What's Zig Forumss opinion on antifa?

Hm, well, I'm a right wing primie and I don't think they make the left look retarded. Mainline leftism is also feminist polyqueer drug addict gay sexworkers.

Now, if they didn't have the backing of the police and the state to conduct their violence, they'd be utterly annihilated by the weightlifting nude bodybuilder nazis they throw themselves up against. But they do have the backing of the state, as all of radical leftism does. So with that backing comes victories. Meaningless victories which only reinforce neoliberal power, but victories nonetheless.

So I wouldn't agree they make you look bad (or any worse than you already look). It's more a matter of them expending their worthless lives to act as thugs and patsy fall-guys for neoliberal power rather than doing anything at all for achieving any kind of communism marxist pipe dream for thinking man intellectuals such as yourselves.

do you like Varg?

fuck you niggerfaggot but also i wanted to know as a prim how back in time do you want humanity to go?

Mixed feelings. He has intellectualized doing nothing because 'all the blacks and muslims in Europe will die due to lack of sunshine vitamins.'

And I tried to play MyFaRog but it was just, just terrible.

But the man has a large and beautiful family and is utterly winning at life, and I really envy and admire that.

If Chalottesville is what those bodybuilder nazis look like i don't think antifa is that bad in comparison

Did you know that the Mongol bow was accurate to 500m? Half a fucking kilometer. I just found that out the other day.

The effective range range of an AKM is 350m. Not that it can't shoot 500m, but it's pretty incredible that the Mongols were hitting targets at over 500m, reliably.

I would like to return to horde organization. Three classes: nobles, warriors, and womenfolk; but everybody is still eating the same mutton and drinking the same kefir. Class hardly even exists when you return to a palace economy and purge all the decadent toys and conveniences of modernity.

I'm willing to entertain a sort of tiered system for technology. Kind of like how India has a space program despite being a third world hellhole. Have a very spartan nomadic lifestyle for 99% of the population and have a small priestly caste that runs a fucking space elevator and orbital mining drones or something. And that way you could have some very basic modern medicine and high tech exploration without cluttering life with all the decadent toys of capitalism.

I was there. I don't know what pictures you saw on the internet, but in person the people in the enclosure looked very nice compared to the ragamuffin antifa outside of it. More or less everyone was in dress code for the event, and if they weren't they probably weren't legitimate participants.

I disavow the dresscode nonsense now, though, since it bred classism and civil war within our ranks. Big tents don't work, because it lets too many signal jammers (think: Qanon boomercons) into the tent.

Sounds retarded but i also want to kill myself, i hope you can see your dream come true.

Why? What's so bad about having meat and milk and a wife and your own yurts full of your entire extended family?

Nomadic palace economy is literally the communist dream come true. Everybody has all the basic needs of life fulfilled, and a rich family life. You just have to have enough testosterone to be a warrior and not cry christian morals about how killing enemies is wrong or whatever. To crush your enemies and hear the lamentation of their women is the most amazing experience you can have in life, and I am quite hopeful I will get to experience it in mine.

You commies want the same thing as me, but you put all your faith in materialism, science, and dumb ass machinery when you could have artisanal hand made bows, your own horse, and eat meat and dairy at every meal.

Technology and materialism is a false god.

Varg is very based. some stuff he is dumb tho. many Zig Forumstards are retarded and think political solution. they vote for "far right" political parties and think that will change things. but Varg knows that all political parties are controlled opposition and that nothing will change.

I will skip the fantasy you spewed and go right ahead: the industrial revolution was a good thing. That's all.

And yet you want to kill yourself despite all those toys and conveniences the assembly lines produced by raping the planet. :thinking:

Yes, I can see how good it has made things for you.

Yeah he's absolutely right about that. Voting, boycotts, and all the political activism that isn't violence is useless. And then he thinks violence is useless too because of the example of the Third Reich being destroyed by the combined might of the entire rest of the planet sans Imperial Japan and Italy.

But the USA is totally unprepared to fight a domestic civil war or revolution, especially an asymmetrical one, and if USA became a hard-right state, there is fuck-all the rest of the planet could do about it. Violence is still a viable form of activism, the only question is how to make the apple fall.

