Hear me out Zig Forums. I sincerely believe, without irony, the Latter-Day Saints are the only organized religion to have the potential to be /ourguys/, and their religious doctrine is the only one entirely consistent with the Enlightenment and universalism.
Mormonism started off as communist. Nauvoo was basically an anarcho-communist commune. Mormon families and communities are based off of mutual aid and hard work, two values in which socialism embodies. Not only is the Mormon understanding of God easily reconcilable with DiaMat, but Mormons believe God became God because he started off as a rational man, and *every* human has the potential to become God in the future through rationality and good character, which is the very ESSENCE of Enlightenment thought. Even the idea that America is the true Promised Land, and middle America will be the site of the New Jerusalem where Jesus will ultimately return to, is revolutionary, as the USA was the first country to be based entirely off of a common set of principles (all Enlightenment-based) rather than race, religion or empire (Christian Zionists BTFO).
I say "Zizekian" because I believe Zizek would agree with me on this. In fact, I wouldn't doubt it if Zizek is himself an "atheist Mormon." Mormonism is strongly universalist, humanist (it puts humans at the center of the faith, not God or even Jesus), believes humans can become God through rationality and ethical behavior, values families, etc. And most importantly, it negates many of the ills which continue to plague the modern left, such as idpol.
Let me put it to you like this: embracing the LDS would be something totally reasonable for the American left to do, not only for the reasons I've mentioned, but because there is no better image of the hard-working American family (you know, the people whom Sanders and other progressives are desperately trying to reach out to) than the Mormons.
Aiden Long
Fuck off, being a mormon is just an excuse to build your personal harem
Charles Rogers
hoping this is not b8 cause i'm laffin p hard rn at this, brother
Owen Allen
I'm being serious.
Jordan Wright
Dipshit, I literally grew up in the "Church" and can confirm most of what you're saying is either half-truths or total bullshit.
No it's not the case that "every Mormon becomes God of their own planet". Godhood is something reserved only for a select few within the church. You have to live a life strictly in line with church teachings, meaning no booze, no smokes, no weed, no recreational drugs, no coffee or tea, no swearing, no porn, no R-rated movies, you get the idea. Mormon families are some of the most reactionary people you'll ever meet. Utah was founded as a white ethno-state just like Israel. Also the Church is a corporation which demands a fuckton of your money. STAY AWAY.
Brandon Diaz
tbh Christian theology has quite a lot of the stuff about God becoming close to humans and humans becoming close to or like God. don't see why u need to latch onto a joke religion for that when the original is already there. the shit abt God starting out as a rational man seems like a bit of a weird addition anyways.
something abt the word zizekian seems p cringy to me anyways unless you can explain how you've derived this position from some aspect of zizek's thought that's uniquely his. i mean "I suspect he'd agree w me" is hardly a justification for calling this position zizekian even if it were true
Isaiah Adams
This is partially true only for the old Mormons, the new one's, the ones born after the big change in doctrine by the old that happen i believe in the 80s. In the 80s the faith became much more conservative to get more converts. The Mormons of today are like evangelicals and are a far cry from what they were in the mid 1800s.
Angel Reyes
lol keep dreaming, based mormons are /ourguys/ their petite bourg as fuck
Landon Foster
But it's not an exclusionary doctrine like Judaism. Mormonism isn't based on race but on commitment.
Alcohol and tobacco are silent killers. Weed is overrated and most potheads are idiots. Recreational drug use funds right-wing death squads. Coffee and tea are huge slave industries. Porn is a waste of time as are most films.
But they have the POTENTIAL to be revolutionary, that's my point.
Which it isn't anymore.
Joseph Smith didn't invent the concept of tithing.
"Conventional" Christianity doesn't hold to the doctrine that humans are capable of being gods though, only one (Jesus). What's wrong with the idea that God is a rational man? Doesn't that fall in line with the same Enlightenment values the left ought to be returning to?
So the Church can reform back to its older socialistic doctrines.
Benjamin Cruz
Yes and no. You would have to find socialist Mormons and you would have to kill the head of the church and all of his successors.
Gavin Foster
Which is even more reason as to why the left should embrace the LDS. We could join the Church and demand a change to their doctrines from the inside.
Christian Young
It would be much easier to just go for Catholics, they already have active workers movements in the US.
Tyler Carter
But they don't possess the doctrines which make Mormonism revolutionary.
Anthony Howard
FUCKING NO
They practically worship America itself.
Kayden James
So? America has always been one of the most radical countries on earth. Hell, there were times when it almost went through a socialist revolution.
Aiden Barnes
lol fucking kys.
Benjamin Morales
Prove me wrong then. American values ARE fundamentally socialist ones.
Asher Long
Because "values" on which a country is funded are explicitly vague as fuck. What you are saying in op is applicable to every nation, ethnicity, religion, country or whatever the fuck you want. Now show me where in history this "socialist" values were ever applied.
Ethan Robinson
Are you seriously denying the existence of the labor movement?
Jaxon Hernandez
the labour movement that you are referring to existed in spite of the traditional american values at the time as well. Look, I'm not going to be one of those people who argue that the American revolution wasn't revolutionary. It was a bourgeois revolution that was needed to advance the historical stage from mercantilism into fully-fledged capitalism. That being said, it's revolutionary usefulness is finished with. It has become necessary for america to move past it's domination by the bourgeoisie and move into a proletarian democracy.
also, the other user was right in pointing out american """values""" are vague as fuck for a reason
also, the problem is not how "progressive" or "woke" a religion's central doctrine is. I don't care if the communist manifesto is hammered right next to the ten commandments on Nauvoo or wherever. The point is that all religion requires a jump, blind faith if you will, in order for you to accept it. you have to have "faith" in this magical sky dude, or heaven planet, or whatever else in order for it to BE a faith.
tell me, are they commuting your preaching mission abroad to evangelizing the atheists of leftypol? what's your quota for this month?
Isaac Miller
I'm not saying America is perfect, I'm saying its very history is revolutionary. America has never been an ethno-state or a state based on religion, but a country based firmly in the same universalist values the left needs to re-take.
So what? Do you believe a communist revolution can happen? If so, you're going on blind faith as well.
Matthew Miller
missionary*
Kevin Rogers
Christianity is the source of Hegel's dialectic and therefore also the dialectic found in historical materialism as well. Mormonism is a bastardization of Christianity and is American. Thus it is incompatible with socialism and will be ruthlessly persecuted by any commmunist government, even a christcom one.
But nothing necessitates communism, does it? You have nothing but "faith" in the idea of revolution.
Shit.
Jose Sullivan
No it isn't. Mormonism is petit bourg at best and therefore incompatible with all forms of socialsim. You don't seem to understand that America is an abomination and will be intentionally destroyed under global socialism. We will literally eliminate the idea of America. In 1,000 years America will be like Atlantis.
Angel Howard
actually, if you understood Marxism at all, you'd also understand that capitalism DOES necessitate a communist revolution.
this is shown through the falling rate of profit, as well as historical examples of capitalism failing as soon as it runs out of natural resources or outside investment expanding it's markets.
