Sonic thread

Why is it so hard to design 3D levels based around momentum style of gameplay?

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It's not that it's hard it's just that Sega is incompetent

What are you talking about? Only Sonic Team/Sega can't make a Sonic game. If Sonic Team were disbanded and Sega were not allowed to be publishers and supervise the project it would be a series on the level of Zelda and Mario.

>Why is it so hard to design 3D levels based around momentum style of gameplay?

Take this with a grain of salt, but I've seen a few seconds of an official sonic level in sonic utopia and it looked pretty good.

None of that shit was hard, sonic team just fucked themselves out the door by not letting you control sonic and implementing scripts and path magnetism with cuuhhhaaarazzzyy camera angles

They're just lazy and dont have any passion. Project hero plays like a dream but there really hasn't been any real levels made for it

Next 3D Sonic game needs to discard every mechanic and gimmick and be (level) designed with just Sonic and his momentum and pinball physics in mind.
That and making the trick system less QTE and more Pro Skater/Skate, although they could save that for a sequel

Jesus fucking christ I'm so tired of seeing these stupid posts. Do you think anyone beyond you autists cares about this shit? No. No one's saying "wow this sonic game sucks because it has poor level design". All complaints on modern sonic games are about shit like story. Why the fuck would SEGA bend over backwards just for you retards when the vast majority of consumers don't care?

It's not hard at all. Problem is that that is not and has not been Sonic Team's design philosophy for a long, long time. Their interest is in making fast-paced, cinematic platformers, and not this somewhat open-ended sandbox-y ball game everyone wants.

>All complaints on modern sonic games are about shit like story
You dropped your brain.

>get forces from humble bundle, don't play it for like 2 years
>finally sit down to play it after staring it down in my backlog for ages
>done in 3 hours
good game, sega

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>pinball physics
Stop using this stupid term.

OPEN WORLD SONIC HEROES2
>all the cool characters: Bark, Fang, Tikal, Eggrobo, Emeryl

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Was there any difference between characters in Heroes or they were just reskins?

They were doing right with Adventure games and making the physics and momentum better in each game. Then they fucked up with Heroes, despite the level design with alternatives paths having the right idea

But he is right. Classic had pinball physics in mind, or what the fuck you think Spring Yard and Collision Chaos were?

Most characters felt different, especially power characters(like Omega blasting shit everywhere), but Sonic and Shadow were about the same. Team Chaotix was the most unique team because their story had missions to use their gimmicks like Espio turning invisible.

What fangame is this?

characters were unique, but not by a lot

>speed
sonic and shadow are essentially the same. amy has a hammer attack and espio has shurikens + can go invisible

>power
third attack is different for each one and there are two groups for air attacks: those that can only fire teammates as projectiles (gamma, knuckles) and those that do body slams when out of teammates (big, vector)

>fly
basically all exactly the same, except for the attack they do when no teammates are around, which is unique

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I played the beta Windy Valley recently.
Don't understand why they dropped that design philosophy.

I think in 3D the physics collide with the speed
I was playing unleashed today and i had a great amount of fun playing the daytime stages but the thing i realized, when you control sonic on the hubworld where you select the acts, Sonic controls like utter garbage
Like its almost impossible to be precise with him, there is no problem controlling him in the city because his speed is slowed down, but on that hub where he uses the same physics as the stages? Impossible
So it all comes down to two thing, do you want a momentum based platform with moderate speed or a flashy spectacle like with the boost formula?

people literally speedran the game before the refund window was closed
what design philosophy?
I'd rather Sonic be moderately fast, but with better handling

>speedran the game before the refund window was closed
Jesus is this true?

Sonic was never good

>what the fuck you think Spring Yard and Collision Chaos were?
Flippers and bumpers don't chance the fact that Sonic doesn't act like a bloody pinball in any way, you ninny. Classic Sonic has a fantastic physics engine but there's nothing 'pinball' about it, and you bringing up level gimmicks that have nothing to do with physics isn't going to make it so.

I'm the guy on the first reply, yes it is. I played the game hella casually and nearly got all S ranks and finished the game in about 3-4 hours, which is still under the refund limit. and yet for some reason the steam game time clocked in at 11 hours which is nowhere close to that. bit of an eyebrow raiser

>Why is it so hard
It's not, in fact, Sonic Team has already done it.

All the way back in 1997.

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I think this is why the boost formula alone cant carry the game
Finishing every level in like 2-3 minutes? Like damn the whole game is over too soon
In the 2D classic games it work better because you can choose to explore the stages, do all the bonuses and find the chaos emerald, and every stage has 2 acts
But with the boost games you are expected to go as fast as you can so the levels are gone fast
Replayability is the thing that carry those games but i havent seen anyone going back to forces tho
Was it really that bad?

Too bad they fucked it up with SA2

Werent there issues with making all levels like that? I mean, big and open with slopes?

>Why is it so hard to design 3D levels based around momentum style of gameplay
It's not, see the Windy Valley beta.

Yes, with the physics engine.

That looks so fun what the fuck

I don't even know what to make of Sonic Forces. It was so mediocre despite pushing the emergency button (OCs) that it just...failed to make waves in any fan circles.
Like, it wasn't decently good or 06 levels of bad/unplayable. Just, mediocre and creatively bankrupt. You'd think it'd be meme'd to hell and back for the OC thing but the game just dropped off the radar and the most you get from people is
>meh, that happened

one of my friends watching me play pointed something out that blasted my sides asunder:
>the credits are longer than two stages combined