And, for the most part, Varg is doing things correctly. He's building his power locally and building his family. His sons will fight when the time is ripe for France, even if he won't.

Could it be because they are not being used in the right way? you dumbo wombo

The Entire West is Fascist but you don't see them bombing parliaments. Instead it's just some dumb lumpen who doesn't know better.

It could be. It could also not be.

It could be that fully automated luxury communism is indistinguishable from fully automated luxury capitalism.

It could be that, if all the geniuses and very very smart people involved in communism in the last century couldn't pull it off – after fighting and bleeding and losing EVERYTHING for their dream – that you can't do it either.

It's supreme arrogance to think you can do it better where many very smart people before you failed. And consider the human cost of those revolutions. They suffered, rude user. They suffered unimaginably, more than you or I could ever fathom. They wanted it to work with all their hearts, but it didn't. Why the hell should we risk it again when we have a perfectly functional alternative that was proven to work for hundreds and hundreds of years and spawn mighty empires that changed history on a whim, overnight, as the mongols and huns and scythians did?

We have a working model for how to feed everyone high quality meals, shelter everyone, and ensure every willing warrior has a wife and family and weapon.

We don't need your stupid autism conveyor belts and drill presses and other silly mechanism-toys for making richpeople-toys.

red or dead mate idk i'll stick with this

Well, okay then. But then you're basically admitting you're wrong.

Why do recent converts try to reconcile their old views with their new found leftism? Anti-fascist activism in the US long predates 2016, you just don't notice it cause 1. you've never taken part in it and 2. it didn't get mainstream media coverage.
You should stop letting what's covered only in the mainstream cloud your view because it will cover (crypto-)fascist thugs but never their backers, it will cover the government shutdown but not organized labor (see the matamoros strike).
American anti-fascism is tainted by americanism just like everything else but it's still good.

LOL
Radlibs arent left

They should ban this anprim honestly. Derailed the shit out of your thread, but thats basically the fault of the anons who decided anprims were worth speaking to

As a concept, I am ambivalent to them. But, as a bunch of radlibs being violent, I appreciate them. I couldn't care less if they beat on Nazis or rightwing """intellectuals""". I think it might be good for society in that it allows ordinary people to take back some of the power that has been kept from them by the State.
Saying if they are needed or not is alarmism, and everyone who says "ruins the image of the left" is legitmately retarded, and it should be in the word filter so they know they are retarded. We don't "require" Antifa and it isn't like they are destroying Leftism. Overall, they seem sort of adventurist, so they might be a little useless in and of themselves.

Even before 2016 antifa haven't been more than the glorious trash can liberators

this isn't needed people can take videos and you can see the raw footage

Watching the MSM is increasingly something only boomers do.

I wouldn't be surprised if antifa was some cia plot to keep the average citizen away from revolutionary politics

From what I have seen, Antifa are pro censurship of what they call "fascist". They are violent just as wich whom they talk about. Antifa are violent thugs, anti-democratic, never helping but repressing. This is what I see in France and in Switzerland. Politics is a game of manipulation, it's never black & white, in this game Antifa are sometimes hitting real democrats. Also in France especially, Antifa aren't targeted by police the same number of time and with the same reaction when nationalistic french are, wich is non-egalitarian. But I know personnaly that they have good heart, want the best for ppl, but it has to go through their Political dogma, wich is never organised, so it never comes up in the mainstream media, wich is also sad.
My conclusion: Good human, bad thinking, violent political action = Antifa are political children & thugs.

American antifa fucking sucks & is basically one big LARP group. As for Europe, some anons on here have said that some are pretty decent, & some are just about the same as the American ones.

I think the moral of the story is sometimes they're useful idiots, & sometimes you shouldn't even bother with them. Its like being stuck between a rock & a hard place.

Hmm I wonder why Richard Spencer can’t even appear in public and Unite the Right 2 was no more than twenty people down from several hundred. Really causes me to ponder

Varg was right
youtube.com/watch?v=RdyfIOK3ZXQ

the massive e drama between alt right fags that caused the movement to be split up after many people jumped ship after Cville like every other time ever?

