Christians 'Standing in the Way' of China's Xi Jinping's Totalitarian Rule What started several years ago as a small government campaign against unregistered churches has turned into all-out war
Unlike Deng Xiaoping, who helped launch the country's reforms 40 years ago and wanted to reduce the power and influence of the Communist Party over civil society, China's current leader believes in the absolute power of the Party and wants his government to exert control over every aspect of Chinese life. ``The Chinese government has also ratcheted up restrictions over Buddhism in Tibetan areas and imposed unprecedented control over religious practices in the predominantly Muslim region of Xinjiang,'' Human Rights Watch added. On December 9, authorities in the city of Chengdu, in China's southwestern Sichuan province, arrested pastor Wang Yi, along with his wife and 100 members of Early Rain Covenant Church.
Authorities shut down the church and charged pastor Wang with `` inciting subversion of state power. Johnson, writing for the New York Times, said the charge against Mr. Wang and his wife, Jiang Rong, ``was far more severe than what other leaders face and that the term ``subversion of state power is ``a catchall charge often used against dissidents and political activists who speak out against the government. This past Sunday morning, members of Early Rain Covenant Church were blocked from entering their worship building. ``And that's the exciting thing, all across China, there are house churches, there are what they call ` family churches ' and the reason the Communist government is so worried is because there are far more Christians in China than there are members of the Communist Party,'' Nettleton told CBN News.
Fenggang Yang, a leading expert on religion in China, says what started several years ago as a small government campaign against unregistered churches has turned into all-out war. Mr. Fengang, who once predicted that China could become the world's largest Christian nation, says the government, headed by Xi Jinping, views Christianity as a threat to the party's long-term political aspirations. ``Under Xi Jinping and the Chinese Communist Party, they are really trying to establish a totalitarian rule of Chinese society and the Christians are standing in the way of totalitarianism, so that's why they've become a target. ``Maybe because of his background as a human rights lawyer, or just because he was filled with the Holy Spirit, Wang Yi gave riveting sermons about a huge variety of topics, from problems in society to Biblical history. Wang gave up his law career to pursue his calling as a pastor and started Early Rain Covenant Church in China's Sichuan province.
Let Xi try. What can he do that Diocletian didn't do in the days of the Roman Empire? This seems desperate, panicked. Xi is right to realize that Christianity can destroy his secular, inhuman state. He knows exactly who his real enemy is: Jesus Christ. But if he thinks he can beat Christ and his Church he's got another thing coming.
Not sure yet. It's either a member of the CCP that's already Christian, or some member that will be converted dramatically, as Constantine was. Either way, I doubt he'll be someone we in the West have heard of, not until he takes power.
Tyler Ward
Meanwhile the Vatican basically sold the underground Catholic Church to the regime.
Jonathan Baker
It was an act of god that the censor for the f word on here is Winnie the Pooh
I pray for the best there. Hopefully, they'll surpass America in faith since they are due to become the next superpower. There needs to be a Christian nation leading the world.
To play devil's advocate, besides the evil tendency of authoritarian regimes to supress alternative philosophies and groups(and the commie anti-religious autism), there's a logical reason the chinese party wants to supress christians.
China's history is full of minor religious conflicts escalading into empire shattering fiascos, and they haven't had nice experiences with Christianity in the past couple of centuries.
You know what's really funny? This new relationship between the Vatican and China is basically similar to the relationship the Vatican had with the Soviet Union. The Soviet government would have a list of bishops they liked for promotion, and the Vatican would say either "yes" or "no" to them.
And then one day the Soviet officials positioned a man named Karol Wojtyla as their preferred candidate for Archbishop of Krakow. And the rest is history.
The same thing might happen again. The Lord does powerful things through the ministry of His Church.
Korea used to be, in the 70s and particularly the 80s, a country of prayer. Churches would frequently have prayer nights where half the congregation would think it nothing to pray all through the night 'cuz the dictatorship was hurting and people were poor and only had God to rely on. There's even a mountain in Seoul called "Prayer Mountain" where you'd find people all around the tracks in prayer. It was just a place you could go in peace and not be hassled by the dictatorship's police. Then affluence came. Now the next generation who never knew the dictatorship and only knew k-pop and Samsung are "too busy" for a night of prayer, and, why not, the corporations and a workaholic culture make them work 70 hours a week and drink with colleagues for another 20. Sad, really. China's such a divided country with the affluence widespread in cities country folk are not allowed to live in, so the poverty-stricken countryside are still calling on God.
I hope you're being serious because the agreement Frankie signed with China gave away the farm. China doesn't mind that you're religious, so long as that religion is thoroughly nationalistic and is submissive in its teaching to Chinese national doctrine, which should be antithetical to Christianity. Christ alone is Lord, not Xi. And Frankie, while we don't know details, seems to have capitulated to this demand by the CCP. The house churches have not. This is why they're persecuted.
