MORE SYSTEMD EXPLOITS PART II

Christian Nguyen
Christian Nguyen

SYSTEMD-JOURNALD IS VULNERABLE TO TWO MEMORY CORRUPTIONS AND ONE INFORMATION LEAK. ALL SYSTEMD LINUX SYSTEMS ARE VULNERABLE.

seclists.org/oss-sec/2019/q1/54

archive.fo/SeSiy

Attached: images.jpeg (6.89 KB, 230x219)

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=CjDaaY9ceN0
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Init
gnu.org/software/shepherd/manual/html_node/Design-decisions.html#Design-decisions
steemit.com/linux/@crokkon/firefox-and-alsa-sound-without-pulseaudio
github.com/i-rinat/apulse#firefox-58-tabs-crashing-when-trying-to-play-audio
github.com/systemd/systemd/blob/master/NEWS
invidio.us/watch?v=4JbDb4bRBK4
homepages.inf.ed.ac.uk/cgi/rni/comp-arch.pl?Vect/cray1.html,Vect/cray1-cpu.gif,Vect/menu-cr1.html
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burroughs_large_systems
gnu.org/gnu/gnu-history.html
archive.fo/qhgoZ
seclists.org/oss-sec/2019/q1/140
seclists.org/oss-sec/2019/q1/54
youtube.com/watch?v=6AeWu1fZ7bY

Colton Cruz
Colton Cruz

This is why operating systems should be re-written in SPARK and formally verified.
Ada masterrace :^)

Caleb Brooks
Caleb Brooks

Eagerly awaiting the "not my problem" response.

David Perez
David Perez

That's inconceivable!

Gabriel Powell
Gabriel Powell

The Multicsfag will blame Unix for this, as if systemd would be a well-written program in any language or operating system.

Attached: Oekaki.png (13.99 KB, 500x250)

Logan Lewis
Logan Lewis

Does it have anything to do with binary logs?
:^)

Colton Taylor
Colton Taylor

It wouldn't even make sense for him to do that. Systemd is actively defiant against the Unix philosophy.

Brody Davis
Brody Davis

He's blamed Unix and its philosophy for bloated web browsers and the parts of Windows he doesn't like, so don't put it past him.

Brayden Hughes
Brayden Hughes

SystemDowns
A service manager for those with Down's.

Adrian Butler
Adrian Butler

Is systemd a security risk? I thought it made things more secure because it helped with sandboxing?

Jonathan Turner
Jonathan Turner

The Multicsfag will blame Unix for this,
I blame UNIX for this because it's a bug caused by C and UNIX that would not be possible on Multics. The bug is caused by a C macro that uses alloca to allocate on the stack with yet another lack of bounds checking. Multics uses separate stack segments with bounds checked automatically by hardware, which makes this exploit impossible. Even better, Multics can extend the stack automatically.

x86 supported bounds-checked segments since the 286 and became more similar to Multics machines since the 386, but UNIX doesn't use it (and neither does Windows) because it's not "portable" to RISCs. RISCs are designed to run C and UNIX and left out anything that would be useful to another OS like Multics. What this means is that RISCs like ARM and RISC-V are just PDP-11s with bigger address spaces. You might be surprised that I'm ultimately blaming RISCs and PDP-11s for a systemd exploit, but it's true.

as if systemd would be a well-written program in any language or operating system.
You're right about that. Systemd, like POSIX, would still suck in any language.

It's still written in C.

Web browsers are written in C and C++, both UNIX languages from AT&T. HTTP itself has misspellings because the UNIX spell checker sucks. Windows is also written in C and C++, which counteract the good engineering from VMS.

Hey. This is unix-haters, not RISC-haters.

Look, those guys at berkeley decided to optimise their
chip for C and Unix programs. It says so right in their
paper. They looked at how C programs tended to behave, and
(later) how Unix behaved, and made a chip that worked that
way. So what if it's hard to make downward lexical funargs
when you have register windows? It's a special-purpose
chip, remember?

Only then companies like Sun push their snazzy RISC
machines. To make their machines more attractive they
proudly point out "and of course it uses the great
general-purpose RISC. Why it's so general purpose that it
runs Unix and C just great!"

This, I suppose, is a variation on the usual "the way
it's done in unix is by definition the general case"
disease.

Nathaniel Bailey
Nathaniel Bailey

I appreciate your tenacity, if nothing else. I can always rely on you to dredge up unix-hating diatribes.

Dominic Thomas
Dominic Thomas

he actually responded

Attached: Oekaki.png (11.5 KB, 500x250)

James Brown
James Brown

Have you ever considered scrapbooking your mailing list quotes together and making them publicly available?

Angel Edwards
Angel Edwards

Aren't those from "The Unix-Haters Handbook"?

