How Left is leftpol?

How Left is leftpol?

What would a leftpol country look like? (and as important, how would it have been accomplished?)

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You've already done it wrong.

left = workers owning the means of production. So:

Isn't he that retard who got his bike stolen and used mental gymnastics to convince himself it was for a good cause?
I bet he uses the same gymnastics to justify capitalism too.
Liberals get the bullet first.

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Ew, socdem.

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Wait he honestly struck me as an ML, what was socdem about his post?!

For one.

For another.

Objectively bad policies there but still overwhelmingly Marxist Leninist. So I'd say more in line with a post Stalin USSR.

Borderless countrysides from coast to coast.
Humans have these two tendencies where some of them like to wander around sometimes, but they normally end up back someplace near where they were born. Fuck nation-states.

In the pursuit of greater freedom we challenge all unjustifiable hierarchies. The fetters of rulers and rules come undone once you drop the use of money and simply share the bounty of the world. The motivating factor of life would no longer be fear of poverty, but cultivation of friendships. These bonds with each other become the new wealth.
We would obviously have huge obstacles to deal with even after reaching this stage, (not to forget the obstacles in the way of getting there) but I believe we'd be a healthier happier civilization and ready to deal with whatever comes.

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Your post itself would have been acceptable but the gif… the gif just ruined everything.

What's wrong with a 4 day workweek? We only need about 4-6 hours a day of work now to be as productive as when we work 8 hours a day. The unemployment is massive around the world, splitting the work seems reasonable. I'm not going to fight to overthrow capitalism to go back to working 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. You can forget it, comrade.

Yeah, that sounds great but it's idealistic. And to characterise the work needed to get there as 'obstacles' is just naive.

It's impossible to know without a proper poll but this place seems to be filled with even more deluded anticommunists than Zig Forums, as far as I can tell.

We wouldn't have a 4 hour labor, or any form of labor, for that matter.

We would fully automate most, if not, all tasks, leaving everyone free to spend their time doing what they want. More than the means of production, we need to seize AI for the benefit of the working class.

Not naive, I was just being brief. I could go into more details on how we could get there later. Not surprisingly the end results are more attractive than the effort to get there.

Why do you hate classic films?

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Absolutely nothing, but there is no way that an ML would go for it. That shit is pure socdem.

Work. Wage labor and division of labor is capitalist, if your revolution doesn't abolish them then you're a socdem.

On the contrary twitter tankies which burger MLs overwhelmingly are think that the 40 hour work week is good if it has a proletarian class character and anything less is counter-revolutionary that will harm the third world.

How would you even begin to bring about this change? Sharing the bounties of your borderless non-nation state would only empower other nation states to take, but not give.

Go on, I'm interested.

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The linchpin is the use of money. Pull that out and the true cost of things becomes apparent. Though we shouldn't wait for the next stock market meltdown, this is when it's most vulnerable.
Sending people to office would only help if they used their status to openly mock their said office. Imagine a president who signs off on a pack of executive orders to empower the masses to seize their workplaces. They would get immediate judicial challenges and there'd be a quick mental incompetency note from his doctor and an impeachment. They pretend to hate Trump but a guy like that could also get himself killed. I donno. It would be great optics for the movement. But mostly it has to be from the bottom up. Take the off-the-grid enthusiasts (and a bit of the preppers). Work with your neighborhoods at getting solar panels, energy batteries, vertical hydroponic farming (where space forbids earth grown) put all your money into credit unions, just anything that saves the community's money, in preparation for the next crash and the automation boom. Share the collected energy, the food grown, and the dentist in town starts to give discounts or free dental work for those of his community. Diversify services, spread out into rural and metro areas. Unionize the people. It's all so much organization, and convincing people to look out for themselves.

This model would appeal to a lot of self styled rightwingers. They often want just the basics in life, but have sometimes wrapped themselves up in their flag or race or faith. There's no reason to exclude these types. Climate change deniers and moderate racists could still be comrades if our system benefited them. They don't keep gun clubs and militias for just sport. Since they're scared of red flags, there's no reason to wave one around.

The push back from the government would come in every possible way, and would have to be dealt with in a variety of ways as they come. This part will get complex and no doubt violent. If our people are landed in prison on some trumped up charges, I think it's high time we make the myth of the Bastille a reality and start liberating people from private prisons if not the regular kinds. I would recommend that the heavier fighting wait till the federal govt. seems about to crack up. Some people in the military would defect, some oath keepers. Their jobs are getting automated too, and they're still not taking care of vets properly, right?

Just some of the scenarios bobbing around my head. Short of it: No time like the present to organize people to our side. the future will get chaotic and violent, but flow with it.
I know none of this is terribly original and I should probably read some Bookchin. I plan to do that, among other things, in the new year.

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Why are you here?

So no concrete ideas on how to get there? I was really looking forward to them. Thank you for your post anyway.
Again, sounds very nice. But it isn't concrete. I'm sorry that I can't offer anything but negativity, this is something I think about often and I haven't seen/read/come up with a satisfactory plan. The working class is too fragmented that any kind of unity, large organisation or mass movement seems like an impossible task.

The state would have functions limited to industrial / distributional administration and all officials are recallable on demand. All people are part of a nationwide militia and are trained in arms. All young people between ages 21 and 45 are drafted mandatorily into an industrial army and after that they never have to work again because they have done their duty to society. Though emergency call-ups could be needed

So after an election or massive coup, you intend to dissolve the country from the start?

What does owning the MoP look like? You work at a walmart or burger king, how do you own the property, building, machinery, assets, liabilities, etc? Elect a manager on a yearly basis? Stock options? End of year revenue divided between the lawyers, retailers, janitors equally?
Or gov. pays a basic wage from the janitor to lawyer, and sends money to pay for day to day operation?


I didn't expect you or anyone else here to be able to pull this off
And you unite them with their bellies, their better interests, their well-being. You organize them. It was pretty much impossible for the hippy generation to excite the majority to revolt, this generation is on the verge of total revolt. Tending to this garden is of utmost importance. We have to offer them the replacement before we burn down the old system.

Dissolve and decentralize the administration the country. Once this model takes hold worldwide, the borders will fade with time.