I'm not american, that's why I have never taken part in it. Not because I'm against antifascism. Look, obviously every person (I hope) here is antifascist, but that doesn't mean we should respect or like autistic red liberals that go around punching normie conservatives one random actual fascist doesn't amount to much

Been personally involved in shutting down right wing groups which now no longer exist. Tell me that’s a bad thing go on

for the most part liberal lifestyle clowns

hi Zig Forums

You should stop letting yourself get influenced by footage of shrill radlibs like a good reactionary drone. The best anti-fascist activism takes place outside of the lens of the spectacle, we're talking about dozens of neo-nazi groups which don't make media coverage (cause they know to avoid it) getting shut down by local anti-fascist groups.

>>>/liberalpol/

you were the one who mentioned the MSM

this is likely

this is the media, thats why i don't watch it

evidence?

Disorganized and sometimes self-conflicting efforts, but efforts which are appreciated. Fascist movements need to be faced by determined resistance and their members be given sour reality-checks to stop their power-fantasies getting out of hand.
After all, considering the overall doctrine of the radical right, everything done to them is self-defense.

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They are needed to protect left wing movements from militant fascist gangs. However antifa alone cannot bring us to communism.

Based. Smashing fascists is a lot of fun.

Ignore the burgers though. They're a fucking embarrassment and want nothing but an aesthetic. half of there so called 'antifa' are literally self proclaimed keyboard warriors…

God damn, why are primitivists always so retarded? and i say this as an anti-civ'er…

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you have to be genuinely, brazenly stupid to look at the problems we're facing and think to yourself a regression to hunter-gathering would solve anything. especially climate problems what the fuck. have fun foraging underwater

I just wish they were more radical

LARP smashies that should be used by broader Left movements to keep the aggro of right-wingers off of said movements. Neither publicly disown nor embrace Antifa but always appreciate that they're there.

What is evolution? We'll just evolve gills in time and will truly be able to forage underwater. Humankind is adaptable. In the past we had telepathic ability before the rise of symbolic language and its destructive effects. With it again removed our potentials would be unlimited

you go to gulag for propaganda against rational thought.

This.

They're pretty good at their job but not much more, too liberal from what I've seen in America at least. Here in the UK and the rest of Europe from what I've heard they're a fair bit more radical, but still often too liberal.

LARP? why, exactly?

And yet when they show up in defense of leftist meetings that the far-right turn up to what do you fucks do again? Oh. That's right… You phone one of our lads and then when everyone rocks up you phone the filth… every. fucking. time… Absolute Scum.

There is no wilds left, burger. When Techno-Industrial Society collapses we will simply starve. And good Riddens.

Incendia al Humano.

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no

Sometimes

No, the failure of the aut-right is that it is divorced of material struggles of people. Fascism can only rise when Porky needs it to, Porky dons’t need it now, and when Porky does, a few students in ski masks won’t stop him. The whole aut-right vs. antifa fight has nothing to do with real material and political struggles workers face today, but it’s just sports for polysci majors.

If your anti-civ your also retarted. Like the aut-right and radlibs your political ideology is divorced from the real struggles people face and the material forces that cause progress. As such your going to be a meme group.

Antifa's not really smashie. They try to use peaceful protest/intimidation first, they'll fight back tho

It alienates burgers of all kinds, it's better to try to sign them up with the IWW, as it seems American, and doesn't use violence unless things have spiraled 100% into death

Remember how fucking shitty Unite The Right 2:Electric Boogaloo was?
They were scared to go.

The Proud Boys and Patriot Prayer have started to disrupt Democrat Cops of America meetings and attack anti-ICE protestors. They would probably attack unions if they were in larger numbers. It's not 2014 anymore. Antifa is more important than ever. The west must be made to decay without going fash.

portlandmercury.com/blogtown/2019/01/24/25623138/union-headquarters-vandalized-after-patriot-prayer-attention
They already have

That post was from me, btw

Imagine actually believing fascism isn't becoming a serious problem. are you actually retarded, user?

Anti-Civilization is clearly anti political. Anti-Civilization is clearly against progressivism.

What does this even mean?

Absolute bullshit. I did that shit for about a decade all over the continent, user. don't try to spoon-feed me this revisionist nonsense.