Blake Garcia
Blake Garcia

RISCs are designed to run C and UNIX
u wot m8
youtube.com/watch?v=CjDaaY9ceN0

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Aiden Powell
Aiden Powell

Multics fag is a CISC fag
How surprising. I guess it helps having "the hardware will solve all my problems" as a retort. Also, when will you admit that a decent GC (in thoughput and latency) is infinitely more complex and bloated (thus full of bug) than even gcc (not GCC)?

Kevin Rodriguez
Kevin Rodriguez

I blame UNIX for this because it's a bug caused by C and UNIX that would not be possible on Multics.
This is retarded, and you know it.
Vulns for Multics would be different, just as vulns for Windows are different than vulns for Linux, but they would still exist, especially in poorly written code.

Your security promises look exactly like those of any memelang: rust, go, jabbascript framework number infinity, they all claim to be airtight just because they don't have a few specific issues other software has.

Aaron Wood
Aaron Wood

What's your point. Acorn saw how RISC worked for UNIX and then applied that same idea to their own C based operating system.

Lucas Richardson
Lucas Richardson

why are you surprised?
the whole point of systemd was to be insecure and have many backdoors

it's obvious that a lot of code, bloat = big attack surface

Brayden Lewis
Brayden Lewis

The point is there's nothing that makes RISC designed for C or Unix. It can run any OS, any language just as well. In the 80's the C compilers sucked dick anyway. A lot of code for micros was done outright in asm. And even on Cray X-MP supercomputers (which did run Unix), people used Fortran for the best performance. Oh, and Sun used m68k before SPARC. You might as well says nonsense like CISC is designed for C/Unix. That'll make about as much sense.

Adrian Jackson
Adrian Jackson

B-BUT LIBAUDIT A-AUDITED IT FOR US

Austin Murphy
Austin Murphy

Serious question, why does every mainstream distribution use systemDicks? I know that GNOME is dependent on it, but what else?

Landon Wright
Landon Wright

You've been lied to. It's a giant program which grows every day, nobody's even exactly sure what it does. It's never been audited by security except by its vapid idiotic clueless users running it, which is hardly an audit.

Matthew Ward
Matthew Ward

booting 3 seconds faster, and something needs to make sure avahi, pulseaudio, dbus, polkit are running.

Jonathan Hernandez
Jonathan Hernandez

expecting anything written in C to be a good program
TOP KEK

Kevin Edwards
Kevin Edwards

based

Henry White
Henry White

How can we make Loonix more like that? What is the best OS that's also usable for web browsing?

Cooper Rivera
Cooper Rivera

Damn, I thought maybe multics user had just spent 20 years collecting snippets off of his mailing lists...
I'm less impressed with this shill now......

Jackson Hill
Jackson Hill

Redhat, Debian and Ubuntu more or less decide the direction the Linux world will take. Redhat has more money to shill their garbage and Debian's dev's are lazy as fuck and their system of internal governance is corrupt and often breaks it's own rules and ignores voting results they don't like. So when systemd forced down Debians throat everyone was pissed but no one did shit, especially when it became clear that after a time many things maintained by Redhat (or members of Redhat's current/former staff outside company time) would need patching to work without it and wouldn't be distributed with traditional init scripts. With both Redhat and Debian using systemd Ubuntu didn't have the clout to fight back, plus their alternative, Upstart, was pure shit.

I run a few servers with Devaun and it's a pain in the ass how many daemons don't include init scripts anymore so you need to dig up an old version and modify it's script and just hope with each update that upstream doesn't make any changes to break your script.

Nolan Jackson
Nolan Jackson

The main reason I see for the adoption is that SystemD simplifies creating and managing init scripts. Historically, init scripts are full of edge cases to verify if program A is already running, dead or needs to be started before program B. Other problem is that an automatic update can easily break them, see the link about init on wikipedia.
This simplification is with a huge cost, though. The complexity doesn't vanish, it is incorporated into SystemD itself.
In other words, SystemD reduces the work needed to be done by distro maintainers.
SystemD is a symptom of diseased system. A good OS wouldn't need such a thing.
And fuck Multics and Lisp machines, they are not the answer, just museum pieces.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Init

Zachary Miller
Zachary Miller

any language just as well.
Maybe if the language is like C.
They aren't from the Unix Haters Handbook. That guy is just a Ctarded UNIX weenie for thinking it's from there.

Kevin Gomez
Kevin Gomez

Cool, I use Devuan and I'm going to switch to GuixSD, after buing libre hardware. Funny thing. Few days ago I checked how big systemd actually is, compared to other init. GNU Shepherd - about 500KiB of source code, SystemDick - 40MiB. That's insane... How big is it going to be in the future? Will it grow forever? Why Poettering aren't making his own OS?

