First off, I'm absolutely against homosexuality of any kind.
I know the Bible verses that talk about it, I've seen some quotes of the Church Fathers, even in my conscience I can say that it's bad.
But I don't understand how it's bad exactly. The Bible verses pretty much only say that homosexuality is bad because it's bad, because it's an abomination etc.. The Church Father quotes I've seen are pretty much the same, just expanded. I've searched on youtube and the search engine but did not find anything else, which is why I'm asking here.
I'm going to repeat once again that I'm fully against homosexuality and agree with Church teaching; the fact that God says it's a sin is enough for me to believe it to be a sin, but I want to UNDERSTAND why it is so, and why it is as bad as they say it is, so I can oppose it even more.
How exactly is homosexuality evil?
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Its brain fungus. It is literally a cancer of the brain.
Don't hate the gays, pray and pity them dearly.
But don't enable them and hope the world will find a way to cure itself of this carnal bullshit.
A reason is that it is entirely unnatural and the opposite of what any healthy organism would want to do. If the ultimate goal of mating is to reproduce, then it is counterproductive to mankind to have members that are choosing to only mate with those of the same sex and not reproduce. Bonus: the only way for gays to have sex is sodomy (sexual intercourse involving anal or oral copulation) so they're sodomites too.
Basically the problem with homosexuality is that even in principle it can not produce children.
Thus the sexual act between the two men or two women are reduced from an act of creating new life to an act of base lust in principle.
Now I personally believe that sex is okay as long as it's an act of genuine love within a marriage, but even so you must allow the possibility of pregnancy, because true love means to accept all consequences of your love without trying to find a way out.
But since homos cant get married and they cant have babies either, the only relationship between them that would not be sinful is one of genuine and true love, which doesn't require sex at all whatsoever.
However that is both incredibly rare and hard to develop in a world where people treat each other as replacable cum-recepticles.
Homosexuality is not evil. It's just a disorder. An accident. Some people are born colourblind and some people are born mentally disabled. Homos are born sexually misaligned. We should try to cure them, not condemn them.
newadvent.org
Article 11 and 12 is what you're looking for
1. It is unnatural. Men are meant to "lie" with women, and women with men. Men and men, or women and women is contrary to the biological design of the human body.
2. It is (for men) exceedingly unhygienic, this point also stands for buggery in general.
3. Being an unnatural practice, it also tends to lead to other deviant sexual practices. You rarely see a homosexual that isn't interested in other deviant things.
4. Sex is meant for reproduction primarily, something which homosexual relations necessarily cannot accomplish.
Something being against our (fallen) nature does not make it sinful by itself. Most of us struggle with lust and it seems to be a biological/mental urge rather than something we choose to have. It can only be tempered by faith, God's grace and a virtous life. If you don't do anything about it it's going to overwhelm you and you'll likely do fornication and/or masturbation. So you could say that lust is a part of our nature, something we automatically have without choosing it and we have to actively oppose this nature.
Similar thing with wrath, when someone does something bad/annoying etc to us it is very easy to react wrathfully, violently - making it seem almost natural. We have to actively fight against this urge.
Also, isn't fasting something you can consider unnatural? You're depriving yourself of food, making your body weaker to strenghten your spirit and you have to fight the urge to eat. It is obviously good, yet it seems unnatural and no living thing other than humans practices it.
Perhaps I'm getting this wrong, but I don't think something being unnatural to us automatically makes it a sin. So it's not enough of an argument.
I'll look into it, thanks
I agree with all of these, but what I still don't get is why it's apparently much worse than some other sins. Based on what I've heard from some Catholic priests on youtube and read in the aforementioned quotes, it seems to be one of the worst sins you can commit and I don't understand why that is.
Kill yourself.
explains it. Summa Theologica is generally the best text to consult if you need theological answers (after the Bible, of course).
Homosexuality = birth defect, thereby natural anomaly, balanced through nature by being a evolutionary dead end.
Sodomy = entirely selfish act, dehumanization of the significant other, abusive in nature, leads to corruption of natural sexuality
That would be a grave sin.
For you.
