America almost went to war over a couple blown up oil tankers and a drone Iran shot down today. Discuss
Iran War pushed back...for now
Levi Green
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Brody Jones
Was pol not supporting the invasion. Did trump get influenced by them? I don't really know why he did what he did.
Carson Cooper
Don't be a dupe. This is part of the usual provocation playbook.
Daniel Mitchell
Remember that NYT is a regime mouthpiece for whatever regime is in power. Point being to try to bait Iran through sucker moves like this. Iran wouldn't have survived as long as it has without being aware of all these tricks.
Connor Cooper
The Trump admin sent a drone into what Iran says was its sovereign airspace. The US knew Iran would shoot it down in self-defense—but the US gov also knew the corporate media would obediently portray this as Iranian "escalation," helping justify Trump's aggression
The Trump admin's strategy toward Iran is blatantly aggressive and illegal provocation — but the corporate media is dutifully going along with this, helping to whitewash US aggression, portray Iran as the aggressor, and sell a new war.
The corporate media is a handmaiden to war.
Case study in propaganda: NBC's Today show obediently regurgitates the US military's narrative, with no skepticism.
Iran says the US drone was in its airspace; US military says otherwise. Whose claims make the headline? US of course.
This is state media.
today.com
This is 100% war propaganda. This has no journalistic value at all.
NBC's Today interviewed Condoleezza Rice — an architect of the Iraq War! — who blamed everything on Iran, claiming "the Iranians are the troublemakers."
Then this report ends goading Trump to wage war!
The corporate media is inviting the same war criminals who lied to justify the illegal war on Iraq to peddle more lies to justify an illegal war on Iran!
CNBC also did a softball interview with Iraq War architect Condoleezza Rice, who just demonized Iran
cnbc.com
In a sane world, a journalist would be fired for doing a softball interview with Condoleezza Rice on Iran and not once mentioning that she is a war criminal who helped orchestrate the Iraq War, which killed 1 MILLION Iraqis.
But in the US corporate media, you are rewarded.
Austin Davis
Laura Ingram of all people talked about that.
Leo Bennett
He did this with Venezuela as well. Trump is going to end up less bellicose than Obama or Bush due to sheer laziness. Thank God Hillary didn't win.
Carter Nguyen
Every report on the US/Iran struggle should start with:
“In the latest predictable consequence of President Trump’s unilateral unprovoked blowup of the international agreement to control Iran’s nuclear development and decision to fill his defense cabinet with war criminals from the Iraq war…”
I hope all these MAGApedes realize if they get drafted into an Iranian war they will be dodging bullets solely for the benefit of Israelis, Saudis and Oil Executives. When they get home missing a limb or two or three they will be rewarded with lip service of their heroics and nothing else. Hell by the time they get back wages will probably be lower, and the middle class thoroughly destroyed. Seriously, fuck the MAGA cult. Trump’s followers are a cult of sadistic bootlickers and violently fundamental joel olsteen fans. They’re stupid and cultish enough that if Trump claimed that 3/4ths of the world was covered in Mountain Dew made from Jesus tears they would believe it. Those fuckers will fall for any ridiculous Gulf of Tonkin tier false flag he gives them.
Jason Scott
No I mean like Laura Ingram on Fox News said that the same people who were pushing for Iraq were pushing for this.
Support Fox News.
David Phillips
Defense contractors are salivating already.
Landon Bailey
What if I told you that criticizing Israel, Saudi Arabia and oil executives wasn’t antisemitic, islamophobic or racist against white male Texans? Israel is shitty fascist country run by a corrupt genocidal demagogue… So is Saudi Arabia… For that matter take away country and replace it with corporation and so is BP (British Petroleum).
Evan Torres
Bad post
Jack Walker
The drone was 322 million dollar war hero. The Republican flag humpers are crying now.
Dude no. You gotta lay off that one or the other thinking. They are all enemies of the working class.. Anyone seeking power is your potential enemy. Whoever will get you killed in a war or sit idly in power while your social and material conditions deteriorate is your enemy. Some are more dangerous than others.
Jayden Bennett
I love how you brainlets still repeat the same joke and think that democrats=communists.
Fuck off to Zig Forums, retard.
Nicholas Taylor
I bet the Iranians can make that same drone for 500 bucks. You know damn well Raytheon charges 500 dollars per screw, and 5 million for an ARM micro controller that costs 2 dollars to manufacture. It’s pretty clear who will benefit from a war with Iran, and who won’t.
Brody Torres
I guarantee Tulsi and Bernie will let down anyone who hopes they would enact social and economic reforms. You would have better luck getting Nancy Pelosi to destroy capitalism than you would getting Tusli or Bernie to accomplish anything worthwhile in America’s current system. A ballot box is not enough to make any social progress. You need organization, unions, protests, strikes and landslide support for dramatic electoral reform to make even an inch of progress against the entrenched powers.
