Pagan tribes, basically every kind of people except the ancient Jews, apparently, and people that became Christians, practiced infanticide, in the form of child sacrifice, exposure, etc. It seems that there were a few Greek philosophers that spoke against infanticide, but regardless, what seemed to halt the practice was Judaism for the Jews or Christianity for whoever.
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Why did Christianity stop the practice? Christianity claims that when a man is saved, he now has the spirit of God within him, and so also has the mind of God in terms of discerning what's right and what's wrong. Yet there were still Greeks before the advent of Christianity that spoke against this practice. Apparently the city of Thebes had the lowest rate of infanticide, but still had some.
What exactly causes a people to stop infanticide? For even the Irish, Celts, Germanic tribes performed some kind of infanticide. Can a people be repulsed by infanticide and also lack Christianity or Judaism? Were those Greeks repulsed by exposure of infants? Or possibly were they only thinking rationally that such exposure limits a population, or seems to go against nature?
It appears that Christianity primarily stopped infanticide in the peoples that practiced it.
Pagan peoples, compared to Christians or even ancient Jews, practiced infanticide
Babies with severe defects should be peacefully euthanized instead of being a useless ward of the state.
Pagan peoples did not always expose by reason of birth defects, but many seemed to kill infants by sex, mostly female
Not sure about the rest but I'm pretty sure Romans, Hellenes and Germanics essentially only practiced exposure, not ritual sacrifice.
It would mostly be used as an eugenic practice, which is good, and would be a decision of the male alone, women would not be allowed to decide this matter. Also, exposing it and not killing it would in principle, keeping in mind their religious mentality, give them a chance to survive IF the Gods willed it, which is a common theme e.g even Romulus and Remus were essentially exposed, only to be saved by the she-wolf.
The local indian tribe in my area would compassionately drown babies, who had birth defects, in the nearby river.
I agree with this method. I also believe in the eternal soul & reincarnation, so it's perfectly fine by me.
And yet out of all these people, the jews are the only ones who have been expelled from multiple countries due to accusations of ritual child murder.
By ancient Jews, I mean those before the advent of Christianity, and also before the Talmud.
So many things about that time is twisted with jewish/Christian lies.
Fuck off jew.
Nature hates you, too.
All claims about any and all human sacrifice come from the discovery of human emains under the smaller henges. The truth is these are ancient Celtic burial grounds located next to the larger superhenges used for seasonal celebations of the sun.
Look it up.
like abortion?
The majority of Christians do not support abortion
Delete your bullshit, fucker.
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In this case, such societies that may consider themselves Christian, yet have abortion, seem to be put in such a situation by Jewish or global elitist influences
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I believe that in the Pre-Christian Greco-Roman perspective; the value of life had to be earned through toil, through killing other men, through accomplishment. To the Christian; life was sacred by dint of it being created by God. Thus the Christian would find infanticide to be blasphemous immediately in a way that others may not.
There's also environmental arguments to be made. Infanticide would be far more likely to happen in harsh climates, so it may not be so surprising that it was common in places like Iceland. The same logic applies to starving sailors resorting to cannibalism; or even something as simple as the hungry stealing food. Difficult times require harsh measures, and morality becomes far less important to most people when survival is at stake. In more temperate and abundant lands/times, one is more likely to take a less morally-dubious route. The rise of Christianity coincided with one of the more wealthy eras of history, with plentiful food and resources from an expansive area with fertile lands in places like North Africa which were able to feed ridiculous amounts before even considering what was produced elsewhere.
Also worth noting is that, as another pointed out, stories such as those of Romulus and Remus indicate that the idea of actually murdering the children (like those subhuman Native Indians do according to the other user) is wrong and vile, and whilst the challenging circumstances like that of bodily disfigurement or little resources might lead to them abandoning the child; they still would see it as wrong to actually murder the child, and instead put the child's life in the hands of God/s by, in our view, "leaving them to the elements"
Yeah I'm not sure how any of these people are making the argument that Christianity allows infanticide. Christians are the main opponents of it, and abortion only became an acceptable thing with the rise of (((atheism))).
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my point is that christian societies commit infanticide on a scale beyond pagan societies
you can say
but the response is just
if the thread was about the ethics of infanticide in various cultures, it might have promoted serious discussion
instead, you're a spiritual kike and went straight for D&C
Could it be that Greeks and Romans, without Christianity, had they advanced in science to the ideas of the 20th century, would have eventually ceased much of their infanticide, possibly by believing in science more so than their gods, and having less faith in divine guidance of the survival or death of an infant placed out of their hands?
Various cultures includes the topic of Christianity, being that England, France, Germany were predominantly Christian nations.
Retards with birth defects should stop having kids then, like the Irish for example
This is clearly untrue, unless you want to dump some stories about Zeus or whoever telling people to stop leaving their kids out to die; and then the unpious people rejecting it (which I would love to hear if they do exist, but I am near certain they do not). The prevailing culture in at least some of these cultures, like in Iceland, was that infanticide was acceptable and a part of life; and it is noted that it only ended BECAUSE of their conversion to Christianity.
