God Tier

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It was pretty neat, although unprepared. The nukes America got rid of in Turkey it was planning to remove anyways because they were so old, and I can imagine there were several ways to challenge the blockade imposed on Cuba.

Tbh I like Kruschev. Sure it introduced right wing reforms but his policies of detente were actually intelligent, since military spending was such a huge drain on the Soviet economy. Brezhnev was much worse, since he didn’t roll back Kruschev’s reforms, but he did re-instigate tensions with the West and resumed the military buildup that continued to sap the USSR’s economic strength. They should have slashed their conventional military and relied on their nuclear deterrent tbh.

Explain.

READ A BOOK

Well, at least it's better than the 16 year old Zig Forumsyps we usually get

No.

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There is nothing wrong with anti-religious persecution, though.

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Effort posting.
OC posting.
Funny posting.
Shitposting.
Trolling, false flagging, spamming.

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why u doin this

I would, but I'm banned.

And to everyone else strawmanning with "lol how can u believe different things than me??", the actual question is "How can you believe in a system that has produced nothing but objective failure every time it's been tried?" Add in a few genocides so atrocious that they make the holocaust look like a joke, and we're not merely talking about "believing in something different", like it's some kind of preference in ice cream flavors.

Lenin > Khrushchev > Gorbachev > Yeltsin > Brezhnev > Nicholas II > Stalin

Stalin turned the Soviet Union into a crypto fascist Russian chauvinist state. Leninists oppose all forms of national chauvinism. A national chauvinist entity cannot be socialist.

a fucking Trotskyite.
lol.
kill yourself vermin.

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What does this do to your paradigm?

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cuz its hot tbh

bye

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Have you read "Marxism and the National Question" by J.V. Stalin?

If Stalin was a Russian chauvinist, he wouldn't have supported cultural autonomy for non-Russian nations within the USSR.

Lenin quite literally called him a 'Great Russian' chauvinist

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How the fuck was he wrong? How can you build international socialism but support national separatism/balkanization at the same time? Stupid as fuck.

Cultural autonomy, predicated by equal representation of constituent sub-states. Y'know, as in the very basic idea of a union of 'soviets'.

I didn't find that in the text you quoted.

If anything, the debacle regarding Finland proved Stalin right. The proletarian revolution in Finland was drowned in blood and the imperialists won an important foothold and all the USSR got in return was getting to feel good about letting them secede when in fact capitalist Finland was a thorn in the USSR's side until the post-WWII at the earliest.

I find it odd that Stalin did not criticize Lenin on this point since it was actually deserving of it.

Forgive me, he called him a nationalist-socialist and a vulgar great-Russian bully. My wording didn't do the aspersion justice

Bruh, he backstabbed Che Guevara, who idolised Stalin.

Communism isn’t a monolithic movement, only two models of socialism have ever been attempted on a large scale: Marxism-Leninism (and its variants like Maoism) and market socialism. Out of those two only one could be said to have failed due to its inherent issues rather than other factors, since predatory lending and ethnic tensions had a lot to do with sinking market socialism in Yugoslavia. Basically there is nobody who is calling to just repeat the mistakes of the USSR again, rather we want to learn from them and develop a working model of socialism.

Okay, so according to most people, “victims of communism” are people who died from starvation or other preventable causes, wars, and political repression under communism. If we are going by these metrics, then preventable causes alone kill around 20 million people every year under capitalism, not to say anything of wars or repression. These people die of starvation, lack of water, lack of shelter, or treatable illness, despite all the resources existing to solve these problems. Rather their deaths are the result of capitalism failing to make these resources available. So if you are going to abandon a system because it kills millions, then you should abandon capitalism right now.