You're a faithful guy
Man is the image and likeness of God, and man's body is the temple of the Holy Spirit. The sacred things are within man himself, with the most naked man in the wildest jungle, just as much as they are within the most monumental churches. Union between man and woman is sacred, because it gives life to new man. Fornication profanes it, homosexuality profanes it even more.
Wow, this reads exactly like the Talmud. No wonder everyone hates Catholicism.
It is an inversion of natural order user.
The purpose of sex is procreation. It also helps strengthen the relationship between man and woman in marriage, they are one flesh. There's mystery - creating a new life, through connection of man and woman, upon selfless love. The man finds the traits he tends to lack (complete devotion, distilled love) in a woman, and woman vice versa (strength, confidence, …) It's almost as if men and women should join together into one flesh that should resemble the divine greatness to raise another generation of mankind.
As I say it is a great mystery and if on thinks of marriage, sexuality in christian perspective you end up just praising God for how great he is.
Now compare it to forms that make all this sterile: Hook up culture, masturbation, porn, wildest perversions…and sodomy. You take something so powerful and mysterious and you make it sterile so it serves no higher purpose. Just your hedonism. Man's seed is supposed to come into a woman and create life. It is literally a life giving liquid. Just think how God thought about everything, and made a human into his image.
Now a sodomite does not care for anything like this. His hedonism is enough for him. Even if it means sticking his penis into someone's rectum, literally spilling the life giving liquid provided by God, to feces. Imagine how incredibly disgusting that is. Is it not satanic in itself? Putting seed into utter waste of your organism. It's like taking a delicious meal that could feed homeless person and flushing it down the toilet. Rectum is not made to be a sexual organ, so there is a higher incidence of STDs, health problems from taking it inside yourself.
Now you understand why it is satanic.Imagine how the act is done, how disgusting it is. How it is anti-nature, anti-Logos in every turn just to serve human ego, pride and hedonism.
No. There's no proof of that just because """scientists""" spout this nonsense that does not make it through.
Homosexuals do not have children through reproduction. If they rproduced by anything that would be connected to genetics/how you are born, they would cease to exist after 3 generations or sooner.
That's because you cannot prove a birth defect that naturally manifests over a decade later. So in this case common sense logic stands above science…homosexuality is a constantly reoccurring defect all through human history and there is no constant trigger event that creates this kind of sexuality. So unless you prove that each and every homosexual (that includes lesbians) was corrupted by molestation, the logical answer is that it's indeed a birth defect.
It's not really that simple. A certain set of genes shared between a brother and sister can express themselves in different ways. In the brother, this set of genes may make him a homosexual. In the sister, this set of genes may make her more fertile than average, which would explain why the sisters of homosexual men have more children than average. In this way, the genes for homosexuality in males can be passed down to the next generation.
I hate to break it to you, but you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about.
Hate to break it to you, but nobody is born gay. It's purely hedonistic desire.
We are talking about the attraction to the same sex which is innate and not the actual act of homosexual intercourse, which is acquired.
It isn’t.
Prove it nibba. Or disprove the studies that imply it.
lol. Man ask yourself one question: Why did they claim first it was "genetic" without any proof, then they switched to "muh epigenetics", "muh expression" when they did not find any sodomite genes.
You're being sold a bunch of lies.
On the other hand there is an evidence that shows that being molested increases the chances of being a sodomite. Wonder why that is omitted today?
Yeah so lack of proof is an actual proof and now we have to disprove it? kek. WOnder why LGBTWAGHUGH propaganda is in every sh*t movie? Could there be a connection. I really wonder.
I hate to break it to you but you're just brainwashed and I do know what I am talking about.
It is not. Sodomy is an act.
In other news: scientists found out you have a predisposition to become an alcoholic. Therefore you cannot really influence if you become one so just embrace your alcoholic identity, drink lots of booze then say "hey I was born this way"
In fact, there is more evidence that the risk of developing alcoholism is hereditary than "muh sodomy identity"
God gave them up.
God gave them over.
Romans 1 should be all you need to know faggots are terrible people.
I lived in San Francisco for years. That's all the proof I need. Amen Amen I say to you, Hell is more tolerable than that den of sodomites.