The main reason I see for the adoption is that SystemD simplifies creating and managing init scripts. Historically, init scripts are full of edge cases to verify if program A is already running, dead or needs to be started before program B.
SystemDick didn't invent dependency based service managers. It doesn't have to be so bloated for that. GNU Shepherd does the same:
gnu.org/software/shepherd/manual/html_node/Design-decisions.html#Design-decisions
I think the problem is that distro maintainers are lazy fucks, and people who donate these projects don't care about safety, nor what's the design of OS internals. What they care about is fancy UI. I don't know when GNOME became so pro systemd, but RedHat hosting it explains a lot. They poluted Debian and GNOME, and so did other distros, just because most of them are Debian based.

Does anyone know more detailed history about systemd and GNOME (New systemd hater here)? I wonder what happend with GNOME's GNU roots. Today you can't find anything about GNU on it's website, like they wanted to burry the past and software freedom.

Joshua Wright
Joshua Wright

Any sysadmin worth the title can whip up an init script for a daemon. Most of it is just adapting a generic template anyway.

Nigger, the Cray used a RISC architecture, but the 80's engineers used motherfucking Fortran when they ran their jobs on it. The Fortran compiler was written in motherfucking Pascal.

Landon Perez
Landon Perez

Stop typing in all caps. It makes you look stupid.

Jeremiah Rivera
Jeremiah Rivera

People think it's easy to use. It's not really though. In the time you have to learn all the custom ways systemd works you could've learned how linux works properly. Most distros also try to make a knockoff Windows with normie appeal. (Which Linux sucks at being anyways) I'm surprised they didn't manage yet to snake their way into the kernel.

Kevin Young
Kevin Young

It's merely just a feature, thread lock

Connor Scott
Connor Scott

why does every mainstream distribution use systemDicks?
Because it's easier for the distro maintainers, and because SystemD developers try to force distros to use their stuff.

Dominic Clark
Dominic Clark

no, just some of them are.

Easton Garcia
Easton Garcia

booting 3 seconds faster
Excuse me? You're telling me that this piece of pajeetware that boots slower than fucking windows is faster than other init systems?

Dominic Perry
Dominic Perry

not to mention the fact that SystemDick wastes minutes when shutting down because it fails to kill services properly and the default timeout is around 2 minutes per service. Also, wasn't RunIT the fastes init?

Jonathan Lewis
Jonathan Lewis

Runit is pretty fucking fast. Void Linux uses it and it easily has the fastest startup time of any distro I've tried.

Benjamin White
Benjamin White

Guess I'll give it a try on Devuan. Did anybody tried it, does it break something?

Nathan Ross
Nathan Ross

Most of all it's simple. Adding a service for it to supervise is usually one two line script. Want it to make logs? That's another two-liner.

You also get a startup file that's basically autoexec.bat. It's very easy to understand and modify.

Jaxson Young
Jaxson Young

Regardless, System D is spyware.

Carson Edwards
Carson Edwards

My mom uses it. It just debian without systemd, only think which may break is pulseaudio (just delet this if you have problems).

Angel Perez
Angel Perez

I'm surprised they didn't manage yet to snake their way into the kernel.
kdbus

Jordan Morales
Jordan Morales

How to use Firefox without pulseaudio? I was so happy with ALSA. It just werked.
Pulseaudio doesn't work very well for me. It cuts off the beginning when audio starts playing and there is white noise in the background.

John Powell
John Powell

steemit.com/linux/@crokkon/firefox-and-alsa-sound-without-pulseaudio

Kdbus wasn't included into Linux because they found a more generic way to do IPC than the Dbus way.

Nathaniel Wood
Nathaniel Wood

In other words, SystemD reduces the work needed to be done by distro maintainers.
No systemD's exists to eliminate distro maintainers. It was a power play by Red Hat to take over the Linux ecosystem and it worked. Just about every distro today is a repackaged version on Redhat/Fedora or Debian. Both lines are Red Hat's systemD.
There are a few hold outs like gentoo and Slackware but they end up just burning up man hours un-systemDing shit. They are just treading water rather then moving forward.

Red Hat wants Linux to become a big complicated mess like Solaris so they can sell those support contracts.

Jace Watson
Jace Watson

sndio, faggot.

Owen Lee
Owen Lee

sudo apt-get install apulse

that's it

Adrian Nguyen
Adrian Nguyen

how do you manage to fuck up an userland audio system in a way where there is white noise in the background constantly, lol I dont even

Leo Anderson
Leo Anderson

So this is the power of open source.... OH NNO NONONOO HAHAHAHA

Logan Jones
Logan Jones

Maybe if the language is like C.
C Derangement syndrome is real. HolyC for life.

Attached: abest.png (760.46 KB, 1046x675)

Justin Gray
Justin Gray

Just wait, all systemdick infections will start to hang like windows vista... and then worse. And worse after that.

