Is Carl of Swindon going full fascist?
/fashycarl/
Luke Moore
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William Myers
I was 'bout to be like "but isn't that book a critique," but I was thinking the movie.
He should do "Horror at Red Hook" next - show those Spanish who's boss!
Jaxson Lewis
What it with right wingers using fiction support their world views?
Levi Butler
Military dictatorship has never been tried without failure.
Jonathan Campbell
To be fair 90% of the time it only fails because someone deliberately takes it down prematurely.
Luke Lee
Carl is the worst example of a pseudo-intellectual I have ever witnessed. Also, characterizing Starship Troooers as fascist isn’t accurate.
Gabriel Nelson
He is already a crypto-fascist by any useful measure.
But Carl is at-least smart enough to realise that actually 'revealing his power level' is not in his interests.
As such I would say no.
On the topic of Starship Troopers, it is important to delineate between the novel and the movie as they are very different beasts.
The movie is an enjoyable action flick that makes use of satirical elements and fascist imagery to make some statement regarding the novel and militarism more broadly; This direction being taken due to Verhoeven not caring to read the novel itself and instead have some very basic elements of the novel described to him.
It is a relatively basic film when one gets down to it and is really only tangentially connected to the novel.
The novel is a work of political philosophy that is presented as an enjoyable sci-fi tale.
It takes place over several years and explores a number of topics raging from civic responsibility and capital punishment through to disciplining children and the mask of command.
Far from advocating some dystopic, fascist, military dictatorship as those who have not actually studied the novel claim, the book simply makes advocates a limited democracy and a government that in almost all other ways is effectively the Korean war era American government from when the book was written.
If one considers a limited democracy and emphasis upon civic responsibility to be fascist, then you simply have a shit definition of fascism.
There is nothing inherently wrong with using fiction to present ones political positions or being politically inspired by fiction.
Star Trek for instance is responsible for the creation of many anti-capitalists.
The problem only comes when one attempts to use fiction as the entire basis for political beliefs/ideology while ignoring anything more substantial.
No version of Starship Troopers advocates for a military dictatorship.
The novel advocates for a limited democracy.
The government of the movie could probably best be described as a Stratocracy.
A Stratocracy and military dictatorship are very, very different things.
Nathaniel Reed
Statship Troopers was fundamentally about Heinlein’s belief that boot camp discipline needs to institutionalized and culturally ingrained because the “kids these days are too weak and misbehaves to fight those damn Chinese commies”. That’s how it needs to be understood, not as a book about militarism, but as a book about whipping kids into shape.
Ryder Watson
Nathan Thompson
While Starship troopers isn’t full on fascist, it’s pretty close. Which is pretty close. And yes it is a military dictatorship. As in the military holds all political power. A Dictatorship doesn’t inherently mean autocracy, but means all political power is centralized into a certain group or institution. In Starship troopers, this institution is the military. In DOTP it’s the proletariat.
Landon Stewart
He’s always been a crypto-fascist at best. I didn’t really realize it until I watched one of his videos after a few years of being into leftism
Blake Nguyen
While I do hold that there is much more to the book then just that.
I do not disagree with your observations.
I personally do not really see anything objectionable about it.
Both the book and movie are not close to fascism.
Any definition of fascism that would include limited, representative democracies is a uselessly loose definition.that is simply not fit for purpose.
Not it is not.
The government of the book is a limited, representative democracy.
The government of the movie is one whose legal, constitutional head of government actively holds a dedicated billet/rank, blurring the line between state and military; A Stratocracy by definition.
That is not an accurate definition of military dictatorship in general.
More specifically it ignores that the government of the movie is a literal military government and not some government that a military has imposed itself on as with military dictatorships.
Eli Murphy
It is though. Again Dictatorship doesn’t mean autocracy, but when all political power in concentrated into a single institution or group. The Military contains all political power. So yes Starship Troopers is a Military Dictatorship. It isn’t a Military Junta, but it is a Military Dictatorship.
The Book, and Heinlein’s philosophy in general of active duty soldiers and vets being a social class above society as a whole and have control of all political power, has a big influence on Burger fascists.
Evan Ross
LMAO. I love Starship troopers and think it is a fun read, but between Heinlein's anti-communist rants and justification for his stratocratic utopianism the "theory" is laughable. Like holy fucking shit how can someone be so fucking poorly read yet be considered some kind of political authority by anyone?
Asher Thompson
Reminder that Pewdiepie did a video discussing Starship Troopers and said that fascism totalitarianism the novel system presented in the book has real benefits people shouldn't overlook and that Paul Verhoeven is a big silly doodoo head for making the movie a parody of the source material which is a serious politcal treatise guys.
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Jayden Miller
When people consider fiction books to be “quite theory heavy” there a psudo-intellectual. Political fiction books are good reads, and sometimes do have some good philosophy behind them. However anyone who thinks there “quite theory heavy”needs to read Das Kapital.
