Opinion on the cyberpunk genre

Read Fisher's works, particularly his blog writings on cyberpunk. His main point centers around our "boring dystopia," the difference between Blade Runner and an Apple store

boards.4channel.org/lit/thread/13296223/new-and-improved-burgerpunktm-thread

i feel that this in it self is commentary. it's so late capitalism that there is nothing to do about it but try to survive. the movie/manga "Akira" involves student and workers protest as a simple background plot devise. In fact one of the reasons that 2077 is first person is because cyberpunk fiction is all about immersion, notice how gibson describes the world.
but as much as i love the genre, alot of it does forget to be a comment, leading to more or less just aesthetics (but that's cool too). i believe that cyberpunk can be good anti-capitalist fiction as long as people don't forget that's what it's about. cuck philosophy did a really good video on this idea
youtube.com/watch?v=Nvor7hhDKTs
if you want a good cyberpunk book dealing with changing society, "Do androids dream of electric sheep" is one that involves something like that around the end (or something like that it's been a while). if that doesn't workout it's movie "blade runner" is good too. Also "Ghost in the shell" is very philosophical as well just saying

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2000AD / Judge Dredd was always my favorite cyberpunk in part because of how self-aware schlocky it is

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Too many n I g g ers in it.

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Probably the most commercialized "anti establishment" genre to ever exist. Thousands copies of Blade Runner with the same aesthetics and storylines who now matter how much they try (they don't) can't come up with anything worth of shit. Cyberpunk instead of being an adventurous fiction genre that doesn't shy away from experimentation, is just "Yoooo SkYScRaPeRs and NeON dude". Orginal Deus Ex is peak video game art and I would kidnap and torture a person just to experience it for the first time again.
Should I also finish Neuromancer? I stopped reading it few years ago midway in the book and feel bad about myself.

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I don't hate Neuromancer but it does have alot of padding, if you can't get into it again try the BBC radio version

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Can you combine cyberpunk with my psychosexual pathologies?

twitter.com/CaseyExplosion/status/1138085340735070209?s=19

This isn’t what I asked for, I want robot porn

I would take a blade runner world over some hipster dystopia

We're kind of halfway between Demolition Man and Shadowrun right now.
There's probably more actual leftist cyberpunk out there it's just not the popular stuff.

I was going to post that.
I believe his videos on neoliberalism and tribal music, hauntology and retro future and American psycho are essential supplementary to his cyberpunk video
Neoliberalism
youtube.com/watch?v=_sCRcfYRslg
Retro future
youtube.com/watch?v=gSvUqhZcbVg
American psycho and simulacura
youtube.com/watch?v=RJfurfb5_kw

While I'm aware of the popular xenophobia towards Japan in the 80s I'm gonna say that for most cyberpunk it was probably more like this lame minions image which is more a matter of taking a noticeable trend to a cynical extreme. Least that's always been my take.

I recall Gibson saying that nueromancer wasn't very good because it was his first book and he kind of just threw everything he could into it. Having not read anything else by him I can't say if he got better tho.
Caring about genres is gay as hell btw. These classifications are for bookstores and academics who are far removed from the original creations they're classifying.

Read Pynchon

Why is cuck philosophy so much better than most of left tube, he's what Philosophy Tube should be. I used to enjoy philosophy tube when he was just explaining philosophical comments, but I can't stand his latest videos where it's just him talking about Steve Banon, or brexit or some other issue/figure I couldn't give a fuck about.

Philosophical ideas* it's very late.

Why do artists delusionally believe they can influence politico-economics? They seem to continue to believe they're anything other than ineffectual, despite all of 20th and 21st century proving they are.

I think Olly is practicing set design and presentation through his recent releases. He is an aspiring actor after all.

Cyberpunk to me is a dystopian future that either never had the idea of socialism or completely forgotten/erased about it. Characters or even the writers themselves can't imagine any opposition to capitalism despite thinking it is shit. It is why most resistance is portrayed in 'anarchists'. So far the mention of socialism in any cyberpunk media is Internationale in Invisible Inc.

Ironically I thought that Tomorrowland of all things was antidote to cyberpunk's pessimism and one of few post-cyberpunk media out there

This is why I don't like this resurgence of Cyberpunk. It has become like all thing 80's nostalgia cash grab and geek culture.