Lots of corporate systems randomly freezing. And people wont even know it its because the code is shit, or someone exfiltrating your data is making the system hang.

I'd say poopering and red-fat shot themselves in the foot, but its more like they shot themselves in the D.

Josiah Nelson
Josiah Nelson

No, there's slighly more you have to do.
You have to "whitelist" /dev/dsp or whatever in about:config.

Kayden Butler
Kayden Butler

All according to plan to destroy OSS.
systemd, loss of grsecurity (blatant violation of the GPL), kicking out of all non-wage slaves from linux-kernel via CoC (and other projects).

FOSS is dead.

Nicholas Taylor
Nicholas Taylor

Bug class from infinite years ago again comes back to haunt.

Jason King
Jason King

Don't forget Devuan

Nicholas Nelson
Nicholas Nelson

SysV without starting 1000 useless services is faster than systemd.

Gavin Martinez
Gavin Martinez

Standard response is
suckMORE fag fucc off blabla bla.
Later:
we don't need hardening scripts like bastille, do it all self by hand every install --Steve Litt Devuan mailing list

Angel Baker
Angel Baker

Serious question, why does every mainstream distribution use systemDicks? I know that GNOME is dependent on it, but what else?

Why does every mainstream distro value do-nothing #debian-women over the men who actually do the work (for free!), and kick out the men (see the debian japanese guy that just got "demoted").

Honestly, the disrespected maintainers and programmers should torture and murder the people "demoting" them.

That's what black men do.
That's what men do.

Cut off their fingers so they cannot "demote" the JP samauri.
Then burn them alive on a wheel.

Henry Cooper
Henry Cooper

See the following (and the rest of the document, if you're going to use apulse): github.com/i-rinat/apulse#firefox-58-tabs-crashing-when-trying-to-play-audio
Also, if you're JACKed up, Firefox is supposed to work with it consistently since some time last year. The bug tracker says version 60. Haven't had JACK and Firefox on the same machine since then though. I'm be curious to know how well they pair together now.

Jose Roberts
Jose Roberts

They'll support JACK but not regular ALSA (which everything actually runs on anyway)

Fucking faggots
(Why would anyone use pulse over jack...)

Christopher Perez
Christopher Perez

That guys face and those glasses, is imprinted into Linux. And its pathetic.

Jayden Gutierrez
Jayden Gutierrez

Now fixed in v241
github.com/systemd/systemd/blob/master/NEWS
Poettering spelled $CURRENT_YEAR wrong

Tyler Hernandez
Tyler Hernandez

I want to fuck that little smug twink until his asshole bleeds!

James Ortiz
James Ortiz

Berlin, 2018-02-14
2018

Benjamin King
Benjamin King

From the latest (2017) edition of "The Unix and Linux System Administrator's Handbook".
btw they also portray UEFI and GRUB2 as waaaay better than their predecessors

Attached: systemd.png (66.79 KB, 475x358)

Kayden Gonzalez
Kayden Gonzalez

GRUB2 is what made me switch to syslinux. GRUB's config was simple, GRUB2 makes it a mess that might be worth it if you have 30 OSs installed but for one or two it's not worth it.

Attached: poettering-wins-black-hat-award-for-systemd.webm (2.56 MB, 640x360)

Ayden Bennett
Ayden Bennett

It's like seeing a modern Russian arguing about how Communism was better than Imperial rule.

Jacob Walker
Jacob Walker

Is there even a reason not to keep using GRUB 0.97 if you don't explicitly need bootloader functionality which goes beyond what it offers?

RUB2 makes it a mess that might be worth it if you have 30 OSs installed
You can install 30 or more OSes with the old GRUB without issue if you know what you're doing (i.e. if you have at least rudimentary knowledge about partitioning, file systems, and boot loaders involved in the OSes you install).

Jacob Sanders
Jacob Sanders

Can someone tell me why Torvalds didn't write his own bootloader for linux?

Sebastian Williams
Sebastian Williams

efi can boot it so you dont even need a bootloader anymore. might not be compiled with support for that if you use a distro kernel

Jackson Smith
Jackson Smith

Can someone tell me why Torvalds didn't write his own bootloader for linux?
Because GNU/Linux is the operating system, and linux is just a kernel.

Mason Edwards
Mason Edwards

There's still people believing Linus Torvalds being directly involved in anything but the kernel?

Levi Ortiz
Levi Ortiz

You guys forget git.

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Luis King
Luis King

But in '92 or whenever, EFI didn't exist, so a bootloader was necessary. I mean it would've been only 512 bytes that he would've had to write by hand. Why didn't he is what I am wanting to know.

Kayden Fisher
Kayden Fisher

Using JACK with Firefox in CloverOS/Gentoo (emerge -g rather than -G). Works just fine.