Thoroughly true. It was less the implied insult, and more the mockery and uncensored commentary of being able to discuss "winnie" and evade the censors. Cuz, y'know, the internet is completely censored in China. There's no 8ch there. Worse yet, I believe now you have to provide your ID to post at all.
No… no… no… Jackie is a thoroughly devoted "son" of China. The CCP can apparently do nothing wrong for Jackie. Doesn't stop me enjoying his movies, but he's not China's salvation. But do remember Constantine only converted when a third of the Empire was already Christian. It wasn't some secretive revolution as he swept the Empire from under Jupiter's feet.
On the plus side, the Sigao/Franciscan Bible translation celebrated it's 50th anniversary recently. Apparently it's available enough there. I wish I could get a copy (don't read Chinese, but I'd like to collect foreign bibles… preferably official ones).
Samuel Ortiz
That's what American doctrine is too.
Hudson Reyes
They can both burn, for all I care.
"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words will not pass away."
Aaron Torres
Jolly little pooh, aren't you.
Nolan Ramirez
I can't really understand with the "pooh" censorship in the way. Is it bad or good? ;)
I'm not jolly about their eventual destruction so much as I am jolly about Christ's victory. This is meant positively instead of as negative.
"Out of his mouth came a sharp sword to strike the nations. He will rule them with an iron rod, and he himself will tread out in the wine press the wine of the fury and wrath of God the almighty." -Rev 19.15
Ethan Adams
Pretentious too.
Alexander Gomez
It should be noted that this is nothing new: Interestingly, Ye is now the director of the Religious Affairs Bureau, an arm of the Chinese government, and told two closed meetings held at Beijing University and the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences in 2006, as reported by the Xinhua News Agency, that these the number of Christians in China had reached 130 million, including approximately 20 million Catholics. Source: asiaharvest.org/2006-ye-xiaowens-130-million/ AsiaHarvest estimates there's 105 million including ~21 million Cathbros including – and this not even I knew was so widespread – two thirds of those in Cathbro House Churches. Kek. So, mouth-off all you like about "no loss", but it's not only protties getting persecuted by the CCP.
Why are you even on Zig Forums if you think the the Gospel (Jesus sword from his mouth) is "pretentious"?
Serious question.
And you're doing it at Christmas even. All our songs at this time of year is about rejoicing at this.
Chase Lee
I don't think the Gospels are pretentious. I think your pretentious.
Liam Cook
If I was pretentious, I'd have given you a wall of text and some pie charts about some pointless theological issue no one cares about.
All I'm doing is giving you the most basic gospel message that even children understand. And you're ashamed of it. Either that or just some larper who can't even swallow the baby milk version of the gospel without spitting it out.
>As a pastor of a Christian church, I have my own understanding and views, based on the Bible, about what righteous order and good government is. At the same time, I am filled with anger and disgust at the persecution of the church by this Communist regime, at the wickedness of their depriving people of the freedoms of religion and of conscience. But changing social and political institutions is not the mission I have been called to, and it is not the goal for which God has given his people the gospel. >As a pastor, my firm belief in the gospel, my teaching, and my rebuking of all evil proceeds from Christ’s command in the gospel and from the unfathomable love of that glorious King. Every man’s life is extremely short, and God fervently commands the church to lead and call any man to repentance who is willing to repent. Christ is eager and willing to forgive all who turn from their sins. This is the goal of all the efforts of the church in China—to testify to the world about our Christ, to testify to the Middle Kingdom about the Kingdom of Heaven, to testify to earthly, momentary lives about heavenly, eternal life. This is also the pastoral calling that I have received. >At the same time, I believe that this Communist regime’s persecution against the church is a greatly wicked, unlawful action. As a pastor of a Christian church, I must denounce this wickedness openly and severely. The calling that I have received requires me to use non-violent methods to disobey those human laws that disobey the Bible and God. My Savior Christ also requires me to joyfully bear all costs for disobeying wicked laws.
>For the mission of the church is only to be the church and not to become a part of any secular institution. From a negative perspective, the church must separate itself from the world and keep itself from being institutionalized by the world. From a positive perspective, all acts of the church are attempts to prove to the world the real existence of another world. The Bible teaches us that, in all matters relating to the gospel and human conscience, we must obey God and not men. For this reason, spiritual disobedience and bodily suffering are both ways we testify to another eternal world and to another glorious King. >If God decides to use the persecution of this Communist regime against the church to help more Chinese people to despair of their futures, to lead them through a wilderness of spiritual disillusionment and through this to make them know Jesus, if through this he continues disciplining and building up his church, then I am joyfully willing to submit to God’s plans, for his plans are always benevolent and good. >Precisely because none of my words and actions are directed toward seeking and hoping for societal and political transformation, I have no fear of any social or political power. For the Bible teaches us that God establishes governmental authorities in order to terrorize evildoers, not to terrorize doers of good. If believers in Jesus do no wrong then they should not be afraid of dark powers. Even though I am often weak, I firmly believe this is the promise of the gospel. It is what I’ve devoted all of my energy to. It is the good news that I am spreading throughout Chinese society. >I also understand that this happens to be the very reason why the Communist regime is filled with fear at a church that is no longer afraid of it.
