Why did none of the numerous souls clones or even fromsoft sequels understand that the appeal of DaS1 was its feeling...

Where would they copy it from when DkS1 doesn't have it either

the game is barely difficult outside 1 or 2 bosses, and a lot of the difficulty can stem from jank/camera issues
I think I died less than 15 total times on the bosses, though this was after beating BB
going back to DeS is an exercise in tedium due to how easy the game is to break

Yeah the difficulty is important but that alone would have made for a mediocre game too. DS1's charm is the combination of difficulty, level design, exploration, and lore.

Fast travel and generous bonfire placements also ruin the tension of exploring

what I wanna know is why do all the souls clones have to be grim-dark? Look at code vein. The anime characters do not fit the world AT ALL. It would have been a much better game if it took place in dragon quest XI's world.

Ashen is not grim dark, I think? Haven't played it but it looks more colorful and fairytal-ish

>looks more colorful and fairytal-ish

really? All the time I was playing code vein I was thinking it should have been a fairy tail setting. The dogshit story might have worked better if you introduced loads of gay fairies and elves to support the incredibly gay story.

I don't think there were fairies or elves in Fairy Tail

DS2 had none of it.
DS3 was overall meh but the trick of going at the deepest part of the castle, then entering a pitch black place only for it to actually be the starting point of the game in the past was a real nice concept

Because the main aesthetic is entropy. The intro shows an epic fantasy primordial world and then a high fantasy LOTR type world. The setting is at the other end of history when all these things have been fought and died for with no major conflicts left, just stubborn forces waiting for the heat death of the universe.

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I don't know but I also wonder when did people start putting games on a pedestal?

Because there wasn't any positive mystery inherent to DS, you fucking child, it was just the first game of its kind you ever played. Had you all played DeS first, you would have said the same moronic shit. Back in my fucking day, that mystery was in many games, and it was good, and we were actual children. Now, you're all manchildren discovering something you didn't have as actual children, but it doesn't last because you're too old to be mystified by something so simple for very long, and you miss it already. Shit like this is why kids need to read books.

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I've always been able to understand the idea behind this complaint but I've never really felt it myself or agreed with it, or at least the tension in the exploring isn't as important to me as the exploration itself. The bonfires and fast-travel just server as QoL improvements to the gameplay.
However, I can agree completely that it DOES detract from the feeling of permanence, theres many places you will never revisit because of the nature of the game's progression as you will just skip over them every time you need to go to the place beyond. Compared to DS1 where you constantly retread many areas, but the problem then is DS1's actual fast-travel system you unlocked was a bit lackluster and not really comprehensive enough, and by that point all there really is to do is go to places you've already been and explore the new areas that opened up that are much more self-contained and not part of that larger sprawling exploration, so it feels like a somewhat pointless and unrewarding restriction.

I don't understand the appeal of Anne. She's such a shallow bimbo. She looks sexy, I guess. But I prefer Hifumi or Makoto.

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NPCs gonna NPC

>The bonfires and fast-travel just server as QoL improvements to the gameplay.

This. Sure it makes it more video gamey, but damned if it doesn't make going back to places for an item you missed or whatever so much more convenient.

so every game that follows the souls formula HAS to be grim-dark or have an *laughs into thesaurus* "aesthetic of entropy"?

lmao at your worthless english/philosophy degree

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Because it takes a brain to comprehend what those things even are.
Miyazaki just slightly copied Ueda so by the time these ideas reach others they're diluted so far from the inspiration that they end up as generic clones instead of works of art.

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>DS2 had none of it.
lol, these games are the fucking same dude, you dark souls fags are pathetic. yeah, DS2 has some butt ugly areas but the overall progression and variety when travelling the world was the same as all the other shit

b-but muh boss battles. Dark Souls is about b-boss battles

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I think Bloodborne does pretty well at making the setting a mystery to unravel as you explore. Very different kind of tone and atmosphere though.
If you're willing to look outside of souls games, try Morrowind. Obviously it's a very different game, but the sense of adventure and atmosphere is definitely there, coupled with rich lore to uncover as you play and explore. I started replaying it a few months back and though I ultimately dropped it because I've already played it to death years ago, I had a lot of fun going out on little adventures, returning with coin to buy books from the book seller and reading up on all the wacky lore.

they did (bloodborne), das2 and 3 was obligatorily made under namco's contract so they just threw some shit together

>Now, you're all manchildren discovering something you didn't have as actual children,

I mean, it's always been pretty fucking clear that the people who lionize these games are mostly people with little to no experience in these games.

