Why aren't there more leftists who have criminal minds?

Most leftists have nothing criminal going on in their heads. Why is this? So many of them flip their shit at the thought of doing a little graffiti, or shoplifting. I know there are a decent amount who are not afraid to do these things, but at the same time so many of them, I'd say 90% or more, cannot convince themselves to commit crime. They'll use all sorts of justifications and such about "being strategic" and "staying under the radar", but TBH that sounds a lot like being a citizen who has revolution fantasies more than anything else.

Basically, where are today's Bonannos and Bonnots?

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Do you realise how hard it is to be a criminal nowadays? Omnipresent surveillance, digital tracking, DNA, undercover political cops, it's hardly like the good old days where you could just shoot up a bank wearing some tights on your face then run with your loot to the next county.

I've tagged a cop car before though, it was fun but ultimately pointless.

See, there are fascist gangs that I live near that prove being a criminal isn't hard, they mostly distribute meth afaik.

I'm not necessarily looking for more people to tag or just breaking the law generally, but I think that people having a generalized culture of breaking the law would do a lot to make it harder to catch single individuals who were breaking the law.

Sounds awfully like

What does doing grafitti or shoplifting contribute to achieving a socialist society?

Exception that proves the rule, that's not anti-state crime, it's fashie scum preying on their community.

Isn't that basically the case at riots though?

TBH I could see the argument that shoplifting at self-scan machines is actually existing communism.

See also flea market socialist


If that's what OP is arguing for I'm all in favour of it.

Based praxis

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Oversocialization. Read Kaczynski

is the next thread going to be "why aren't there more lefties willing to become colombian drug lords to overthrow their own governments"

Fucking based.


Ah yes the Bonnot Gang, known for their uncompromising efforts to establish a socialist society. So surprising that bank heists failed to usher in communism

The Bonnot Gang is undeniably really fucking cool I'm not saying otherwise but they are in no way a model. Illegalism is necessary for survival in certain circumstances and I am not suggesting law should be respected on the basis of being law but it is on its own completely insufficient and often extremely counterproductive.

Do not fucking waste your time reading Kaczynski

What the fuck, I HATE TED NOW

that's fucking right, didn't even need to debunk him

Can we just talk about this for a while? I've wanted to make a thread about this exact thing for a while now. People should, if at all possible, be doing this.

You can do a couple things at the self-scan checkouts that save you some cash. Fundamentally these rely heavily on you being honest about what you're getting because they have no idea what you're really doing there, all they can check on what you're loading up is the weight. You can easily scan the wrong item and load a similar, but more expensive thing into your bag. There's the fact that it's even easier to just cram stuff in your pockets and walk because it's usually one camera that's focused on your face rather than anything.

Shoplifting in general it's easy to just pocket stuff and get through. Having a light jacket or hoodie makes it even easier and only looks odd on the hottest days. If it's a place you're going to come back to, biggest thing is to just not act any different than usual. Adding just a few more things to what you take home, even if you pay for most of what you get, really does build up over time. Best things to pocket are small and more expensive like off-the-shelf medicine.

Anyone have more experience in this they'd be willing to share?

Those gangs are actively supported by the police.

Most people only turn to crime out of an act of desperation or material conditions are bad enough to where a person has to turn to an "illegal" source of labor to achieve a income to survive. Essentially, while illegalism is a necessary part of revolution it's not the first thing most people turn to. Shit has to hit the fan before people start looting for food and stuff and given history it only takes one crisis to get the ball rolling. It's not as easy to convince people who already have housing and job security to do dumb illegal shit that'll threaten their financial security

Wasn't Stalin a bank robber before the Russian Revolution?

And what role did that have in the formation of the Bolsheviks? Maybe it helped him get into a position where he was personally secure enough to commit himself to radical politics, in which case, like I said, very cool but not radical politics in itself (and should certainly not be advised as a strategy for radical leftist politics, especially where alphabet soup can hear)

I made a thread about how only 2% of arsonists in the US are ever caught. Then started posting useful resources and guides. For some reason BO deleted it about 30 replies in.

boy… thats not ok

If the cops attack you when you're doing nothing just let the whole rally go to purge, you spooky nig

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under rated comrade.
Needs more attention.

I would expand your premise to include isolation in general to explain the existence of actual retards who crave life of 'mobster' and physical violence ridden superiority complex.

The reason why Americunt libtards have to go through mental gymnastic with their country's segregation problem is because they will never acknowledge what kind of negative feedback structure they are imposing under capitalism. Not that they actually wanted to help anybody in the first place.

