Why God in OT commanded Israelites to genocide these wicked tribes when he could do it himself like he did with Sodom...

Why God in OT commanded Israelites to genocide these wicked tribes when he could do it himself like he did with Sodom and Gomorrah? These tribes deserved to die, there is no doubt about it, but why it had to be this way? Killing people is heavy on human mind no matter how justified and righteous it could be. These Israelites executing Gods commands had to suffer PTSD we cant even imagine from all this violence they had to do.

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molinism
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To show them firsthand the consequences of sin. Remember that they were on the receiving end of it a few centuries later.

Because if they wouldn't, they would end up as degenerate as them. Also let's not forget the reasons that are listed in Leviticus for extermination, such as child sacrifices, incest, bestiality, sacred prostitution and so on and so forth.

Let's all stop pretending we can know God's heart

As if we aren't explicitly told why, as pointed out.

But isnt taking vengeance against the Word of God? Lets see:

Leviticus 19:18
'You shall not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the sons of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself; I am the LORD.

Deuteronomy 32:35
'Vengeance is Mine, and retribution, In due time their foot will slip; For the day of their calamity is near, And the impending things are hastening upon them.'

Proverbs 20:22
Do not say, "I will repay evil"; Wait for the LORD, and He will save you.

Proverbs 24:29
Do not say, "Thus I shall do to him as he has done to me; I will render to the man according to his work."

Romans 12:17
Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Carefully consider what is right in the eyes of everybody.


This is my biggest obstacle in my path to holiness. We truly have no idea who God is and how he think. We only hope that he will have mercy with us and thats why we struggle every day in this terrible, terrible world to keep Gods commandments. Also, what Jesus meant by pic related?

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What on Earth is sacred prostitution?

These are valid under certain conditions. God for example told us to follow our rulers, but Mary and Joseph for example fled to Egypt to escape King Herod's sinful judgement.

God's word is his final authority. When he told the Israelites to commit genocide, it would have been more sinful for them not to have done so.

Tl;Dr: Sacred prostitution is a term for certain rituals in pagan religions that involve sexual acts (not always heterosexual and sometimes even involved bestiality). They are usually connected to fertility rites and certain form of fetishism of animals, who were thought to be representatives of gods.

Because they were wicked. And techinally the ancient Isrealites never did follow God's law to the 't' as many Isrealites gave these wicked people mercy. What followed afterwards was a slow but deliberate subversion of the souls of Israel. Which eventually lead to Jeremiah giving the Isrealites the bad news about their inevitable re-enslavement.

That was done in the Old Testament to set up what we see today. That is the conflict between Israel and surrounding countries. And why you ask. This is to bring to light the promise God has made to His people (all people who believe and follow His son Jesus as Lord and Savior).

(Checked)
Based post

When Christ came to bear everyones suffering, that suffering included the dreadful feeling of Gods absence. Naturally God never truly abandoned him (considering He Himself is God), but the "black grace" of Gods silence was felt by Christs human nature, as we do in our own lives. By referencing Psalm 22 in his true human agony and suffering, he not only again cements the prophecy of his coming, but fulfills completely his fellowship with us by sharing in one of the worst feelings the soul can endure - thus his confirmation right after with

also its super metal

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I don't get it?

God came to solve a problem he caused(by being omniscient), everything is for his ego

Didn't know Adam and Eve were part of the Trinity.

Lrn2Molinism/Via media

Of course it is, dummy. Psalm 148 perfectly encapsulates this.

Damn it, can't you just learn some theology and try to look like you know whatyou are talking about?

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Free will is an excuse, he knows the choice before it happens or he is not all-knowing

What exactly is so wrong about Child Sacrifice again? Didn't God order Abraham to do it?

Your reddit tier understanding of free will and time relations strikes again. First of all, God is outside time-space. He is always all-time present. Second of all, if one knows what will happen, doesnt mean anything for a free will. If you rewatch movie several times, you dont actually force or even influence actors that participate in them actors did it themselves, even if you financed the filmmaking.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molinism
>>>/reddit/


Because besides the immorality of the practise itself, it was done for the benefit of demons.
The point of the Abraham story isn't just about the man being tested on his faith, but serves as a type of the Passion.
The point that is missed is that Abraham didn't go that far because he didn't need to.