Oh my god, can you people please stop getting autismo-hyper-focous on these nobody burger groups when we have actual legit fascists in the world gaining political power and a serious base? I don't think we would mind so much if you did /actual/ antifa actions instead of just bullshit counter-demonstrations with an Europan anti-fascist aesthetic.

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That's why it is LARP

Antifa are pretty weak right now, you never hear of any antifa ever beating the shit out of someone or winning a fight apart from that one guy with the bikelock, they dont really have antifa here and instead just have some form of the IRA who just recently set of a carbomb and atleast they get shit done unlike american communists, can you fags step it up over there? either antifa starts an armed revolution or the neo-nazis get to it before them.
world situation is worsening with france at the boiling point pollibly a catylist for another conflcit and the current capitalist government will be destroyed, who takes the throne is unknown

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words are easy when you litrally don't even have to back them up, huh?

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Enjoy your global report

Lie.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Dawn_(political_party)#Bomb_attacks_on_Golden_Dawn_offices
theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/01/golden-dawn-killed-shooting-athens
reuters.com/article/us-germany-afd-blast/blast-hits-office-of-german-far-right-afd-in-saxony-police-idUSKCN1OY0TH
rt.com/news/420791-italy-casapound-trento-bombing/
independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/italy-elections-latest-updates-beat-bound-forza-nuova-antifa-massimo-ursino-palermo-sicily-a8223316.html

Fuck off, CIA.

Do they put something in the water in burgerland? i honestly just don't get you people..

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can you show any signs of recent attacks tovarisch?

afd article was super recent. 2018.

This is exactly not 'old news'. All of these attacks are in the last decade, lots in this half of. I personally understand It is a symptom of 24h rolling news, of spectacular society to see the news this way. Though, i concede it is hard not to as it is the world we live in.

And even then, do you think these spectacular events exist in a vacuum? Do you think that only what you hear about in your mainstream media is what happens? Hell, do you even think that contra-info sites get even a fifth of what's happening?

^–This sounds unnecessarily defensive or aggressive, i sorry for that but also to tired to re-write. Forgive me for this.

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The alt-right didn’t collapse because of Charlitzville, but because the fash ideology has no solutions to people’s problem.

ICE and DCA are for people who thinks politics is like sports. These groups don’t effect the lives of the majority of the people.

Fascists only rise when Porky needs them to, that’s why their rising in Greece, but not other countries, when this happens, student groups like Antifa won’t beable to stop them, because tiny cliches of students have no power.

A meme ideology is an ideology that has no soltions to people’s problems.

Go away syop. Others: See for a few, albeit spectacular, examples as well as your local and international contra-info sites for more examples of actual antifascist actions from our generation instead of listening to CIA cunt trying to push this narative of antifa being pussy student study groups that organise counter-demos (which in actuality is the role of established left and socdems, etc) divorced from radical leftist and anarchist struggles.

Listening to 'comrades' who swallow mainstream, (worse, garbage burger mainstream) narratives on such things is not helpful and should be publicly discouraged wherever possible. These are the same leftists who would have turned against the Red Brigades, the OIRA or the Black Panthers in the past. Useful pawns of the state/porky. They will always exist but i fear the internet gives them more power.

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Stop linking your shit inciting unprovoked violence, fbi man

I'm embarrassed that you call yourself an anarchist and I'm offended that you think I'm a yankee. tbqh.

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Their are no Antifa groups that aren’t student majority. This doesn’t mean their aren’t good Anti-fascist groups, but Anti-fascist and Antifa aren’t the same. Antifa is a subset of Anti-Fascists who thinks student struggles are the most important and ignore trade unions. Productive Anti-fascists are engaged with the working class.

Anarchist struggles are meaningless. Worker struggles are what drive forward the dialectic.

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was talking about pics. violence only makes people afraid of you, and when violence is your only platform, and what you use initially you're fucked

Lie. I did this for a decade. Do not try to bullshit me like i'm a teenager, psyop.

nonsense. pdf's related.

Burger, please an hero.

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Anti-fascism is the worst product of fascism.

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Damn what I meant to say is that antifa is full of weaklings that say

But would be to beta to handle them irl.

I support them trying to stop fascism, but I think they're really dumb in how they go about doing it.
Also, a lot of them have barely any theory.
They basically exist to protect liberalism from becoming fascism, rather than offering a real alternative. Liberals who hate them without at least critically supporting them are total cucks, in this regard.