Ethan Collins
What the fuck? Do you legitimately believe Trump gets his military advice from a mongolian throat singing forum?
Aiden Long
sauce on pic?
Lincoln Williams
Why the fuck not? This is clown word.
Asher Watson
probably a howard zinn book
Dylan Williams
You have schizophrenia
Matthew Morales
comic of two jews talking to each other
Adam Cooper
truth.
It is inflated to at least 100 times the cost.
Jacob Cook
tranny whitey puppets are obvious
like bots, always the same rhetoric.
Christopher Price
nah, this is just a technique to try and play the US as the "good guys" so that in a few days/weeks after another tanker gets hit or US base get attacked with some rockets they can go
They're just gearing up the public for war with Iran
Joseph Roberts
Fox has gotten better in some ways, but all MSM is equally bad.
CNN = Fox News = NYTimes = Breitbart = DemocracyNow = MSNBC = The Intercept = ABC News = RT = The Atlantic
They all say something good once in awhile… Some more than others. They all push dangerous corporate takes quite a bit. The fact is.. We cannot trust any MSM or semi-popular publication. They all have a long history of pushing outrage, and patting politicians who look into it on the back even though every last politician has only looked superficially into the scandal-ridden corrupt lion’s den that is global political leadership. The pattern is clear:
1st) Government leaders do something corrupt, illegal, genocidal or vile.
2nd) Print their lies.
3rd) When the lies are discovered print the outrage
4th) Print support for an investigation
5th) Print support for the investigators
6th) Watch the investigators indict no one of importance, and only uncover half of the truth. Feel disappointed as many threads are left uninvestigated, and matters are left wide open or unprosecuted. Nothing changes, and no reforms are made. The investigator then moves on to advertising his “exciting” policy ideas.
7th) Print support for the investigators “exciting” policy ideas.
8th) Repeat
It took me some time to accept this fact. There us no hope to be garnered from MSM journalism improving itself. Our only hope is the singularity, and future AI overlords.
Ayden Moore
Yes, Howard Zinn. A People’s History of the American Empire.
Julian Carter
You have way too much faith in the US government. Maybe not Trump himself is on Zig Forums but some kind of aide that is just a brainlet magapede.
Owen Cooper
They're still preparing people for war. Trump "backing down" shows that he's "restrained" in the face of "Iranian escalation", or that he's "weak" (in the case of neocons and #resistance retards). Then when another tanker attack or whatever happens in the coming weeks, Trump won't want/be able to back down again and war will be treated as an unavoidable necessity.
Eli Mitchell
Right now Trump is on Twitter repeating practically verbatim a plot line from the "West Wing" where he overcomes a moral dilemma when the general tells him how many would die if launched the bombers, and liberals are going "hruhh!?" They are so easily fooled.
Jason Roberts
So, knowing war with Iran is inevitable…
Can this escalate?
I mean, I heard that China has it's plans with Iran to make the new silk road, and almost all of the oil that Asia uses comes from the ME, so…
What's gonna happen after?
Chase Johnson
So what actually caused Trump to call off the airstrikes? It obviously wasn't because he cared about the lives of those 150 people.
Luke Morris
The days of the Empire are over it seems
Charles Thomas
I think it's a possibility. Not sure if it would be all-out nuclear war, but Iran occupies a strategically critical area. If a full-blown war were to break out between Iran and the US, it would have global repercussions and I could imagine other powers like China and Russia getting involved in some way. But I can't say for certain how any of this will play out.
Justin Barnes
I think he either he hoped he could pull with Iran what he pulled with DPRK (i.e. threaten them to the bargaining table) and backed down when he realized they were serious about retaliating, or he's trying to make himself look restrained so as to justify "necessary" US strikes when the next incident happens.
Ryan Hernandez
It's just part of the larger provocation strategy. The way it works is by riding right up to the line and hoping Iran miscalculates / overreacts which the WH can then use to roll over domestic and European opposition. Basically the *poke poke* "I'm not touching you" *poke poke* method where you keep doing it over and over again in different ways and hope Iran punches back.
I very much doubt there was ever any real plans to do anything. But there are a bunch of lazy stories they can plant in the press like Trump giving the West Wing speech about proportionality or that Tucker Carlson phoned him up at the last minute or whatever which liberals believe is a thing that actually happens
Gavin Robinson
Sigh, does anyone even bother reading the Clinton emails?
It was a distraction
Israel annexed the Golan Heights and moved the embassy to Jerusalem, both against UN resolutions, like that matters…
The plan worked perfectly, Trump has been faithful to Bibi.