Who you serve is who you worship matthew 4:8-10 and by extension glorify 1 corinthians 1:31. The israelites, as part of the espoused chaste virgins to Christ 2 corinthians 11:2, were taking the name of their husband, God, and by extension doing His will by serving Him like a wife serves a husband. Thereby God gets the glory when they obeyed Him. So it technically is like if God Himself killed those people as God gets the glory IF those Christians were acting in His name as a espoused chaste virgin to Christ. Just like a wife is said to be doing what Her husband says and her husband gets the glory for her being a good housewife/insert action here. This is like how authority works, who you serve is who you worship. Don't take authority/marry from Satan to serve/worship/glorify the Devil. But rather do/take on the name of Jesus in marriage and serve/worship/glorify Him.
Remember 1 corinthians 7:19

revelation 4:11
You were saying?

646423
I'm not going to give a (you) to hafizposting moron, but I'll point out that this verse means that God made Creation, because he wanted so and is translated so in the English bibles, as well as in bible n my language.
biblehub.com/revelation/4-11.htm

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Literally heresy

A movie is scripted and never changes, the very same thing is this creation

Of course, it cannot be predicted by men the future because they are inside the creation, but the creator knows everything if he is the very first creator

God knew adam and eve would fall, knew the devil before its creation, knew every bad thing before it happened

Every atrocious torture he allowed it

Where?

Do you even know what analogy is? or are you so literal in everything? No analogy is perfect, I used movie analogy for that specific example
God set the stage, but we are the screenwriters and actors.


so you rather prefer to be like animals, preprogramed with mere basic instincts and nothing more and act as a robot? Because this is what you are advocating for. Dont blame the Creator if His creation uses free will wrong way. Especially since those who would fell, knew the results that it would bring.

He probably buy into "Law vs. Gospel" and "Work covenant" heresies himself and project it unto faith.

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You are both wrong, what that picture is talking about aren't true laws, but rather are hebrews 9:19
They are leveticus 18:4
The actual law(s) are recorded in romans 7:25, the law of sin/romans 6:23 and the law of God/faith/romans 3:26-27

You keep ignore the very basic foundation of logic which is for every effect there is a cause

If God is the first cause of everything, then we are an effect of this cause and therefore he can predict everything

Oh, good Lord, Whats even the point of your post? Yes, I know that God is omniscient and knows the future, since he is outside time-space and there is no need to use logic to post WHAT WE ALREADY KNOW.
I am writing one thing, and you are reading it as totally different. This is just reddit tier of reading comprehension.

Therefore we have no free-will, only an apparent illusion of self-determination but all we do is following the script

Oh, good Lord, we are back to stage one. NO, the fact that he knows all, doesnt mean that we dont decide on our volition. It is you who make the decision, it is you that out of all possible realities, choose that exact one to be real. WE ARE THE ONES WHO WRITE THE SCRIPT.

In such a case God wouldn't know the future for sure but only every possibility, making him not omniscient

An omniscient God knows your choice before you take it, he doesn't just know the possibilities but the actual outcome

We can choose to disobey God though. Even if God already "knows" what our choice will be or won't be or the outcome of that choice we still have that choice to obey or disobey God. God doesn't want us to perish ezekiel 18:21,23,32
Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.
So turn to the Lord GOD, and live.

Explain then.

You are wrong. Saint crealy speaks about true law, for even thoug law of moses was not perfect, it was still true.
Ah you are the guy who claim that God is irrational. Then to repet:
I know for a fact that everytime we discuss omniscience and foreknowledge of God there will be at least one reatard who would claim that it means that we have no free will.
Did my forknowlage caused you to be a retard?

It is written (Sirach 15:14): "God made man from the beginning, and left him in the hand of his own counsel" therefore Man has free-will: otherwise counsels, exhortations, commands, prohibitions, rewards, and punishments would be in vain.
In order to make this evident, we must observe that some things act without judgment; as a stone moves downwards; and in like manner all things which lack knowledge. And some act from judgment, but not a free judgment; as brute animals. For the sheep, seeing the wolf, judges it a thing to be shunned, from a natural and not a free judgment, because it judges, not from reason, but from natural instinct. And the same thing is to be said of any judgment of brute animals.
But man acts from judgment, because by his apprehensive power he judges that something should be avoided or sought. But because this judgment, in the case of some particular act, is not from a natural instinct, but from some act of comparison in the reason, therefore he acts from free judgment and retains the power of being inclined to various things. For reason in contingent matters may follow opposite courses, as we see in dialectic syllogisms and rhetorical arguments. Now particular operations are contingent, and therefore in such matters the judgment of reason may follow opposite courses, and is not determinate to one. And forasmuch as man is rational is it necessary that man have a free-will.