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Angel Hill
Angel Hill

I'll just leave this here:
invidio.us/watch?v=4JbDb4bRBK4

Ryan Green
Ryan Green

The firmware's job should be to find the physical boot device and bootstrap it's sector 0 code. Finding filesystems or even kernels to boot should be none of its business, this is actually systemd-like feature creep.

Evan Reyes
Evan Reyes

OK. Thanks for the video, but how does it have anything to do with Torvalds not writing a bootloader for linux?
I understand how Basic Input/Output System works. I am asking about why Torvalds didn't write his own bootloader. That's all I want to know about.

Camden Ross
Camden Ross

RISCs like ARM and RISC-V are just PDP-11s with bigger address spaces
What's wrong with this? Simplicity breeds creativity and Terry Davis's TempleOS is proof of this. To this day x86 and all sorts of Mega-computer bullshit like the burroughs machines and the CRAY sludge still live while GOOD processors like the m68k and the classic ARM processors are thrown out due to the IBM disease.
Computing peaked at the Amiga, Sparcstations, SGI machines, and the Classic-PowerPC Apple boxes.
Bring me the 64 bit PIC and you'll bring me the Light.

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Liam Cruz
Liam Cruz

What's wrong with this?
Because PDP's weren't RISC anyways.

Ryder Phillips
Ryder Phillips

So are you pro-RISC or are you anti-RISC?
In my opinion it doesn't matter. The m68k had combined load-store instructions so its technically a CISC but it was so small and nice that its fantastic to work with. Compared that to modern x86 that it feels like it needs to add another processor built into the main processor to run MINIX. (I know this will piss you off)

Noah Turner
Noah Turner

RISC architecture didn't exist until after the PDP's. That's my point.

Nicholas Ortiz
Nicholas Ortiz

You guys forget git.
Right so now Linus has the kernel, systemd and git in his operating system. Congratulations!
Or Poettering has linux and git inside systemd operating system.

Dylan Bell
Dylan Bell

What's wrong with this?
Because it ignores 60 years of working solutions. RISCs resemble the PDP-11 because they're designed for C and UNIX. Lisp machine hardware and Multics hardware would make a lot of programs much faster and solutions much simpler.

Simplicity breeds creativity
RISCs like POWER are not simple. RISCs are anti-creativity because they all look the same. 32 registers, load store, separate FP "coprocessor" design, PDP-11 memory model, 32-bit instructions now with 16/32-bit "compressed" instructions. What sucks about RISC assembly vs x86 or another CISC is how many instructions it needs to do anything and how much memory those take up.

To this day x86
The 286 and 386 were good designs (given their requirement for 8086 compatibility) and most of the ugliness and bloat in x86 came from SIMD registers, which is a RISC idea. The CISC equivalent to SIMD is vector registers, from the CRAY that you don't like.
homepages.inf.ed.ac.uk/cgi/rni/comp-arch.pl?Vect/cray1.html,Vect/cray1-cpu.gif,Vect/menu-cr1.html

all sorts of Mega-computer bullshit like the burroughs machines and the CRAY sludge still live
Burroughs machines are a very elegant and powerful design and one of the forerunners to Lisp machines. CRAY is vector registers done right, but Intel was copying RISCs instead, so they're stuck reinventing SIMD wheels over and over again.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burroughs_large_systems

while GOOD processors like the m68k and the classic ARM processors are thrown out due to the IBM disease.
Motorola and Apple replaced 68K with PowerPC. Classic ARM was thrown out because it's not RISC enough.

"RISC is to hardware what the UNIX operating system
[sic] is to software."

Subject: Wait, I thought RISC was a *good* idea


No, the quote is exactly right. RISC is a lazy solution
along the lines of "well, we don't know how to write
compilers that use complex instructions efficiently, and we
don't know how to design complex hardware that runs fast, so
we'll make everything simple, and we can advertise we run at
80Mhz even though the system supports fewer user than a 1
MIP DEC-20."

It's exactly analagous to "you can use pipes and
redirection shell scripts to do anything, so we don't have
to write any REAL programs" and "portability is more
important that usability" philosophies so rampant in the
unix world.

(Was I properly vitrolic this time?)

Thomas Sullivan
Thomas Sullivan

I disagree.

Isaiah Foster
Isaiah Foster

Video is literally linux *as* a bootloader
Brainlet asks what this has to do with torvalds not writing a bootloader for linux.

Don't ever change, Zig Forums.

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Jaxson Cruz
Jaxson Cruz

It still doesn't explain why Torvalds didn't write his own bootlader so it still doesn't apply no matter how you try to spin it.

Christian Morris
Christian Morris

< What's "scope creep", daddy?
< Why doesn't linux handle init, too?

You're neat.