This. Or at best there's a kind of social democrat movement but they're shown to be completely powerless, a march or a strike might be shown but it never ends well for the workers. Instead the only resistance comes from underground cells, small cliques who try to take down the power grid or the internet or whatever. Fragmented action instead of mass organization.
I know you can see my flag but I don't consider that a good thing at all.

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Cuck philosophy is a socialist and not a liberal.

Gotchu' covered fam

vastabrupt.com/2018/10/31/gender-acceleration/

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Fisher keeps being so right.

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It's a hold-over from an earlier time when art was a driver of culture.

If you can find a copy of the essay The Two Modes of Cultural History by Shulamith Firestone, she has an interesting take on the issue of art's modern cultural irrelevance.

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the expanse, gits, deus ex, altered carbon are all great works
also cyberpunk is late capitalism, it show us the horror of a world where capitalism won, ofc the protags aren't trying to change it, everyone barely manages to survive the dystopia

Don't forget Snow Crash. It's basically a parody on the world of AnCapistan.

Cyberpunk is slice of life thus inherently conservative, the only reason it's become so dominant in the West is that it's futuristic in its nostalgia, it comes down to that Angel shit Benjamin kept blathering on about I fear.
There are material reasons for its predominance but it's just that such an aesthetic fitted well to the time when technology made 'art' obsolete and really most of what you people feel teriffied about in the face of rapacious technological vore wouldn't be unfamiliar to a German or American in the 20s, cyberpunk is really astounding for its conservatism when you think about it and it's mostly the cultural frosting to Japan gaining a place in the imperial core, more like the Jazz or Rock of the 90s than anything really revolutionary or anything.
I mean the Beinflussungsapparat was written in 1919, and I'd argue the only reason cyberpunk has become so prominent now is that it is the residue of optimistic Americanism and belief in technical progress (see also ML thought).

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Count zero succeeded neuromancer. I didn't care much for it. Pattern recognition was okay though.

what?

Nyx is that you?

Laughs in ARIA

"the future happened yesterday, and you missed it. It was shit anyway"
This sums up most of cyberpunk and really even its supposed malaise is very cheerful and even stolid at points, you could say it sweeps away the malignant dreams the lack of a socialist alternative have led to into a very very pleasant if squeaky dystopia where technological advancement acquires a magical force that makes the contradictions fester and explode instead of cementing the conditions that gave birth to them by first obliterating them and then imposing a version of them in the new order.
It really is extremely conservative and it has been ramped up because it is the ideal superstructure of a society where money considerations manage to stall the implementation of the technology that would make capital superfluous, that's one of the reasons people like Graeber and Cockshott have the following they have, technological adulation is really a massive amount of blue balls over the missed chances of the net and what else, and now the net is dying cyberpunk is its Biedermeier.
Sturgeon's law always applies of course, and most American trash is automatically discarded, but cyberpunk really is the nostalgia of hope, it always had a red paintjob outside America but its cargo cultism makes it almost Imaginist by now, even in the escaping gasses of the dying beast's vowels.
Red Plenty pretty much explains where a strain of cyberpunk came from, there were nerds sitting next to the New Left guys at all those occupied universities. Also all the rust belt hagiographies you got after Trump won, and in the end the fact abandoned factories have become such an ubiquitous fashion symbol is that they failed to become churches, as did cinemas. Comité Invisible still is normative in the way Zola was normative and that's a good thing, too.

And of course slice of life is where the art of the future will come from and should be supported at every chance.

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Nah, just a fan.
I'm not sure if Nyx is on Zig Forums. I know she'll pop up in /lit/ threads on 4chan sometimes, but idk if I've ever seen her here.

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ARIA is anti-bum, idealist as all hell and cringe to the core, it really could be the facebook posts of a fading and very camp theatre producer bitterly renouncing his missed gay loves and I am saying this as someone who loves slice of life and here is a good recommendation.

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Lesbian Nrx is the weirdest thing I've seen and I still don't get it

Yuri incest is applied anti-natalism in its most direct form, really the rest is just linear.

Girls > boys.
More girls, more better.

On an only slightly more serious note, LesbiaNRx is about reducing masculinity (in terms of generic traits often ascribed to masculinity - remember that this is still coming out of traditional feminist literature) wherever it appears.

