Why does no one ever talk about TF2's crate system when the topic of predatory lootboxes and gambling in games are brought up? Any time lootboxes are brought up its always mainly talking about overwatch. Even though the way that game handles lootboxes is really generous compared with other games. I believe CS has a similar loot system to TF2, but I only have experience with TF2's, so I'll only be talking about that one.
TF2's loot system is one of the worst I've personally experience in multiplayer games. Everything about it is designed specifically to be predatory and encourage you to keep unboxing. Not only do you have to pay to open them you also have to pay for (or randomly find) the crate itself. To top it off, the items in the crates are almost always worth much less than the means to open them. So you'd always be better off to just buy them directly if you wanted them. But unboxing gives an incredibly low chance you get something worth a lot; which is literally just gambling. But the absolute worst part is that the ONLY way to get new cosmetic items in the game is to either buy them on the community market, trade for them (no one wants metal so good luck), or unbox. All of which involve spending real money. There are no ways to feasibly get the cosmetics just by playing the game.
But that's the weird thing. Even back when it was more in the mainstream no one really brought it up. It's like people just gave valve a pass since they were one of the first to do the whole cosmetic lootboxes thing.
Christian Cook
The moment TF2 copied the case and item rarity system from CSGO thats when it actually got worse.
Dota 2 at minimum guarantees you one item of each tier. TF2 and CSGO do not.
Jason Morales
Pretty much. I don't think anyone at the time realised just how quickly and how much it was gonna spread
Anthony Sullivan
>"it's ok when valve does it"
Matthew Hernandez
>What are craft hats
Landon Williams
I didn't read any of that, but yet loot boxes are trash. Here is the thing tho, what other platform or game let's you sell these boxes for a profit? What other game or service let's you sell useless cosmetics that can be used to buy new video games off steam?
William Moore
Because the items in tf2's crates can be obtained through trading
Mason Wright
I absolutely hate the rarity system they have. It's so insulting to item creators. Imagine you spend days working on an item and it actually gets approved to be in the game you love. And then valve make it a common so they can put some gaudy meme hat as a high tier. Now people don't want or like the cosmetics because of how they look, but because of some arbitrary rng rarity and text color.
Joshua Morgan
Also imo the most bullshit thing about the mann co store isn't even the crates, it's how much they overcharge for hats that are worth like a handful of ref
Caleb Roberts
When was the last time valve adding any hats to the crafting pool? 5, 6 years ago?
John Hall
The open economy, trading and selling are why its just seen as normal for Valve games because most people just see it as microtransactions rather than gambling.
If you genuinely do like a cheap ass hat from a case it costs mere cents as opposed to other games where the company sets all the overpriced cosmetics.
And yet no matter how gaudy something is in a case theres no restriction for it and yet other perfectly normal hats have restrictions.
Ryder Murphy
I can drop a dollar and buy up the latest cosmetics that idiots unboxed. I can also sell useless CS GO boxes from years back and get like $30 each to buy new games. It's a weird system but it's nothing like other loot box schemes or even worse non-refundable "premium currency".
Dominic Perez
I wasn't talking about the economy. Just the uncrating system itself. If you're a player just now coming in are you really going to want to brave the toxic bog that is the tf2 economy? Making it essentially impossible to get the new items without spending money is just going to drive potential new people away. Especially since most comparable other multiplayer games have some means for you to get items without spending real money.
Levi Cook
>Literally just cosmetics >Unusual hat effects look ugly as shit anyway >Strange stats don't do anything >War paints don't do anything
Isaac Nguyen
becau valve gud dey made steam funney gaben sales :D
Xavier Evans
What are you talking about, user? Just look at this OUTRAGEOUS outfit!
Cosmetic items are an aspect of the game. You can't just pretend they don't have an impact on the enjoyment of it or don't play any role it the game experience. Locking away an aspect of the game behind a paywall is not consumer friendly.
Sebastian Carter
This. So: >Sell unsuals >Sell strange >Sell drops you don't want on market >Buy cosmetics you want for $0.10 each or buy a key and sell it for metal to go craft crazy >Buy new games instead
Tell me what other game literally pays you for playing.
Jason Price
Cosmetics started good. Make your character have some swagger. Then as the years passed by it was just meme and furry shit due to the selection being solely based on user scores and not valve trying to keep an aesthetic. Every Unusual cosmetic wearer Ive ever played against was a either a role playing furry or was dog shit at the game. Cosmetics don't affect the game experience that involves capturing or defending points, getting Intel, etc.
Noah Baker
THEY'RE COSMETICS. THEY DO LITERALLY NOTHING OTHER THAN LOOK NEAT OR TRACK KILLS. THEY DO NOT MAKE YOU ANY BETTER AT THE GAME THAN ANYONE ELSE. YOU CAN LITERALLY GET EVERY WEAPON WITH JUST RANDOM DROPS AND JUST TRADE FOR SCRAP METAL IF YOU GET DUPLICATES. HATS ARE STILL RARE DROPS AND NORMAL HAT DROPS ARE SO OVER SATURATED THAT THERE'S A FUCKING EXCESS OF THEM. GET THE FUCK OUT YOU STUPID FUCKTARD.
A big thing to note is that you can actually sell your rare drops in CSGO/TF2, in the overwatch model you get fucked either way sense there is no open market like on Steam
Samuel Taylor
For being fair, you have trading.
You can buy a key and with just 2.50 buy cosmetics for all your mercs. 2.50 more and you get all the guns and with metal to spare.
That's something you can't say about most other loot box games.
Thomas Baker
they're the worst kind of lootbox and also the first time it was introduced in the west but it's fine when valve does it I guess
Henry Cruz
I made 40 bucks selling the glitched crates that had a 100% unusual drop rate. Thanks for the free games valve
Ryan Long
Because it's totally irrelevant to the actual gameplay. Pay to win microtransactions are an issue, gambling for a stupid hat is fine. That, plus the fact that you can in fact make money off of it, puts it in the 'acceptable' category for most people.
Aaron White
everyone has always done it and it was even described as the predecessor to todays bullshit nobody ever said this