If he knows it, the choice already happened basically, it's like saying 2+2 can make 5 no it doesn't

If he doesn't know it, he is not omniscient

Did you fail logics class? How does the fact that we write the script, contradicts the statement, that he knows the script? These two points dont even connect.
And how does the fact, that he knows that outcome, contradicts the fact, that it was you who made the decision in the first place? IT DOESNT. It is is still you that chooses which reality to be true, God knows, but you are the one that is taking the decision. It is still your will that is working here.
At this point I see absolutely no point to continue our conversation. You fail even the basics of logics and cant even choose two points to connect to eachother. Ths is just moving in pointless circles

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He knows what you will write as well, because he is omniscient. Different would be if he is not omniscient but only all-seeing.

He is the cause of you if he is the creator of all things.

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my last reply to (you)
Yes, what WE WILL WRITE, WITH OUR FREE WILL. This is our choice that we do this or do not. You are deciding, you are writing and omniscience doesnt mean that it isnt you who is making the choice.
And yet again, you try to apply human logic to the divine, without even comprehending that human logic. Yes, He is my cause, but He granted me free will to decide. The fact that I was made by Him, doesnt mean that I am a puppet. He made me from nothing and gave me free will to decide. And if you will say that Omnipotent God cant make beings with free will, then there is literally nothing to talk about.

Now I have to go, I have to sleep for tomorrow lectures and yet here I am on 4AM arguing with someone who failed his logics class.

He did, indeed, know all of the choices people would make, but if prevented them from acting on those choices free will would have no meaning. It would be a joke.

Our choice doesn't come from nothing, it comes from a cause, God is the very first cause and he knows your choice as well if he is omniscient.

Your decision is not a random sparkle of the void, but the very reasoning of a software, a software started by the programmer(God). Since you believe everything was created.


This is the same of saying "can God make a rock he is not able to lift?", he would stop being omnipotent by the very moment he makes it.

In addedum 1 samuel 15:22-23
You have the choice to "reject" the word of the LORD, to obey or to disobey God. Even though God already knows all the possible outcomes of all the possible choices. The intent is to galatians 4:8-9
Be known of God, and know Him and accept His word in obeidience. Rather then rejecting His word and disobeying. This is why in revelation 22:11 God mentions
Because 1 corinthians 3:6-9

If God is both the creator and the all-knowing all-foreesing infinite entity the bible talks about, then you have no free will.

Is simply a fact, you are the effect of a cause a very mathematical operation undergoing at microcosmic levels.

Unless God has given up omniscience the moment he made you, you are a very complex robot.

all-foreseeing*

isaiah 1:18
If we are robots, why did God give us this choice to obey him or not to obey him? Why does God say "Come now, and let us reason together"? Wouldn't this just be to clarify to the observer that he is or isn't obeying God? Which is to say having been known of God?

If you see someone jump, you know for certain that they are going to come back down to earth. But you did are not the one causing them to come back down, they did that of their own free will. Do you understand?

To add even more to that, God "made" the apostles "choice" in acts 15:8
Which is in reference that althought they choose a decision, God was and is still in control and could do whatever He wanted with that "choice" even though the apostles made it. God still "knew" all the outcomes and still was able to control them if He so willed.

In my personal view the bible is mythology, you are taking for literal a fantasy book with its very contradictions. That's my point overall.


I only suppose he will come back down to earth because I am used to gravity, but I can't foreseen the unexpected.

If God removed gravity the very moment he jumps he would outsmart my prediction, that's the difference. I have a probability(99%+ in this case), God has the actual final result.

What are you doing here then Satan? Begone!

I can believe some parts of it, it is a collection of books from different writers with mixed mythological and historical contexts.

I am not really here to debate the bible-worshippers but the catholics who pretend to defend with pure reason their gods.

Matthew 12:33

Again I don't care about you bible-worshippers is the same thing of debating quran with a muslim

First thing first. Law is a rule and measure of acts, whereby man is induced to act or is restrained from acting: for "lex" [law] is derived from "ligare" [to bind], because it binds one to act. Percept is application of law for it comes "percipere" [understand]. Percepts are particualr laws of the Law.