Isaiah Rogers
Also for a historical example of this is the Six-Day War. The Israelis were looking for war and preceded it with weeks of minor air skirmishes over the Golan, most of which (80 percent) they instigated. Egyptian Field Marshal Abdel Hakim Amer then lost his nerve and redeployed some forces in early June, anticipating an Israeli attack, and the IAF immediately swooped down like an eagle and burned his air force on the ground claiming that they had to pre-empt an Egyptian invasion. The redeployment also had the effect of moving his defensive units in the Sinai out of position, so they were caught out on the roads and annihalated. The war lost as soon as it started and Amer – the poor bastard – would go on to shoot himself in the head. The Iranians are well aware of how this works.
Adam Murphy
there is no way that the meme drone is worth 200 million dollars. It easily got dropped by what looks like some soviet made meme rocket just now a Russian SU-3o costs them 30 million dollars to mnake this is fucking why America is meme empire and is finna bouttta get dabbed on
Jaxson Miller
Exactly.
Also the Sinai land grabs during the Suez Crisis whilst everyone was focused on Britain and Egypt.
It's the standard greater Israel M.O.
Evan Morgan
The idea that Trump is a "madman" who must be "talked down" at the last minute is exactly what the WH wants people to believe. Liberals can fret and moan about it, but that perception of instability is useful. Then you also have guys like Tucker Carlson who is useful here as well because he's an "anti-war" voice who happens to be fully-integrated into the regime's agenda, and a convenient person for the WH to tell the press is "whispering in the president's ear." The Daily Beast, which is a tabloid rag that can fall for all kinds of planted stories like this, had a piece two days ago referencing a "source familiar with the conversations." Useful idiots like Michael Tracey and other rubes amplify this message.
The people who are actually running the show are these guys like Mike Pompeo and John Bolton who have read a bunch of Tom Clancy novels, and are kinda the B-team hand-me-downs from past Republican administrations, so they're trying all the same tricks but just not as good at it. Amerikan libs fall for it, because they're idiots, but the Iranians are smarter and understand the U.$.A. to be a predator.
Hudson Robinson
When driving, never look at the road just ahead of you. You want a clear sight of all potential hazards, and thus it is best to look forward. Sometimes, one must look to his rear to see what is coming to surprise him.
Just as it is with driving, so as it is with history and the future.
Colton Edwards
Finally, the WH does have contempt for the press, and the bourgeois press deserves your contempt, but the WH's contempt comes from the fact that they know the media will print whatever bullshit they give them because they just care about getting scoops and thus ratings. The press are willing dupes so why should the WH have any respect for them? Trump can get up on stage at rallies with this phony-baloney spiel about the media "looking down on real America" or whatever by printing these bullshit stories but it's all part of the game.
Grayson Gomez
How do I get a job writing for wired. Took me a minute to do better research. The source they listed is a GAO report from 2012. Also that per unit procurrment cost includes RnD. So it wouldn't have cost 220 million to replace in 2012 either.
John Foster
S C A R E D
John White
Tankies stand supreme.
Christian Thomas
The POTUS is the Commander-in-Chief of the US Armed Forces. They will have to replace Trump for war to happen.
Nathaniel Harris
Trump routinely dumps his responsibilities off on other staffers, refuses to read debriefings unless they're a list of bullet points, and by all appearances has the literacy of a middle schooler. Trump had the house and senate with the ability to do whatever he wanted with Obamacare, infrastructure, or even his wall. What did he do? Deferred that legislation to Paul Ryan and wasted his majority. He did the same with Venezuela and let Pompeo and Bolton run wild with the most retardedly engineered coup attempt that left Trump saying "Wow, that Maduro sue is one tough cookie" and then shuffled his senile sundowner ass to Mar-a-Lago to play a round of golf.
So if you're asking why we should believe that Trump had no idea what this military strike entailed until 10 minutes before it was a go, it's because his Security officials know there's no point trying to wrangle an obstinate toddler, and to a degree even relish the freedom that Trump's apathy gives them.
Carson Evans
How can one man be so based?
Christopher Rodriguez
The Yemeni are literally killing Saudis with East German rockets.
Caleb Lewis
in their own fucking bases
Carter Reed
wahhabist hoes mad
William Mitchell
It's now "only" 110 million? That's still ridiculously expensive for what it is, especially for getting shot down by some piece of shit from the 70s.
Zachary James
Bringing these two back. Relevant.
Jonathan Lewis
LOL, probably this.
Kayden Cook
They wanted the drone to get shot down.
Austin Taylor
Yeah still ludicrously exspensive. Even 10 million would be for a plane that's bought to patrol the other side of the planet from your country.
Wired still has laughably bad journslism.
Hudson Phillips
Why should it be surprising to anyone when the last trump/dod story rhat came out just a few days ago was the nyt breaking that the cia was hacking russia's power grid and keeping it secret from trump deliberately?