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Pic related.
Also this.
You don't, because you can't, which makes my statement that every homosexual was molested between birth and puberty a natural impossibility. And since natural law trumps science unless proven otherwise, homosexuality is a this state of our knowledge a birth defect. If there is no provable timetable for the origin, one always needs to start at the beginning.
thanks for all the answers folks
It's important to recall that it is not only homosexuality that is evil, but homosexuals themselves who are (very frequently) evil. Look at all the agendas they push, their nepotism, pedophilia, etc.
Was getting saved part of your plan?
You have to look outside to understand why it was prohibited in the first place. It's a cult where people worship their identity; they spread STDs, increases promiscuity, pick depraved kinks, and attack those who criticize it.
You don’t need to be afraid of the fact that people are born gay.
Also, you clearly don’t know much about how any of this works. There is very rarely a single gene that does a single thing. There is no such thing as a sex gene for either gay people or straight people. There are many genes that determine sexuality and they are different in males and females.
For example, in the 1950s, a drug called DES was given to pregnant women to prevent spontaneous miscarriage. The drug didn’t actually work and in many cases, made the likelihood of miscarriage rise. Anyway, decades later, what researchers found was that girls born to mothers who were on DES were more likely to become lesbians.
They are not. No amount of normalization will make homosexuality less unnatural. Walking peri dishes do not survive in nature.
What Christian doctrine will be affected when there is conclusive proof that people are born Gay? Why do you care so much?
Because God said so.
Even Satan knows the order of things, and even he hates homosexuals, but he encourages it, to destroy man.
(witnessed)
yeah cool numbers friendo, BUT
you seem to not even have read my post, as I explicitly said that I know and accept this explaination, but it answers the question "Why is homosexuality a sin?" not "How is homosexuality a sin?"
It takes the act of sex, a life-giving act of loving trust between two people, and perverts it to be solely about their own physical desires. If you don't know why people giving in to their physical desires is bad, read the Bible. Anything it says when referring to mammon (money) can also be applied to any time a person puts material or physical needs above the spiritual.
tldr; God gave humans the ability that only He held previously, to create a new life with a new soul. Denying that part of yourself isn't necessarily bad, as a lot of Christians became celibate to better focus on spreading the Word of God, but taking that gift and using it for something He specifically forbids is nothing short of insulting.
This.
Are you saying that most people are evil and some of them turn to God and try to get better?
You can single out homosexuals for the sin of lust, because that is their great weakness, but I can single out anti-homo people for their wrath and hatred, which is also sinful, and nowhere is it mentioned that one sin is better than the other. You think that you are a better person because you are not a homo, but if you are greedy, or a fornicator or an idolator, you are not any better.
All humanity is fundamentally evil inasmuch as they turn away from God, homo or not homo.
We should help homos overcome their sinful nature through scientific methods, if need be. I mean we are literally wasting our science on trying to turn women into men and vice versa, how much of a worthier goal would it be to turn homos straight instead?
This. Also a recent study with a huge sample size pretty much found that homosexuality and male pattern baldness are genetically interlinked, and the presence of some of those genes corellate with greater reproductive success in women. So it's not just about the genes, it's also about the degree of manifestation of genes, and whether those genes are expressed in a female or a male. This study however doesn't explain lesbianism.
It is clear that our understanding of this affliction is nowhere complete, but this gives me hope that a cure will be made one day, and we can stop hating each other over this unfortunate state of affairs.
Because that will fundamentally mean that they are intended to be that way. If it's wrong to abort a down-syndrome baby it's also wrong to kill a homo. If it's genetic, than God made you that way and wanted that cross for you. Liberals want this to be true, because "if God made it happen, it's not sinful", but liberals are notorious idolators, so they would end up worshipping homosexuality (they already do).
You can't argue with that.
That's a brainer. Why would we care someone lies to undermine us.
A cure for what? What does it mean to “cure” sexuality?
I suppose in the near future when gene editing, embryo selection becomes popular, people will choose to have heterosexual children, so it will sort itself out.
