores

Additional evidence. Life was worse for the average person in pre-war Nazi Germany than it was Weimar Germany
cesifo-group.de/DocDL/cesifo_wp800.pdf

Ayden Walker
Ayden Walker

Wages stagnated as well

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Owen Turner
Owen Turner

gold reserves and a gold standard are the same

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Adrian Ward
Adrian Ward

It's a WIP mod called calm before the storm. The concept is Kaiserriech but applied to IRL history and beginning in 1933, with some new mechanics added. It looks cool but the leading developer is a liberal centrist with a huge bias.

Wyatt Stewart
Wyatt Stewart

Also Germany left the gold standard before Hitler came to power, among many other countries.

Nolan Allen
Nolan Allen

really makes ya think doesn't it?

Liam Gomez
Liam Gomez

Ha! I know who you're on about, its s_team. The guy is clearly a brain dead libshit who is even biased against Socialism & Communism. He's even giving big debuffs to the USSR as well.

Samuel Cox
Samuel Cox

Watch your back, comrade

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William Smith
William Smith

And by that I mean s_team, not you.

Fuck, I'm kind of bad at this menacing thing.

Jace Butler
Jace Butler

He's not as bad as the liberals who think that fascism is better than communism at least
Who got hacked on 0 AD? What is that anyway?

Brody Brooks
Brody Brooks

About the inherent crises in capitalism

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Andrew Campbell
Andrew Campbell

Hans Schmidt
Yeah, no shit a member of the SS had a comfortable life.

Parker Johnson
Parker Johnson

I mean, they were exiting the Great Depression after all.

Kevin Nguyen
Kevin Nguyen

What even is that screenshot anyways?

Cameron Rogers
Cameron Rogers

I think he doxxed or hacked s_team, I don't know but it looks like that

Blake Rodriguez
Blake Rodriguez

What'd he do to Soviet Union?

Michael Walker
Michael Walker

This

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Jack Cooper
Jack Cooper

And the Focus Tree?

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Michael King
Michael King

fucking yikes this is painful

Colton Phillips
Colton Phillips

Here's how s_team feels about socialism & communism as well.

reddit.com/r/CBTSmod/comments/acor1y/how_will_socialists_work/

Sorry for the reddit link, but it really shows the liberal bias.

Jeremiah Johnson
Jeremiah Johnson

Absolutely delusional

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Alexander Perry
Alexander Perry

Not out yet, it's a WIP mod. He only has one focus and it gives a single civilian factory.

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Thomas Garcia
Thomas Garcia

going by this its will be fucking awful

Oliver Bailey
Oliver Bailey

An even bigger trainwreck than the base HOI4 USSR and Deep Battle. Ya did it, champs.

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Cooper Hill
Cooper Hill

I bet the USSR focus tree will have a lot more debuffs than Nazi Germany at this point.

Matthew Taylor
Matthew Taylor

But how will "muh Lend Lease" fix everything?

Nathaniel Morgan
Nathaniel Morgan

To add insult to injury, the only way these debuffs can be removed is if you change the government to liberalism. The liberal focus tree will also have around 3 X more advantages than the other ones.

Hudson Collins
Hudson Collins

I will imagine the lend lease gives a +50% to attack and defence, and produces a near infinite amount of weapons

Lucas Garcia
Lucas Garcia

Bet /his/fags will love it then

Asher Jenkins
Asher Jenkins

Nearly 50% stability debuff for being a communist related to shortages. Why? Most of the prominent ML states outlasted their shortages and the upheavals of collectivization. The ones toppled by coups were often not initiated by mass unrest, but military or CIA funded militants. Hell, Cuba and NK lived through peak oil.