But then I must ask you, did you even read Heb 9:19? To quote thee:

Law of God is eternal law. But we who are not eternal participate in it. First - naturally by natural law. Second by revelation of things higher than us by divine law. But Divine law is twolf - there is Old and New law. And bassed on that there is human law.
As for law of sin - the law, as to its essence, resides in him that rules and measures; but, by way of participation, in that which is ruled and measured; so that every inclination or ordination which may be found in things subject to the law, is called a law by participation.
Now those who are subject to a law may receive a twofold inclination from the lawgiver.
First, in so far as he directly inclines his subjects to something; sometimes indeed different subjects to different acts; in this way we may say that there is a military law and a mercantile law.
Secondly, indirectly; thus by the very fact that a lawgiver deprives a subject of some dignity, the latter passes into another order, so as to be under another law, as it were: thus if a soldier be turned out of the army, he becomes a subject of rural or of mercantile legislation.

Accordingly under the Divine Lawgiver various creatures have various natural inclinations, so that what is, as it were, a law for one, is against the law for another: thus I might say that fierceness is, in a way, the law of a dog, but against the law of a sheep or another meek animal.
And so the law of man, which, by the Divine ordinance, is allotted to him, according to his proper natural condition, is that he should act in accordance with reason: and this law was so effective in the primitive state, that nothing either beside or against reason could take man unawares.
But when man turned his back on God, he fell under the influence of his sensual impulses: in fact this happens to each one individually, the more he deviates from the path of reason, so that, after a fashion, he is likened to the beasts that are led by the impulse of sensuality, according to Psalm 48:21: "Man, when he was in honor, did not understand: he hath been compared to senseless beasts, and made like to them."

So, then, this very inclination of sensuality which is called the "law of sin," in other animals has simply the nature of a law (yet only in so far as a law may be said to be in such things), by reason of a direct inclination.
But in man, it has not the nature of law in this way, rather is it a deviation from the law of reason.
But since, by the just sentence of God, man is destitute of original justice, and his reason bereft of its vigor, this impulse of sensuality, whereby he is led, in so far as it is a penalty following from the Divine law depriving man of his proper dignity, has the nature of a law.
Natural law is participation in eternal law of God by natural means. Anything that does not meet this definition is not natural law.
14 For when the Gentiles, who have not the law, do by nature those things that are of the law; these having not the law are a law to themselves:
15 Who shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness to them, and their thoughts between themselves accusing, or also defending one another,
As for Romans 3:26-27 I apologise, I've seen 2 in place of 3.
So to make it up:Divine law spoken about in Romans 3 and Natural law in Romans 2 is part of the same Eternal law.
If you have read what you quote in context you would see that:

This is useful.

No its not. You can prove a muslim a liar with laughable ease.

Some people, yikes.

The Quran was written 200 years after m**med, the resurrection of Christ is better cross-documented event than the existence of Plato and Aristotle. Which were preserved by the true Church, by the way.
The j*ws took their broken telephone number to thousands of years in the Talm*d. When in my 4th grade class it only took Timothy 20 seconds to change one of the words for ass, the j*ws claim it was never changed.
Talk about a false equivalent.

Watch a Case for Christ. There's a book but a 14 year old like you only watches youtube videos, so the movie might actually catch your attention.

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I already know the quran is a book of lies/mythology, what you don't know is the bible is too

Prove your claim. Otherwise thou are a liar who should have been banned for not being a christian nor having ears to hear long ago. At this point maybe some lurkers might be edified.

I've already proven to you the very basic contradictions of your God as described in the bible, if you don't want to understand it I don't force you to do so

Nothing good comes out when you mix mythology with actual facts, irrationality is only the beginning

Which post proves it? I don't see it and I searched all posts here with the ID 15f25f . The one that even comes close is but is explained by and which TLDR; God knows and still controls the possible outcome, but sometime He lets his espoused chaste virgin, pseudo because of espoused, wives make a decision that is within His control and will which He already foreknew.

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Context m8. "I form the light, and create darkness, I make peace, and create evil". Evil here is opposed to peace like light to darkness. Thus evil means lack of peace like darkness means lack of light.
It's totally difrent from your claim that God commanded Moses to jusge injustly, to worsahip not holy and to have moral code that is evil. For that you claimed - that law of Moses is evil and sin.
You do know that we talk about Romans 6? And that End of this chapter is end of thought? And you do know that Paul already told you what he means by law of sin? (hint: it's have little fo witht Rom 6)
Are you? We don't talk about Romans 7 here.

Because sometimes Christians need to take genociding into their own hands.
Nah, only modern snowflakes suffer PTSD.

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Well, no shit. Law of Gospel is harsh. Ever heard about Sermon on the Mount? Burden and yoke of Christ is as much sweet and light as much charity moves us inwardly to do what Law commands outwardly.
Romans 7, Galatians 3