Councils and Unions

a thread for council communists. DeLeonists, Luxemburgists,and other armchairs are all welcome. let's discuss the mechanics and function of councils and unions in completing Marx's vision

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_Days
libcom.org/library/council-communism-reading-guide
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Lenin was a revisionist and only remnant of councils and democratic control by workers is in USSR name.

The people elected those in charge of the means of production, you idiot

Long delegation chains have extremely distorting effects, so I'm not really a fan of that, and I don't think people should identify too much with the sector they work in.

Are you seriously trying to revive the nonsensical debate of "centralization vs decentralization" here? It isn't a real problem in the world. Every society divides itself into regions and cities. There has never been any real conflict in history over this false dichotomy. It is an entirely theoretical obsession.

Was that post too long for you so you just made up things?

Literally every regionalist revolt has been over decentralisation.

Not in socialism, idiot

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_Days

that's ye olde autism, nobody's that sectarian anymore, it's mostly optics/passing off socialism in your country

I think this is just intuitively a great, even obvious, idea and that makes me suspicious of it because then why would it not have been implemented? I can imagine problems arising. Does the national council vote on the allocation of resources? How is it organized and who makes final calls? What happens if one region refuses to give up what theyre producing in a time of trouble? If there's someone that can just demand they do anyway, doesnt that defeat the purpose to some extent?

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Is there a council communist reading list?

there'ss won on libcom, plus de leon's work is on marxist internet archive. I'd start out with pannekoek.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

does anyone have a picture/diogram if how the structure of a socialist US government?

A core question is how worker's councils should be adapted to the digital age. It no longer makes sense to me to make a physical conference the official locus of decision making. This only serves to spatially delimit the democratic process, and thereby exclude vast sections of the population. Instead we should aim to establish an online platform in which discussion can take place.

Here of course we run into a similar issue. Just as the format of a physical council shapes the discussion in a certain way, any digital format will also do this. This is already visible in how the "algorithms" used by Facebook or Twitter serve to promote certain posts and hide others. Even the lack of a complex algorithm imposes a certain ideology.

To resolve this the democratic process must be available as a raw dataset, free to be given concrete form by users however they want. The software used to organize the discussion should be highly modular and adaptable by participants according to their personal preferences. They should have full control over what is prioritized and what is filtered out.

The conversation should be centralized using a single protocol, but diverse in how this protocol is parsed.

Council Communism: reading guide
libcom.org/library/council-communism-reading-guide

Exactly, and this is an issue that should concern everyone in the left because is about the construction of a duality of power.


We dont have "know-how" to do it and even if we build a online platform its probably just gonna by used by people that already identify themselves as leftists.

Imo we should use what people are already using to organizing themselves, like whatssap or signal with a bot to organize poll, like VotesApp, after that we just need to build a group inside of every workplace and neighborhood and we are gonna be one step closer to a revolution.

Bump.

I joined the IWW for a few months but I couldn't afford the dues. I generally want to pay them, but my neighborhood is gentrifying so I basically have enough to eat, utilities, and share a house.
Can anyone give me a good cheap union in the US? I'm a research chemist, and the UCS seems like a complete scam to me.

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All right lads. I'm an anarchist and I'm getting pretty tired of the anarchist community. Where do you reccomend with luxemburg,Deleon and Marxist Syndicalism? I already know you shoudl start with Marx but want to read some Ernst jünger first.

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You do know that soviet means council? That 1917 was council communism revolution?

P.s. also 1905

Didn't lenin have to abandon the council's? Or am I mistaken?

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Yes, afterwards. But in 1917 they were what made the revolution go. Ok if nitpicky, the second AllRussian congress eas undecisive, so the Bolsheviks ended the provisionsl government on the eve before the 2nd congress started its meeting. After 1920 they mostly became powerless and meaningless though.

P.s. However local soviets especially in the countryside remained important into the 30s for revolutionizing peasantry, educating them and establishing Soviet rule.