Look at the "communist" countries of today, they are better managers of capital than the actual western capitalists. It is pretty clear that if we are to truly destroy the present state of things, the spectacle of capitalism, we cannot merely replace it with the spectacle of the Stalinist state-capitalist. I'm dedicating this thread to post-left and left communist political theory. If the DPRKfags can have their own thread why can't we?
Creating a functioning society is not really a compelling argument, you created a functioning capitalist state. Clearly you do not understand what communism even entails. I have no jealousy for your inane and sycophantic bullshit.
Blake Foster
The conclusion is self-evident: - functioning: not communist - communism: not functioning
Nolan Cooper
pure idealism
Andrew Russell
can't expect more from a leftcom, the left wing of tankies
Adrian Nguyen
Nice strawman you've made for yourself buddy. Some people are actually interested in building communism instead of LARPing as the glorious chairman of the party. You're just buttmad because leftcoms actually know how to read books instead of just parroting the latest fatwa issued from comrade Xi.
What's with the fighting between Dauve and either Theorie Communiste or Endnotes?
Didn't Bordiga support the Kronsdadt suppression? If so that is in line with being a tankie assuming you're going with "supports red capitalists crushing workers", a definition that fits most of the marcyites well enough.
Evan Ross
I don't recall any article by him dealing with that. There is a text called "3-18 marzo 1921 - Kronstadt: una tragica necessità", but apparently it has been published long after his death.
Jesus. To begin with, the original definition of a tankie was a ML who supported post-Stalin USSR, meaning that technically neither Hoxhaists nor Maoists were tankies. Now it seems that tankie has been generalized to MLs in general which is fair since even those who proclaim Khrushchev to be a heretic still usually suck off post-Stalin USSR because space race and Cuba and whatever. But extending it towards Kronstadt, thus lumping Trots and Left Communists with Stalinists, is diluting that term beyond recognition.
Justin Taylor
Well if you want to get technical, the first tankies were a trotskyite sect, Marcyites.
Jaxon Powell
Must have been someone on the internet who liked the ravioli ravager then.
I think it's perfectly fine to extend it to Kronsdadt, I'd go as far as to say the conflict was remarkably similar to Hungary 1956 on a smaller scale from the rebellion of workers against a red capitalist state to the smears of being part of an international reactionary conspiracy. Trots are fine to lump in with the Stalinists, not only do marcyites have a larger influence on Stalinists of today than Hoxha's autism but aside from irrelevant stances in geopolitics the praxis of Stalinist and Trotskyist parties are virtually the same kind of edgy socdems. Left Communist would have to be a meaningful term to consider them tankies, perhaps the Bordigiafags fit that label with some extra pedantry than normal tankwads but the councilists and communizationfags seem to oppose such things.
leftcoms are mostly epic internet pseuds that have a habbit of using big words that they themselves don't really know or understand but know it makes themselves sound smart
Jaxson Evans
TBH I'd actually argue against MLMs being tanks, like the RGA are crypto Neocohens so that kind of disqualifies you imo.
John Ramirez
I agree but that doesn't make leftcoms right.
Jacob Flores
Tankies are: -the left-wing of capital -the right-wing of transgenderism -the upside of the world ending -the down syndrome of marxism
That was an article from one of the ICP newspapers from 2000. It did say putting down Kronstadt had to happen, but not because they were reactionary devils wanting to restore the rule of Tsar. Even the conclusion of that article states that
leftcoms never archieved a "functionin society" because the change that left communism (tru communist theory) aims at archieving actually leads to a change to social relations of production, authority and even in how people see their own subjectivity. MLism just needs propaganda, a coup, civil war and lastly state repression.
Jason Hall
bomp, friendship ended with lenin, now pancake is my bestfriend
Nobody is getting the bullet, stop LARPing. Revolution isn't going to happen, take the blackpill.
Kevin Fisher
Weren't you the same faggot who ranted against the vanguard model in the other thread but unironically shill Bordiga here, a person who complains about democratic centralism being to democratic?
Leftcommunism is not only wrong in its political economy and historical materialism, it is also useless on the ground - which is the reason why most Leftcoms today are Lacan or Focault fags.
Take the post-left anarchist pill. Communism isn't just a global system, it's a structure of relations and you can push back against capitalism at every level by practicing communism in your own life. Don't seize the means of production. Communize your town and set up solidarity networks with other towns so you can weather the inevitable collapse. Organize politically only to push for reforms via electoralism that weaken the establishment. Organize economically at the local level to build communism now independent of the capitalist economy.
The very implementation of that plan is a pipe dream since it's require companies of "your town" gracefully submitting to the unified and central plan of production and distribution. And the problems keep piling up! Your town is not self-sufficient, so it has to interact with the outside world by the means of monetary market exchange, which means it gets promptly subsumed by the market forces and becomes yet another productive unit within capitalism.
Harman responded in the comments three days ago, have the pastafags responded to the charges of pedantry?
It's more accurate to say leftcoms are autistic leninists who insist on calling the "revolutionary state" "capitalism under proletarian dictatorship" instead of socialism and insisting on all communist parties ruling instead of the one based in the area of the state in question. Did moving past the left make you forget all the lessons you were taught over the past 15 decades? Your "communization" seems to have more in common with memechin's social democracy with libertarian characteristics than it does with the insurrectionists or any anarchist communists.
left communism includes under its umbrella communization theory and not the one blackposter just shat out, you can be a post-left anarchist and a leftcom because there's soooo much overlap that dude obviously never read gilles dauve
Grayson Williams
In my experience council coms will call themselves council coms and communizers will call themselves Marxists (without prefixes, suffixes, or adjectives), the ones who refer to themselves as "the communist left" are almost universally the autistic leninists like libri incongriti. If "leftcom" ranges such a diaspora then we should stop using it because it means almost nothing.
God no, we can say some groups of communization theory are indeed marxist and left communist, but for example the Invisible Committee is anarchist from start to finish. More importantly communization is a stillborn meme theory and we should finally let it pass away.
Angel Diaz
Why would they be anarchists? They are communists, just not Marxists.
Asher Cook
Have you read them? Anarchist Communist has been a thing since the late 19th century fam.
Wyatt Wright
anarchism and communism either have the same goal or mean two completely different things depending on who you talk to.
This applies to virtually every term we use on this board, from liberal to socialism. From my readings of Tiqqun/IC I think it's correct to place them in the anarchist communist tendency with fellas like Berkman and Malatesta.
I have read them, they barely ever mention anarchism while they talk about communism almost non-stop. They are certainly not from the anarchist communist tendency, there's nothing that would link them to Berkman or Malatesta, they come out of the French ultraleft scene and that's where their roots are.
Ayden Hughes
Slap Conservative/Trad social views on Libertarian Marxism or something like DeLeonism and it's basically Nazbol
T. Someone who actually had a native German speaker translate the ideology from Karl Otto Paetel's book.