Attached: dalailaser.gif (1.74 MB, 320x240)

Luis Gutierrez
Luis Gutierrez

What are you trying to say? That Linux should be it's own bootloader and have its own init system? It definitely should have its own bootloader and init system so we can avoid shit like systemd and grub2. Fuck. Free software is for faggots.

Hunter Miller
Hunter Miller

< Linux should become more like systemd in order to avoid systemd from existing.

I guess this thread is over, lads.

Attached: EXTERMINATION.png (711.79 KB, 1176x654)

Gabriel Edwards
Gabriel Edwards

Not anywhere close what I am discussing. How about you shove a broomstick through up your ass? Maybe you will scratch your brain and have an actual thought. I know you are faggot and will enjoy it either way.

Jose Powell
Jose Powell

Why stop with the bootloader. Let's put a DNS lookup service in the kernel! Oh and a webserver for remote administration! Why yes, I do love javascript and rust, why do you ask?

Chase Parker
Chase Parker

It definitely should have its own bootloader and init system so we can avoid shit like systemd and grub2.
or use a different distro or operating system that does not use potterware or grub2
Fuck. Free software is for faggots.
back to windows already? :^)

Landon Jones
Landon Jones

It still doesn't explain why Torvalds didn't write his own bootlader so it still doesn't apply no matter how you try to spin it.
What are you trying to say? That Linux should be it's own bootloader and have its own init system? It definitely should have its own bootloader and init system so we can avoid shit like systemd and grub2. Fuck. Free software is for faggots.
Because Linux was never indended to be an operating system, but just a kernel. GNU was, but it was lacking a kernel, so they started developing the Hurd, but Torvalds was kind enough to free linux.
Read this and everything will become clear.
gnu.org/gnu/gnu-history.html

Grayson Walker
Grayson Walker

A NEW EXPLOIT: SYSTEMDICK PID 1 CAN BE SEGFAULTED WITH A "SPECIALLY" CRAFTED D-BUS MESSAGE
three fucking patches to fix
archive.fo/qhgoZ
seclists.org/oss-sec/2019/q1/140

Jaxson Kelly
Jaxson Kelly

whats a dbus and why does so many things depend on it? on my gentoo system something is always complaining that it cant connect to dbus but they do still work

Daniel Perry
Daniel Perry

Dbus is a high level messaging service to allow processes to communicate messages to one another. Without the Dbus service, programmers have to do significantly more work on their end to make processes to communicate messages.

Jonathan Campbell
Jonathan Campbell

i dont know anything that would need to do that. its just a forced dependency on most binary distros.

Levi Rodriguez
Levi Rodriguez

i dont know anything that would need to do that.
Because you don't know much about software

Angel Harris
Angel Harris

What in the flying fuck has to read dbus messages in an unprotected state? So we're going to have windows like vulnerabilities this time? It's just command addresses fucking up, not to mention the task scheduler being bought to linux. So this is what that user had been saying "landing cushion" for microsoft developers (also cloud shit) and windows itself.

Andrew Lopez
Andrew Lopez

The problem is GNU was so modular and independent by design that it can still operate with its own or without stuff. Meanwhile linux is trying to steer the wheel as the "real system" causing this disaster of a monolithic design that decides which stuff should everyone use.
Didn't we already have similar shit with the DNS? And there was an exploit about DNS and I suspect Dbus+NM+systemdlinuxDNS anything about these are the culprits.
MORE SYSTEMD EXPLOITS PART II - youtube or some ad video leaks the whole system through pulse.

Asher Collins
Asher Collins

Glad I haven't touched systemd shit for years. Each time this shit happens but it gets swiftly swept away. Fucking kikes.

John Perez
John Perez

It's actually pretty damn useful, but the code quality is definitely not great. I haven't had to hack the daemon or library code for a few years, so hopefully it's gotten better. Last I checked, though, it was pretty meh - not terrible but not great, with lots of clearly missing pieces. (Linus rejected kdbus for code quality reasons IIRC.)
DBus is the last survivor of the many attempts to implement an object broker on Linux. (On Windows, this type of software is used for everything from the clipboard to a embedded widgets.) If you aren't using KDE or GNOME, then you might only use it for PulseAudio and udev events. Which inevitably leads you to SystemD...

Julian Edwards
Julian Edwards

FUCK OFF. U HAVE BEEN SHIT-POSTING LIKE THIS FOR SO LONG, U NOW BELIEVE UR DELUSIONS TO BE TRUE. now fuck off to another board & whine about bsd, swine_fuck.

Nathan Martin
Nathan Martin

when you're completely out of arguments and have to desperately strawman

Attached: update.jpg (23.98 KB, 540x359)

Isaiah Cook
Isaiah Cook

Grsecurity uses it if it's available on the architecture atleast.

Caleb Adams
Caleb Adams

>Serious question, why does every mainstream distribution use systemDicks? I know that GNOME is dependent on it, but what else?

