Do you think Bernie will ever talk about something other than succdem?

Blake Reyes
Blake Reyes

yfw america will never be socialist

Do you think Bernie will ever talk about something other than succdem?

Attached: Capture.PNG (603.2 KB, 823x454)

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=RU3NKvvxcSs
marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/On The Jewish Question.pdf

Colton Smith
Colton Smith

People don’t politically change that much at that age, so no

Levi Baker
Levi Baker

No, he won't bother

Gabriel Sullivan
Gabriel Sullivan

I think he's going to run as a succdem and win and then release the death squads on the bourgeoisie and CIA/FBI, essentially channeling the ghost of 1988 Bernie Sanders.

Andrew Allen
Andrew Allen

Proles in America are being heavily gatekept from just $15/h. They will never own the means of production without a revolution. Bernie represents an important leftist movement in USA though, I fully support him. Salty communists on leftypol are always missing the bigger picture.

Attached: 533518867f215.jpeg.jpg (57.3 KB, 640x472)

Cooper Williams
Cooper Williams

What's a bit astonishing about American proles is the extent to which they've been trained to gatekeep themselves from even $15/hr. American elites have been so successful in framing the conversation that many American workers almost reflexively respond to the issue, as that picture shows, with "but burger flippers tho". That people like Bezos or Gate "deserve" their billions is taken as a matter of course, while people working shit jobs like fast food aren't considered to be working hard enough to make what is barely a living wage in many parts of the country. So yeah people like Bernie might be Rosa-killing socdems, but even then being able to shift the discourse on that would be an accomplishment in America.

Nicholas Clark
Nicholas Clark

No because Bernie is a liberal, furthermore he's a Zionist.

Blake Nelson
Blake Nelson

nigger digger

Anthony Bell
Anthony Bell

Anybody want to talk about the fact that Warren literally leapt to her feet clapping when Trump said that line…

Owen Stewart
Owen Stewart

t. Rosa Killer
While important as this movement may be, Americans don't know the difference between socialism, or communism and don't care to. Many don't even have time to think or read about socialism, let alone progressive measures to allow people a basic need to survive while working full shifts, the MSM basically regurgitates antisocialist propaganda. And there's myth that once you get a job, or a family, you'll somehow stop being a commie/socialist. How and why people suddenly fall for this meme is beyond big brains. If anything, having a job has made me even more acutely aware of my exploitation.

Carter Martinez
Carter Martinez

Denver teachers are launching their first strike in over 25 years. Massive strike waves are about to hit the US and the unions which represent them are sure to fail. Keep in mind that Sanders and AOC will not fail to support the actions of the unions and thus when workers see the betrayals before their very eyes, support for soc-dems will decline. Sanders is a gatekeeper and its the job of socialists to expose him for the fraud that he is rather than support him due to having anti-marxist conceptions of the unreliability of the proletariat to be revolutionary.

David Jenkins
David Jenkins

It should be remembered that no communist movement has ever sprung fully formed out of nothing. Class consciousness develops gradually through class struggle, and takes time to manifest itself as a truly revolutionary movement. If Lenin is to be believed then this process requires the active role of communists in transforming trade union consciousness to class consciousness, but that’s another debate. The point being that world historical movements enter through phases of development before they reach maturity, just as the Chartisrs and Luddites were the vulgar but essential precursors of the real worker’s movement, or the Boxer Rebellion the vulgar predecessor of proper Chinese anti-imperialism. Social democracy marks the re-emergence of a worker’s movement in America which was long dead, and with proper encouragement and agitation will lay the groundwork for something more radical.

Nolan Taylor
Nolan Taylor

what exactly does 15/hr accomplish?

Aiden Hernandez
Aiden Hernandez

not much, but that's the point I was making. America is so far gone in hating workers that 15/h seems like a huge deal when it doesn't really solve many problems. It is a movement which is coinciding with med4all and all that other Justice Dem stuff so USA is heading in the right direction, at least. I think class consciousness is rising in such a manner that Trump won't even get a second term, which is a powerful symbol against the populism of the alt-right.

Camden Ward
Camden Ward

I think class consciousness is rising in such a manner that Trump won't even get a second term, which is a powerful symbol against the populism of the alt-right.
why wouldn't he? He has a higher approve rating now than the day he got elected.
Also most people approve of his SOTU address

Ethan Adams
Ethan Adams

Who in the running could actually beat Trump? Note: they need to get the nomination to beat Trump.

