Front de libération du Québec

Nathan Torres
Nathan Torres

What was their deal? Apparently they were Marxist-Leninist but also adventurist terrorists? I'm especially interested in the status of Quebecois in Canada that prompted this, were they truly a repressed minority justified in their actions towards national liberation or was this a misguided ethnonationalist deviation of general working class struggle. They claimed to be the "white niggers of America" and drew comparisons between themselves and black Americans as having similar struggles.

FLQ members practised propaganda of the deed and issued declarations that called for a socialist insurrection against oppressors identified with "Anglo-Saxon" imperialism,[10] the overthrow of the Quebec government, the independence of Quebec from Canada and the establishment of a French-speaking Quebecer "workers' society". It gained the support of many left-leaning students, teachers and academics up to 1970, who engaged in public strikes in solidarity with FLQ during the October crisis. After the kidnapping of Cross, nearly 1,000 students at Université de Montréal signed a petition supporting the FLQ manifesto. This public support largely ended after the group announced they had executed Laporte, in a public communique that ended with an insult of the victim.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Front_de_libération_du_Québec

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Other urls found in this thread:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Army_Faction
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Brigades
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Red_Army
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_Red_Army
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Liberation_Front_of_Corsica
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Quebec_general_election
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Catalan_regional_election

Bentley Stewart
Bentley Stewart

Leaf here, although I’m an Anglo so my view may be biased.

Apparently they were Marxist-Leninist but also adventurist terrorists?
They were ML but their praxis was basically the same as the IRA, which would have been better if they had any real popular support like the Provos did.
I'm especially interested in the status of Quebecois in Canada that prompted this, were they truly a repressed minority justified in their actions towards national liberation or was this a misguided ethnonationalist deviation of general working class struggle. They claimed to be the "white niggers of America" and drew comparisons between themselves and black Americans as having similar struggles.
Yeah they were never even close to black people in the US. The Canadian government has made special provisions to include and cater to Quebecois since confederation. Plenty of our most important Prime Ministers have been from Quebec, including Pierre Trudeau and Jean Chrétien, who basically wrote our constitution. They also implemented the Catholic school system, which are the only religious schools that get government funding despite Catholics being a minority outside of Quebec. Bilingualism is prevalent in every province EXCEPT Quebec, where anglophones are basically shit out of luck. We have bilingual government offices, signs, schools, military units, etc. The idea that they were oppressed systemically on the scale of black people is laughable.

Joseph Perry
Joseph Perry

Apparently they were Marxist-Leninist but also adventurist terrorists?
The New Left in a nutshell.

Eli Wood
Eli Wood

Apparently they were Marxist-Leninist but also adventurist terrorists?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Army_Faction
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Brigades
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Red_Army
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_Red_Army
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETA_(separatist_group)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Liberation_Front_of_Corsica

Eli Thomas
Eli Thomas

including the United Red Army in that list
Early in August, two defectors were lynched and their bodies buried in Inba numa marsh, Chiba Prefecture. In the winter of 1971–1972 the United Red Army was hiding in the mountains in Gunma Prefecture. They established camps and trained for military purposes. The leaders of the United Red Army encouraged their fighters to examine their weaknesses in criticism and self-criticism, and these sessions turned into lynchings. The group purged itself one by one of members deemed not sufficiently revolutionary. Many of the twelve victims died tied to posts in the open, exposed to the elements, but others were beaten to death or slaughtered with knives. The first died on 31 December and the last on 12 February. The United Red Army leaders later did not admit that they had killed, but called it death by defeatism (敗北死 Haiboku shi).[1]
Clearly people we should emulate.

Adrian Wright
Adrian Wright

Real talk though, the URA members subjected to group criticism and violence were members of the RLF, an undisciplined anti-authoritarian Maoist trend. The Red Army itself was much more centralized and disciplined. Circumstances and repression forced them together, mainly due to the RLF having weapons – something the Red Army needed desperately. The Maoists were warped by nationalist ideology and bourgeois thought, just look at some of the reasons for their killings – only a bourgeois would visit the hotsprings when you’re supposed to be underground and preparing for war. Tsuneo Mori did nothing wrong

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Bentley Lewis
Bentley Lewis

Which one of these led to the creation of a successful socialist society or even got close? These seem at best to be small and counterproductive factions of broader movements and most were just doomed sects.