Justin Gonzalez
Sense when did Pewdiepie read books, I thought he was illiterate? But seriously isn’t he a gamer? Also regardless of the political message, directors of political fiction film adaptations should’t turn the movie into a parody, they should try as hard to stick to the Author’s ideas as much as possible.
Chase Rogers
People who make art should do whatever the fuck they want. Giving the finger to an author's shitty ideas in an adaptation is awesome and should happen more. For an even better (but less entertaining) example than Starship Troopers see A Clockwork Orange.
Cameron Morgan
This is why I spit on anyone bitching about 'oh the left calls everyone Nazis', no most of the people who get tarred with that brush are just crypto-fash and the people complaining are either willfully ignorant or too dumb to see between the lines.
Jason Bennett
It's also reason to slap people when they say pewdiepie doing nazi jokes is "just jokes." He's not a retard. He knows how big his audience is. When he makes nazi jokes it's not in any way making nazis the butt of the joke. It's just "look at this thing that's offensive!" The format means any offensive thing could be substituted because the butt of the joke is the fact that people get offended, and whatever you do use that way is getting promoted because the mockery in that context is targeted at being offended by it.
David Fisher
Exactly, same thing as that 'pug nazi' guy, he deserved to be in fucking jail. Pisses me off that the discourse is so idiotic… Oh well, maybe I should go make some videos for once so I can have my say.
Nolan Rogers
Nah, that's a bad idea. May be different in bongland where dankula is from, but here in burgerstan prison is full of nazis, and putting a bunch of them together actively helps their cause. Even if not, don't actually give these guys something reall to be upset about. A slap, a punch, even getting knocked the fuck out is one thing (interpersonal violence), but imprisonment is going to make it look like they have a point to a lot of people because that's state violence. That's not even the worst thing though.
If we rely on state violence to resist people like nazis, then they can win by taking control of the state. There are already cases where nazis have infiltrated the government (it's not all that hard). Hell, you don't even need real nazis in power, just sympathizers. This is a concrete and fairly reasonable goal for them. Contrast with resistance on a personal level. If nazis can't speak for danger of incarceration, they'll be facing down the system, mannnn. If they can't speak for their neighbors ostracizing them, they're facing down the people they claim to fight for and that challenges their belief in the cause. A huge part of statism in general is over-reliance on state violence creating a separation and abstraction from people's interests.
Few people are willing to take a verbal - much less physical - stand against someone threatening them. This makes it much easier than it should be for people to believe that it's just the system that's against them and not the people in general. It's not just nazis. There are a lot of people with batshit ideas who think they're people's champions but it's just that the rulers are stopping them, because they don't encounter enough conflict from people they know IRL. That kind of interpersonal conflcit gets sublimated into submission to state authority when it would be much healthier to simply act it out and resolve it. Nazis and similar ideologues aren't necessarily diabolical. A lot of them are just fucking ignorant. Look at JonTron, not a hateful person by any stretch, repeating white nationalist talking points because he's too dumb to understand why they're wrong. Look at that black man who de-converted all those KKK members by talking to them.
Cameron Gray
I actually really enjoyed the film parody. I doubt a faithful adaptation would have been as good as just reading the book.
Jeremiah Anderson
Dankula was obviously just making an edgy joke, though. He only starting associating with the right after the SJWs, the media, and the government attacked him, and the right-wing talking heads came to his defense. He's a manipulable moron but it's understandable why he became a part of the Sargon crowd.
Jeremiah Gray
Prison nazis aren't nazi-nazis, fyi. Burger prisons are racially segregated by nature, and white inmates fall in with white gangs by simple necessity. The aesthetics are a simple identification marker at this point, that serve the dual purposes of being explicitly and unapologetically "white" and scaring the bejeezus out of nonwhites. Maybe you get a few actual fash who held those views before they got locked up, but mostly they're just average degenerate criminals who figured it was easier to shave their head and get a swastika inked on their chest than to be alone and vulnerable in that environment.
Aiden Bennett
The real question is why does anyone give a fuck?
Fuck this fat piece of shit and I hate that I even know he's fat.
Luke Ward
He's yet another attention whore. He's the male version of Lauren Southern.
At least with Lauren you can jack off to her.
Liam Parker
Even if tattooing a swastika on yourself isn't "nazi-nazi" it puts you a lot closer to nazi-nazis because it alienates you from most other people.
Jace Hall
This, same reason MS13 went from a generic California ethnic prison gang to a horrifying transnational terrorist syndicate when they got released.
Noah Stewart
You win points!
Yes and prison guards actually promote the racial divides. Even diesel therapy[1] is racially segregated. I would not be surprised if prison snitches are incentivized to encourage racial division. Dead simple "divide and conquer" tactics.
Caleb Cox
All mafias are fascist. Most all mafias are racial. Prison is crime university.
Jacob Cox
These flying machines have never worked, therefore heavier-than-air flight is impossible. Prove me wrong.
Liam Ramirez
Fuck, I posted in the wrong thread. Please ignore.
Chase Moore
Oh no no no
Carson Cox
hey Posadas man, you like Alien enforced Globalist military herding humans like cattle?