If you understand what traits they're trying to reduce you have a pretty good understanding of the general philosophy. The rest of it is pretty much like what was saying. From Neo-Amazonian tribes going their own way to cybernetic slime-girl society. Often you'll find LesbianNRx involves melding the feminine with technology in order to replicate each-other without any masculinity/phallic traits being present in the process. The lesbian synthesis of Lilith and Eve, technocapital and nature, paring away what is unnecessary within a runaway cyber-circuit of incestual asynchronous replication towards perfection, finally dragging one and all, willing and unwilling, into the slime-girl singularity.

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Such a phallocentric form of revolutionary defeatism, don't you think comrade? Really, think of its coming coopting, the shedding of masculinity becoming its new assertion with a whole set of hierarchies growing around it, the trap ascendancy was only the beginning and really sexual politics is such a sordid sewer and we've learned nothing and forgotten nothing.

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but what about the manly gays

This.

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Cringe but historically necessary, just like the USSR

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:P

Nyx's work is definitely (Acé)phallocentric, and I'd generally agree that I dislike the whole feminine/masculine trait schema that feminist lit. often rolls out. Interpretation of traits like this is quite subjective.

It's somewhat of a matter of opinion whether one would consider the position defeatist or not, but that's really true of pretty much all accelerationist lit. If Neo-China really is arriving from the future there's little left to do but go along with it - but I think the interesting bit in all this is the analysis of machenic reproduction in relation to humanity. It's crazy to think about how this runaway self-replicating, deterritorializing/reterritorializing turbo-machine of technocapital has, for hundreds of years now, existed along the currents of human civilization - growing stronger and larger, more a part of our existence by the day -, and how, when taken to extreme ends, this machenic process could see a humanity that is exceedingly different from the one we see today.

The feminist lit. of LesbianNRx isn't what people are there for, I don't think. I'd wager it's more for the sci-fi. For the idea of the human as subject in relation to this array of exceptionally powerful global systems. I suspect that most people heavily invested in LesbiaNRx and G/ACC are already trans, because for them they have already, in a sense, destroyed their gender and created essentially a new one with a synthesis of pharmochemicals and adapted cultural camouflage (fashion, mannerisms and whathaveyou). They have already 'ascended' from one gender by eschewing masculine traits, so the fact that they'd bring that into accelerationist theory isn't entirely surprising - it fits quite well there.

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Its ridiculous to think, even as a leftist, that socialism would solve all the problems that the cyberpunk genre present. Changing the CEO for the Party Officer doesnt solve anything at all, in fact China seems to do a much better job in creating a cyberpunk dystopia.

Cyberpunk is about the problems that technology brings, and tech is above politics.

you should probably be deeply skeptical of such comedic images of men in the post-ironic sexual liberalism consciousness of today tbh. They curtail the strengthening of essentialism and repression of the sexual while implying their death.

All 21st century gender experiments fail by ignoring, purposefully or otherwise, what gender actually is and depends on. It's not something left to the individual, and it doesn't really rely on it.

Well the ghost of OGAS will turn the desertifying backwaters of Neo-China into a luxuriant peony garden so there is no need to worry about such trifles as the future, and Land's thought has been misconstrued by the fact that most Nrx fellas are mostly of an IT/CS background and speak only one language fluently, usually English. It really is idpol of the knowledge economy, if you think about it, and it's only natural for a lesbian reductionist (and what is the knobchopping but a progressive reduction?) viewpoint to simply arise, but without Land's grounding in Continental bibliography you're lost in the face of gender, because of course a cloud is a girl and a car a guy, and it switches when you cross the Rhine. So really gender nonconformism has such an enormous history and we're all bored by it, I suppose.
About the machinic part, printed books were the real horror, the madness they fed people in the 1500s really makes you wonder if the current ecocide is just revenge against the trees whose corpses made humans decide capitalism was a good idea, and the famous "sie wissen das nicht, aber sie tun es" puts rest to any revelatory character people ascribe to our current forms of the fear machine or how we call it, it's just the manifestation of an exponential function and if people cared about microbiology as much as they cared about algorithms we wouldn't be so scared of progress.
Because a suitable form of Kleineferter will be reverse engineered and installed soon, through junk food and radiation and whatever it takes, and in the pink depths of late communism all the little boys will be able to become their own Chihiro, and really the cappies don't understand that their failed "culture" counterrevolution on sexual idpol stepped on a landmine because Malraux and Dworkin were right about most things and Man, that the disposable, manic transvestite genetic freak with retard strength, a deep horror of the flesh and the stroke of genius forced on him by the psychosocial portrait of evolutionary pressure, that piece of shit will become the force that will abolish gender in communist society. And I'm a cis male myself but I was in love with a girl who liked Topology once.