Tyler Rodriguez
Tyler Rodriguez

Left terrorism is obviously demonstrably ineffective in the first world, we had a few decades to test the theory from the 70s to the 90s and not a single one of these groups succeeded in anything significant at all, I think we can comfortably toss domestic terrorism in the trash bin of ineffective revolutionary strategies.

Lincoln Ortiz
Lincoln Ortiz

Exactly, and it was a waste of time to even try it. Marx himself condemned Fenian terrorism in England as ineffectual and laid out why, followed by Lenin doing the same. By the second half of the 20th century we already knew that terrorism was one of the most ineffective strategies to actually achieve political change that could be attempted.

Cooper Bennett
Cooper Bennett

Ipersonally believe they where men and women ready to do what needed to be done. The people of Québec where always treated like second class citizens, we where not treated as bad as African Americans where, but the only reason is because they tried to destroy our identity. For a long time under the English regime (that's how we call the periode before the independence of canada and after the 7 year war) many of us could be refused services, jobs and more unless they converted to protestantism and stoped speaking french. During the 20th century we had to go fight in both world wars even if we strongly opposed it. During and after ww2 something happened in Québec and it was our cultural identity that was taking form, that time is refered as the quiet revolution, the FLQ only tried to make it less quiet and to open the eyes of the people that we can go even further then just a province with a special identity, but we could be a Nation that would oppose the system that brought us down and for that they will always have my respect.

Oliver Sullivan
Oliver Sullivan

As an Anglo Canadian I respect them as well, I believe Quebec has long since deserved independence from Canada, especially considering the more socialist leanings of the Quebec people. Canada is holding Quebec back.

Aiden Walker
Aiden Walker

Thanks for the info friend. I am completely sympathetic to the sovereignty of nations and national-liberation, and don't mean to undermine the right of Quebec to self-determination, was just surprised to hear the comparison to blacks because my impression has always been what you said, that there was preference for Anglos and assimilation efforts towards Quebecois. I have no problem with militancy and think it is necessary for it to accompany any effective socialist and/or national liberation movement to a large extent but that doesnt imply terrorism is at all effective let alone necessary.

This is basically what I assumed.

Hunter Ward
Hunter Ward

since you gave your point of view from a Anglo perspective, allow me to give mine that is from the perspective of a Francophone, I also want to warn I might also have a bias. I believe that we can just talk about our opinions and points of view in a respectable and mature way.
You should know that once the brits took over they have used the catholic church against us in order to supress any form of rebellion. Your point on Bilingualism is hard to believe for me. In Québec we don't treat our english population like shit, we treat them like anybody else, the law 101 is just there to protect our language and culture not to discriminate the ones of others. I also agree that the term white Nigger is highly exagerated when you take it literaly, but I believe that is was meant as a methaphore of beeing discriminated against based on their origins. We where basicaly just treated like the Irish where, wich might also explain why you can find alot of people of Irish decent in the separatist movement of Québec, from the rebellion of 1837 up to today.

Isaac Powell
Isaac Powell

Even today there is casual anti-Francophone discrimination in Anglo Canada, the systemic discrimination is mostly gone now but the culture is still bigoted especially in conservative communities. I see it firsthand regularly.

Brayden Cook
Brayden Cook

I believe Quebec has long since deserved independence from Canada, especially considering the more socialist leanings of the Quebec people.
considering the majority of quebecois vote for a conservative (CAQ) or a neoliberal (QLP) party, it is highly doubtful life would get any better for their working class if they voted for independence

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Quebec_general_election

this is unlike in catalonia where they actually do have a sizable social-democratic/democratic-socialist coalition

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Catalan_regional_election

Liam Price
Liam Price

I would have to disagree, it is true that Québec has elected a conservative goverment with the CAQ and have had the Liberal party in power for a long time, I would like to bring your attention to the fact that Québec solidaire, a highly left leaning party came in 3th place during the last elections, it might not be alot, but it is a start. The peopulation of Québec is getting more and more concious about the struggle of the working class, especialy with millenials and gen Z's.