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That second line would've been really good if you didn't demonstrate absolute retardation by putting Yeltsin and Gorby on the list, plus Nicholas II. Mediocre effort at false flag

Notice that he doesn't name Stalin directly but this is in fact added by Marxist Internet Archive which is well known for its Trotskyist sympathies. He could have been talking about another Georgian though it is likely he is talking about Stalin. However, while Lenin was brutally critical against both friends and allies, his burns of Stalin don't even reach the level of scorn he heaped on Trotsky:

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I've no particular grievance to be filed against Stalin in the name of Trotsky, as I surely find the latter within a far more odious company than that of the former. Opportunists and orienteers persist without regards to their compatriots, I've only an interest in a common Soviet historicity.

Whoever you are and wherever you live I always screencap these posts.
You have a laudable amount knowledge.

Source for Ho Chi Minh's claim about Chinese Trotkyists allying with Japan?

The source is Ho Chi Minh, a revolutionary who committed his life to proletarian liberation. What more do you need?

History books, primary sources (texts, state documents, letters of important figures). Stop being a faggot.

I believe you and Ho Chi Minh, I just want to learn more about the subject.

Tbh Mao worked with the Japanese to crush the Korean anarchists.

[citation needed]

Another user, it was under the auspices of the "Chinese Soviet Republic", but they did play a part in the partition of the Korean Anarchist Federation (province Shinmin) in Manchuria between the Chinese and the Japanese Imperial Forces

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Chwa-chin

Tito
Tommy Douglas, Olof Palme, Corbyn, Melenchon
Bukharin
Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Any Kim Jong
Deng Xiaoping

Change Andropov with Chernenko and you've got a decent list. Chernenko was already dying at start of his term.
Andropov was the best KGB leader and opened his year with anti-corruption campaign and work-discipline policies.

Is this irony?

yeltsin's neoliberal economic policies caused the deaths of 4.2mil people from poverty in Russia alone.

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I thought he's been dead for like 20 years. Is this the Mandela effect?

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No.
It's just good thinking.
On the other hand I'm kind of happy that he's still breathing seen how he's basically living in his personal hell.
The fucker can't even go back to russia for his birthday because no one would show up

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Stalin, Kim Il Sung and sons
Lenin, Deng Xiaoping
Mao, Hoxha, Castro
Pol Pot
Tito

Has Gorby actually acknowledged that he fucked up on such a monumental level? Does he show regret for the passing of the USSR?

The truth is that Gorbachev was a Wehrmacht spy planted in Ukraine to overtrow the Ussr from inside.

But Gorby would've been just ten when the Germans began their invasion of the USSR.

It must've taken your only two brain cells quite the effort to compile such a list, huh?

Honestly, I can't bring myself down to viciously hating Gorbachev. Of course, he was totally wrong, he had no clue about Marxism, his policies were wrong. But he was dedicated to the USSR, he unironically thought he could save socialism with market reforms, and modernize it. He paid bitterly for this, but at least he believed in something.

Yeltsin, on the other hand, was a corrupt capitalist oligarch and wish him pestilence and cholera.

What kind of conspiracy theory Zig Forums tier bullshit is this.
Capitalist pawn maybe but the wehrmacht ended with ww2, you're telling me that a single remaining German Nazi pawn managed to take down an entire superpower just out of spite and vengeance for his own nation being fucked?

There are still Japanese soldiers fighting in the jungles of Indonesia. I'm not kidding.

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It's not so incredible. The nazis in retreat leaved behind an army of guerrillas, and they were kids.

what was wrong with Andropov ?

I can. As leader of the largest and greatest worker's state to ever exist, it was the duty of Gorbachev to ensure that the USSR and her allies are defended by any and all means possible.

Gorbachev neglected his duties, and as the whole system began to rot around him, he just stood back. Yeltsin is far worse, but seriously, fuck them both.

Leave now you revisionist.

Oh shit son, sauce?

Juche doesn't transcend ML, it's just supposed to add some stuff to it, especially in regards to the Korean conditions. Nowhere have they claimed it would depart from ML.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that Gorbachev acted in negligence, he didn't want to bring down the USSR and believed he was doing the right thing. Yeltsin on the other hand only was only in for his own gain.

