So one thing that really stumps me is why Satan is evil depsite knowing the world will end. This really gets in my way of believing in a literal Satan. Why would Satan, who truly knows, not just has faith that Jesus is God's son and God is all-powerful and will eventually destroy all evil, choose to be evil? It doesn't make sense to me. I know humans choose to be evil usually because they are blind or blissfully ignorant but Satan knows.
So one thing that really stumps me is why Satan is evil depsite knowing the world will end...
Ian Bennett
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Cameron Martinez
Addicts know drugs are hurting them but they still do them. Maybe at one point he didn't know for sure and made evil his habit.
Or maybe he just wants to take people down with him, if he is hopeless, like a suicide bomber or pilot who wants to take everyone on board down.
Daniel James
You've just never met the truly evil. There are indeed, live humans, that understand goodness and have rejected it. They hurt others: serial killers, etc. and now what they do is evil. They know it will return nothing but more despair and pain - but right now it brings them power and that's the only thing left that they can feel.
It's a choice for the now because they believe eternity will either never come or will be as bad as the present. They need their fix while they can get it. I assume Satan is like that.
Christian Wilson
He's completely insane with pride, that's why.
Xavier Hall
Thank you the addiction metaphor helps me to understand somwhat better.
I understand but most of them don't believe in an afterlife. They're usually nihlist. It seems like Satan, directly knowing God can't be a nihlist because he knows God is all knowing and all powerful and the truth. He knows God is good.
Daniel Foster
This is a good explanation as well. I can see this. Do you know where you heard that? I'd be interesting in reading more.
Ryan Gutierrez
I read somwhere that once he chose to rebel his will became fixed same for the obedient angels
Easton Ward
the new testament says we will be judging the angels too. If they deserve judgement then there is a chance they can be saved too, I don't see why not, if they are rational and spiritual beings like we are. Being judged means you can choose right from wrong and potentially be redeemed, otherwise they would simply be damned.
No?
Adam Sanchez
I asked my pastor this same question, about if there is something unique about angel's free will. He told me that have the same free will as humans however their spiritual nature is different from humans. Similar to how Adem and Eve changed in the fall of man, an angel will change when it becomes a fallen angel. Whether a fallen angel has redemption is tough to say.
if Fallen angels have redemption, Satan most likely wouldn't take it, hes pretty confident seeing as how he tried to tempt Jesus, who has authority over all angels and demons. If fallen angels don't have redemption then they made a terrible choice in rebelling against God, just like Humanity did when they fell. Also Satan created Sin, if you look at the end of creation, it describes it as "and God made everything, and it was good", so sin didn't exist until Eden (labor did exist in Eden).
drmsh.com
This lends to Angels having salvation, unless it's referring to a church as angelic
>1 “To the angel of the church in Ephesus write: ‘The words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand, who walks among the seven golden lampstands. 2 “ ‘I know your works, your toil and your patient endurance, and how you cannot bear with those who are evil, but have tested those who call themselves apostles and are not, and found them to be false. 3 I know you are enduring patiently and bearing up for my name’s sake, and you have not grown weary. 4 But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first. 5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent. 6 Yet this you have: you hate the works of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate. 7 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who conquers I will grant to eat of the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.’
This says their salvation might be different, since Jesus has supremacy over angels, yet being also human he benefits the salvation of humanity. Hes is like a human and celestial bridge for humanity.
I'll ask my pastor about this again, hes an admirable Christian whose has studied and earned his pastor name.
Could you site this in the bible? I would be kind of sad that the fallen angel rebellion was a "point of no return" for them.
Oliver Gutierrez
It's pride, user. Think of someone who is very prideful and try to remember times when they were wrong. For example, have you ever argued with someone about something that they've realized is obviously wrong but who refused to accept they were wrong? Satan is the most prideful being in existence because he knows that God is all powerful but refuses to accept that he will win in the end.
Parker Hill
Angels are already present with God and know him, meaning that their rejection is final.
As for why, well, pride is overexaggeration of oneself, and thats his sin. He is blinded by his pride. There s a story about some monastic (on Mount Athos or in Egypt, I dont remember correctly) who was visited by the devil and began talking to him. Monk asked "can you repent?". Devil said "yes". Then monk said "Then repent" after which devil laughed and started boasting about how great he is and so on and so forth, after which monk banished him. I dont remember the story exactly, but you get the point.
end this retarded meme
Landon Howard
That is about that we will have authority over angels. Greek word for "to judge" also means "to govern" and it is most likely that we should use it in this context.
David Thompson
see . Satan doesnt "collect souls", all of Mankind belongs to God only, our Father and this idiotic meme needs to end.
Satan didnt create anything. Sin doesnt exist on its own, its a mere deficiency of Good. This sounds as idiotic as someone creating Empty or Vacuum, which is emptiness on its own. This statement is only one step away from full blown dualism.