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What is gender actually, and what does it rely on?

cyberpunk represents a false future, one dreamt up by the cold war about a resurgent japan, ignorant of the geopolitics of today.

because of this, it becomes a harmless entity to be profitted off, since as a future it will not come true, the future that will take the place of cyberpunk will be much more different, thus masked from us

i kind of want to write a story about it in greentext, and i think i'll do that in due time.

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It's a bug made by life(replicating amino acids) to bootstrap its reproduction, it is the superstructure of the base and a trace or birthmark of you will of biomass accumulation and it gets into eroguro stuff if you read embryology.

It has caused people problems in the past though.

Is there a difference between biological sex and gender?

for the majority no

Of course there are intersex people and all sorts of syndromes or other cases, but mostly gender is feels.

Mad Max wastelands are way more anti-capitalist to me than cyberpunk, Every liberal I know misses the point when it comes to cyberpunk, because of "hey, at least we'll have cool metal arms". They've admitted to me before that if they could live in a dystopia, they would choose cyberpunk because if society did become that fascist, there would also be a backlash from cool hacker activist, and they would be one of them. It's like they think they will get a chance to be Adam Jensen some day. I also disagree with the assumption that capitalism will even reach that stage of technology. Nobody wants to admit that it's a very real possibility we won't get cool metal arms due to global warming and world war. I think it's much more displeasing to imagine we may only be left with a desert where a mutated capitalist grug and his toadies have a monopoly on water.

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For the majority? But what if the majority changes? Between tanking sperm counts, the lack of requirement for human physical labour (the stereotypical men's jobs), the massive amounts of estrogen in most mens bodies thanks to the ubiquitous nature of plastic in the 21c, that majority could actually decline precipitously.
Plus if this already isn't the case for some minority of the human population, then it is already happening in nature. Perhaps at an accelerating pace?

Technology is doing some pretty incredible stuff to the human subject. Assuming stasis of said subject is likely a fool's errand at this point.

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You know what the worst part of these posts is? The fact you could phrase all of this in mundane easy to understand language for your presumed audience, yet you choose to write like a caricature of a humanities academic.

It's just transGerman humour you shitlord

Somebody's never read Anti-Oedipus.

Seriously though, writing into the aether is hard. On the one hand, you could write it for normies in normie-speak, but does the normie browse leftypol looking for a new take on gender? Would they care if they even saw what you were saying?

Using occulty reference-driven language isn't necessary, but it's a matter of presentation to a wide and diverse audience. People who know the references you're dropping will be more likely to tune in and engage, and that's really the target audience I think. Someone coming in having never read Deleuze or Land or Bataille or Nietzsche might pick them up somewhere to start if they want to engage with the topic - but if they don't want to engage with the topic to begin with why would you write it for them?

Did it ever occur to you that I AM a caricature of a humanities academic?

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Already working on a couple for a while now.

Uhh 1984. Farenheit 451. Brave New World he was trying to go against the system but cucks out or just retreats? Dunno didn't finish ot because it was boring and his writing style sucks. Logan's run he becomes a revolutionary to take down the system. Zardoz he helps the proles sneak in to bougie paradise and they kill all the bourgeoise. Blade Runner he subverts the system as mucj as we are shown by saving a robot instead of killing it but then he flees but what could he really do anyways? Workplace shooting at police HQ? It was more of a film noir set in dystopic story anyways. Hunger Games they take down the system right. Matrix they take down the system. Minority Report he takes down the aspect of dystopianism we are shown in the film. Mad Max same. Boy and his Dog same.

I literally can't name one example of the trope you are describing.

They just end up living in their own virtual world where they get to be the epic revolutionaries

armies still need labour, and much of what you said inherently applies more to the developed world

Technology does great things, but the average person does not have the same access as the state, it will be, and already is, deciding the future for us

Do not mistake FOSS for everything, for I assure you there is no FOSS program that can save you from a predator's missile

More than that, Deckard, a replicant, was able to conceive a child with Rachael, another replicant. Machine-on-machine biogenesis. Making humans obsolete in a single machenic act. They subverted the system of life itself.

