What is the historical materialist explanation for the common acceptance of homosexuality in the west and now trans folks?
What is the historical materialist explanation for the common acceptance of homosexuality in the west and now trans...
Aiden Howard
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Elijah Wright
Life getting easier + alienation from your work that in combination with capitalists selling you things damaging to your health i.e poor diets, sugary foods, chemicals and plastics in everything, disgenic healthcare leads to a whole host of mental illness
Brayden Brown
hi Zig Forums.
this is not a historical materialist analysis .
Nice stats tho, you realise gay people are more likely to be homeless, significantly so, and more likely to become sex workers, which accounts for all of these things. This is due to getting kicked out their house a lot. Wonder how it would be if faggot christcuk parents hadn't kicked them out and persecuted them for centuries.
I am not going to say that none sex worker gay men are not promiscuous but literally who cares. It has no social consequences to blow a load in someones ass. Which is the materialist analysis for why gay guys are less choosy.
no retards please. Some real analysis would be good
Landon Taylor
Camden Turner
nah just posting retarded infographics with stats about da ebil gays is Zig Forums tier. Lenin legalized homosexuality, Stalin on undid that to appease reactionary forces.
your analysis is life got easier (over which period? why does this mean people would be more accepting? ) and work was alienated (it has always been alienated) plus capitalists selling things that are damaging to mental health but this is completely retarded because homosexuality has been around far longer than capitalism, unless you are trying to tell me that everyone is mentally ill and that is why they now accept homosexuality, which was the question.
it was in response to your infographic but you knew that
the reason this is not a historical materialist analysis is because you are talking about capitalism selling an idea, but this is idealism, it doesn't describe material conditions, which are what bring about societal change, not ideas.
Nonetheless why would the hypersexualisation of society mean that homosexuality specifically was more accepted?
well not really, its pretty common knowledge gay guys have done heaps of good shit throughout history. You are trying to frame it as a mental illness which nobody in the mental health profession taken seriously actually thinks.
Brody Thomas
Urbanization.
High population density means that literally every lifestyle can become its own popular niche with thousands or millions of people who practice it publicly, thus norrmalizing it. In any given village the chance that there are even two gay people of the same sex is actually pretty low, so they either remain single or pretend to be hetero so they can be normal. A gay couple in a village would be strange and stand out a lot, because they're literally the only gay people for miles. Cities obviously change this, so now gay people can actually find each other and because there are so many gay couples it becomes a normal thing to see.
So if you grew up in a city seeing gay couples all the time then you won't think it's strange or scary, but if you grew up in a village and literally never saw a gay person before in your life you would.
And higher density just means even more niche things become normalized. Transgender incidence rates are even lower than homosexuality, for example, so even small cities would have fairly low numbers and so they couldn't be normalized until cities grew even more to have millions of people. Many cities are big enough now that they are getting normalized and accepted as well, but most are still too small and so there's also pushback.
Asher Cook
You cannot be Marxist and anti-racist. You cannot be Marxist and homosexual or even tolerate homosexuality. You cannot be a Marxist and not want to have only as racially healthy children as possible. You cannot be a Marxist and believe in "free love". You cannot be a Marxist and at the same time be what Christians call a "humanist".
Ryder Jones
I think this is basically because homosexuals are just another group of people that capital can appease and control with products targeting their brand of identity.
Remember that at the end of the day, what the bourgies want is "happy" wage slaves, which are content with shit like, for example, their favorite coffeshop flying the rainbow flag or similar nonsense like that.
You want docile slaves, not angry ones.
Jonathan Rodriguez
what the fuck has this board become…?
Ayden Gray
...
Mason Morales
...
Dylan Howard
Lmao mods will let any shiit flynthis day. But god forbid one speaks generalizingly about something.
Ryan Gutierrez
prove it
everybody who posts here knows that saying "read marx" with no further explanation is shit tier. It makes me think you have not read it.
so there is a difference in form between old school gays and new school gays? Tell me please what is
so which aspect of the base changed it and from what to what and why is this relevant to its general acceptance?
most people in the west do, so to be clear you are accounting the acceptance of homosexuality with some kind of increase in mental illness that is your explanation?
hardly you posted a picture and i responded
this does not explain common acceptance of homosexuality though, just increased sexualisation
and it is harder for gay people to interact with capitalist society so.,…
and yet capitalism existed for 100-150 years before any of this happened so what changed
Wyatt Kelly
lmao wtf Lenin and Mao and Fred Hampton no longer marxist wtfff
Gavin Gonzalez
yeah right after you prove your retarded claim.
