Hey lefty pol,
new fag from Zig Forums here, Decided to have a "lurk" on the other side and I'm really surprised with how many things both boards have in common with regards to problems identified within society, (except one blames Jews and the other capitalists). It surprised me how much i agree with comments on this board (assumed it would be a sea of SJW culture and white hate, but it was informative and interesting). I know this probably gets posted every week here (please don't gulag me) but how do we reconcile? it seems like NutSac is just socialism with a racial consciousness? And can I get your opinions on the "anuddah shoah" that Zig Forums is so concerned with? And why or why not race and ethnicity would/wouldn't matter to you?
Not trying to start an argument or "red pill" you all I've just been hearing so much "1488 Nazi masturbation fantasy now" lately I'm kinda sick and would appreciate some other input. Thanks in advance
Hey lefty pol
Hey lefty pol,
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it seems like NutSac is just socialism with a racial consciousness?
I would say its socialism without economic counsciousness.
Most of the things nazis blame jews for are a direct result of capitalist production. This becomes unquestionable once you look at how consistent class/race divide is.
For example, every capitalist profits of the exploitation of the working class. Every capitalist is part of the ruling class. However, not every jew would profit of the "destruction of the white race" (who are their allies against arab countries) and definetly not every jew is part of the ruling class. Therefore, class as a construct is consistent, while antisemitism is not.
Jokes aside, there is not really any way leftism can be fused with racism. Leftism is internationalist by its nature, since its not certain ppl who are the problem, its economic conditions taht empower ppl to exploit which are. And since conditions are not different according to their heritage but to their structure, there is no reconciling possible. Youll have to decide between the eternal, materialist analysis that is marxism, and the romatic, mystical idea of race.
I would be happy if you choose former.
Not-socialism is just a way for porky to sway idiots to his side. I guess you can be redeemed in my eyes if you stop going after the "JUICE" and "niggers" and actually look into something more deeply than id-pol with racial characteristics.
Basically what I would tell you is that all the jews that actually deserve to die will die if we initiate a socialist revolution. Obviously not for being jewish
Hitler killed off all the socialists or exiled them. There was nothing socialist about Hitler's Germany.
You should stop being a racist faggot. Decide between a country where everyone tries to live together normally while improving the quality of life and solving common problems or a larp fantasy about Nazi masturbation fantasy, peaceful genocide ethnostate and separatism.
Forgot about the shitpost flag
Every week someone comes barging in with the never seen before idea of reconciling fascism and socialism. It's not gonna happen. Fascism has its roots in WW1 veterans acting as strikebreakers for German and Italian industrialists. Fascists have always been footsoldiers of capital against a rising labor movement. There is no reconciliation to be done, there is no such thing as anti-capitalist fascism.
That's like saying a dictator killing off other dictators isn't a dictator because he killed off other dictators.
You can be a racist, but you have to stop tunnel vision.
wut? Yeah, but dictatorship implies theres only one ruler who would act against other potential rulers with violence.
Where is the part in socialism that implies one tendency has to be violent against other socialist tendencies?
Hitler HAD to remove them because their views were contrary to his.
So this is the brain of a Zig Forumsyp.
In what way was Nazi germany socialist? Unless if you're an American who thinks welfare = socialism.
Seriously Fuck Mutts. I REPEAT FUCK MUTTS. I fully support the SJWs and the corporations when they trigger the fuck out of you with some new black or trans pokemon. Fuck your video games, Fuck your tv shows fuck all your nerd shit and your culture there have to be blacks in every single video game. I want Gay porn and BLACKED to show up in all your pornhub recommendations.
In what way? I'll start with this: what is capitalism? Or – what does a capitalist do? He gets some money together in the form of a loan, and buys labor plus machinery and puts these two things together to make a commodity, which he then sells for the initial cost plus a profit. That profit is then reinvested – it's recapitalized – for an expansion. This cycle of production and investment requires profit.
Likewise, capitalism now is so sophisticated that major corporations have a fiduciary obligation to their investors to seek a return; they could be sued otherwise. This is a big reason why capitalism is such a dynamic and explosive force in terms of growth. The world basically didn't grow at all (or only extremely slowly) for thousands of years and then growth went parabolic in the past 200 years or so.
And if you don't grow, your competitors will eat you.
Likewise, the bank is going to expect a return on the loan you took out. The financial system generally has been bound up with the history of capitalism since the beginning with the rise of Dutch commercial banking, since it's through financial innovation that capitalists are able to get the money for investment in the right place, at the right time, and in the right quantity. If the system does not grow – if it does not expand to every corner of the globe – then it will slow down and eventually collapse. The problem here is that profitability generally falls over time. You take on more and more debt to fund further expansion, and the cost of servicing the debt rises, or you build too much and profits generally begin to decline. It is very complicated, but the falling rate of profitability has been a consistent pattern throughout, and the approximate cause of major depressions in the history of capitalism, although it has amazingly found ways to dig itself out and restart the cycle. Obviously there was the Great Depression, which did not really end until World War II destroyed large amounts of excess capital in the world.