Why do protestants fail at theology so horribly?
Jace Nguyen
Go back to school and learn how to read
Nathan Smith
Why do you wilfully commit sin despite knowing that you grieve the Holy Spirit and will be judged for those sins?
Aiden White
Some people are short-sighted in their actions, since Satan is often attributed with negative traits, guess we shouldn't be surprise that he would be to.
Personally, I never thought of Satan as an "Equal" to the creator of the universe, and thought of the devil in revelations to be opportunists willingly fulfilling a roll against Christianity in the final days of Earth.
I recently found this Carelinks ministry site ( realdevil.info
Daniel Parker
Like Humans Angels too could have free will.. let’s not forget Satan/Lucifer is the fallen angel. Maybe he thinks he has chance. But there’s no chance. God will reign supreme for ever.
Jack Hughes
Enjoy your ban, latent gn*stic
Austin Diaz
Satan does what Satan does because he's basically an edgy, rebellious teenager who's throwing a suicidal temper-tantrum on a cosmic scale. If you stop thinking of Satan as a well adjusted, rational adult it all starts making sense.
Eli Cook
Because he likes it.
Parker Thompson
Is this not a spiritual battle? Of course you can't actually give your soul to Satan since it belongs to God, that doesn't mean you can't lose your soul in a spiritual battle.
What peace of God, what love for one another. All that post said was that i heard that fallen angels don't have redemption, and if that is so than that could be why Satan "collects" souls (as said above even though our souls belong to God, that doesn't mean we can't lose our souls, that is what it's called "salvation"). Stop jumping at any chance to ban someone trying to understand, and actually look into what Gnosticism is before charging any possible definition of it.
If what i heard was so wrong than simply correct me, part of the point of posting here is to test what i have learned from my church. There is no need to get so defensive about it.
Jaxson Reyes
Insanity can get someone guilty of committing crimes off the hook though?
Sounds like me..
I can, and again I view this as a form of insanity and mental illness, maybe he knows in the bottom of his heart he acts against his conscience insisting he's in the right, but honestly it more seems like the case he's actually blind (i.e. disabled in a way and I therefore question how culpable he is). Maybe my internal empathy (or sympathy alwys get them confused) monitor is oversensitive
always been aware of this general use/meaning of the word but looks like an interesting site thanks for the link
Ryder Hughes
Hell, despite knowing it's going to lose, seems to be in a race against Heaven to drag as many people as it can down with it before closing time. Surely you've seen a spiteful kid that would break a toy to prevent another to play with it, this is the same principle. This is actually how inferior the forces of Hell are; despite being from Heaven and having the potential of grand intellect in the past, their ultimate goal is so simple and stupid in nature. It's shocking just how many people willingly sign up for assistance from these complete cosmic losers in the ultimate sense. But then complete losers in humanity today have much power and are feted on the internet where the honorable are marginalized, so as it is mirrored in the divine.
Serial killers are insane, usually. Evil things, but usually more akin to a bulldozer going through your house or your neighbors for no good reason, still terrifying if you are in the way of it. When you meet a really evil person of the mold you should be concerned about, you might not even know it unless they make a tell…the feel of an evil spirit or soul is unmistakable.
Gabriel Butler
I think he's a spiteful idiot. Look at the Book of Job or Zechariah, he keeps accusing men who have the Lord's favor of being wicked sinners even when he's obviously wrong and will draw the Lord's anger by doing so.
Tyler Reyes
Yes they're stupid, but in what way? Inherently or are they just not thinking clearly? And if they're just not thinking clearly, who's to say they're actually able to think clearly at all and it's not just in their nature (/a result of their nuture - see below) that they would be evil? These points in your post ring with but don't respond to what I posted here (appreciate you weren't resopnding to me in the first place, I just want to press this for discussion) re: who can be held responsible for their nature - the kids like that, and the one I brought to mind (now a grown man) in my third reply in my post seem to be like that because they were spoilt. From my experience with him (he's been a friend since I was a small boy) spoiling kids and not learning when to say no is the utmost descructive thing you can do in parenting. Point being, it was his environment, nurture, rather than nature that made him like that, i.e. he was delt an extreme disadvantage compared to say, me, who wasn't raised that way, when it comes to this. Compared to me, he was literally dis-abled in able to make the right choices. And what started off as a thing as a boy from being spoilt and learning that he could always have his way, it then becomes pic related and what user here re evil being borne of habit - I'm not trying to excuse him or anyone like that (nor myself on the understanding I'm still a sinful person), like I said in second reply, this sounds like me, I've got my own sin problems (and, knowing my sinful inclining nature as a man I know all of us have by virtue of being of man) - but then I lean heavely to the monergistic view of salvation whereby I think we're helpless in our sin unless God actually formerly intervenes in our nature with an irrestiable call. It doesn't mean that I won't continue to pray for my friend and give up hope for his salvation, but his way and other's evil ways provides an indication of backing for the passage that refers to God making some of us as vessels of wrath prepared for desctruction.