It’s not genetic you NPC brainlet, it’s a mental disease that is spread by pornographers and child molesters.
To orient it in such a way that it is in accordance with God's will. The only solution for homos now is total abstinence. If we can give them a cure we allow them a life of fulfillment with a
wife and kids.
The jews would disagree with you on this one😄
okay
...
And if you understand modern psychology you're a tool for Satan, thank you very much.
Exactly this. Actually I was just watching a Bishop Fulton Sheen video entitled "How To Think", and even there, broadcast in like 1955, he says, if there's a study done by an independent lab, ask, who paid for the study?
People have fallen to the false song of Scientism, where people don't realize that results are bought and paid for. If you don't provide the result your funder wants, you won't get more funding. Same way why any sort of study funded by Christians exposing the degeneracy of faggotry gets instantly denounced by Liberals/Leftists by simply saying "Oh sure, sure, look who funded this study, it's all a bunch of bunkum"
However they expect you to buy all the studies that are funded by them without question, otherwise you are a "science denier" who should be ostracized, assaulted and even killed. If you deny trans ideology, you are committing "violence" and are responsible for the deaths of trans and gay children. Attacking you, imprisoning you or killing you will be for the greater good. They are saving lives (in their head).
This obviously isn’t like a cigarette company funding a study about the effects of smoking, which one would be right to deny. What exactly are you implying? Is there a global conspiracy somehow? For example, studies showing that the prenatal hormonal environment of the mother has an effect on sexuality is completely fake? Or only parts of it fake? Where are these *real* scientists that say sexuality is some sort of bizarre unknown trait, like intelligence?
How is it not.
nbcnews.com
This just happened recently. Happens all the time. If someone tries to study something that goes against this sort of thing you are shut down. Do you really think you could honestly debate these kind of things on any level in this day and age? That there isn't a cabal of fags and other freaks that aren't pushing things in the direction they want.
Look up the John Money twin study. Is that real science? Does it have merit because they have no problem using his work to further their agenda.
At best, they are highly criminal 70-IQs who should be kept in containment facilities with padded cells and Valium. At worst, they should be tortured in the worst way possible before they are sent back to where they come from.
Homosexuals are fundamentally incapable of love, both romantic which instead becomes pleasure-seeking and platonic which they always corrupt into sodomy. This all comes from the fact that they are all sociopaths. For example I have trouble feeling empathy or true connection to other people, and I feel no remorse when I steal, lie, and cheat, which I do much too frequently.
Less so than Down syndrome. At least we know trisomy 21 does something. Not so for fags.
Those things, sexual energies or anger, can be redirected to non-evil ends. Homosexuality, which is sodomy, cries out to heaven for vengeance.
Numerous replicated GWAS studies showed genetic weight in homosexuality has p-value no less than around 0.3 and r-value of no more than 0.2.
Homosexuality is less a dead cell than a prion that infests everything it touches. It must be excised from a society and burnt wherever it is seen.
I logically know that things are wrong, but I am nearly always filled with conspiracy, anger, vengefulness, kleptomania, and avarice.
1. Homosexuals are not people
2. They do not want to become people let alone "better"
3. They are incapable of turning to God and they hate him.
4. God gave up on them.
Hopeless. That's why my main research pursuit at the moment is life extension. It's the best (and only) gamble.
I was never molested. It's not anybody's fault except the one who turned away.
WITNESSED
Remember all, they want fags to be accepted here so badly
That’s not what the study was about at all. The author of the study believes in every wacky expression of gender that people come up with. The controversy here is that children with autism are being misdiagnosed as gender dysphoric. You should read more than the headline, buddy. It’s weird that it was “shut down” but we are still hearing about it on a progressive media outlet huh?
This.
Well you seem like a completely stable, rational person. Let me guess, Baptist?
I grew up Calvinist and moved towards Catholicism. No other fag would ever be honestly Baptist, otherwise they'd have become an heroes.
I get it. Its beneficial for the devil if you to believe you can't be saved, so that's where he's leading you.
Look at how they act. If you are a homosexual there is an extremely high likelihood that your heart is hardened and you are a deranged, mentally ill, Christ hating subversive.
