Why are leftists so weak?

And Trump turned out to be just another establishment neocon. WINNING

Did you even read my post?
I said gained, Merkel win months ago yet was only able to form a government couple of weeks ago.

Again macron won but even he's had to admit leftists policies have been an abject failure that has destabilized the continent of Europe.

Like one of the reasons Europeans are so willing to try the right is because leftist policies have broken up the continent.

Explain how you're winning?

Tell me how your winning?

I didn't know the proletariat owned the MoP in Europe.

I was being sarcastic, Trump is shit

really seizes my means

This is very sort sighted view. Right wing populist had landslide victory (23%) in Finland. After they got power in goverment everybody could see how incompetent and stupid they are and now have only 7% support left. Hungary and Poland are special cases because of their poverty.

But none of you are addressing the fact leftist policy have destabilized Europe

To all the dumb fucks not saging, sage ffs. Fucking hell

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What country in Europe has seized the means of production?

Why?
Like if your arguments are good & hold up to scrutiny then debate me?

Like I train, & teach young classes, when training we realize bag/pad work is good but only for technique & fitness, for them to get really good they have to spar.
Why can't you do the same?

Massive 3rd world immigration is not leftist and let's face it, once that's no longer an issue, *any* support the Right has will evaporate.

top kek. which one?

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Only thing destabilizing Europe is right wing nationalism that is a tool for Russia to destroy European NATO/EU alliance. Divide and conquer.

But it's only implemented by social Democratic parties, so how is not leftist?

Like the right wing is not calling for it.

Italian here. This isn't news. Italian have always been politically right.

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Its centrist and extreme right wing is monarchism/fascism.

You keep saying fascism but that political thought was brought about by a Italian Socialist

Mass immigration

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When you read a book you understand that words can have different meanings depending on its context and users. To a leftist fascism means something else than Zig Forumsyp memes.

Sorry mate not catching your drift

Okay. I'll bite. How exactly did you arrive at the conclusion that mass immigration is a "leftist policy"?

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fam you're straight up retarded if you think macron is anywhere near the left
he's firmly on the right

See this is another leftist thing, constantly redefining terms/language.

It's the equivalent of someone who believes in the Bible using the Bible to debate a atheist.
The atheist doesn't believe in the Bible so what's the point in doing it?
Have to use common agreed upon language in order to communicate

How is every drive-by Zig Forumsack so fucking dumb that they think Europe is left.

So are you saying that the other guy who used macron to debunk me is wrong?

The thingy about Zig Forumsyps is that they are so retarded that they think every word has only one meaning.

what lol? hitler and the nazi party (both then and now) have proclaimed that they're socialist too. does that make Zig Forums a bunch of commies? we're not ~redefining terms and language~. that is literally what you're doing by implying these disingenuous propagandists calling themselves socialists to gain political clout with the working class is real socialism even if it doesn't reflect any socialist theory that came beforehand whatsoever.

Social democracy which means left.
I also it anyway one not Marx or Lenin doesn't qualify as left enough for you?

Just because X party, with Y leaning or Z name or B history, does something, doesn't mean that it is automatically representative of the ideaolgy as a whole.

social democracy is just capitalism with more government programs for poor people. it literally isn't socialism

i like how Zig Forums keeps flipflopping between socialism being minor socdem concessions and hyper-stalinist gulag land and then cries at us for redefining terms and language

It's very simple. 'The Left' is failing to demonstrate its value to the majority of the electorate. Having your friends agree with you vigorously inside your bubble doesn't mean a god damned thing if it's just the people inside your bubble agreeing with you. The left, such as it is today, is largely responsible for the majority of the things that many people across the world see as 'the big problem' of this generation, and the right is seen as the only ones even trying to provide solutions. You may not agree with their assessment, but that doesn't really matter to them when they're stood in the solitude of the voting booth.

Actually no I agree with you, Hitler was leftist, he nationalized the means of production by proxy, using state owned companies & he ended freedom of speech.
Up until the 70s it was widely accepted that the Nazis were of the left, then the Frankfurt school decided it was bad PR in
Began petitioning academia to begin saying the were right wing.

The only right wing values the Nazis had we're nationalism & that the traditional family should be the staple of society

>Implying social democracy is a bad thing
Oy vey we god a commie jew.

you'd have to be under 1,000 layers of ideology to only want to "maintain your quality of life" regardless of what that means or implies

Well done, you actually seem like you're able to actually see what's going on.

Liberalism is right wing but traditional conservatism (the european one with dictatorship and extreme nationalism) is far right. Liberal democracy is left wing compared to this.

nazis did nothing but privatize though. the word "privatize" was literally invented to describe what was happening in germany when the nazis were in power. you have no idea what you are talking about

*privatization

Would you like to try again?

It's not being implemented or called for. It's an organic result of uneven global development, regional destabilization largely due to the imperial activities of the west, and the increasing pressures of climate change. It's looked upon favorably by the neoliberal technocrats of Europe, who may or may not call themselves social democrats, as it injects cheap labor onto the market which can be used to further erode the gains of the post-war welfare state and it aligns nicely with their cosmopolitan pseudo tolerant worldview.