To me it seems that, ultimately we can explain away the problem of evil philosophically all well and good, but as to the question of why satan rebelled, given the circumstances, I just don't think there's an answer, not in this life, maybe in the next, but then again maybe not. Sproul confirms as such in this lecture.
William Rodriguez
pic related
Jace Perez
St Thomas Aquinas teaches that free will is the choice between two goods. The will cannot actually choose evil because evil is not actually anything but the defect of good. Thus to sin, the will must move the intellect to perceive the evil as a good and then it can choose it. This is called delusion. That's right, to sin we must become stupider and delusional.
Satan is delusional in the area of pride, he thinks he is greater than God and can win.
Brayden Allen
Because he hates God and its a pleasure for him to hurt Him by stealing souls from Him. He couldn't care less since his fate is already decided so he is trying to create the biggest possible damege. Basically crashing mankind with no survivors.
Lucas Price
Insanity only gets people off the hook as far as declaring that they're incapable of correct judgement and need to be adjusted or locked up.
Kayden Walker
Agreed. The crux of the matter is that Satan and all beings like him ultimately see the good of doing one's own will as the highest relative to the actual highest good which is doing God's will. “There are only two kinds of people in the end: those who say to God, "Thy will be done," and those to whom God says, in the end, "Thy will be done."
Doing God's will isn't easy. It can be painful to admit how wrong you've been and to make that commitment to truly change the course of your life, which up to that point has been synonymous with your entire identity. It means a total self-renunciation.
John Howard
Also, angels are not exactly like humans. The text in the attached image explains the essential differences and is taken from this page:
edwardfeser.blogspot.com
Jose Richardson
Satan is the ultimate "My Will" guy.
Jesus is the ultimate "Thy Will" guy.
They're kinda like the brothers in the Prodigal Son story.
Jesus is the good guy who stays with his Father and does His Will.
Satan thinks he knows best and goes and blows all his money on blackjack, coke and hookers.
Jesus submits to the will of the Father.
Satan refuses to submit.
The whole of Judao-Christian thought could be summed up as "Father knows best".
Alexander Thomas
Ever heard the phrase "cutting your nose off to spite your face"? There's probably been at least one time in your life that your pride got the better of you and instead of accepting you're wrong you double down even when you're just shooting yourself in the foot. Satan is like that. His pride is so strong that he won't accept he's wrong, he'd rather burn for eternity then say "Sorry God, I was in error". He's the epitome of pride and spite.
Jayden Garcia
I said this in another thread but it bears repeating. You know the kid who breaks other kids toys and stomps his foot? Sound familiar? If you are going to lose, take as many with you as possible.
Isaiah Collins
Maybe he knows something you don't.
Blake Cook
Fake term
Satanists and their millions of subdivisions, gaytheists, fagnostics, edgelords, pagan larpers, kikes, Mormons etc do the will of their father as well, just their father is Satan. He's the ultimate liar and god to all children of pride which unfortunately is most of the world. The choice isn't really obedience or rebellion it's which to obey.
edgy
Charles Reyes
winnie the pooh off, latent gn*stic
Adrian Morales
Ephesians 2:2
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
James 4:7
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
Revelation 12:9
nd the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
etc etc etc
Stop being pretentious
Jacob Jackson
Nice, everyone can do this. How about this one
"I have said ye are gods and all of you are children of the most high"
See, Mormonism is true according to that…
How about you actually consult with the priest and bishop about this, instead of using your retarded headcanon?
Logan Garcia
and what did I use my "retarded headcanon" for? People see Satan as some cool guy rebellion against the Father and I'm saying by denying Christ you're just making yourself a servant of Satan. And I'm right. Oooh such blasphemy! How dare I!
What's wrong with you people?
Lincoln Morgan
Here. You are making up a retarded dualistic system with two opposite sides and nearing idiotic religious systems such as Manicheism. You and all of your american protestant pals.
Nicholas Richardson
On what level of prelest are you, my pr*testants pal?
Jack Parker
ism this ism that, Can you deny Christ and be saved? This isn't that complicated.
oh I get it, you're still mad people read the Bible
We got ourselves some fired up defenders of the faith here, ready to bring souls to Christ. Good job guys. I feel God's everlasting love just pouring through you two and if I was an outsider I'd be really impressed. I mean really. Nicely done. I'm sure this is exactly the sort of thing Jesus had in mind.
Jack Anderson
Are you accusing Christ of being a dualist then by making the same point?
There isn't a hint of dualism nor elevation of satan in this.