Easton Brown
Easton Brown

If 15 dollars an hour is too much it encourages automation, and automation literally moves the dialectic forward

Noah King
Noah King

If 15 dollars an hour is too much it encourages automation, and automation literally moves the dialectic forward

<porky automates all labor no longer needs proletariat
<offers 100% welfare only requirement is you get sterilized
<bourgeoisie eliminates whole proletariat and the class system in 1 lifetime

maybe porky is the subject of history after all

Lincoln Collins
Lincoln Collins

this
Never underestimate the support from the hogs to their king hog. The man can literally have a tape saying he wants to destroy the working class and subjugate blacks into slavery, nuke Manhattan and they will claim 7D chess.

Nathaniel Rivera
Nathaniel Rivera

If exterminism was the goal, they'd just figure out how to make a sustainable society without the mass of proles and then leave us to our own devices. Look up "breakaway civilization."

Gavin Brooks
Gavin Brooks

In the long term a $15/hour minimum wage will accomplish nothing concrete by itself, indeed for a great many it will likely already be inadequate due to increasing cost of living by the time any such policy could be enacted. The point is less the policy itself but laying the groundwork for future action which can affect a meaningful change. It can't be emphasized enough that the state of class consciousness in America is abysmal correctly points out that no revolutionary movement will spring forth from the masses of American workers perfectly formed, it's going to be a long process of half-starts and education through failure before anything of the sort comes about in any meaningful sense. Like it or not we have to engage with the working masses where they are not where we wish them to be, and for Americans right now that means working with the woefully poor class consciousness which pervades their own working class.

Andrew Rivera
Andrew Rivera

Like it or not we have to engage with the working masses where they are not where we wish them to be, and for Americans right now that means working with the woefully poor class consciousness which pervades their own working class

How exactly do we go about doing that? When any type of political discussion arises, whether its between coworkers, friends, family, whatever. The most I can achieve is tipping them over to succdems. Never full Marx. I encounter a lot of roadblocks with the complexity that surrounds Marxism in general and I don't want to dumb it down any further than I'm already doing so.

Attached: talking-to-liberals-be-like-dialectical-materialism-14250273.png (75.98 KB, 500x431)

Anthony Turner
Anthony Turner

Bernie is trying so that people will stop cringing at the S word. As soon as the revolution comes, he'll outlive his usefulness

Juan Campbell
Juan Campbell

anyone with bernie's support will win

Anthony Martinez
Anthony Martinez

Talk about things in terms of concrete experiences that people can relate to rather than just abstract concepts. For instance, bring up the facts that US wages were at their peak at the same period where union membership was also at it's peak (in the 1950s). Tell them that the reason for this is simply because businesses want to pay workers as little as possible in order to make more money, and that workers have the opposite interest. Therefore, it is in the interest of the capitalists to drive down wages as low as possible, so they can live rich off of our hard work. The working class has the opposite interests, they want high wages. So through unions and other forms of working class power, they are able to extract concessions and make life better for themselves for a bit. However, since the capitalists still control the means of production as well as the state, they are able to roll back these concessions with time. A concrete example of this is Taft-Hartley.
Labor lawyer Thomas Geoghegan attributes the drop to the long-term effects of the 1947 Taft-Hartley Act, which slowed and then halted labor's growth and then, over many decades, enabled management to roll back labor's previous gains

Basically, tell them in simple terms how labor and capital have ENTIRELY opposite interests. One of these groups must win in this struggle. However, there is an important distinction to be made. The capitalists needs the laborers in order to survive, but it doesn't work the other way around. In other words, in order to preserve and strengthen the gains the working class have made, the working class itself must take power into it's own hands and do away with the capitalists. Otherwise, the capitalists will just roll things back and make it worse and worse for us.

Attached: original.jpg (47.53 KB, 631x588)

Ryder Smith
Ryder Smith

Good advice. Thanks comrade.

Jack Sanders
Jack Sanders

The most I can achieve is tipping them over to succdems. Never full Marx.
In all honesty I would say that that's enough for now. Like I said earlier, it is participation in the struggle itself that builds up the revolutionary movement. The fastest way to radicalize a moderate leftist is for them to watch cops attack a peaceful demonstration, or see how even the slightest reforms are met with hysteria and stubbornness from the right. So if you get them to the level of succdems that's fine for now, the next step is to get them active in the movement. I'd say keep up your Marxist critiques of their socdem ideas, but more importantly you should be ready to provide a Marxist interpretation of why their own experiences are happening to them. This latter point will be much easier of these people are engaged in struggle directly.