I distinctly remember forums (including Zig Forums) in 2011 and 2012 being filled with people who said stupid shit like "wow, Dark Souls's combat system is so much better than Skyrim!", as if the only other fantasy ARPG with melee combat in history has only ever been Skyrim (and, of course, Skyrim is a very low bar when it comes to satisfying melee combat, so just about anything feels better than that). For me, it tells me that these people have very little experience with videogames.

Yes

>I think Bloodborne does pretty well at making the setting a mystery to unravel as you explore. Very different kind of tone and atmosphere though.

Bloodborne was just a boring hallway compared to DeS and DS1. It was just the first "lol xD soulsgame i'm such a gamer" for the PS4.

>compared to DeS
lol wut

>DS1
only the first half, second half is 4 very linear paths. Most of bloodborne isn't even required

What you gain in convenience you lose in immersion. The best example of this is Blighttown. Once you're deep in it, the idea of backtracking is as daunting as to keep pushing forward. It actually really feels like a dangerous journey where you're completely isolated in this dark and evil place, and that makes it so much more memorable than if you were easily able to warp back to firelink to talk to NPCs etc

There are other examples in DaS like having to backtrack to the bridge and having to deal with the dragon every time unless you decide to fight it. More than likely, most players run away the first few times but after a certain point you feel strong enough and finally slay it. It feels earned because of all the experience that came before. You slay a few dragons in DaS2 but they're just bosses in rooms, there's no tension being built so when you finally defeat them, it just feels like "meh, just beat another boss", instead of realizing this is the result of hours of progress and in-game storytelling of your own adventure choices. Wouldn't be possible either if you could just warp back and forth and avoid it.

>des=das=bb>>>>>>> and 3
if a fromsoft game has a number after it, it is garbage

holy based

This. Even Souls fans go into competitions as to which of these games is easier.

There are exactly three hard parts in Dark Souls 1 (two depending on what starting item you picked) for a first time playthrough:

1. Your first hour or two as you learn to control your character and get used to the clunky four way rolling, the annoying stacking of input buffers (that you can STILL find in Dark Souls 3 and Bloodborne) and the stamina system

2. Anor Londo, because of the Anor Londo archers and Ornstein/Smough being unique challenges you don't get anywhere else in the game

3. If you didn't get the Master Key, you would have a hard time fighting Capra Demon because he becomes unskippable.

Even throughout all of this, you can remove points number 2 and 3 if you summon people for co-op because that shit trivializes the game.

god I hope elden ring will be the sotc successor we deserve instead of a fast paced linear action game

ahem

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Bloodborne is full of little side paths and shortcuts within levels though. Besides I meant more from the narrative side. You start out fighting werewolves in some Gothic Victorian setting with little more to go on than 'you're a hunter, hunt beasts'. That progresses to finding out about blood and Old Ones and all the other weird shit, with new areas and enemies feeding you down that rabbithole.

you're funny

why the fuck can't I level up at a bonfire in 2 and 3? What's the lore reason? If you're gonna make QoL changes, make them across the board. I mean, I can teleport back to majula/firelink with no penalty, it's just wasting my fucking time. Anyway, DS3 was dogshit.

Play other games faggot, dork souls is just a 3d metroidvania without the fun of getting different abilities to unlock more areas, just fuckin keys or doors opening when you kill shit.

Blight town is memorable, however it is also a shitthole and I do not want to remember it

You do find new abilities though, in the form of spells and weapon movesets. You don't NEED them but they help you beat bosses and it's fun to experiment.

Get over yourself. The original fanbase of Demon's Souls was mostly oldfags who played all the older games it borrowed from. No one is claiming its individual elements are original, but it's the whole that is unique and unmatched. There's a reason these games sustain such a level of obsession even outside of the hype cycle.