Why does every mainstream distro value do-nothing #debian-women over the men who actually do the work (for free!), and kick out the men (see the debian japanese guy that just got "demoted").

Honestly, the disrespected maintainers and programmers should torture and murder the people "demoting" them.

That's what black men do.

That's what men do.

Cut off their fingers so they cannot "demote" the JP samauri.

Then burn them alive on a wheel.

<Inquiring minds wish to know

Luis Cook
Luis Cook

Muen and Genode are almost there.

Robert Peterson
Robert Peterson

inb4 thread turns into a grub2 and torvalds discussion

What is the solution then? Building kernels without systemd and using init? I don't think most of us use a lot of systemd anyways, so how about using plain old init again?

Joshua Ortiz
Joshua Ortiz

Building kernels without systemd
systemd is not included in the Linux kernel
and using init
there is not one single init
there are many different init systems to use, such as: sysv, openrc, runit, systemd, etc.
What is the solution then?
the solution is to find a GNU/Linux distribution that suites you and contains your init system of choice. you can use distrowatch to search distros for certain init systems.

Adam Lewis
Adam Lewis

There is literally nothing bad about the laumchd/systemd model.
Plan9 service managers and POSIX style init daemon are inferior in every way.

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Luke Allen
Luke Allen

If I take one hour to bake a batch of cookies, and cookie monster has 15 ovens running 24 hours a day, everyday, for 5 years, how long does it take cookie monster to bake 6 million cookie batches?

biggame19

inits
The confusion is that there are 3 classes of "init systems".

There's the POSIX model (SYSVINIT):
PID1 just runs a bunch of shell scripts, usually just under 1K lines each
these scripts fork a bunch of daemons that allow you to mount the disk or whatever
cron, mount, dhcpd, etc are there own daemons that runs in the bg
adopted some RC features over the years

PLAN 9 model (RC):
you fork a daemon called RC that manages "runlevels"
runs op top of sysvinit as its own layer
own set of service modules but cans still manage sysvinit scripts
you interact with RC and it enables and disables modules in SYSVINIT based on RC's policies
since RC manages the other daemons and runs in the bg, it can watch out for events, like one of its children dying and restart it

MacOSX Tiger Model (launchd/systemd):
replaces RC and SYSVINIT
implements a layer that any application can use for messaging (somewhat like 9FS, but socket-based)
everything is a service (microkernel-model but in userspace)
crond, mountd, etc, made redundant since launchd can provide the same abilities as a natural result of it's core functionality (actually removing the need to have them)
can boot services in parallel since every service modules is part of a dependency-tree instead of a slow shell script that's constantly forking ps and awk to check if it's allowed to start
can automatically start and stop things like the printing service or any daemon only as they're needed instead of wasting RAM and starting everything at bootup
way faster bootup since only what you need gets loaded (and in parallel)
finally allows POSIX to match Windows' event-driven dynamic services policies

Ian Moore
Ian Moore

I'd say poopering and red-fat shot themselves in the foot, but its more like they shot themselves in the D.
Moarpheus is that you?
you are a faggot and everyone hates you

Cameron Thompson
Cameron Thompson

Aww devuan is so cute. I love devuan now.

Henry Taylor
Henry Taylor

systemd is not included in the Linux kernel
yet

Leo Anderson
Leo Anderson

When systemd is ready, there won't be any linux kernel.

Lincoln Edwards
Lincoln Edwards

No, systemd mostly helps with rate limiting. Systemd was mainlined instead of OpenVz's schedulers.
It doesn't matter anyway, everyone is moving towards projects that don't necessarily depend on systemd for serverless.

Anthony Murphy
Anthony Murphy

I remember reading somewhere that some early versions of Linux had their own bootloader.

Jason Martin
Jason Martin

You don't know what you're talking about.

a) Sysvinit init had the runlevels, not what you described
b) Plan9 didn't invent runlevels; in fact sysvinit didn't invent them either; and Plan9 came vastly much later than all that legacy crap (I actually don't know how Plan9 inits LOL)
c) before sysvinit was widely adopted something akin bsd-like init system was used - a single fat script, for example
d) while I believe you're talking about UNIX world, it is not where such an init system/service management system/software platform was conceived; similar stuff you can see in David Cutler's design of svchost in WindowsNT and on

Aaron Baker
Aaron Baker

When most linux devs overnight just turned into M$ levels of lolberging
<you thought your "private computer's" OS was safe from CIAniggers tier sabotage
<systemd developed by government contractors @ (((redhat))) even though it's not needed and nobody asked for it
<people thinking systemd is legit

lmfao

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Connor Reyes
Connor Reyes

You do know that Linux doesn't require systemd.