In my country, killing someone by being negligent doesn't even get you to prison. Yet, intentional homicide might get you a lifelong sentence. There is a quantitative difference.

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Gorbachev was far better than """Comrade""" Stalin

Blows my mind that Yeltsin was never assassinated by any of the hundreds of millions of people whose lives he destroyed.

Jesus Christ

St John

Kierkegaard

Николай II Александрович

Diocletian
Nero
Judas
Che

Makhno, Sankara, Subcomandante Marcos, Kim Chwa Chin, Rosa

Durruti, Maurice Bishop,
Magon, Ocalan, Delescluze, Nagy, Lenin, Bela Kun, Heng.

Mao, Castro, Guevara, Ho Chi Minh, De Leon, Tito

Trotsky, Mugabe, Stalin

Pol Pot, Gorbachev, Deng, Xi Jingping,

Brezhnev is an absolute shit, he ruined the soviet union. Should go with Gorbachov in the last tier

heh lol ??
excellent bait

He triggers the shit out of Rhodesia fanboys tho.
He was a stalinist.

he's a joke and even the ANC are telling him to kindly fuck off after all the damage he caused to everyone

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You say it like its a terrible thing

You say it like its a good thing.

That's why he's low tier. I'd put him on shit tier if he didn't piss of Rhodfags as much as he does.

stalin was not marxist or even communist he was a criminal and opportunist, most likely a demon possessed man

revisionist and politically illiterate AF, but at least he made some efforts to make his own form of theory, shit as it was.
Maybe

majority were just poor suckers in the wrong place at the wrong time, the initial criteria for being a kulak was anyone who could afford to pay someone else 2months wages or had some grain in their house, eventually this criteria was eliminated and the police would just round up anyone they didn't like

Lenin is not like the others, and why is goldman worth liking again?

I like him too but dude…

Your entire mid tier list except Mao should at least high tier godamn anarkids.

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Debs, Hampton, Haywood
Rosa, Lenin, Che, Sankara, Ocalan, Newton
Castro, Trotsky, Tito, Ho Chi Minh, Hoxha
Stalin, Andropov, Kim Jong Un
Kruschev, Brezhnev, Mao, Kim Il Sung, Kim Jong Il
Pol Pot, Bob Avakian, Phil Greaves

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Marx and Engels

Otto Bauer

Rosa Luxemburg and Leon Trotsky

Bruno Kreisky

Stalin, Mao, Che, Castro, Makhno, Kropotkin, Stirner, Pol Pot, Mugabe, the Kim dynasty and scho on and scho on

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Anyone who didn't manage or have the possibility to do anything so that I can I fetishize failed revolutions and indept idiots as better than anyone else
Someone I can safely put on my shirt
Someone I can praise without causing too much controversy
Anyone who did something
Legitimate fuck ups

ITT: People who are not ML just because they don't want to defend the USSR

you could start by reading a book. try blackshirts and reds by michael parenti

No but on a serious note, much of what you've been told about socialism is objectively bullshit since the comical death tolls you see about communism basically include anyone who died for any reason in those regions at that time, including casualties from WW2 which Hitler started. (To add, the whole "Stalin won WW2 by throwing literal shitloads of men at them until they ran out of ammo" is also a myth).

This is not to say that the historical attempts at socialism were not without contradictions and some did do objectively terrible things, but the unuanced "bad thing = drop everything to do with the movement and give no further consideration" is an absolutely terrible way to go about developing good political theory and practice. We should look to discover precisely what the context was to the tragedy, its causes, and find solutions to ensure they do not happen again. Science, materialism, and progress are at the core of socialist ideology, and as long as those are used to influence socialist praxis I am convinced we can greater a better world for everyone.

I’m not ML and I defend the USSR in some areas.

I suppose Yeltsin is as well then?

Lenin

Trotsky

Khruschev

Chernenko
Gorbachev

Andropov
Malenkov

Stalin

This thread is genius. It shows brilliantly the retardation that's going on in this board

It's better than id pol bickering idiots.