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Not all of those examples are considered cyberpunk. And also neuromancer, snow crash, when gravity fails. All about characters just barely scraping by to live another day

I think of namedropping as an attached file to be honest, and Anatole France was not only a famous advocate of plagiarism but also had quite some thousands of books in his library, many of them unread but it's easy to see even in your beloved communists that libraries are a tempivorous egregore of the revolutionary bureaucrat and namedropping random German shitters like a broken machinegun was Hegel's way of getting people to read, and that was his way of making Prussia stay in the future through counterEnlightenment singularity of the Knowledge, and the Wissen is Werden because that's the reason Germany kept the Heavens and left Matter to the West, and basically Communism is a Meister Eckhart psyop, Luther was a papist plant without knowing it and Feuerbach was the best Christian in history.
Such things unfold in all directions and all possible literatures, thus and with all the proliferation of data combined with the death of the author and his property does the subject inform itself and post-Marxist communism arise as an historical force, propagated by precisely the literate precariat all the caricatures and normie wars serve to infantilise.
And basically people should read if not austrian incest stuff, at least those gommie things because people in 1970 had big ideas too and internationalism was a thing as well, so even if cyberpunk is weaboo eurocommunism I still like it.
And eurothemed cyberpunk is about to get a giant boost soon I fear, so if any murrigan who can write wants to commodify angst for the lefties move to one of the smaller cities, but most of all Britain is such a goldmine, early Self and Ballard are great, no matter what anyone says.

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This is pretty different to the comment I was replying to, which was more to do with his inability to differentiate gender from sex characteristics in humans and how those characteristics are already changing - but we'll roll with it.

This is less and less the case. The armies with large numbers of troops are not necessarily the most fearsome forces in the modern era. This is the mitigating effect of technology. The list below is sorted by active military units.

1 China 2,183,000
2 India 1,395,100
3 United States 1,347,300
4 North Korea 1,190,000

This much is obviously true, though it almost stands to refute your original point. What you are saying here is that the masses don't have ready access to power or nearly the capability of insular power-groups (states, kingdoms, etc.) and that these groups have inordinately more control over the future than the masses. Isn't that right?

This also seems to be the point I was making. Massive power, to the point where it changes world ecology are happening outside of the control of the mass-populace.

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Thats not what they said. I havn't seen matrix 3 since the theatre but from my recollection when Neo, The Oracle, and The Architect had there little conversation at the very end they agreed they would basically let everyone who was still plugged in to the mayrix become aware of their situation and give them the option to live in the biofarm/virtual recreation of the past or the fucked up present reality of Earth.

I will only concede on Mad Max maybe. All the other ones are firmly cyber punk because they are in tge future with technology more advanced then our own.

Fuck your Blade Runner sequel. It was gay! GAY! I'm not even some uber Blade Runner fan but boy did they fuck the story up. They fucked it up in the first five seconds with that opening text explaining what happened between tge original and the sequel.

So are you agreeing or disagreeing? Because that still doesn't fit with what OP was saying about "rising in the ranks"

I thought of one that halfway fits your op halfway doesn't. Ready Player One the MC and co. Take down the evil company and free all the gamers from debt slavery, but then they just become enlightened capitalists who own the virtual world. So kinda "rising the ranks" of the fucked up society.

Dude wtf are you talking about? Deckard was always a replicant - the director's cut made that clear and obvious back in 1992.

You just weren't paying attention to the movie - didn't see what was really going on.

Too slow to see the future right in front of your eyes. Blinded, just like Tyrell. More human than human indeed.

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bro or broette or bronegate, if you keep that up I promise you'll have earned a philosophy degree within two years.

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It's been explicitly confirmed that the whole the idea of Deckard being a replicant came from Ridley misinterpreting the writers.

Are they really ? consider that cyberpunk is about hyper-individualistic techno-self-modification in a chaotic environment, where laws, or order in general have been subverted by technology. If you listen to Chinese official noises they are building a data optimized society, i would consider this to lead to a different future then what was depicted in cyberpunk.

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I'm sorry, I thought we were talking about Blade Runner here, not Philip K. Suck My Dick.