I want to see actual accelerationist's argument on illegalism for sure but I don't think he will be able to convince my mind over leftist populist takeover plan

I am totally not pussyfart who are afraid of violent revolution.

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I am VERY 100% sure the man who wrote that article is a liberal.

i can be quite develish when i want to be

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do people not care about filename anymore?

lol, what even is it? i bet youre lying. i dont even care, really

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Ngl that was a good thread though

This pic is exactly what I imagine when a Zig Forumsyp says he used to be a leftist.

Well it can be interpreted any number of ways, was it posted to say that's what liberals are actually like? Or that that's what pol pretends they're like? Either way it makes no sense.

Another pussy-ass leftist afraid of getting caught, lel.

Because being arrested for petty vandalism is retarded when I have much better things to be doing with my time.

Same poster.

Really reminds me of 30-year old "punks" on twitter asking why the left isn't drinking alcohol without a paper bag on trains anymore and how it's really a really profound something blah blah blah. What's the problem with NOT being some 19 year old Beto O'Rourke cult of the dead cow dipshit? I get the fun in breaking rules. I used to trespass all the time early in my high school days, do a little acid in public, etc. But it's so stupid when you attach that stuff to politics. It's performative poser shit, as we used to say.

Burgers are so retarded

Gonna be honest unless there's extreme extenuating circumstances most of you guys should be doing minor shoplifting any time you buy from a supermarket at the least. From a practical perspective it's a very low risk activity that really does help stretch out your food dollar.

Shoplifting for personal game is not the idea here. Shoplifting the hurt the bottom dollar a corporation is the idea.

This is especially true with self checkout systems. Automation is inevitable and we should not be against it as socialists, But we should be sabotaging where that profit goes.

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I actually am not sure as to whether theft from stores actually hurts capitalism. It rather strikes me that when considered from the view of broken-window economics, in a land where windows are so overproduced that it stalls the economy, breaking windows might actually be necessary for capitalism to continue.

On the other hand I am quite sure that shoplifting helps comrades continue to procure their daily needs without the need for pointless suffering, so there's that.

Who the fuck wants to submit themselves to crime? Paranoid asshats running surveillance systems think the whole world is as broken as their own minds. They run from shadows! Many of them have done terrible things! The rest of us are just ourselves. We understand that hurting others hurts everyone. Shoplifting impoverishes communities. Graffiti is ugly and promotes a sense of helplessness.

Sometimes, anyways. Sometimes graffiti does that, but sometimes graffiti is okay. is okay. Who is wise enough to know? Do you know every circumstance of a wall you are scrawling something dreadful on? Are you God, omniscient of the needs of your community?

In a few years you'll be rafiq if you get smarter and try a little harder.

This is straight bullshit.

bad post

lol if you think literally any of the profit walmart makes goes to the community

Did the Americans seriously let you graduate from kindergarten?

Got any ideas for simple theft? Stuff that is a good gateway into the trade while being relatively easy not to get caught? I've worked in retail for we'll over 8+ years. Started in grocery and saw people steal shit. Didn't say anything because they weren't paying me enough to do so (they even accused me of stealing once when one of there automated machines broke). But all it takes is some overzealous wageslaving boomer to oust you from one slip-up.

Ill be honest in admitting the worst I've done is pirating. Never been caught (although I know people who have). While pirating is based praxis, it's not really high risk, high reward or even low risk, high reward. In terms of praxis or personal benefit.

To add. I've genuinely thought of stealing from stuff like cash machines. I've seen videos of guys successfully hauling those things away or stealing things from the back of trucks. Used to be a truck driver, so I know how the schedules work. I remember one haul I had involved me hauling 300k worth of shoes once. We were unarmed (we are taught to just give the stuff up, like bank tellers) and the trailer's lock could have easily been cut off. Our saving grace was the fact that no one knew what we were really hauling. But all it takes is one lucky score from a burgerland rest stop.
Those are examples. Stuff that really is virtually impossible to get caught doing, but ultimately a good payoff.

Wow, really funny that all the sudden we have so many threads about "crime as praxis"! I sure do wonder where they're coming from!

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I'm guessing it wouldn't exactly be easy to turn 300k in shoes into cash.

I wouldnt have stolen all the shoes. Just a couple pairs. Enough to fit in a mid sized trunk and net $10k at most. No one would even notice that they were gone.

I'm pretty sure they would do some kind of stocktaking at the other end bro. Then even if you get away with that you have to go about selling $10k of shoes, I'll be generous and say you only have to shift 50 pairs of stolen shoes, do you think that would be easy to do? Or you'd get anywhere near retail price?

Sorry I don't mean to piss on your fantasy, just saying that crime is not a realistic way to fund the revolution, the real criminals are wearing suits and ties.

