Truly I say to you, all sins shall be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they utter; but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin. (Mark 3:28-29)
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Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.” (John 14:6)
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Filioque is true
Truly I say to you, all sins shall be forgiven the sons of men...
Gavin White
Hunter Parker
he said it boyos
Samuel Miller
I'M GONNA SAY THE F WORD
Ryan Adams
YOU CAN'T SAY THE F WORD!
Thats heretical!
John Reed
FIL-
Jaxson Long
STOPPP!!!!
Lincoln Peterson
(checked)
HOLY SPIRIT! GET DOWN!
David Rivera
He's talking about the path of salvation of souls. And a procession TO the Father, not FROM. You can argue about Filioque in many ways, but this passage is not about an illustration of the Trinity. God is not schizophrenic, where he is literally blocking himself from his own self. All Persons of the Trinity are God.
Bentley Stewart
On top of all of this, they were all present at creation, and interestingly, the Spirit of God hovered over the chaos first, and the Word of God said "Let there be light!" after him.
Isaac Campbell
My argument made more explicit is this: can a soul who has never heard of the Son find salvation?
-If the answer is no, this contradicts Mark 3:28-29.
-If the answer is yes, and the Filioque is false, then it’s possible to find the Father by the Spirit only, which contradicts John 14:6.
Therefore, the Filioque is true.
Alexander Price
In terms of salvation it's definitely true. I don't think anyone would disagree with that. But the Schism was never about salvation (both sides obviously hold up Christ), but about the nature of the Trinity… regardless of man's salvation.
Sometimes I think it's a question we shouldn't ask, but maybe that's a copout. I see the same about Predestination - I believe it, but I couldn't guess to how it works. It's a great mystery.
Jacob Johnson
that graph is misleading, it shows the photian position of the spirit proceeding from the father alone rather than through the son that catholics equally affirm with (i believe) the majority of orthodox.
Adrian Hall
Let’s just be rigorous about it though. How can you seriously say you hold up Christ if there is another way to the Father other than through the Son, namely the Spirit alone?
(Predestination is impossible for anyone without an eternal perspective to fathom — which rules out all humans that aren’t God)
Are you saying it goes like pic related?
Aaron Thompson
Or like this perhaps?
Owen Brown
That's not what the Filoque issue centers around though. It's not about any other way TO the Father. All agree that it is only Christ. The controversy is on "FROM" (not to).
This is where I compare it to Predestination - because understanding the very nature of the Trinity requires an eternal perspective too. God has seen fit to reveal much to us, but I'm not sure he has about this. If we went by scripture alone, Jesus himself says that the Spirit proceeds from the Father (John 15:26).
Jackson Cruz
Ah I see. So the Spirit always leads one TO Christ (perhaps implicitly, not by name) because it is God, and it leads people to God. But the Spirit may still be proceeding from the Father. Gotcha.
Very nuanced indeed.
Zachary Miller
yodelay hee hoo!
Tyler Nelson
What is that first flag?
Kevin Fisher
Move over, nerds.
Elijah Foster
It’s just not true tho.
Dominic Turner
Angel Wilson
Grayson Hall
Lutheranism.
Jaxson Miller
Ah, so completely irrelevant. Got it.
Nicholas Long
First, allow me to pray that I have not spoken wrongly about our Lord. Whatever I have written here that is correct, may He proclaim it to the whole world through His Church, and whatever I have written here that is false, may He erase it from memory and correct me with punishment so that I may not fall into heresy. "Heresy is to be separated from God, and I do not want to be separated from God." (St. Abba Agatho)
Left: The Father is the sole cause, and the Son and the Spirit are His two hands - the Son being begotten of Him alone, the Spirit proceeding from Him alone. See: St. Irenaeus of Lyons, St. Gregory of Nazianzus, St. Photius. The Son (1 John 2:1) and the Holy Spirit (John 14:16) are the two Paracletes by which God unites us back to Himself.
Middle: The Son is the One upon Whom the fullness of the divinity dwells bodily. He is sent onto His mission by the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35; Matthew 4:1), and in return He sends the Holy Spirit onto the world in the economy (John 20:21-23) and to the Father in the Trinity (Matthew 27:50).
Right: The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father to rest in the Son (Matthew 3:16-17) and is sent by the Son back to the Father (Matthew 27:50), therefore being the bond of love between the lover and the loved. Furthemore the Holy Spirit is sent by the Son onto His disciples so that they may taste of this inner Trinitarian love and receive the Father and the Son, Whom the Holy Spirit comprehends the relationship of. (John 14:23)
In my opinion, these are the truths that the Fathers have attempted to express in several different ways, in Greek and in Latin. This is how we must understand the Greeks saying:
(cont)
Gabriel Young
And how we must understand the Latins saying:
And how we must understand the common agreement on what the filioque means according to St Maximus the Confessor:
And Anastasius Bibliothecarius:
Logan Cox
I will note also that it is not as if these truths were completely lost in either Orthodoxy or Catholicism.
While the Orthodox have had a tendency to interpret every reference to the Spirit's relationship to the Son being purely temporal, as if they had no eternal relationship, recent appreciation of the theology of the Latin fathers as well as that of St. Gregory of Cyprus and St. Gregory Palamas has changed this.
St Gregory of Cyprus says:
And St Gregory Palamas says:
And while it is unacceptable for the Orthodox that Catholics call the Son a cause of the Holy Spirit, Catholics nonetheless acknowledge that the Spirit is also said to rest upon the Son, and even more importantly that the Spirit doesn't proceed from the Son exactly as He proceeds from the Father, and perhaps most importantly of all, that the Latin term of "procession" is much more general than the Greek term of "procession".