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John Gonzalez
John Gonzalez

They must be r/socialism users

Xavier Kelly
Xavier Kelly

No, it's a liberal centrist who made that. The only way to get rid of those problems is to change your government to liberalism and privatize everything

Luis Flores
Luis Flores

That's the joke

Ryan Jones
Ryan Jones

Good post but keep in mind that the term "Holodomor" does NOT refer to the 1932-1933 famine (these are conflated on purpose so if you challenge the Holodomor narrative you get branded as a famine denier), it's specifically a term cooked up by ukrainian nationalists in the 1980s which claims the 1932-1933 famine was 1. man-made and 2. targeted at ukrainians, both of which are blatant lies. It's no coincidence that the name resembles the holocaust and the supposed death toll (7 million, actual is 2 million) is higher than that of the holocaust.
The holodomor, just like cultural marxism, is unironically fascist propaganda but every anti-communist will run with it cause they don't face the mouth that feeds them.

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Kayden Roberts
Kayden Roberts

The holodomor, just like cultural marxism, is unironically fascist propaganda but every anti-communist will run with it cause they don't face the mouth that feeds them.
This is not entirely a matter of bad faith. Holocaust denial is widely known in popular culture as an example of poor reasoning, so many people just assume whoever questions claims of genocide is a lying idiot.

Xavier Price
Xavier Price

1980s

So the all powerful USSR allowed people to come up with Fascism which led to Literal Nazis with 14 Words in the Government now.

Makes you thunk.

Aaron Johnson
Aaron Johnson

Yeah who knew that revisionism and """liberalization""" would lead to Western propaganda and literal nazis gaining a platform, nah the USSR was a monolithic block for all of its 70 years of existence and Gorbachev was literally the same as Lenin and Stalin

Adam Parker
Adam Parker

This actually proves they were not as "authoritarian" as libshits would have you believe. They should've unironically supressed the shit out of ukranian nationalism.

Leo Russell
Leo Russell

Never once thought I'd see an anarchist denying the holodomor.

Cameron Edwards
Cameron Edwards

Let me explain once more. What objectively happened was a famine which affected large parts of USSR territory. This famine was the result of droughts. According to some, dekulakization and collectivization (which happened at the same time) made it even worse, or might even be the sole cause of the famine. This is disputable. Even if you believe collectivization and dekulakization caused starvation (lmao), that still makes it unintentional.
The soviet famine of 1932-1933 is NOT known as the holodomor.
Holodomor is NOT the term used for the 1932-1933 famine which spanned multiple republics.
Holodomor is NOT the term used for the famine in Ukraine.
Holodomor is NOT the term used for a famine which might or might not have been the result of mismanagement.
Holodomor is a term used which rewrites this famine as a man-made, intentional and anti-ukranian effort.

Grayson Butler
Grayson Butler

you need 3500 calories a day of butter and cake and sugar and high fructose corn syrup
lel speak for yourself amerifats

Brody Edwards
Brody Edwards

Thank you user ill take this into consideration when talking about the soviet 1932-1933 famine

Jack Ward
Jack Ward

Tooze’s book has been widely discredited. The title alone tells you it’s a screed rather than an honest historical study. Here’s a link to the full text of Richard Tedor’s study “Hitler’s Revolution,” the best one-volume account of what Not Socialism was actually about and what it accomplished:
archive.org/details/HitlersRevolutionByRichardTedor_383

Fritz Reinhardt, a state secretary in the Reich Ministry of Finance, introduced the revolutionary program in 1933 that rebuilt Germany’s economy. The plan is often credited to the Minister of Finance Schact, but in fact he opposed it. The restoration of the shattered economy was enabled through the Labor Procurement Law of June 1, the Building Repair Law passed later that summer, the Tax Relief Law, the Company Refinancing Law; and for farmers the Reich’s Food Producer’s Law, all legislated in September, completing the foundation of the new economy. The huge costs of the these plans were covered by the reduction in jobless benefits made by creating jobs, and increases in corporate tax and sales tax, to the extent that in October, Reinhart was able to announce in Bremen, “expenditures and income of the Reich have balanced out.”

Millions of jobs were created for civilian infrastructure improvements. Contrary to persistent rumor, no more than 16.6% was annually allocated to military spending, and most of this was defensive, aimed at necessary precautions against a France that had invaded German territory thirty times in the previous two centuries. Compare this to the contemporary new arms race in rivals Britain and France which consumed 9% of their hugely larger GDPs.