Jace Miller
Jace Miller

How do you debunk, in layman's terms, the trickle-down shit? Like you said The working class has the opposite interests, they want high wages. One may respond
<Ha! You silly gommie! Then hardwoyking business owners won't have money to spend on goods and services we produce so we'll lose our jobs! And they will no longer invest so there will be no economic growth. Read basic economics!

Thomas Mitchell
Thomas Mitchell

Honestly trickle down economics has been pretty thoroughly debunked even by bourgeois economics. You can just point to the fact that numerous studies have disproven it, they shouldn’t even be hard to find on your own.

Joshua Russell
Joshua Russell

Assuming he won't lead the revolution.

Ryder Carter
Ryder Carter

he’s to old

Liam Carter
Liam Carter

he can give one mean sucker punch

Andrew Hall
Andrew Hall

but socdem is the best option.
but if the government isn't a dictatorship that mows people down with tanks it's not True Socialism!
no

Aaron Price
Aaron Price

Socdems do plenty of mowing down people with tanks. Did you forget about 1914 you filthy traitor?

Jace Ramirez
Jace Ramirez

He was always more than a succdem. He's a Democratic Socialist, the same party as the party of Karl Marx himself, in his times.

Attached: ClipboardImage.png (1.61 MB, 900x1200)

Michael Kelly
Michael Kelly

Bernie was killed and replaced by a reptilian in 2016. It's literally the only explanation for why he became such a piece of shit.

Zachary Stewart
Zachary Stewart

of that there was never any doubt. the real question is whether the Marxist-Leninists are doing to Trumpism what Trotrskyists did to Neocons?

Jonathan Perry
Jonathan Perry

That wasn't Warren, it was some other Republican woman who had almost the same dress and short hair. Not defending her, I know she's just slightly to the left of Obama.

Jordan Campbell
Jordan Campbell

I know she's just slightly to the left of Obama
S-so Reagan?

Attached: spook-of-gommunism.gif (312.89 KB, 215x194)

Mason Robinson
Mason Robinson

There are not complicates explanations, just fake left-wingers trying to get power just like nazies did it. They're the new facism not the alt-rigth or the retard 'nazis' of /pol/

Zachary Sullivan
Zachary Sullivan

When and where was this image taken?

Gabriel Rogers
Gabriel Rogers

nvm
it's fake…

Andrew Cox
Andrew Cox

Except he was saying pretty much the same thing for 30 years.
youtube.com/watch?v=RU3NKvvxcSs
You smell a lot like /pol/ though.

Charles Hill
Charles Hill

He's always been kind of a socdem with semi-imperialist tendencies.
He can be critical of U.S. intervention, but look how he can't even bring himself to give full throat support of Maduro despite knowing the history of U.S. interest in Latin America.

Aaron Reed
Aaron Reed

Sidenote, if he is hiding his power level, I don't know how much longer he can do it without taking the gloves off.
His opponents are already doing opposition research on him, and they found of a video of him hanging out in the soviet union on his honeymoon.

Jeremiah Turner
Jeremiah Turner

but look how he can't even bring himself to give full throat support of Maduro despite knowing the history of U.S. interest in Latin America.
This is post 2016 reptilian Bernie. Find me some pro imperialism from Bernie from pre 2016.

Jaxon Nguyen
Jaxon Nguyen

Bernie Sanders is a socialist seeking power in the very heart of international capital, of course he's going to make some small compromises

Blake Phillips
Blake Phillips

Bernie has only dropped in influence and popularity after coming out as a piece of shit bootlicker.

Ian Sanchez
Ian Sanchez

Marxism-leninism is democratic centralism, he's a social democratic fag
You smell a lot like /pol/ though.
Why, because I'm not a left retard and instead I'm a based formed tanki?. Whatever, USA will never been socialist like Trump said, your contry is brainwashed and the other side is just faggots (lireraly), jews (enemys of marxism and marx), and feminist trash.

Aaron Wood
Aaron Wood

Well I see that video, and… Ok I'll accept his discurd pre-2016 was at least some socialist, but, the present day is only important now, and reptilian or not, he's bulshit now and a traitor of himself.