John Campbell
John Campbell

That makes sense, Canadians I've met from Alberta and rural Ontario definitely have an arrogance about them.

What do you think are the prospects for Quebecs independence these days? Did the Quiet Revolution basically settle the question or is it still something a lot of people in general population want to happen?

Asher Howard
Asher Howard

I don't see why the French deserve any sympathy for being discriminated against by other colonizers while they colonize.

Isaac Phillips
Isaac Phillips

Rural Ontario is heavily francophone. Franco-Ontarians are a distinct group from Quebecois and often feel neglected by them.

Logan Phillips
Logan Phillips

condoning any discrimination
Wew

Nicholas Roberts
Nicholas Roberts

He has a point though. Although French Canadians deal with some serious shit outside of Quebec, within the province separatists are some of the worst ethnonats. They regularly drum up resentment against natives, Anglo Quebecois, and immigrants.

Benjamin Hughes
Benjamin Hughes

not discriminating against porkies
not discriminating against colonizers
not killing the boer
not killing the frog
/liberalpol/index.html

Brayden Thomas
Brayden Thomas

If an independent Quebec could build socialism then decolonization could actually occur, the status quo is doing absolutely nothing to help the indigenous people here.

Chase Cox
Chase Cox

If an independent Quebec could build socialism
That's a pretty big "IF" there, buddy. Far more likely it would just be another obnoxious Yank protectorate that prattles on about how far more enlightened they are than their burger masters.

Angel Davis
Angel Davis

An independent Quebec would oppress natives as bad as or worse than the rest of Canada. Their separatist movement is pure ethnonat, they have no love for anybody who isn’t a white French speaking Quebecois.

Dylan Butler
Dylan Butler

So your solution is what exactly? Just don't build socialism? Sounds pretty counterrevolutionary.

Hudson Powell
Hudson Powell

Right now the Quebec seperatist movement is mostly ethnonat bullshit, but the FLQ was revolutionary ML, that is who I support historically here.

James Hall
James Hall

So your solution is what exactly? Just don't build socialism?
The solution IS to build socialism. What I'm saying is that narcissistic Yanks-in-denial won't do it, and that the category of French Canada is an inherently shit line to draw nationalistic conflict along. It's an inter-imperialist conflict.

Levi Harris
Levi Harris

Also splitting a multi ethnic country along ethnic lines is completely retarded and won’t help socialism in the slightest. If you want to build socialism in Canada it needs to be done on a national, multi-ethnic basis.

Ayden Gray
Ayden Gray

Left terrorism is obviously demonstrably ineffective in the first world
Are you implying it's effective in the third world? Where exactly has it worked?

Catalan independence today is just pushed by Catalan porkies, it isn't a working-class movement.

Jackson Hughes
Jackson Hughes

Are you implying it's effective in the third world? Where exactly has it worked?
I'm just saying I don't know enough about third world terrorism to comment on its effectiveness. I would wager it is just as ineffective there but I don't have the knowledge to assert that.

Hunter Robinson
Hunter Robinson

Quebec
Caring about indigenous people, or any people other than their own autistic province
You're funny.

Bentley White
Bentley White

Seems like if Quebec seperatists promised actual development and opportunities for the First Nations in the province they'd gain some additional leverage, from both the actual natives wanting to see actual improvement and exploiting the general fetishization of natives to give them the moral high ground in the press.

David Foster
David Foster

First nations are a huge pool of revolutionary potential in this country.

Brandon Bailey
Brandon Bailey

They won't because their entire ideology is inherently exclusionary. There is nothing that would be gained from Quebec's separation as far a socialism is concerned that wouldn't be better served by keeping the country together.