You had various left terror orgs in the 70s, 80s, 90s who funded their operations through bank robbing. The thing is that their praxis didn't worked at all. But they successfully funded their operations through crime.

dunno bout others, i have 27k european android botnet.

What are the most serious hypothetical crimes that can be discussed ITT without getting raided by the feds or suffering any legal consequences?


Nice try, FBI

Because unlike Zig Forums we aren’t skitcos.

But it's also far easier because you can just be a criminal with a computer. No risk to your life and easier to hide your tracks. Digital illegalist gang representing.

this is now a cool science video thread





Perhaps the lack of criminality is reflective of the ideological values of the individual Communists who emphathise and perceive the collective suffering of others as superseding their need for individual satisfaction. Most people I know who are criminals (ie. regularly shoplift, rob people, beat their partners etc) tend to be apolitical and generally uneducated and unintelligent. However this is purely based on my empirical experiences.

Most major retailers factor shoplifting into their costs and pass it on to the consumers.

One could argue that if you don’t shoplift the company is getting money for free… however we are all paying extra for people who shoplift.

nice try FBI

do you know what a camera or "responsibility" or "common sense" is

absolute raping and kidnapping of someone currently on the senate

And in this case I would argue that the stores are absolutely not going to lower their costs in the case of lower shoplifting, they have no reason to, as people already are paying prices that are what they are.

Or you can just shoplift yourself so that you're actually getting what you pay for. :^)

Crime is entirely a social construct.

Did that article really just argue that black people don't have a theory of mind? That's the best analysis he came up with for his dumb little anecdote?

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Even the 70s is a totally different world from today even if it did work. I admire and semi-ironically respect the Symbionese Liberation Army but I'm not gonna try imitate them today (especially considering as you say it didn't work then either).

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There's Criminal in terms of breaking the law and criminal as a type of person - that's the result of traumatic brain injury, abuse in formative years and drugs that remove fear like benzodiazepines, amphetamines and poorly researched use of steroids.

I don't get this leftist/right-wing shit in the context of crime. The vast majority of people fear the deterrents in place to prevent crime even if some fantasize about killing blacks or bankers or whatever they think will achieve something. Have you not noticed how egregious 'political' crimes like mass shootings and bombings are always people blowing their wad on a soft target that achieves nothing?

The finer the granularity in your thinking (this doesn't make you a genius it's simply a mindset) the more you fear the consequences of pain, death, fear itself, loss of livelihood, public disgrace etc if that's what you mean by "leftists" (I'm assuming you mean the lefty/pol/ notion of studious class-warriors not concerned with idpol) as in people who read books and mull over minutiae.

Most of the time can't be sedentary & contemplative and have the urge to carry out egregious actions that mean the end of your life or livelihood. You have to be somewhere inbetween the near-sighted highly mobile consumer worker who doesn't read who would put their job and family before any kind of action and a person who has a lot of time to reflect and sits down all day who is too afraid.

You can't rectify the fear of consequences in the latter with exercise and TRT. You can't do it with any cocktail of drugs. I know how to overcome the fear of any consequence but I'm not going to say it because I believe violence is a waste of time and people always pick the dumbest targets and achieve nothing or the opposite of what they wanted.

If you want to weigh up the effects of someone breaking the law because they believed they were doing the right thing, Snowden's leaks had and will have more effect than if someone detonated a 5kt nuclear device in downtown Manhattan. For whatever reason, a group of people hit the twin towers and the fucking Pentagon on 9/11. It also hit the airline industry very hard. If you wanted to strike the heart of American finance and the MICC you couldn't have hoped for a better result. But everything was just replaced and it was used as a blank check to destroy the middle east, so if you had a tally result, 9/11 was a massive failure, minus a gazillion points if we accept the common notions of what the motive was.

Look at how many bombs the USAF and USN dropped on Vietnam: webapps-cdn-dev.esri.com/CDN/page-templates/products/map-cookbook/vietnam.html

If you count the number of bombs dropped by the US on Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos it is the equivalent to 9 LGM-30 III Minuteman missiles or 100 times the combined tonnage of the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. This is spread out across a massive area which is actually worse. The civilian deathcounts which are no doubt underplayed do not account for amount of concussion which caused brain damage to those who survived nearby detonations and that is simply physical damage. Add in the defoliant birth defects and alleged deployment of BZ and you have a whole lot of violence.

And now it's as if nothing ever happened. The US and Vietnam are chums.

