60fps

Post an actual example where you experienced this. I'm not trying to convince you that this is *NEVER* an issue, but like do you have eyes? What is the purpose of this thread?

In no way does that interpolation artifacting weigh against that 24fps stutter.

It's in the panning where it's jarring to see, not the actual cel animation. I hope anime studios start to produce in 60fps natively, but that won't happen any time soon.
And no, I do *NOT* mean 60fps with cel interpolation(CACANi) natively. Just 60fps for the output and keeping the cel refresh rate the same.

Just go look up anime 60fps on youtube, alot of clippers seem to fall for this meme and I'm sure there are better examples than this one: youtube.com/watch?v=Au-whxGOrp4
The motion just doesn't look as good because it's 24fps anime transposed to 60fps shit. It just doesn't look the way it's supposed to.

my laptop monitor (144hz, msi gs65 stealth) has a 7ms response time, I tried watching a slow pan from some anime and I saw ZERO stuttering. my secondary monitor (60hz, lg 24ea53) has a 5ms response time, I watched that exact same slow pan on there and I noticed some intermittent but consistent stuttering.
What you're talking abot IS a refresh rate issue, 24 fps does not divide neatly into 60hz, each new frame of anime would ideally show up every 2.5 screen refreshes but obviously that can't happen so it stutters and sometimes you notice it. The exact pan I used was from episode 27 of D-YFI's release of LOGH.
I even tried it on my old 1l908w (75hz, 5ms response time) and the stuttering was even worse (75/24 = 3.125), so yeah this is a refresh rate thing not a response time thing

60fps live action already feels awkward and you only need to film it, and in anime it's just horrid.

0:38 that's a medium/slow PU (Pan-up).
That's where it would stutter at a constant rate if you have a modern monitor.

Well, I guess I'll go try it then without interpolation though, this is distracting me from my ""work"".
I think I already have my panel set to 120Hz in the Nvidia control panel but whatever, I'll try.

I highly highly doubt it, just look at LG CX motion interpolation demo they use. That stuttering with 24fps is annoying as fuck.

Appreciating good timing in animation is hard.
Going "Wow that looks good!" whenever something moves smoothly is easy.

It really is just a meme. You have the correct perspective already. It would be fine if anime were composited at a faster rate, say 48 instead of 24, just for the sake of smoother scrolling or being able to have faster panning shots, without affecting the number and quality of key frames and their pacing. But thats at the production stage, not some dumb program you run to smear your show in vaseline.

Those who want to make interpolated frames with some shitty algorithm really have no appreciation of anime line art and the timing style of high detail, low key frames style of animation. It's especially telling that they have chosen 60 fps as their target, not even 48, 72 or 96, so that they make SURE to damage every individual key frame. We're talking about people who don't know the first thing about video quality, don't realize that 24 doesn't go into 60, and are too ignorant or lazy to set their monitor to the correct refresh rate.

I understand that 24 fps can suck in panning shots, but it's not worth applying a shitty filter to the entire video trying to fix that. That's not how line art works, and if you don't care about line art, why are you even here?

Go to the OP of Taimadou Gakuen 35 Shiken Shoutai and then to the slow pan with the falling stars en masse.
The characters and credits keep "teleporting" as it were to the left. With interpolation that effect is diminished greatly, but not wholly eliminated.

Probably going to close this thread as I highly doubt you are in fact right.

I was experimenting with

What is your point

>. It would be fine if anime were composited at a faster rate, say 48 instead of 24,
Hey, thank you for existing, but the program actually kinda works *when you dial it in correctly*, you have to turn the Nvidia hardware acceleration off though, as that just doesn't work well at all.

Well you only reach that level of aesthetic sensibility after seeing a lot of anime and most anime fans have seen probably less than fifty shows.

60fps is objectively better than 24fps. This should be obvious because you can represent what you see at 24fps in 60fps, but the converse is not true. Interpolation does usually suck though unfortunately. But when you get used to 60fps them 24fps content looks like shit so some people are willing to put up with the weird artifacting that occurs.

Unironically yes.

