/leftybritpol/ - Summer of discontent edition

Right lads, you know the drill. Last thread hit the bump-limit and all that. Now the meat of the starting topic should be about UKIP's recent swing to the alt-right in ernest, Tommy Robinson (sbuh) being arrested, the likelihood brexit will fail to go "far enough" under May and this recent entryism into UKIP itself. Paul Mason puts it quite well, but still. This summer is only going to get worse, and things could really kick-off.
newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2018/06/ukip-s-turn-alt-right-warning-sign-we-need-fight-back

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Other urls found in this thread:

thetimes.co.uk/article/disputes-and-dysfunction-reign-in-a-cabinet-all-at-sea-lkf2rhtpw
politico.eu/article/london-brexit-time-bomb-is-about-to-blow-theresa-may-withdrawal-agreement/
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Democratic_Fascist_Party
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

Why tommy robinson was arrested? I didn't have the balls to watch any of those free tommy robinson videos online

Contempt of court.

He was caught filming inside a court (which has been illegal since the 1920s), the reason he was arrested & sentenced so quickly is that is contempt of court and that is normally handled by a judge. The reason he got 9 months in jail is because he was on a suspended sentence for a different case of court contempt where he stood outside a court and call the defendants rapists, paedos ect. Now whether this was right or not (it was right) he was rightly trailed for influencing a jury decision. So yeah, not even police state bs he was being a cunt and could have stopped legit motherfuckers from going to prison.

no comment

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Really, he got jailed for shouting outside of a courthouse?

Is the UK that bad a state?

the permit for his shouting license wasn't valid, he had it coming

Seriously? You need a permit for shouting?

Holy fucking shit.

it was a shitpost mate

Really bad taste, buddy boi, considering now tommy is getting his butt raped in the cell.

Man, what is your problem man? Are you fucking retarded?

That does not answer the question.

Okay, let me put this in fucking mong terms for you:
broadcasting outside okay.
shouting shit about people inside the court, not okay but not illegal.
shouting shit about people inside the court while broadcasting it is v bad, as people inside the court might see it and it may affect their judgement.

Again:
Or are we all children here, and the louder you shout, the more it becomes real?

UK doesn't have a prison rape culture lad, very rarely happens

Genuine conservatives should be pleased he got arrested, he was being a nuisance and broke the law. And things that are against the law are bad.

lmao imagine being so far-right that Theresa and communism are in the same group

m8 stop replying to him he's trolling, he doesn't understand that what Tommy did would have led to the pedos getting a mistrial and being freed, nor does he care because just like Tommy his worldview is based around manufacturing outrage porn

user I hope you find treatment for your FAS, it appears to be quite developed.

I mean they are: it is the alt-right types not the tories getting trigger by them.

>thetimes.co.uk/article/disputes-and-dysfunction-reign-in-a-cabinet-all-at-sea-lkf2rhtpw

If anyone has a subscription can they copypaste it please? Much appreciated

you're all going to the zoo

Just accept it

that is literally how the world works you fucking mongoloid

literal idealism

it's called propaganda

Who cares. They never got any useful amount of seats last time they started stirring and it's unlikely to happen again. The best we can do for now is back labour, entryism, outside influence and other such. This is a political game and at the very least, we can prevent them from winning.

Yeah UKIP is dying , the far right in general is dead in the UK

They've gotten a little more asshurt lately. Are they finally realizing that they've basically been swallowed by neoliberals?

the further right you go, the more salt there is to be found. in the UK, groups like the EDL are noisy but ultimately impotent. I dare say the left may have a trump card in terms of the future of labour if handled correctly.

Carlgon and crew are joining UKIP though, so I believe that they might make a resurgence.

most he'll do is bellyache muh foreign hordes and other bog standard crappy rightist talking points, sure they may get some new members but it'll be the same as last time, they'll make a lot of noise, but won't make any significant gain parliament wise.

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Labour will just be absorbed by identity politics as they style themselves as the voice of the migrant to captilise on shifting demographics and essentially devolve into race baiting politics. Local elections in inner city Labour strongholds already have.

i'm referring more about more of the far left entering labour and not just attending meetings but making an effort to rise through the ranks. race baiting is shit and always will be, best case we can hope for a return to 70s style labour.

Then you're holding onto a pipe dream because that sort of state ownership and intervention is never coming back under the current system. And like I said you'll be chucked out due to not being electable which is what party in a democracy looks for. The people that might vote for that are in their 60's and disappearing fast.

so what do you suggest, just sit around moping in our armchairs that
a long and slow drip feed of the far left will precipitate change in the future. this is a long game, user. things may be awful now but they can be better later.