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I don't think nations will simply roll with ignoring gender, if you haven't seen the air of reaction in many parts of the world

The US military iirc is now facing a shortfall of fit soldiers for example.

These groups that have power are not some internationally aligned bunch of trans supervillains like pol would like, but rather again, players in the great game that spans across the world, with Russia and China vs France, Britain and the USA.

Just because dude who was hunting him left a unicorn and deckard had a unicorn dream that proves he accessed deckards mind? Why were the police using a replicant on earth? They all knew the whole time except Deckard?

But fuck all that thays only a minor detail they fucked up. The robo jesus baby that you mentioned. Whatever bullshit that was in the opening text that fucked the original story right up. Chernobyl Vegas. Floating Meditation stone jesus robo master. It was gay top to bottom. Harrison Ford should retired decades ago. All he does now is shit on his mpst xlassic roles with half assed geriatric "where are they now?" Style sequels.

I don't even see how the directors cut makes the case for it.

The fundamental problem with it is that cyberpunk emerged from a time when Japan was poised to be the next thing, but Japan was an ally of America, so this was viewed with an eventual merger (Weyland yutani)

China is a far different and independent actor in comparison to japan, and even lands works do not apply these days as the Chinese liberals/free marketeers lose ground to the maoist old guard/nationalists as the Chinese public perceives America blocking their progress as a world superpower

I presumed the posts were a satirical poke at the nature of being human via algorithmic text generation.

Also from my recollection from the first one replicants were clearly advanced androids, them the sequel says: "no scratch that, they are just gene edited slave humans."

That writing style is both inefficient and only leads to your ideas becoming calling card of a weak an insular in-group that will never have influence.

And don't give me crap about that kind of philosophizing having some spooky inherent value detached from wider society. If someone philosophizes about politics, culture, and economics without the intent or ability to create practical influence then your ideas and those that subscribe to them are worthless.

I'm not talking about Philip K. Dick, I'm talking about the scriptwriters for the Blade Runner who were misinterpreted by Ridley.

You guys are out of the loop.

youtube.com/watch?v=OBbJYAtdNMU

Watch this - it's less than 5 min's and outlines Deckard's replicant characteristics, along with a pretty damning quote for you from Ridley himself.

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if you keep that up I promise you'll have earned a philosophy degree within two years.

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Fuck those gay youtube movie theory videos. Are you going to pull that why not pull the one about how jar jar is really the suoreme sith lord behind palpatine?

If you want to post the points i will debate them but right away from what you posted how can that not be explained by the "you hunt killers for so long you start thinking like a killer" trope?

I can totally see some U.S. senator saying this exact bit about Marx. Hell this is only slightly more lucid that a Trump tweet.

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And here I figured telling you to just read LA 2019: Demopathy and Xenogenesis, Some Realist Notes on Bladerunner and the Postmodern Condition by Iain Hamilton Grant would be too much of a stretch.

Thanks for your interest, even if it's malicious the glowering curtain of unknowing we write against makes it feel like love, because of the flesheating organs. I'm precariat myself but I don't think a philosophy degree is such an insult so good luck with what you do too.

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Seriously though, if you want to engage with the subject regarding a movie that you probably haven't watched in the last, what, ten years? A visual 5min youtube vid that plays quotes from the director is probably the best status-update you can hope to get without having to do much more looking.

But don't worry, sweetie, I'll pull up wikipedia for you.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rick_Deckard#Deckard:_human_or_replicant?

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Type my nigga type. I'm just posting on here to kill time but not THAT much time. Also I'm phoneposting and I have no headphones. I'm just unimpressed with and unterested in the deckard is a replicant theory. Like said that wasn't my main gripe with the sequel.

What the hell is this? Some diesertation on blade runner?

Pic related.

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This is the only kind of cyberpunk I want

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Much love - I was being more beneficent than malicious but I was being both. I have a philosophy degree and am also precariat. This is what I'm doing with my weekends.

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Who gives a fuck what ridley said. Dude was given a script and he filmed it without rewriting his theory into the actual plot of the movie. Directors always love ambiguous chose your own interpretation movies and so do art house faggots and matter of fact thats the one of the aspects of the original i like the least.

Also seriously, the dude who drew the flying cars says he is a replicant, therefore he is?