One reason there is so much financial speculation these days, you could argue from a Marxist perspective, is that we've been sustained on the back of rebuilding the global economy after World War II – which was highly profitable. But there's nowhere else for all the money to go to seek a return, and profitability has been slowly on the decline for decades worldwide, so capitalism is seeking out profits now in basically gambling on rising asset prices: wadding up all the money into a big ball and throwing it at whatever looks like it will make a return no matter how stupid. Like Elon Musk or whatever. Housing becomes very expensive for example. This creates very destabilizing asset bubbles like we saw with the 2008 financial crisis, and there is a lot of talk now that another one may be looming.
I'll add that you can study the Great Depression to learn what capitalism looks like when growth is not automatic. The U.S. dollar suffered massive deflation, money appreciated more value when hidden under a mattress than it did in a bank, because there were too many failed investments, i.e. investments that do not result in growth. Basically "everyone needs to get paid." All the mechanisms of capitalism create economic gridlock when there is no profit to be made. You can't employ anyone, you can't feed anyone, because everyone in the supply chain is demanding a profit. Instead of coming together in times of hardship, people scatter. It's the reason communism and socialism were so popular during the Great Depression.
So what is the Nazi analysis of this? "The Jews did it." They are a convenient scapegoat, in part because Jews – due to a variety of cultural and historical reasons – have been bound up in commercial banking. The Nazi economy, in practice however, was a credit-fueled bubble expanded to finance rearmament which was then directed by necessity into a war that killed millions of communists. From our perspective, fascism is a metastatic and basically insane reaction that emerges from within capitalism when it is faced with a deep enough crisis. It offers to "save" capitalism by redirecting anger onto its signifiers: Jews. Its "solution" is warfare. This is why it burns hot and then burns out, with appalling consequences.
The communist project is to break out of the commodity as a structuring force in society: destroying the machine (capitalism) that has enslaved humanity.
The Nazis believed they were fighting a war against a global conspiracy of Jewish sorcerers. It makes sense, if that's what you believe, that'd you try to wipe them out. The main thing is that even if the things Nazis say about Jews is true, their obsession with Jews is still pathological because they require this image of the Jew to sustain their own politics instead of facing to the immortal science of Marxism-Leninism.
The most you can demand from anyone in this world is a minimum standard of mutual respect.
uhhh Nazi Germany had a government so it's socialist, duh
I'm a white guy who grew up with an all white family and I don't hate white people but the "w.hite genocide" thing is a total fabrication. When I first started coming here we used to have a thread about it every once and a while and the general consensus is 1) that it's a myth and 2) if it is real it's something that would be halted by abolishing capitalism so that should take priority over any social engineering or whatever.
Usually it isn't discussed much these days and most of us aren't interested in it but since I know Zig Forums is genuinely concerned about it and you appear to be in good faith I'll give you some things to check out. Also I'm very sorry but it's going to have to be a 2 part post but I swear i tried to keep it brief
1)I hate to direct you to a liberal right off the bat because you'll probably think I'm trying to promote him but I genuinely don't know of any actual Communists (except for BadMouse but his video has more to do with the Globalism side of "w.hite genocide" rather than hard statistics and demographic data so I'm saving his video for later when i get to that point) who have done a good analysis of the claims regarding w.hite genocide and all the other libs I've seen who tried are just really really smug and annoying about it including Hbomberguy who is a faggot and a grifter who is first against the wall when the revolution happens imo.
The guy's voice is a bit grating so if you don't want to actually watch the video I recommend just reading the sources he provided in the description box to support his arguments.
2)There's a book out now that suggests the world population might actually drop to zero or near zero by 2100 or something like that. And they mean everywhere too not just in the West. Their claim comes from data across several studies that shows birthrates are declining everywhere, even in brown countries, albeit more slowly due to the increase in economic development (I can understand Zig Forums not considering this since a lot of them seem to think the majority of Africans still live in mudhuts and that all of Africa looks like the slum in that video of people literally eating dirt)
Now to be fair I haven't read the book and have just read a few interviews these guys did and idk what impact if any their research has had in the greater field but from the articles I've read their data and sources seem solid
3) the general trend for the last 30 years has been to manage immigration and immigrants rather than a blanket invitation for them to come to western countries and do whatever the hell they want (although I will concede that many pc liberal pieces of shit do literally say this and I hate it because it turns a fuckload of people away from Leftism). Basically what I mean by manage is, let enough immigrants in so that they are a cheap source of labor that can be used to drive down the wages of domestic laborers but not so much that it breaks this system or causes too much resentment among the domestic laboring population and causes the ruling class to have to shut down their operation. I'll post some sources on this if you really want me to but it's pretty easy to read about with some simple googling.