Yes, that hip new thing all the Liberals are advocating for is squashing Union and Labour rights, killing commies and re-affirming the nuclear family unit.

Winning.

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No you don't know what you're talking about, he seized the means of production by proxy under state owned companies.
SOCIALIST

What makes you think I don't? So you are just gonna assume how I am and what I do? Idk about the rest of Zig Forums but I myself work out, so you just assume I'm a no life and that you are so much better cause you "train and teach young classes"

Winning

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Yes, what a great socialist hitler was… which is why he killed all the actual socialists?

liberal != leftist
he debunked your claim that the right (AKA Le Pen) was winning
Macron is neither left nor your flavor of right, he's economically very right wing and socially liberal (with some weird royalty fetish)

But it is being implemented & called for.
Go on YouTube & look at politicians speeches & Lefty's marching with signs saying"migrants welcome"

It's there in plain sight in front of you.

So far on my time here I've seen 1 poster who seems to grasp what's going on & how the right are the only ones offering solutions.

No he killed Communists.
He hated them & their international ideas.

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Nazi Germany privatized the largest banks and railway companies in Germany. Along with vast swaths of the shipping industry.

Yes he "privatized" by proxy, they were government owned companies.

FFS STOP BUMPING THIS BAIT SHIT YOU FUCKING MONGOLTARDS MY GOD jesus fucking christ

Why what's your problem we're having a healthy discussion.

Let me guess, you're Antifa right?

You're shit at falseflagging, Zig Forums

The baboons are going back, baby!

How'd yeh mean?

Liberals are not left-wing, Democrats belong in the same mass grave as Republicans do. hth

Democrats dont even count as socdems but they are still better option than le drumpf meme.

So let me guess, you're communist or anarchist?

Shut the fuck up, liberal.

Bullshit. There was pretty much nothing socialist about the Nazi regime. HITLER INVENTED PRIVATIZATION.

ub.edu/graap/nazi.pdf

Mussolini USED TO be a socialist in his younger years. The Doctrine of Fascism EXPLICITLY REJECTED SOCIALISM AND MARX.

those are liberals not leftists

Government firms have existed throughout the entire history of capitalism.

I'm not being smart but you're showing your ignorance a bit there.
So Mussolini didn't actually come up with fascism, he seized on it when it was already developed

Your reasoning there basically amounts to "I'm not familiar with this use of XYZ term, therefore you're changing the definition." That's completely fallacious.

Which the Nazi government sold their controlling shares of and relinquished control to private investors.

It all leads to jewish supremacy. The supremacy you cucks pretend doesnt exist.

Revolutionary communism is not a realistical option in any 1st world country and if i have to pick sides between social democrats or liberals/conservatives i always pick the most left wing one.

No they didn't.
Look I know this a hard pill to swallow, but the Nazis were Socialist.
Look I debate people on Zig Forums about this all the time & thankfully more & more are recognizing that at the end of the day, as much as some love him, Hitler was a Socialist. Oddly enough it's equally hard for them to accept as alot of you leftys

You are ok if your own nationality fuck your wife and use you as a slave?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Nazi_Germany

>Earlier, Hitler had restated his economic intentions in a 1931 interview with Richard Breiting, singling out the 13 point plank of the Not Socialist 25-point program, which he declared “demands the nationalisation of all public companies, in other words socialisation, or what is known here as socialism.”[45] Hitler however contradicted this with privatization of industries

TL;DR Hitler was at most a welfare state capitalist. And no, the presence of a welfare state does not automatically mean "socialism"

Healthy discussion? Healthy? This? Ok, if you aren't being ironic, you are actually retarded

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( ( ( Wikipedia ) ) )

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LITERALLY ANYONE here is either a communist or an anarchist, you massive fucking retard. Holy fucking, can't even troll properly, please fuck off back to Zig Forums, you dumb fuck

Wikipedia?
Seriously?
I can go on that now & edit it.
Wikipedia is hardly a scholarly source.
Like I said when the Frankfurt school decided it was bad PR for the Nazis to be identified with the left, the left began doing mental gymnastics to disavow them

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pls be a joke

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Thing is I'm not actually trolling.
Having sincere discussion.
Like if you're a Communist, then WHY DON'T YOU FUCK OFF TO NORTH KOREA OR VENEZUELA & LEAVE THE REST OF US IN FUCKIN PEACE!!!

Then provide your sources saying Hitler was socialist, also that quote wasn't said by Hitler, it was said by Gregor Asser, who was part of the left wing of the nazi party, and Hitler had him killed btw, so if Hitler killed people of the leftwing of nazism, imagine what he did to actual socialists.

Then fuck off to austria maybe? Dumb nigger

Sure thing buddy.
You drown in here either way.

OH THE IRONY

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It's objective truth that Nazi Germany had wide-reaching privatization programs, at a time when even the most capitalist nations of the world were averse to the practice. It is also objective fact that large capitalists existed in Germany and were influential, like Krupp. The means of production didn't belong to the workers, in fact labor unions were crushed in Nazi Germany, and replaced with a pro-Nazi front.

Private property existed in Germany, means of production weren't seized, worker movements were repressed, capitalists were powerful.

Your argument meanwhile is literally covering your ears and going "nuh uh, you're ignorant"