Breaking OPSEC/NDA laws and risking extrajudicial torture/killing to leak secrets does more damage than any weapon a civilian could get their hands on. The absolute peak of 'terrorism' (really this means committing relatively small-scale violence to create spectacle to invoke a disproportionate response) that can be achieved is a rogue launch of a single submarine-launched ballistic missile which can only release 8 multiple independently-targetable 100kt re-entry vehicles that detach from a bus at the zenith of ballistic arc and spread out across a 150 mile diameter circle which means the devastation of one major metropolitan area and the outskirts. Within a decade people would be making 9/11-esque jokes even if this near-impossible incident took place because it would all be rebuilt. Even if you surgically targeted individuals or small groups, others would take their place.

The most effective action, whistleblowing, is not even a criminal activity. It merely breaks the rules of the criminal underworld.

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The ridiculous ballistic missile example I give is based on a whistleblower's account from the Royal Navy who worked on a Vanguard-class submarine.

According to the British government, when a Trident missile with a small quantity of tritonal went the opposite direction and flew over the United States in a 'failed test', they were able to self-destruct it remotely in space over Florida and add to the junk floating around. I don't know if this is the true story, remote self-destruct of missiles sounds like fiction and it seems like a cover story. Perhaps it was a test of a self-destruct mechanism or perhaps they were firing at White Sands for unknown reasons.

The nuke talk that seems like an autism flare-up (it never goes down) relates to what I meant about fear of consequences.

Muskets -> Rifles -> Cannons -> Artillery & high-explosive bombs -> "The Bomber Will Always Get Through"/Dresden/Tokyo -> Biological Weapons -> Chemical Weapons -> Nuclear Weapons -> ???

What comes next? The next "WMD". It's coming. If you figure out what it is before it arrives you'll no longer fear death or injury.

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I once smoked a ton of weed then drove home without wearing a seatbelt \m/

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One vote from me to appoint you leader of The Revolution

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Tungsten rods dropped from orbit.

I can't drive high, I keep forgetting what I am doing and I can't feel the pedals.

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I unironically think the age of consent thing is a joke.

I would take pleasure in shoving the nightstick of a female cop up her cunt

Op, back finally. I like all the input I see and will be taking it into serious consideration, probably going to watch all the videos posted and such today when I get to work. I'm very curious as to how leftists might redirect the already existing activities of.criminals into revolutionary activity- that is, not changing WHAT or HOW the criminals are doing, but changing the goals and ousting the lumpen bourgeois class.

Smoke more, you have a low tolerance.

Why? Low reward for a high risk. I'll just get barred from the store. Growing your shit or foraging is better.

I once stole like $10,000 in overtime pay over the course of year by exploring a security flaw in the clock-in system used by the company I worked for. I felt absolutely no guilt while doing it too. Do I possess this "criminal mind"?

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Nah he did but it got deleted because uh we're not trying to get Zig Forums shut down by advocating for retards to set fires for no reason

Dude I've been pocketing stuff from the store every single time I've gone for over a year now and I've just smiled to the cashiers and told them to have a great day every single time and never once has anyone stopped me.

Having a light hoodie that has internal pockets helps a lot, look into one of those.

Stalin and his compadres dynamited a carriage full of imperial bank notes but it's questionable whether they were ever able to smuggle the booty out of the country (which was the goal) because all the notes had numbers on them, meaning they'd likely have been intercepted at the banks in Europe. Trotsky I believed said the booty "did no good."

It also caused a lot of problems for Lenin. I believe he was living in St. Petersburg at the time and had to flee to Finland because the secret police were rounding people up because of Stalin's adventurism.

Case in point: Dr. Bones.

I should add that Stalin's shenanigans, dubious as they might have been politically, were in the context of early 20th century Georgia which was like the fucking Wild West – so that's one thing to keep in mind.

You probably don't live in the Wild West.

Anyways the performative poseur shit is why I'm wary of that sort of thing. Back in the 1970s there was a lot of performative criminality on the left like "Steal This Book" which is like a guide on how to hack payphones and so on. If anything I think it's the alt-right these days which are emulating that and a lot of them are winding up in jail and with criminal records. Not working out so great for them in my opinion.

Yeah but on the other hand a lot of the alt-right are legitimately retarded dipshits who actually think that because they're straight white kids with a decent bit of money they won't be arrested cause they're not black.

you just hate fun


Sure, trust Trotsky's words

We had some criminals in the 70s-80s.

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it's cute you have no idea how the world works. Shoplifting doesn't hurt the corporations, they just build that into the cost model. Shoplifting only hurts honest consumers


>surgically targeting indviduals or small groups


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Most anarchist direct action is illegal, from simple spray painting to torching police cars. Expropriating banks is still a common pastime among the anarchists in Greece.