Lincoln Hernandez
Lincoln Hernandez

How about you say something less obvious clown

Ryder Lopez
Ryder Lopez

That why I use void Linux too much sandbox but it saved a lot of updates lol meme (gentoo) os and arch Linux

Benjamin Wright
Benjamin Wright

linux doesn't need systemd
Linux obviously doesn't need it but sysops were always less effeciant having to reproduce scripts over and over for each system.
Obviously systemd isn't the best for this either but it was commonly seen as an improvement to the time=money dilemma.
Honestly wonder why anyone uses systemd these days, back then you had an excuse but these days with how terrible systemd is, there is no good reason to use it over something like openrc, especially since openrc pretty much does everything that systemd was marketed as doing but cuts down the obvious unneeded shit.

The only thing that is keeping systemd afloat is the hundreds of disposable and shitty DEs that anyone with a brain wouldn't be using.

Dominic Jones
Dominic Jones

When there's a will, there's a way. Systemd is completely replaceable.

Attached: MoreInitNeeded.jpg (2.78 MB, 4056x3040)

Gabriel Butler
Gabriel Butler

so many memes

Cooper Perez
Cooper Perez

seclists.org/oss-sec/2019/q1/54
SOAD quotes
based

Brody Russell
Brody Russell

systemd
1+ million lines of code
data stored in various incompatible binary formats
for every security hole discovered and fixed three more appear
supported by every major distro except one until the project founder was murdered
any company, individual, and government would be right to be extremely suspicious of systemd

Jacob Clark
Jacob Clark

What am I looking at here?

Henry Jackson
Henry Jackson

The only thing that is keeping systemd afloat is the hundreds of disposable and shitty DEs that anyone with a brain wouldn't be using.
BTW it's actually baffling how bad loonix DEs are.
Some stuff like XFCE is fine, but the Freedesktop whatever shitheads are actually so bad we don't even have a uniform way to do screensaving (well screen locking is more useful in this context). The best portable way to do it seems to be X Screensaver Extension, and it tends to be buggy for whatever reason: I personally have my Firefox doing the weird glitch after screensaver kicks in - it just stops rendering, like, renewing screen content, but in a weird way: you can do some arbitrary tag switching (I use dwm) and it renews the screen, but only once.
I really don't fucking know where the problem lies: is it GTK, Firefox, X Screensaver, or Mesa? Nothing else has the problem, so I just think it's mostly Firefox, but it's hard to test this, since GTK is also shit, and the way X regularly has random visual glitches doesn't help either.

Jonathan Peterson
Jonathan Peterson

NOTABUG
WONTFIX

Joseph Carter
Joseph Carter

What's the name of the font?

Nathaniel Russell
Nathaniel Russell

supported by every major distro except one until the project founder was murdered
What project, who?

Benjamin Cook
Benjamin Cook

Thoughts on this presentation?

youtube.com/watch?v=6AeWu1fZ7bY

Bentley Robinson
Bentley Robinson

He's referring to Ian Murdock the founder of Debian. He's lying about that though. Ian Murdock had stepped down as a maintainer for Debian and had pursued other work after Debian. He was already disconnected from Debian for many years when he died as a mentally unstable person at the hands of the police. The conspiracy theorists have a habit of jumping to conclusions and this situation is no different. This guys is interpreting the facts as an assassination job connecting Red Hat's development of Systemd to the death Ian Murdock.

Caleb Jenkins
Caleb Jenkins

Thanks. Also why would they do that? Making systemd a hard dependency of GNOME and other software, using buzzwords and merging important pieces of the operating system into systemd is a lot easier. It's funny how pushing systemd into debian made almost all distributions switch.

Leo Lewis
Leo Lewis

Not sure. I'm sure someone on the Bedrock Linux IRC would be able to tell you.

Owen Bell
Owen Bell

HAPAS ARE SUPERIOR TO WHITES

Jose Wright
Jose Wright

HAPAS ARE SUPERIOR TO WHITES

Christian Gray
Christian Gray

HAPAS ARE SUPERIOR TO WHITES

Gabriel Bailey
Gabriel Bailey

HAPAS ARE SUPERIOR TO WHITES

Nathan Martinez
Nathan Martinez

HAPAS ARE SUPERIOR TO WHITES

Chase Collins
Chase Collins

This is a slide thread. SAGE AND REPORT

Easton Morgan
Easton Morgan

Oof, the racism in this thread!

Julian Edwards
Julian Edwards

e-celeb thread

Chase Cruz
Chase Cruz

Masons, Masons everywhere.

Jose Price
Jose Price

What’s with the botspam?

James Johnson
James Johnson

Lots of shills in this thread.

Parker Peterson
Parker Peterson

Yeah, right, and the moon is made of cheese.

Austin Jackson
Austin Jackson

Europeons need to burn in a tar-pit. Disgusting

James Morales
James Morales

Wow. Just wow.

Dominic Fisher
Dominic Fisher

Indeed.

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