It really depends on the situation.
As I said previously, most of the time they operate without any theory to help them analyze what fascism is, how to fight it, and what alternatives to support. They're methods are wrong headed, which often renders them ineffectual. Could I see them becoming useful in the future if they manage to become more tactically savvy?
Sure.

Okay say apparently you can’t say Y.P.G. Lmao.
Text change ain’t lying tho.

Okay friendo, what should we have done better? What conversations should we have been having?

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The problem is, that they you're going to have varying levels of effectiveness, because literally anyone can be antifa.
They're basically the anonymous of anti-fascism.
Part of me thinks that is fine, but in the west you don't differentiate yourself much from liberals.

Hopefully not much longer bois

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Where did i say antifa was one group?
antifa despite being many groupings more often overlap heavily in social and political circles internationally.
A clarification not a condescension. I may not have been clear enough in my wording.

This is true with the exception of dineyland. North American anarchists insist on a weird kind of isolation where they nonetheless attempt to imitate others aesthetically whilst doing the vanilla activism of payed and socialist and whatnot orgs, the counter-demonstrations, the news-media interviews and condemnations, the public petitions, etc. the 'antifa' in the democrat party membership and show this. I unfortunately do not think you can perform both tasks under one banner. to believe this is silly. If you could why would we have antifa as a tactic in the first place.

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Sometimes they're good, but sometimes they're retarded.
American antifa is a whole other level of shit, though. Once they attacked BLM activists because they were in a pro-free speech rally, so obviously they were Uncle Toms and not just people who felt like they were being silenced.
And then there's the anti-German antifa, which is a bunch pants-on-head-retarded zionists that make even American antifa look good.

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Being a lumpen isn’t much better than being a student, actually it’s worse. Where’s antifa fighting cops suppressing strikes. They aren’t there. It’s because there divorced from class struggle which is their problem.

Fuck off. This symbol was used by the Freikorps when they killed Rosa. It isn’t a leftist symbol. We should not use it.

Fascists attack and terrorize /working class/ migrant communities. you utter mong. Also, what do you think antifa people do when they're not doing antifa? I'm not saying all do but to pretend that some also arn't on the picket lines is beyond a joke.

During periods of time where Porky decides to build fascists up, in which case Antifa is defenseless against them. For the rest of the time fascists don’t do shit. The only way to counter fascism is to destroy the material conditions that allow for it, which is capitalism. And capitalism can only be destroyed though revolution.

Porky builds them (the fascists) up to thwart revolution. You cannot have revolution without some kind of paramilitary wing to help defend against extrajudicial violence. Just because antifa triggers you does not mean that they are bad.

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We had a better discussion on it here a while back 8ch.net/leftypol/res/2730417.html

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But this paramilitary group must be made up of workers, not students.

I never said their bad, I just said that they aren’t effective at what they do. Anti-fascism needs a different, more disciplined and centralized, structure that has no or little student and lumpen involvement.

...

...

The vast majority of college students do not have trust funds and have jobs while going to school while accruing thousands of dollars of debt. They're nearly all workers in the literal sense.
Have you ever actually been to a college campus?

That's worth non saging, tbh

They will be workers, but right now they aren’t. As such they have no class continuousness. This is why students are obsessed with idpol.

Factually untrue.
They are workers while they are in school:
thinkprogress.org/nearly-80-percent-of-students-work-while-in-school-2f44edacd275/

They are class conscious:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_1968_events_in_France

fivethirtyeight.com/features/college-freshmen-are-more-politically-engaged-than-they-have-been-in-decades/

thefederalist.com/2017/11/01/study-nearly-half-millennials-prefer-socialism-capitalism/

FUCKING BASED

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Its the federalist, they meant as a lie/smear

not based

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That's how you know you're doing it right

*attacks yellow vests*
DAMN bruh so based!!!

Hi Zig Forums
I know you like historical revisionism but the yellow vests are fundamentally leftist and if you expect some epic right wing uprising you're in for a nasty surprise.

How was keeping Berlinguer out of office good praxis?

antifa is bad because right-wing grifters told me they are bad

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