You are obviously ignorant of the Marxist concept of Alienation. It is impossible to have a conversation on a topic you have demonstrated a lack of knowledge of.
Like I said before base effects superstructure in Marxism are you unfamiliar with this concept as well?
"which aspect of base changed it"
are you serious? do you know what base vs superstructure is?
profitably of hyper sexualization > expansion of sexual markets = porky pushes for acceptance of homosex for increase profits.
mental illness under capitalism is defined as how well a person can interact with capitalist society not what is healthy for people
Matthew Sullivan
but it's literally been proven that mixed children are more healthy tho, and it makes fucking sense if you know a little bit of biology and figure out that the gene pool grows
Luis Smith
replied
Josiah Miller
not really
Noah Anderson
Heterosis, hybrid vigor, outbreeding enhancement, take your pick. Eugenicists were wrong dude.
Jose Lewis
not an argument
Brayden Hernandez
Acceptance of niche identities is important when you want to squeeze as much value out of the workers as possible in an era where profits are increasingly hard to come by. That being said there is nothing wrong with homosexual activity (it's a sin technically but then again so is premarital straight sex so whatevs.)
Gabriel Morris
ive seen this post before
Logan Anderson
none of those are real though
Ryder Bailey
check again
Carter Lewis
actually it is
Thomas Hall
autistic NazBol gang?
Bentley Cruz
A negation is not an argument.
Robert Richardson
Dylan Bell
what is this graph
Mason Gutierrez
thanks Zig Forums, I needed that laugh.
Caleb Williams
right-wing chaos meme magick?
John Garcia
class consciousness emerging in neoliberal conditions creating solidarity. Queers organised with working class communities during Thatcher's leadership. The film Pride is about it. We learn that we share the same class struggle in the end.
Ethan Thomas
counter revolution was rising particularly from the orthodox church not liking the equalisation of men and women etc. It was seen as a way to appease them.
im igorant of alienation because you have failed to link alienation to homosexuality in any meaningful way, or to the acceptance of it by general society, which was the question.
yes i am, but at this point you are just blurting out dogmas. Yes the base effects the superstructure, as i said, i am aware, i then asked you to go that one step further, and show you understand it, by pointing to the specific aspects of the base which affect this part of the superstructure.
you said new homosexuality was different to old sexuality so i asked you how, you have failed to answer.
yes i am specifically asking you which economic conditions affected it specifically.
you are saying the rules without applying them to the issue at hand.
Its like if i ask what 2x2 is and you say multiplication
but it wasnt porky pushing it, porky pushed against it.
yes you said the before
i can guarentee i am more familiar than you considering there are precisely zero real world marxists with any following pushing what you are pushing right now.
Bentley Sanchez
Anyway, after that derailment, can i have some none retarded answers please
Benjamin Baker
hmmm this also seems idealist, like it depended on consciousness changing rather than conditions changing
Nathan Myers
the conditions of the working class changed causing collective understanding of the class struggle. including gays and whatnot.
Adam Perez
which conditions and when tho
James Harris
Are you familiar with the eugenics of Thatcher against working class communities in the North of England in the 80s?
Joseph Rogers
equality comes from changes of economic system not government policy
read the book sticky 8ch.net
Marxism = dogma
ok
doesn't seem like it
what does that have to do with the actual conversation? That is a completely different topic.
yes. by definition Base vs. Superstructure Homosexuality under capitalism is different than homosexuality under feudalism
private ownership of the means of production + commodity production.
Maybe you should learn about what Marx wrote on alienation and Base v. Superstructure.
this is incorrect. I'm not about to list examples of companies supporting homos they're out there its common knowledge,
mental illness under capitalism is defined as how well a person can interact with capitalist society not what is healthy for people
Well considering you are unfamiliar with all the Marxist concepts we're discussing
now you're just making up statistics and appealing to majority
ok bud
Nicholas Ross
We're being raided, also the hammer & sickle guy is a reactionary I've called him in other threads for falseflagging
Jordan Williams
Report the thread/posts retardo
Jaxon Morales
no you haven't
Dylan Wright
You are doing a shitty job at imitating a Marxist.
Ryder Morris
(It’s because you don’t understand marxism)
Cooper Barnes
you being mad is not an argument
Oliver Ross
"What is the historical materialist explanation for the common acceptance of pizza in the West?"
What political usefulness does this question have? In what way is this a pressing issue?
Liam Flores
rekt
Luke Watson
Simple answer: American billionaires financed the Gay, Transgender etc. movements into prominence because it was useful to them at the time.