>If this regime is one day overthrown by God, it will be for no other reason than God’s righteous punishment and revenge for this evil. For on earth, there has only ever been a thousand-year church. There has never been a thousand-year government. There is only eternal faith. There is no eternal power. >Those who lock me up will one day be locked up by angels. Those who interrogate me will finally be questioned and judged by Christ. When I think of this, the Lord fills me with a natural compassion and grief toward those who are attempting to and actively imprisoning me. Pray that the Lord would use me, that he would grant me patience and wisdom, that I might take the gospel to them. >And so, respectable officers, stop committing evil. This is not for my benefit but rather for yours and your children’s. I plead earnestly with you to stay your hands, for why should you be willing to pay the price of eternal damnation in hell for the sake of a lowly sinner such as I?
Don't tell me you're not saying "wow" after reading all that.
Not even close. I got called pretentious for hoping Christ has victory over these two nations and reshapes them. Before that, I mentioned wanting a version of the Franciscan/Chinese bible the Catholics put out there. I doubt I was being called pretentious for that. So it was the former. Now I want to know why. It honestly stumps me.
This sounds like gaslighting at this point. And I'm not even sure why. You can't even explain yourself except call me names (or more names, at this point)…hoping I'm going to succumb or something? If you want to be a Christian about it (and simply just be a Man), then just exhort me properly and state your case. Explain yourself.
Grayson Butler
I am Christian. Why do you claim you're more Christian than me? Are you that vain in your faith?
Levi Powell
Go talk to Asia Harvest. They've got aaaaaall the stats. It is, to be sure, an estimate, but a low-ball one compared to what China themselves estimate. It's not TOO dissimilar to the one on Wikipedia, note – pic related – but the AH one is broken down by town and county and therefore has more areas of higher Christian concentration whereas the one on Wiki is just by province. If you care to actually dig, start here: asiaharvest.org/how-many-christians-are-in-china-summary/
You already know you were called "pretentious" for your … post, and you know this because user replied to it. You're either VERY new here, or are being deliberately obtuse. You obviously insulted user's sensibilities about his home-country. That's no crime, but he is going to call you out on it. Being pretentious – his bad use of a word – was because you doubled down on your "insult" against his nation. (Why do I have to explain this to you?) You're being argumentative because you know all this, but you are STILL harping on about being called "pretentious". So what? You got insulted because you slapped user's country and you want to go on and on about it? Find something more edifying to think about, for Winnie the Pooh's-sake!
And you 'n' all. Just stop it. This is just childish.
Well, I don't even apologize at all. That's hilarious. I almost wanted to give more credit than this. I don't care about any of the world's nations until they come under God. You can shoot me and I wouldn't apologize. You want to call it pretentious, go ahead. Whatever that means. Call it prideful too. But it's not pride in myself. It's that this is God's earth. Not USA's or China's.
Luis Scott
I asked if you *want* to be a Christian about it, then simply exhort me properly. I'm not prideful. I was ready to face my accuser and be ready for an apology even, if necessary (now I don't find it necessary, when I realized it's just about your sense of nationalism).
Giving me one word replies didn't help. I had to rely on the other guy above to explain anything.
I'm glad it's out of the way. Take care (honestly).
Sebastian Perez
Here’s a preemptively more positve one. Also having the first Chinese pope in history would be cool, as long as he’s so clear in all of his statements that the media can’t paint him as anything but traditional.
Look man, I really really don't care what you think or say.
Thomas Diaz
if we DID have a Chinese Pope, I hope he's not from the government-approved church but from the underground, otherwise China has just pwnd your church
Grayson Long
Well, it all depends. What would he do when he actually assumed the papacy? Would he continue to be a stooge of the CCP, or would the Holy Spirit transform him? You have to assume that the Spirit would work its will upon the Holy Father, if you're a believing Catholic.
Which is why i said "in the past few centuries" CotE and Catholics were considered bros by chinese. Then the Pope treated China like his own personal backyard, and commanded the Emperor like he was some minor lordling. Then the Heavenly Kingdom happened, and then missionaries brought by colonial powers in parallel with economic and military plots. And the Century of Humiliation, and then Eastern Lightning and other cults started propping up, etc.