You're never going to get that adherents what do you offer the average person that they really want or need? You're simply not even going to drip in and even if you do you'll end up like Corbyn cucked by his party.

As for what you should do don't ask me I'm not even left leaning in the slightest.

then why the fuck are you on a leftist board

Because I want too. Other than that I think UK politics is a dog and pony show and any hope of salvaging something form the three headed dog of modern liberal politics is a fools errand. You'd be better off running as an independent that being turfed out by a diversity officer in one of the main three parties.

You don't have to be particularly far right for that to be the case, you just have to have certain right-wing views. If you are anti-multiculturalism, as many are, then communism and May are in the same group.

then what would you say the tories classify as

She's just another liberal hack there's no true conservatism left at best they're referring to maybe the crony capitalism that all three parties engage in.

liberals

Liberals. All mainstream UK parties are liberals.

...

Not sure how that applies at all here. Are you an American?

it's likely the contrast to sonservatism in the UK which consists of privatise everything and strangle the economy with austerity

How is someone who engages in authoritarian paternalism, moralism, and law-and-order criminal policy not of traditional conservatism in this country? Powell would take no issue with the fundamental policy of this government, maybe just argue it does not extend far enough.

How can a party that legalised gay marriage (for one pertinent example) be considered in any way conservative?

That's only been the case since Thatcher, and most people would say (I imagine) that her premiership was the beginning of neoliberal politics in this country.

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honestly, my biggest beef with the tories is their economic policy. Austerity isn't fucking working, the north is in a shameful state, london is becoming dangerously overcrowded and there's a crippling shortage of skilled workers, caused largely by elitism among employers

Conservatism as a concept basically does boil down to gays and immigrants. Conservatism isn't an economic policy, and doesn't really have an economic dimension outside of "maintain the status quo, try not to be in power when the current economic cycle busts".

It's fear, essentially. Nobody has a clue how to handle a free-market economy. In the modern globalised world, it can't be handled at the nation state level. We're balanced on a knife edge, and they don't want to do anything to rock the boat. Of course, non-action is itself an action, and eventually this will catch up to them.

it's almost as if the free market is more concerned with profit than actually improving lives and conditions

The question is, what would you do about it if you were them? The next crash is going to make the Great Depression look like losing loose change down the back of the sofa. Something drastic needs to be done to fix our situation, but if they try it, they'll bring the country to it's knees overnight.

Some people might say that it's better to rip the band aid off and get it over and done with. Personally, I would advocate following the lead of Japan - ignore your debts, borrow like crazy, and at least by the time the global economy shits the bed you'll have a country that's had some serious money spent on it. We'll certainly never have to repay a penny.

i'm an ancom, that should tell you what my solution is. But in case you're not versed, i'll give you the laconic.
I could write an essay on this but that's 1000+ words easily. AnCom-ism isn't going to happen in the near future, but I predict a rise in anarchism when state economies start falling like dominoes. people will be radicalised, and groups like SF, CNT and IWW will likely take the chance to make their presence known, if they're smart.

I lean to the libertarian left, so I'm familiar. I was talking more practically about what the Tories themselves (or whoever is in power next - they're all the same) could do about the current situation.

As for that, the pragmatic option would be the Japanese model of borrow shitloads, plug your ears about debt and use it to build stuff so that when things do go to shit, at least it'll be somewhat softened. Then again, chances are it'd only be MP's salaries and frittered away on extraneous crap rather than the really prescient issues.

Conservatives are also Liberals though, your no TRUE Conservatism doesn't work here, Conservative as a label is inherently Liberal

I disagree.

for me in practical terms Peter Hitchens type thinking is "true" conservative.
a sort of low-tax economic liberal, yes, but sort of subservient to a paternalist noblesse oblige that with any consistency drifts straight into social democratic waters with largely lip-service to low taxes, albeit with some snags that don't fit neatly into purely economic conceptions of ideology, such as designing the high-funded welfare system with the assumption of a male breadwinner, which creates awkwardness for other social structures, but doesn't change the funding or the nature of class-relations too much.

but like social democracy considering how far we've come that conception of conservatism may be outdated and never coming back, since now it would be outright reactionary to construct their utopia.

Doesn't really matter if you agree or not, economically conservatives are liberal.