Basically just look at how Barack Obama deported more immigrants then any modern president including everyone from the first Bush up to the second Bush combined. Look at how Angela Merkel pivoted on the "flood" of Somalian immigrants recently and now is slowing and eventually will cut off the flow. To be fair on the Merkel point I've heard the argument that this was a concession to the Right that wouldn't have happened if there hadn't been a strong anti-immigrant movement in the first place but if you look at the state of Germany's real economy you begin to see that it moreso has to do with having achieved the sufficient number of laborers needed to prop up Germany's current economic model (I admittedly am not an expert on Germany's economy so if some smarter comrades itt could help me out on this point it would be greatly appreciated)
Continued and concluded in next post
4) Think for a moment about the argument liberals always make in favor of immigration. How many times have you heard some variant of; "Immigrants come here and do the hard and dirty jobs nobody else will do and also pay into the welfare system!" Basically they are saying that with immigrants doing all the hard work and paying into the system without reaping the benefits due to their status as illegals or in a legal gray zone not only does the Liberal Elite now not have hordes of organized workers who they can't deport at a moments notice if they get angry about having to do hard work without a raise in wages, they can keep up appearances of caring about the working class do to being able to give people their pensions and so on without having to create more jobs for domestic laborers due to said immigrants.
This suggests that the Liberal Elites in the Ruling Class are more concerned with promoting immigration and accompanying it with virtue signalling about blanket acceptance of immigrants no matter how much their culture clashes with that of the domestic population not to erase and replace white people but rather as part of a larger economic process to keep neoliberal globalization trucking without having to actually increase welfare spending and also without (they think) creating the conditions for worker revolt. If the domestic laborers do start to revolt you can deepen divisions easily between the working class by turning immigration into a Culture Wars issue and then when someone like Trump comes along you get to have a big chunk of the working class and middle class calm down because he appears to be fixing a problem that was never a problem and in fact an easy fix for a ruthlessly hypocritical economic system for the Elite
5) Final point: the welfare that many complain immigrants are stealing is largely gone at this point. The most basic programs are left untouched so that what us happening in France right now doesn't become a global movement but much of what even immigrants perceive as being a robust nanny state has been either completely abolished or privatized in the current capitalist era of neoliberal globalization. Read Zizek's piece about this here he articulates it way better than I can
Also watch BadMouse's video about how the rhetoric of the left leaning Anti-Globalization Movement has been evolved by the Right into the creeping threat of "Globalism" I think you'll enjoy it
Sorry this went on so long but you seem to be an open minded and good faith Nazi and I really appreciate you asking for a true Left appeal on these subjects. I wanted to give you something in depth and introduce you to some of the avenues I took to despook myself of some of this shit and I hope that if you don't completely give up your Nazism you at least become NAZBOL GANG
The ruling elite will ally with fascists everytime socialists and communists start getting power.
There can be no reconciliation
EXCEPT THROUGH NAZBOL
N'gha l' juden ngnah something. Nilgh'ri mgep ahmgep NAZBOL!
Hell, in the United States, most of the Republican Party's ethnic outreach to immigrant communities in the Cold War were done heavily through exiled fascists. Like the guy the GOP had doing work for Romanian expats for years was ex-Iron Guard. Same with the Ukrainians and on and on. Most of that generation is now dead or really, really old though so they brought in these guys like Bannon to do their Nazi turd-wrangling but they're not as good at it and they fuck up a lot (Charlottesville, which is why Bannon got sacked).
I mean that's the central problem (for the right wing) with the whole Trump era: they're just not as good at it. Unlike the old guard, the new generation (and Trump is technically part of this new generation) thinks everything they do is "oh this is some sneaky spy shit!" and they get all exited and nervous. Bannon was probably emailing Spencer like some wannabe Baron Harkonnen, "plans within plans," in the hope of generating a violent left-wing compaction cycle which they could crush with the full force of the state. That is typically what the right used to do with GLADIO stay-behind-networks in Europe. But the whole thing went kablooey and now these Zig Forums kids – who couldn't find their own asses if they wanted to – don't know what to do.
