A LOTTA LOYALTY FOR A HIRED GUN!
A LOTTA LOYALTY FOR A HIRED GUN!
Brody Thompson
Jacob Clark
>"PERHAPS HE IS WONDERING WHY SOMEONE WOULD SHOOT A MAN, BEFORE THRO'ENG IMMOUTAVA-BLAINE"
Why did it matter if Thro'Eng Immoutava-Blaine went first or not?
Isaac Sanchez
After months of careful thought and research, I believe I have cracked the meaning of the plane scene in TDKR. Nolan has interwoven poetry throughout the scene, the likes of which George Lucas cannot even comprehend.
>"The flight plan I just filed with the agency lists me, my men, Dr. Pavel here, but only Juan or Hugh"
Masketta man has obviously fed the names of the hostages to CIA, leading him to believe that two of the hostages are named Juan and Hugh.
>CIA: First Juan to talk gets to stay on my aircraft!
This line puzzled me for weeks. CIA just called them Juan and Hugh - why is he now calling them both Juan? Then it hit me - Bane, Juan and Hugh are brothers: Bane Juan, Hugh Juan and Juan Juan. Pay close attention to their names because it becomes important later.
>CIA grabs Juan Juan
>"Hugh paid you to grab Dr. Pavel?"
(CIA is asking Juan if his brother paid him to kidnap Dr. Pavel.)
>CIA shoots his hired gun
>"He didn't fly so good! Hugh wants to try next!"
>CIA signals for his men to grab Hugh Juan
>"Tell me about Bane! Why does he wear the mask? A lotta loyalty for a hired Juan!
But the poetry of the scene really comes to fruition when CIA is talking to Bane:
>"If I pulled that off would you die?"
>"It would be extremely painful"
>"You're a big guy"
>"For you"
This is an in-joke between Bane and Hugh. Hugh Juan = huge one - Hugh was named because he was the biggest of the three brothers. By any standards Bane is a big guy, but his whole life his size has been overshadowed by Hugh, hence why Bane says he is a big guy, but only for CIA, not for Hugh.
John Green
Computer, is there any way to generate a nude Bane?
Elijah King
Finally, at the end of the scene, Bane asks one of his brothers to stay behind:
>"No! They expect Juan of us in the wreckage, brother."
The brother he tells to stay behind is Juan, with Bane making a pun on his name to ease the fear of Juan's incoming death. It is the final pun Juan hears before he dies in the plane wreckage. The final pun before death = The Killing Joke, a Batman comic released in 1988 starring the Joker. Yes, Nolan has laid a breadcrumb trail for us that tells us that Juan Juan is the Joker in disguise, which is why we don't see him for the rest of the film. The Joker lays down his life at the beginning of the film to start the fire. Bravo Nolan.
Austin Smith
Bane.
Eli Nelson
What movie?
Carter Rodriguez
Who is this mosquito man?
Christian Hall
VEIN?
Julian Wright
>Smee
>Maimen
>Dr. Pavelheer
>Button Lee
>Juan Aviéu
>"Fast Owen" Tattaq
>Gitstus Taeion
>Maier Kraft
>Hugh Pediéu
>Tughrab di Qatar
>Paul Vil
>Heidi Dinn
>Flass O'Goode
>Howance Tàuterai
>Nëhst
>Tillmie á Bouté
>Bane
>Veidoû Sïwere
>Damasc
>Allah Dalai al-Teih
>Frau Haìrdegon
>Atlee Sioux
>Kantaaq
>Hugh Aeiou
>Irfah Boulte
>Tatov
>Willy Uday
>Yuri Bigaev
>Voss Göeting
>Chaôute
>Partov Īplaan
>Will Khäng
>Roche U.
>"Lesions" Yagat
>Hieselv Kòutê
>Nâvou Watts
>Dan Echsteppe
>Auvia Masze
>"Tupple" Anne
Who are these people? Do they ever appear in the film?
Hunter Stewart
Mr. Banely?
Jordan Anderson
I've always thought that CIA was bluffing when he said only one of them would stay on the plane. Bane forcing one of his men to stay just makes it more hilarious.
Ayden Mitchell
This whole scene, in fact, is a reference to Nietzschean philosophy. Hotheads would never understand.
First, when Agent Wilson calls Bane a "big guy" he's clearly referencing him as the Übermensch, while himself indulges in slave morality represented by the authoritarian institution that is Central Intelligence Agency. Note how Wilson never references himself as his real name. There is no individuality in him, only CIA. The essence of slave morality (represented as the "flight plan", opposed to master morality - the "master plan") is utility: the good is what is most useful for the whole community, not the strong. But he does not see beyond initial good and evil.
Also prior to the scene, Wilson shoots out of the plane without actually killing anyone. He does so out of misguided anger, furious that neither faith in god nor scientific knowledge has not given him the rest or respite he desires. At the same time, CIA shooting the sky symbolizes the death of God as a source of morality for people, leading to the unhooding of Bane, the Übermensch.
When Bane crashes the plane with no survivors, he's crashing the entire worldview based on slave morality. He's crashing old thoughts and institutions (such as Judeo-Chrsitian religion). He's crashing secular humanism. He's crashing herd mentality. He's crashing even himself, as he overcomes his former self to become the over-man. In this crash, a fire rises in the wreckage - the triumph of "life" over "logic"
Then, in the end Bane reminds Dr. Pavel that "Now is not the time for fear, that comes later!" The world is necessarily moved in a cycle, endlessly repeating all past events due to finite amount of matter and infinite amount of time. In this eternal recurrence, the plane crash will repeat - again and again.
But if life triumphs over logic, the only meaning is life then is the will to power, that means the big guy will always be in charge here.
Bravo Nolan.
Logan Phillips
John Robinson
joe kerr
dunnhier
Ryan Bailey
>The flight plan lists Smee Maimen and Dr Pavelheer..
WHO????
Tyler Johnson
I forgot batman was even in this fucking movie desu
Easton Foster
Why was he talking to his gun, an inanimate object, while clearly there was work to do interrogating his prisoners?
Of course it is loyal, it's his gun, or at least the gun he hired.
who's going to post the naked cia pic and get banned?
Nolan James
>lets go pal, I’m McKenna with Draul here
I never knew Joe Kerr had yet another alias. The plot thickens
Alexander Barnes
>I’m Amanda Wayward
HUH??
Adam Anderson
he didn't fly so good
Hunter Russell
i've only ever watched this movie once and i was falling asleep because it was a midnight viewing. should i bother with it again?
Alexander Price
>Why did it matter if Thro'Eng Immoutava-Blaine went first or not?
because he didn't fly so good and that's obvious user
Caleb Wood
Cut down on your damn casts, Nolan.
Blake Gonzalez
good thread
Jonathan Powell
Kino
Caleb Taylor
He had a parachute you clown
David Powell
BANE?
Jack Watson
It's to fulfill the requirements of The Flight Plan.
Cooper Hill
Big Guy
Jack Hughes
That’s not Batman, it’s Bateman. It’s okay to be confused, though, they frequently misspelt his name.
Carson Parker
10/10
Caleb Wood
He's trans, that's why he appears to Harvey Dent, the man transforming into Two-Face, as a sexy nurse. One caterpillar undergoing metamorphosis moved to fellow feeling for another.