Justin Morales
Justin Morales

I see my nose didn't fail me. Back to /pol/ with you.

Cameron Fisher
Cameron Fisher

other side is just faggots (lireraly)
jews (enemys of marxism and marx)

hmmmmmm

Attached: Iy9FeCa.jpg (65.88 KB, 491x491)

Jonathan Brooks
Jonathan Brooks

Read fucking Marx and redpilled yourself, or you're so retarded thinking Marx was nazi too?, and remember, fags deserve gulag too just trotskyists and revisinist like americans 'left-wingers' support them, faggotry is just bourgeois vice:
marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/On The Jewish Question.pdf

Attached: 58512aa15d9ba315986aeb060b2fd50d873b58cf2f68e0423a7357e1a8d6c183.png (155.17 KB, 381x412)

Ayden Ward
Ayden Ward

If you really want to falseflag as one of us, I suggest you LURK MORE you absolute faggot

Ryder Edwards
Ryder Edwards

You'll fit right in over at /leftpol/index.html

Bentley Powell
Bentley Powell

as one of us
Sorry revisionist, Communism is not a sect, is a scientific theory.

Well, leftpol is too SJW to me, leftypol is contaminated with those people though.

Aiden White
Aiden White

Corbyn ALMOST getting elected in the U.K. Almost triggered a fucking military coup
If Sanders got elected in the US and actually attempted to implemented his SucDem policy the US would just smashed its liberal skin and become a banana republic

Landon Torres
Landon Torres

He is actually technically correct in that in primitive communism, which for lack of a better model is how social relations will play out under communism homosexuals tend to either get tagged with a third gender or the bottoms assume a feminine gender like sister girl or the like that emphasises their lack of womanhood

But yeah, he needs to fuck off to the containment board where we've gulaged the Not Socialists, anarchists, liberals, greens, national bolsheviks, etc etc ad nauseum until he's lurked moar and knows how to take a scientific tone and attitude

Jacob James
Jacob James

He is actually technically correct in that in primitive communism, which for lack of a better model is how social relations will play out under communism homosexuals tend to either get tagged with a third gender or the bottoms assume a feminine gender like sister girl or the like that emphasises their lack of womanhood
No idea where this tirade came from, but ok.

Jayden Peterson
Jayden Peterson

Just like with any scientific endeavor it does have a living tradition though

And this board has a culture that supports this, it's not your opinion that makes Zig Forumsindex.html a better fit for you, it's your attitude

Remember son, science is a cooperative endeavor, sharp destructive rhetoric does have its place but it has to be excercised with great discretion

Joseph Butler
Joseph Butler

No idea where this tirade came from, but ok.
Elaborate your thoughts here, I'm interested in your reasoning

Grayson Wilson
Grayson Wilson

I mean, the totally not a nazi basically just said "kill the fags" and you say he's technically correct and then go on some psychoanalytic analysis on the structure of a homosexual relationship. I have no idea why you first said he's correct and why you made this analysis.

Zachary White
Zachary White

some psychoanalytic analysis
This is the answer to what perplexes you, but I can elaborate if there is still any confusion

Jack Parker
Jack Parker

Yes please.

Hudson Harris
Hudson Harris

Zig Forumsindex.html a better fit for you.
I guess you try to said leftpol. And idk what attitude you mean, not be a idpol fag?

Just like with any scientific endeavor it does have a living tradition though

Ok so where are your facts and scientifics argumets to debate about the homosexuality isn't a vice. I'm not english native, but your sophism don't scare me, your empty argument don't make sense and is just ad hominen try.

Noah Edwards
Noah Edwards

Ok so where are your facts and scientifics argumets to debate about the homosexuality isn't a vice
Where are your arguments that homosexuality is a vice? Burden of proof, motherfucker.

Austin James
Austin James

Because liberalism is a bourgeois ideology and the modern structure of the homosexual relationship is a liberal one, he's clearly correct and to deny this removes us from scientific discourse and risks pushing the dialectic into revisionism and opportunism

Revisionism and opportunism aren't curse words, they have meaning

To build communism especially full communism a scientific attitude and approach is required, opportunism and revisionism damage or even destroy conceptual clarity, which is the radical base of any scientific endeavor

Therefore the level of truth of his claim needed to be acknowledged along with an instrumental hint that if he wanted to enjoy a non scientific discourse leftpol would be a better fit for him
Yes, I should have put more effort in, I think you'd enjoy leftpol more as its board culture is closer to pol as it stands now, leftypol board culture is closer to the culture of pol that is, at least by appearance now a historical matter

Except you rejected leftpol and came here, and are still arguing which suggests you're looking for something else, something new

Now vices kid, they aren't magic or supernatural, which is another way of saying they are not sacred

Vices are vices because they cause harm, so what harm does homosexuality cause?