FDR imitated Germany’s policies in his NRA, with the CCC and other alphabet agencies designed to put the unemployed back to work. The fatal difference is that his programs were financed by loans from the one-percenters, “the hyenas of international capital”, in the German leader’s words. Germany achieved full employment in four years, while the U.S. unemployment rate was still a staggering 14% after nine years of FDR’s policies, and the American people were saddled with massive deficit spending to repay the bankers, from which we have never since been freed.

It behooves us on the left to remember Marx's dictum that in the modern world, nation-states function chiefly as agents of international capital. At the most fundamental level, Germany's unforgivable sin was its refusal to become enmeshed in this web of global greed. And Germany's authoritarian socialism implicitly committed heresy against America's primary political illusion, that capitalism and democracy are compatible.

Dismiss me a neo-nazi if it comforts you, but if we are to rehash them over and over again in the 21st century, we won’t learn anything from the effort if we do not do so accurately and in context. Representing the annihilation of Germany’s socialist revolution as a holy crusade against evil was the first total success of the modern US propaganda machine and the rationale for creating the military-industrial complex. Together these two institutions effectively destroyed our republic, and now, in the service of globalism, they jeopardize the very survival of our species.

Jacob Gray
Jacob Gray

wages of destruction is a screed
"ideololgy"
starts off with a 30-page screed about liberalism and holocaust denial
"It should be noted that the Soviet Union, the flagship Marxist state, dealt with the non-proletariat far more harshly than what downtrodden labor suffered during the Industrial Revolution in Western countries"
Ok, this is epic. Like even from the most centrist and indifferent reading possible this book appears far more biased and ideological than Wages.

us
Germany's socialist revolution
Fuck off retard.

Dylan Rogers
Dylan Rogers

None of that excuses the fact that Nazi Germany's economy still was built on the land and resources it seized from neighboring countries. Fascism *cannot* survive without this, as it is inherently expansionist.

Daniel Hughes
Daniel Hughes

That book looks unreliable. Not an academic historian, apparently very biased in favor of Hitler’s government. To be fair, I don’t recommend Grover Furr to anyone on Stalin. I saw multiple critiques that stated Tedor committed the same kind of (likely ideologically based) historical sins someone like Furr usually does, like obviously leaving out or not addressing information he should be aware of that could contradict his thesis. Or relying too much on sources that would support his argument even if they have contradictions elsewhere, and even if they were weaker sources than others (like domestic media propaganda vs. internal memos, private diaries of high officials and state data collection). I haven’t read Tooze’s book, but I’d be inclined to trust western historian’s data collection more than a rando as long as you read between the lines for certain things. Especially on something like Nazi Germany, which has had so much academic attention that another academic would jump to tear down the mistakes of somebody doing specious revisionism.

As it turns out, it seems like Tooze’s book isn’t considered that way. The journal reviews I’ve found claim that he just restated the consensus of other academics on the German economy, so I’m guessing he hasn’t been thoroughly debunked or torn down by anybody but internet Nazis.

Benjamin Turner
Benjamin Turner

Lol, it looks like Richard Tedor was in the American Nazi Party

Blake Jones
Blake Jones

Why did the Soviet Union kill so many of its workers and farmers?

Jaxon Cox
Jaxon Cox

"Joseph Stalin" is a debuff
this is what happens when children aren't taught dialectical materialism. shitty ass mod.

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Blake Martinez
Blake Martinez

uncle joe is so inherently broken that he needs a direct nerf

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Owen Baker
Owen Baker

calls Tooze's work discredited and a screed
offers the Nazi-propaganda self-published """"""study""""" to debunk Tooze
Simply lol

Xavier Green
Xavier Green

Why did the Soviet Union [do something it didn't do]?
gee I dunno user

Gabriel Watson
Gabriel Watson

bump for good discussion

Kevin Walker
Kevin Walker

Semi-related

The United Kingdom used to get their bacon and eggs from the Polish People’s Republic.

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Grayson Myers
Grayson Myers

Why is this thread already dying?

Jeremiah Harris
Jeremiah Harris

What a faggot. The trotsky in Mexico is more realistic mod.

Michael Jones
Michael Jones

/leftpol/

Lucas Perry
Lucas Perry

bump

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