I can never get used to how 60fps anime moves though. It lacks the weightiness of the limited frame animation and seems unnatural with how smooth it is.

The human eye can't see more then 20 fps

>hose who want to make interpolated frames with some shitty algorithm really have no appreciation of anime line art and the timing style of high detail, low key frames style of animation. It's especially telling that they have chosen 60 fps as their target, not even 48, 72 or 96, so that they make SURE to damage every individual key frame. We're talking about people who don't know the first thing about video quality, don't realize that 24 doesn't go into 60, and are too ignorant or lazy to set their monitor to the correct refresh rate.

This thread should be closed. I have it set to 96 or something though.

I was experimenting with anime and the amount of action you can show with 60 and 24 in terms of like impact frames, it's a lot.

My point is that on a first glance normalfags will think it looks good because of how smooth it seems.

These youtube videos are total shit because they're forcing 60 fps on animation that wasn't made for it. 60 fps can actually look really good IF the show was made for it. For example the bluray rips of Thunderbolt fantasy look stunning

That's because your brain is used to filling in all the gaps in 24fps for you. When you start watching 60fps it still tries doing the same thing, but it can't, or if it does things feel like they're sped up even though they're happening in the same time frame so it feels unnerving. Once you get used to 60fps that stops happening, but then 24fps starts to feel like a suttery slideshow because your brain isn't filling in the gaps to you anymore.

No anime in history was ever animated on the 1s

I've tried out these programs and played with the settings, both SVP and MadVR, but I just don't think they're worth it. I'm used to 24 fps judder, and anyone who watches movies will have to be. I also don't use madvr anymore. I pretty much use the default renderer in MPC with settings for color calibration. Get a 4k monitor so you can have integer scaling on everything with minimal to no black bars. Fundamentally, what I want is to see the video signal represented as accurately as possible. In pixel count, color, time, every respect. Sometimes that is a shitty fansub from 2005 and it looks like ass, but no amount of filters are going to improve it. I'd rather deal with whatever artifacts there are than blur out detail or mess up timing.

I'm the kind of guy who, before we had variable refresh rate monitors, I would spend hours setting custom refresh rates for every resolution and frame rate of my monitors. I had this awesome viewsonic crt that could do 1920x1440 72hz. Sadly it's broke and I haven't been able to fix it yet. But I would spend afternoons setting it up so every video format would have flawless frame pacing with no dropped or repeated frames for at least 3 hours, long enough to watch any movie. BTW it really did help changing away from standard pc refresh rates like 60, 72, or 85. Pulldown, even 3:2 pulldown, makes the 24 fps juddering a lot worse than it has to be. With a modern display, try to make sure you have gsync or freesync and all the software is setup correctly.

> It's especially telling that they have chosen 60 fps as their target
That's presumably because of 60Hz refresh rates being standard for years. If they picked 48fps they'd have both artifacting AND judder.

you're right, that particular scene of the stars with the text DOES stutter, it stutters identically on all of my monitors because the encoding for that video is pretty trash. you can even check it yourself, frame by frame the youtube video and you'll see some frames repeating once twice or even three times, thats just cus the video itself sucks, it has nothing to do with response times or even refresh rates in this case.
you can even see the video runs at 30fps, obviously the anime as it aired only ran at 24fps, so there's your explanation for that one.

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48 is not too bad when viewed without any pulldown. I think it gets a bad rap because of people trying to view it on 60hz monitors 72 or 96 would be better if your computer can do that. If that's really how you want to watch your shows, more power to you, but I can't recommend it to anyone.

For computers, I've found that almost any 60hz monitor can be made to do 72hz. If yours can't, it's probably pretty old, and it may be time to consider an upgrade if you care about video quality enough to use something like SVP in the first place.

60hz is the standard only because that's the frequency of our AC power in the US, and early TVs used that as the clock. It was never considered ideal for anything, it was just good enough and it made TV production cheaper in a time when electronic clocks would have added a fair bit of cost and complexity. These days, anyone who sticks with 60hz, is just someone who doesn't care. Which is fine, but then why have an argument about it? This is objectively a terrible target frame rate.

Purist will be purist.

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