There were certainly people murdering their children during the Christian era (which I believe has long since ended, we live in an atheist world now); but it was something shameful and to be hidden lest another find out, and was indeed considered criminal. In this day Christian communities in near entirety oppose infanticide, and only those who would fail against ANY objective measure of being a Christian would support it (and I know you can shout "no true scotsman" - but seriously, most Christians who follow the Bible, believe in Jesus, accept the teachings of the Vatican, etc.; oppose abortion - the only 'Christians' you will find who are for abortion are those with no knowledge or interest in Scripture, who may not even believe Christ is real, who disagree with parts of Scripture, etc; its hard to call such people Christians, even if they want to claim the title).
I do not know enough about Greek history to say for certain, but there were various philosophers who were against infanticide; and I would wager that society as a whole was becoming more and more dominated by the ideals of great philosophers, with Christianity arising at a time of fierce debate between the Stoics and Sophists. It could well have been that without Christianity, an anti-infanticide position would have won out as philosophy became the an ever more important guiding principle of Greco-Roman society (which it still was in our 'true' history, but with Christianity 'winning' the 'philosophy' war with its blend of Stoic and Platonist ideas as opposed to any other ideology).
I do not think that Christianity was a wholly alien culture as a lot of 'pagans' do on this board; but instead it was a new way to frame the culture that was emerging at the time. 'Nationalism' (or something close to it) was dead because it was the time of Empire, the survival of the masses was no longer dependent on their brothers and sisters plowing the family field; but on the breadbaskets of North Africa. Italians fought alongside Germans who fought alongside Syrians. All of these things and more would have led to a natural change in ideology, and Christianity allowed a largely seamless transition where City Identity -> National Identity -> Imperial Identity became Religious Identity.
There is so much to be said on that subject that I cannot hope to go into any detail though, but broadly speaking: Yes I believe that even without Christianity; we would have had largely the exact same morals being enforced at near enough the exact same time, at least in the educated areas of Rome and Greece.
… Religious fervour certainly aided with its spread to more distant areas though.
the majority of christians aren't even white
I should have explicitly said 'human society'
the prevailing attitude in christian societies is that abortion is acceptable
it's industrialized, in fact
even the Aztecs didn't kill children on the scale christian societies do
it could be argued that leaving a child to be eaten by wolves is a fairer system than the power drill/suction pump setup that christian societies employ
Yep, this is a christcuck thread.
I dispute this in entirety. What Christian society approves of abortion? If you're going to say that nations where jews make the rules and atheists murder their children whilst Christians remain oblivious to the threat or else protest with painted signs, deludedly thinking that they still live in a democratic WASP nation; then you are a fool. These nations are not Christian nations.
And to call various subhuman hell-holes in Africa or South America 'Christian' discredits the entire memory of the ORIGINAL Christian nations of Europe, those that first coined the term 'Christian nation' and those which defined what the Christian religion and Christian culture was.
If you want to say 'new-Christian' or 'subhuman-Christian' or 'ex-Christian' then fine; but it is dishonest and devious to refer to these peoples so ignorant and uncaring of Scripture or the Church Masters as 'Christians', and if you insist upon doing it you muddy the waters for any interested in history in the future by having them equate many entirely different world views with entirely different ethical codes, mythologies and - most importantly - different views on infanticide.
The 'spirit of the argument' from the OP was that European Pagans initially only stopped practicing infanticide due to their conversion to Christianity, which in cases like Iceland is undeniably true; whilst in cases like the educated regions of Greece and Rome might have happened anyway - but Christianity allowed for a 'better', or at least 'easier' transitional tool for the new culture with its emerging values (so Greco-Roman culture may well have turned against infanticide due to a number of reasons, like increasing reverence for philosophy as well as bountiful resources no longer encouraging people to commit infanticide in the same way that an army with low provisions might stop feeding the weak who are likely to die anyway and instead just feed the strong who might survive).
All pre christcuck societies believed in eugenics and the idea of a healthy race.
It was only the jews and their sickness that they believed that a race is made healthy by (((yahweh))) and not by good breeding.
As for philosophers that were against infanticide, is it possible that these philosophers obtained their ideas due to exposure to the ideas of Judaism or Christianity? Another situation, that of the city of Thebes and before the advent of Christianity, were there Jews in this city that possibly influenced the rate of infanticide there? For if Judaism nor Christianity influenced these men or this ancient region, then it seems that such ethics can develop without either of these religions. However, if either religion contributes, then it appears that one or both of these religions, both related to the other, have a kind of unique quality about them, whether divine or something else.
this is not a controversial opinion, because it's fact
yeah they are, fuck off
your jew cult ran of of people to deracinate, so it moved to the fringes of civilization
now it's whole-heartedly complicit in attempting to bring those fringes to the center
burning down the house while they're still in it
christians kill more children, in total and proportionally, than the Europeans you're kvetching about, that's a fact