Hard mode, what harms does it cause that aren't, fundamentally, from it being a bourgeois institution?

Jason Powell
Jason Powell

According whit the principes of materialism and not pseudo cientifict theorys and thougt, like conductivism and structural linguistics Freudian, the humans relations are just for needs and production, the pleasure you get with them, is jus part of both.

So, the relationship between a mens and womans fit with those concepts, Is needed for the individuals becasue his bodies demandad them, and for production because is a part of evolution, and the place of reproduction in any social system is requied for renews forces of production.

Speaking of biology, the homosexual relations dosen't have a production feature, just pleasure or lewd needed.

Compared with another needs of humans, for example, hungry or thirst. Homosexuality is just the need of sex, but as desviation, humans have hungry and thirst, but theys find out and reliaze of certain aliment and drinks are more pleasure than other, so they change their habits of consume, and excess, now, if you add a social structre with classes and hierarchies, you get a vice which affecte and harmed the persona who practiquet it or the society in where is paratiqued by one, with the before example you have alcholicsm, tabacism, drugs, obesity, the only difference is the class where these apperece.

And fow what homosexuality cause harm, well, not for oneself but the society, homosexuality aren't and won't form part of production system, and for the revolution the same problem is heredic, because, you'll need new socialists if you want lead a new society. Homosexuals cannot be part of production, and their activity is denigrand for socialits values, and that's why I considere a vice. Perphaps migth be wrong, nevertheless this discución just be proof with facts, and the only facts we have is the expirience in URSS with this topic in first year, and don't work and don't fit with the system.

Jaxon Lee
Jaxon Lee

10/10
Now consider material constraints
We are fast approaching 10 billion people on this green and blue covered rock floating in space that we call earth

What level of population should an international scientific socialism support, what about a communist Terra (leaving aside a full communist Terra on the assumption we'll be reaching for the stars at this point)?

Parker Miller
Parker Miller

Because liberalism is a bourgeois ideology and the modern structure of the homosexual relationship is a liberal one
I was really looking forward to some hard hitting theory. What a disappointment TBH.

Oliver Lopez
Oliver Lopez

What level of population should an international scientific socialism support, what about a communist Terra (leaving aside a full communist Terra on the assumption we'll be reaching for the stars at this point)?
Communism should do away with reproduction entirely and humanity should die out comfortably.

Leo Moore
Leo Moore

Why are people responding to the sexpol trolls again?

Oh and Bernie died inside when the USSR fell. He knows the writing on the wall, socialism as a force with teeth is dead and he has to roll with the punches. I kind of like the guy, but he has no chance in hell of winning, and he'd be a pretty lousy president. Guy can give a stump speech and do some campaigning, but he doesn't have it in him to make any of his plans work even with a cooperative Congress (and that isn't going to be a thing, they'll be 100% dead set against him and the two parties will join forces to work over his head).

Trump isn't winning 2020 unless the Democrats engage in monumental stupidity to top 2016. Of course, it's Democrats, so they can always find a way to fail harder. Trump has pissed off some elements of his base already and shown that he's just another neolib. They'll certainly try to fabricate the same narrative, but it will just be that little bit less effective.
The only way I see Trump winning is either Hillary Clinton loudly inserting herself into the process and selling her neoconservative shit that no one anywhere likes, or actually selecting Bernie to represent them in which case the professional class base of Dems will leave en masse. The left doesn't have a choice, the centrists do and have shown they would back Trump the moment they have a convenient pretext.

Disable AdBlock to view this page

Disable AdBlock to view this page

Confirm your age

This website may contain content of an adult nature. If you are under the age of 18, if such content offends you or if it is illegal to view such content in your community, please EXIT.

Enter Exit

About Privacy

We use cookies to personalize content and ads, to provide social media features and to analyze our traffic. We also share information about your use of our site with our advertising and analytics partners.

Accept Exit