Economically, the conservatives are fucking morons. They speak often about wanting to rebuild the North but ardently refuse to lift the austerity that caused it. Their policy is the noose and they are the hangman.

I tell you this now, next election the tories are gonna lose every seat they had ever thought about holding in the North: this rail fiasco has fucked people off bigtime. All the papers from up there were crucifying Grayling. Seriously expect the tories to die north of the Humber and Mersey next election, more than they have since 1997.

Not brit, but how the fuck people from the north still vote Tories? Thatcher destroyed that fucking place

My grandparents who live in Lancashire are fucking fuming about it, being retired civil servants. I agree fully, anything remotely considered northern is going to get bushwhacked, Lancashire, Yorkshire, greater Manchester, you name it.

Its a mix of things, but the main underlying issue is that the great recession happened during a long period new labour control which poisoned labour's relationship with the working and lower middle classes, the conservatives were therefore able to avoid most of the blame even though most of the really severe harm was actually caused by their policies after ousting new labour in the 2010 GE, this election also spelt the death knell of the libdems as they were completely outplayed while in coalition with the conservatives and ultimately ended up as irrelevant lapdogs

Since then its been a mixture of Labour incompetence and rapidly rising ethnic and social tensions which has allowed conservatives to cling to their vote share in the north, with most of the newspapers directly aimed at the working class being little more than right wing propaganda. the collapse of UKIP following the brexit vote was another unexpected boon for them, as most of the pro hard brexit UKIPers went to the cons instead of Labour, which was the party they would have most likely have voted for before UKIP

The whole Iraq cluster fuck didn't help either, new labour never bothered to properly distance itself from the war criminal Blair and many people rightly point out that the rapidly expanding surveillance state was started under new labour and its most dangerous bits came from them

Actually most of the UKIP vote went back to Labour, people were expecting a wipeout in the NE and they held steady in all but one seat (and actually gained one). The concept of Lab→UKIP→Con never actually played-out much.
But the rest is right, fuck Blair man.

Also you need to realise the "north" isn't actually the north of England (which is very very tory)

Not quite UKIP vote more or less went back to who they voted for before 2015 in most areas. Overall it was about 33% to Labour 66% to Torys.

Dead Party Irrelevant
More right-wing persecution complex
He wasnt given a year in prison for "Muh 1984 Wrongthink XD"
He was given a year for breaching conditions of his bail on a Unrelated Non-Political charge

I thought lefty/pol/ had more honesty than this

Fuck outta here with that pussy shit.

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Then you misunderstand what Liberalism is in our Parlance, Conservatives support Rule of Law, Private Property, Individual Rights etc. so they are Liberal and inherently Conservatism implies a maintenance of the Status Quo, as the current dominant form of Society is Liberalism and has been since the Industrial Revolution and Capitalism rose as the dominant mode of production. They might be wary of Progressivism & Social issues, and may well even harbour some Reactionary stances but they're not for a Reactionary return to Status Quo Ante.

Yeah I'm sure all his brown cellmates are going to get on with him fine. lmao

This is propaganda lad, someone will have the chart but the muslim population of the prison he's at isn't even 3%

Legit the prison population of muslims for Stephen Yaxley-Lennon was like lower than 5%. Stop believing anything PJW says is accurate.

Now he will say

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London’s Brexit time bomb is about to blow
politico.eu/article/london-brexit-time-bomb-is-about-to-blow-theresa-may-withdrawal-agreement/
In short

Another brexit election, nice dude.

Seriously though, if labour runs on a peoples vote platform, do they scrape a win? It seems to be the only appropriate middle ground

...

Cant wait, gonna make the penguins eat tic tacs

I want to get offered a knighthood exclusively so I can turn it down and feel really smug about it.

hard hitting facts

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Honestly Corbyn needs to openly adopt an English Parliament once this cup is done.

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Kek

Embrace hooligan praxis, every four years we export the socialist revolution to whoever is hosting the world cup. Embrace Ultra-Corbynism

Don't forget the euros user.

only time so far that I have disliked corbyn

he is great but has the misfortunate character of being born English

scotland: how many layers of ideology are you on right now?
me: have you ever noticed we only win the world cup under a labour government // it's coming home it's coming home bank holiday NOW // only under a labour government // it's coming home it's coming home bank holiday NOW
[this was supposed to be a 1970 world cup/election victory]
scotland: you are like a little edward heath. watch THIS
scotland: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Democratic_Fascist_Party

Corbyn is an Arsenal supporter, no way he cares about the english nt when it's filled with Spurs players.