The entire alt right-gamergate movement is a Republican party Astroturfed youth outreach program thought up by people like Mitch McConnell. The cucks have been spooked so hard by the culture war that they can be reliably be counted on to vote for Republicans every single time. Theres a great article I cant find rn about how the entire far right conspiratard community like Alex Jones and Coast to Coast Am radio were funded by Texas based Bush linked oil and gas companies
if you honestly think socialism is us just blaming a single group for all our problems then you need to lurk more. we don't blame the capitalists as individuals for being the problem, it's the very system itself that needs to be broken down. the difference between me and you is that instead of looking for an easy answer to the complicated question of "why is society bad" in the form of some jewish boogeyman who is responsible for every bad thing, we marxists recognise the inherent problem in the system itself. the biggest meme is that we "hate rich people" like that's who we specifically blame for capitalism. they are tools of the system and they're bad, but when one capitalist dies another fills its place and continues the cycle. the rich people themselves, jewish or not, aren't going to change the way capitalism operates no matter how much you try and preach.
this is why i want to smash my fucking head against my desk when i see "le marxists don't realise that the 1% are jewish xd" like the jewish capitalists are any different from the white ones. the system stays the same, and pointing fingers at specific groups as if that will fix anything is retarded.
this is why we'll never be allies, because beyond the historical roots of fascism being a tool to preserve capitalism during a period of communist revolutions, the modern fascist, however disconnected he may be with his ideological forefathers, and no matter how much he convinces himself that he is opposed to capitalism, he will never truly be anti-capitalism because his view of "anti-capitalism" is nothing more than racial rhetoric masked in some phony "true socialism" aimed at recruiting workers. Zig Forums is too spooked to ever abandon capitalism because muh volk and think that if we get rid of """jewish finance capitalism""" and replace it with white capitalists that will make a fucking difference. stop trying to play semantics with this whole "i'm anti-capitalist because i wanna kill jewish bankers and consumer culture" yet you never dare actually critique capitalism itself, thinking that you can use some magic wand to get rid of all the "jewish" elements and leave only the good bits i.e. literally the same thing but "serving the nation" which has never fucking happened, because capitalism will always put profit over people.
stop trying to ally with us and hijack our movement just because communists continue to be more successful than fascists and their measly "1000 year reich" have ever been. reminder that nearly 1/3 of the world used to be either red or red-alligned, and communist parties still exist in large numbers, while fascism only exists in fringe groups or coexist with neocon boomer schizos and alt-lite retards.
Here OP read this
The allies knew what the Nazis were doing with the Jews, too.
Thank you for your interest user. I wish that this alliance was possible, but it doesn't really seem to be in the historical context. I hope that you will consider leftism however, since you were pleasantly surprised. Unfortunately many Zig Forumsacks have a false perception about what the left really wants as opposed to liberals (though I think mostly they're strawmanned too).
You have nothing to offer. All the good parts of your meme movement the non interventionism and the social spending is just shit you copy and pasted from us which you aren't even serious about you just took those positions because they are popular cringe free market libertarianism and belligerent chest thumping is not as popular and you know everyone hates it so that just leaves racism and dehumanizing rhetoric which is fundamentally immoral dumb and threatens to plunge the country into civil war and rivers of blood to get your ethnostate which is shit anyway what a sad fake and gay utopia to aspire towards just move to any 99% white neighborhood right now move to Poland or Iceland the Balkans etc most European countries on the eve of WW1 where ethnostates
I always think it's funny seeing these threads where a Zig Forumslack has a moment of self awareness
Bumping to see if our new Nazi friend has any new perspective on things
Look at your hero Donald Trump.
He loves foreign illegal workers and foreign wives. He travels and does business worldwide,not caring about some lines drawn on map we are supposed to be agog about. He is best buddy with Muslim billionaries we are supposed to hate.
Is there anything "patriotic" about him?
Does "patriotism" "race" and "ethnicity" matters to the capitalists? No.
Why should it matter to us?
Capitalists of the world have their disagreements, but they are united against workers. Wouldn't it be good idea for the workers of the world to unite too?
We have no interest in siding with fascists. Your "racial consciousness" is garbage divisiveness of the working class.
If you're interested in learning about left wing economics shoehorned into your garbage though there is national bolshevism.
The individual persons who make up the working class are absolutely divided on the grounds of race, culture, langauge, etc. Just because such differences are not valued by capitalism doesn't mean they don't exist. What is so wrong with striving towards socialism while also wishing to preserve ones race?
Not OP, but also from Zig Forums btw.
What is there to gain by any normal person in the world to divide and opposite himself from others based on race, culture or language?
The divisions are already there. They exist. That two Frenchmen are both working class doesn't mean they have the same height, weight, etc.
So you only hang out with people who have the same weight and height, skincolour, hair colour, local dialect, gender, eyecolour, teethcolour, musclemass, naillength and musictaste as you do? And create an idea of heightism-war with anyone who is 2 cm shorter or taller than you are?