Science is magic. Or rather, magic is magic. But a magician never reveals his secrets, because once he does, it ceases to be magic and instead becomes science.
E.g. the greatest scientist of all time, Sir Isaac Newton, was an alchemist. He used alchemical methods to study the Bible and concluded that the world would end no sooner than the year 2060, for instance.
THE ONLY REASON NEWTON IS REMEMBERED AS A SCIENTIST AND NOT AS A MAGICIAN IS BECAUSE HE REVEALED HIS SECRETS. A good magician NEVER reveals his secrets.
Now, Magic isn't holy in itself but honestly, what was Jesus with his many miracles if not a magician by modern standards? He was walking on water 2000 years before Criss Angel. The Talmud even accuses Jeshua of studying witchcraft in Egypt.
Therefore, for all intents and purposes, Jesus was a magician. Now, if Jesus was a magician, then if you knew his secrets, he would cease to be a magician and simply be a scientist. So Jesus was a mad scientist.
Of course, a good magician NEVER reveals his secrets, so we can't know the kinds of science Jesus did. All we can do is follow him. Jesus, the supreme magician/scientist for all times and all places, and saviour of the (European!?) human race.
Historically, scientists have worked side-by-side with magicians. The only difference for whether it's called magic or science is whether it's open-source or closed-source.
Nathaniel Cruz
On the off chance you are not a troll, I will only say that you collapse magic, supernatural power, and science, all of which are distinct, into one phenomenon, all for the purpose of proving some stupid, useless point.
Benjamin Sullivan
You forgot true religion. Are you even Christian, or are you a Satanic occultist wannabe Christ?
Are you saying Christ's miracles had no magical quality to them at all?
Nolan Ward
woops was meant for
Carson Baker
Yeah I know.
Ethan Jackson
Yep. Magic is an illusion of something.
Eli Scott
The Bible and the gospel are useless if the supernatural events recorded were falsified What hope would I have for my resurrection if Jesus didn't even accomplish it?
Lincoln Bailey
Not necessarily. Satan can perform magic, and it's only an illusion to the extent that it's not of Christ (Who is Himself the truth). But from a practical everyday perspective, magic is no less real than science.
True. Good thing we have eye witness accounts and the true testimony of the Spirit.
Bentley Hernandez
I disagree. There's a wealth of wisdom, principles, philosophy, etc.
Mason Murphy
Nah. It's useless. There is plenty of good moral philosophy out there. Jesus is not a moral philosopher. He is God the Son, the Word made Flesh.
Aiden Flores
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Jace Collins
I'm just saying, metaphorical "Christianity" is literally useless. What are you, Anglican?
Dominic Howard
What Jesus did isn't closed source he tells you how he does it. The Apostles themselves performed miracles. It's only "magic" in the sense that people don't understand it. There's alot of stuf that scientist don't understand and can't make sense of but they don't refer to those things as magic.
Why are you trying to make this personal? The Bible is a wealth of information. The book of Proverbs is a great example. And by your logic all those other sources of good moral philosophy are rendered null becuase they have no supernatural events.
Ayden Nguyen
Ok then, how exactly did Jesus perform his miracles? Can you do the same? That's what I said. Science is open-source magic, magic is closed-source science. Sorry, I'm honestly not trying to be a dick. It's just really easy to make fun of Anglicans.
I personally don't see the value of betting my soul on Jesus if the whole thing is metaphor and can't be taken at face value.
Oliver Morales
I would just add that if you really want to see the Bible as JUST a text on moral philosophy then I would respect that. But as a Christian, I also fear for your eternal salvation.
Ryder Watson
Then I guess it's whatever you want it to be.
I'm not an Anglican. I don't even know what that is, and at the moment don't really care.
Then don't. It's by faith through grace you believe in Jesus. Not physical evidence.
That's not what I'm saying.
I'd rather all people read and leran from the Bible (all the birds would come to rest in its branches) wether they believe Jesus to be God or not. Rather than only believers read and learn from it.
Nolan Mitchell
We basically seem to agree on things… but are you Christian or not? If not, why not?
Brayden Kelly
And by saying that the Bible is no use if the supernatural aspects were falsified is saying to those don't believe that the Jesus performed supernatural works or miracles then the Bible is no use to you. By saying this you are shooting yourself in the foot. The Bible is of use to everyone wether they believe it is the true inspired word of God or not.
Isaiah Collins
What would say if I was? What would you say if I wasn't?
Carter Lee
Fair enough, I mean, the Bible is obviously the single most culturally important text ever recorded, if nothing else.
If you're not, I would ask you why not.
Jackson King
Oh boy this looks like a good thread God damn it
Logan Hughes
Consider the argument that science is open-source magic and magic is closed-source science very carefully.
Connor Bell
useless soteriologically, as in it can't bring salvation the OP tries to leverage the bible on naturalist terms
Parker Hall
What people forget is that God even created science, and God even created the Devil, and the Devil uses even science to draw people away from the truth, which is Jesus. Thanks for the support, brother in Christ.
Julian Fisher
By definition, magic is an illusion. science = open-sourced closed-sourced open-sourced closed-sourced… magic = closed source open-sourced closed source open-sourced…
I'm sorry that Satan has convinced you that magic isn't real.
Joshua Powell
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Anthony Foster
Where is the infinite loop? I honestly don't follow.
Grayson Moore
I sincerely hope this is bait.
Angel Perry
x = y y = x
Everytime you reference x it references y, which references x which references y which references x… It's an infinite loop of nothingness.
Eli Perez
In labelland, not the real world.
Lucas Thomas
no. in the real world. It's an infinite loop. ARe you denying mathmatics?
Chase Allen
God Himself is a singularity.
Connor Cook
Wrong thread, dumbass.
Gabriel Allen
No. Singularity is the only way these kinds of "infinite loops of nothingness" make sense.
Julian Rodriguez
For everyone having a hissy fit over my equivalence between science and magic, it's like this: a good magician never reveals his secrets, but a good scientist is forced to. That's the ONLY difference between the two. And God created both science and magic (via Satan).
James Evans
Science/magic are methodological, they make use of impersonal forces according to fixed ritual means. Christ was not a magician, he did not employ any technical method to perform miracles, he performed them with authority granted to him as the Son of the Living God.
Carson Rivera
I agree 100%, I am just doing apologetics for science-oriented skeptics. I of course don't agree with the Talmudic opinion that Joshke studied witchcraft.
Jace Lopez
Reposting from Zig Forums?
Wow the talmudic poison around here. Delet
If you are not talmudist then you should stop consuming their lies. Jesus was not a magician. He was Logos incarnated.
Mason Bennett
Yes I am spreading the gospel.
I'm not a Talmudist, I'm just referencing it to prove a point regarding science.
I agree. However, keep in mind that God uses quantum mechanics to bring about His means in His times. E.g. It's very likely that quantum entanglement is used to bring consciousness to Heaven upon death. To the extent that Christ implicitly understood this, he could be said to be a scientist. Of course, sharing His knowledge of QM would be pointless because the nature of QM is that it can ever truly only be understood by one person – God.
Julian Foster
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Jaxson Anderson
what's the quote
Justin Bailey
Also known as Clarke's Third Law
Matthew Kelly
Magic IS a technology, it's the application of a technique for practical ends.