I really don't think I can be saved. Just look at this thread. Creatures like me are corrupted hellspawn. How could someone still be okay with this?
At best, the Catholic church treats these undesirables as a rich public school district treats people with Down syndrome. Behind all the nice and hopeful words, we know there's nothing for them except palliative "care" until they go back.
The only and best course of action is to extend one's lifespan and to make as much money as possible.
You're sick creature.
Repent.
There's worse. You're actually below with the people that aren't homosexual but abuse homosexuals to disintegrate cultures.
Doesn't sound so at the beginning, but it is actually. Those people became evil through their own free will and you likely were made gay by someone else.
I'm spiritually incapable.
So I'm worse? Not surprising.
Also, I was never abused. I had such a great childhood and I threw that all away.
>You're actually below with the people
So I screwed up that part.
How did you become gay then?
These.
/thread
sage
Any horror stories?
Not him, but I also struggle with such urges.
I had a very traumatic sexual experience when I was 8.
That and my father was a cruel and distant man. I couldn't bond with him in my formative years.
My parents dont know about my trauma because they would blame me for it.
As a child my mom was the positive parent figure for me because at least she was there and she cared about me to a degree.
So I internalized her behaviour as loving and good. She was my pattern for love and affection. All I learned from my father is neglect, and making demands.
I was raised christian and both my parents are devout catholics, they just really suck at being parents.
They are trying to fix things now but I am afraid its too late for me.
I will probably marry a lesbian and use some viagra to have babies.
It'll be alright, user.
We'll all pray for you and you pray for us.
How did you feel about God as a child?
I feared and loved Him.
I was afraid he will punish me. And loved him because he didn't.
Some mental health problems are genetic, others aren't. Phineas Gage's mental problems were not caused by his genes.
The only mental health problems not caused by genes are ones caused by getting hit in the head.
It potentially blocks parents from becoming grandparents. If you've ever seen the joy grandparents get from their grandchildren you would agree that denying them that joy is wrong.
This is kind of a hypocritical argument when you remember that staying chaste also does that.
Being fruitful and multiplying is best from what I've read and experienced.
Its great but its not best.
(All form 1 Corinthians 7. You can check that one out actually, I wanted to quote a few others but without context they looked bad)
Why shouldn't marriage be the default instead of being "because of temptation"?
If God truly ordered everyone to have children, then Paul basically saying that he's sinning in being single. But that can't be, since the Bible is divinely inspired.
getting feces on your penis is stupid, maybe not evil, but definitely self-harm.
is self-harm evil?
2% of gays spread over 55% of HIV infections. And they walk around with shit dicks. Think on that.
*I meant gays are 2% of the population yet spread over 55% of new hiv infections
Marriage is the default because temptation is the default.
Monogamous marriage is the proper way to regulate sexuality.
The end result of Paul's wish that, ideally, everyone be childless and celibate, is that humans (God's crowning achievement in creation) go extinct. Pretty much the opposite of multiplying, but yeah maybe Paul knows better than God himself? I'll have to re read, it's been a while.
(wew)
(wew)
(wew)
Cool numbers bro
Are you actually gay as in sexually attracted to men?
Read this for an introduction to a very solid and often used, but usually incompletely understood by the people who use it in discussions, argument.
edwardfeser.blogspot.com
I reject the "gay" label.
I'm attracted to the same sex, but I didn't want this to happen, nor am I satisfied with this state of being.
He literally wrote down this due to what he heard form Jesus Christ
That is God
Even if he wasn't, Paul was also writing into the bible, and Christians admit the Bible is divinely inspired and free of moral error.
...
Pick one
Do you think it matters what the bulk of laymen believe? The Catholic Church is not a democracy. No one can change the Church's teachings, including the pope.
Every so-called Catholic who disagrees is a Fake Catholic. They're not real Catholics.
That's right, so shut up and listen to the head of your church, homophobic heretic
Why do Protestants think that true Catholicism = Super-Mega-Ultramontanism where the Pope can literally never say anything false?
let's be honest: we all create strawmen out of what we do not fully understand or disagree with.
The hubris.