Are visual novels videogames?

No. But it’s just easier to call it a game. Only desperate incel nerds are going to play them, why not sell it where they occupy most of their time. It’s like a gas station selling snacks, snacks is not gas, but you can get it at the gas station. See? Very simple

/thread

Can someone tell me what makes a good VN a good game from a pure gameplay perspective?
Lets say you were to remove the art, the writing, and music, and make it as simple as something like Tetris. What would you rate the GAME portion out of 10?

The player has zero control so it’s not a game. It’s a visual board game :)

Some have minigames that take skill though. Theres a bullet hell in Valhalla and some annoying shit in Danganrona V3

Most videogames require 0 skills. Visual novels are objectively part of the interactive medium that is videogame

so take out anything good about VNs? 0/10

Can you lose?
Yes? Then its a game even if it's a shitty one.
No? Then its not a game.

>it's not a game
>it's a - - - game :)
Huh?

If you remove the art, music, writing from any game it becomes absolutely unplayable. Any game.

The only good VNs from a gameplay perspective are the VN hybrids like Ace Attorney and Zero Escape. Pure VNs only really have a choice here and there and some VNs don't even have choices.

Is tag not a game now? You can be "it" but nobody ever loses

Tag is an arcade game

Tag is not a video game

Good thing he has a turbo controller, or else that guy might actually have to do something to see the ending.

still better than movie game

So are they good GAMES? If you watch to have a medium judged on its writing then maybe it should be classed as a different medium?
Would Sokoban be bad if you replaced all the assets with colored blocks? No, it would still be a good game. If you replaced all the assets in something like SMB with Tetris blocks it would still be a fun game due to the raw mechanics being gun as a GAME. By your logic Go is unplayable.

>エロゲ
>ゲ
Yes, they are video games.

False. It requires you to use your deductive abilities to solve the puzzles

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they are usually not sold in book stores so i guess

VNs have less interactivity than fucking Zork.

If you take out the art/writing/music from the vast majority of crpgs you'd see the only difference between them and the average vn is a cookie clicker mechanic that allows you to meet specific numbers required for progression. Many VNs have hidden mechanics like this that will net you bad endings if you didn't put enough eggs in one basket based on clues in the writing, but without the context clues they are no different than dicerolls when it comes to the relevant choices

Those games on the right are all Adventure games, where you have a lot of agency and variation of outcome
A visual novel is LITERALLY just "click to turn the page"

Those are VN hybrids. Not pure VNs.

Change intellectual to """intellectual""" and I'll agree with this picture

>you should only judge film based on cinematography or move on to a different medium
>you should only judge music based on composition or move on to a different medium
>you should only judge novels based on prose or move on to a different medium

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What skills does a game like Heavy Rain require?

No

As much as walking simulators are.

Yes. You can have integral portions of the medium expressed poorly and therefore have a bad expression of that medium.

Don't visual novels have choice? Like maybe no skill or puzzles involved but I figured most have some choice like "do you want to fuck blue hair waifu or pink hair waifu?"

People need VNs to be classed as games. Can you imagine someone talking about Le Mort D'Arthur and then someone saying "you should read Fate!" So they need them to be compared to video games so their low-quality writing and art stands up to its peers.

The skill to do the QTEs.

who cares if they're video games or not?