Carter Jenkins
Holy shit Drumpf is such a cuck I hope the CIA coup's his dumb ass.
Anthony Perez
I think even house democrats are being instructed to keep Trump around as long as possible. They want him having another 4 years. Trump is good at pwning liberal constituents, but is an absolute windfall of providence for Dem donors and the military industrial complex. Obviously the IC has found an approach to deal with him. The only people getting cucked are liberals, Trump and some of Trump’s supporters. Neoconservatives and neoliberal establishments never had a better candidate more willing to be a lightning rod for forcing unpopular policy actions with executive actions and strong arming (think his actions on Jerome Powell at the Fed or on conservative media and politicians for strong arming multinational shareholders large fortunes). Sure the IC has to take a beating on Twitter, and Dems need to let in one or two progressives who will criticize them… But they can take the beating. It’s not like the IC has ever been expressly popular or as if Dems will open up a floodgate of reformists. Hell you can’t even get DCCC funding to challenge incumbent Dems in primaries anymore. The Boltons and Mitch McConnells can do their damndest to start a costly bloodbath in Iran, and let Trump pay the political costs. Trump has just enough rock star cred amongst his base to weather it. Mainstream journalists will keep getting their corporate bux, and establishment politicians will keep getting their AIPAC shekels, Saudi contracts and multinational shares. It’s a perfect marriage. No one important wants s coup or impeachment. Mike Pence doesn’t have Trump’s appeal or mindset, and a coup would have to make moderate reforms to legitimize itself.
Hunter Green
Mason Hernandez
Imagine my shock.
Jonathan Russell
Can't we just start this stupid war and have the US Navy sunk already?
Ryder Cooper
ffs no war?
Ayden Diaz
war is likely
the Iranians can't tolerate the sanctions and will increase the pressure on oil prices though deniable actions in order to pressure the US which can't tolerate an increase in oil prices too high without crashing the economy
the Americans have the choice of either lifting sanctions or going to war. The US won't lift sanctions given the choice
Nolan Mitchell
Well we are already at war with them. If you mean full on invasion like iraq, and afghanistan? I say unlikely unless the usa to can get some kind of rebel force going in iran. Iraq and afghanistan are kind of one off wars in modern us history because of 9-11. Libya, syria, vietnam, korea, the usa always uses the preyext of only being there to support "the good guys" against "the evil dictator." Maybe iran will start gassing kurds all of a sudden like assad and saddam but even that didn't work in syria.
Adrian Torres
the US has become so weak they can't even manage to coup venezuela, what makes you think they can take on iran ?
Chase Edwards
Reminder that Iran is a state sponsor of international terrorism and a belligerantly hostile foreign power. Leftist tend to fall into this retarded Noam Chomsky trap which pretty much renders them formless fifth columns to be used by anyone who needs to use them for public image purposes. Anyone can spout out some half backed conspiracy theory as long as they hit all the major marks (use the words ike "CIA" or "neocon" a bunch) and simply ignore the other side completely.
Irans revoutionary guard was very justifiably labelled as a terrorist group for its repeated support for terrorism around the world for going on 20+ years now. They are also supporters of the Taliban as well.
Dylan Reed
Isn't the US also a sponsor of international terrorism and supported the Taliban as well?
Hunter Watson
No they arent. You are again working from this retarded Noam Chomsky take on the world (I dont know a better word for it) and a horrible ignorance on recent world history. Do you believe the US supported the Taliban in Afghanistan to combat the soviets in the 1980s? Because thats a common misconception people make all the time. The Taliban wasnt formed until the early 90s and if anything, they were Pakistans puppet to be used to control the Afghan region in the resulting civil war after the soviets pulled out to counter any claims by rivals India or China. China was also heavily involved in the Soviet-Afghan war and this is often overlooked.
But in recent years, Iran has supported the Taliban.
thedailybeast.com
worldview.stratfor.com
thetimes.co.uk
theguardian.com
Carter Cook
FBI Special Agent Michael J. Rod or a colleague of his?
Elijah Sanchez
Ah of course, my mistake, they supported Al-Qaeda and the mujaheddin in the 1980s.
It's pretty much the same as the US supporting numerous FSA factions and other groups in Syria but their weapons still ending up in the hands of ISIS.
Ryan King
It is a misconception that the US "funded the Taliban" but the fact is it armed and trained reactionary jihadist forces to fight communists.
Let me guess, you support the FSA too? Are the FSA real leftists that have merely been smeared by Putin propaganda?
Fuck off, fed
Julian Clark
No, this is once again your ignorance of history revealing itself.
You are assuming "mujaheddin" is a group, and not a general term for any sort of rebel group. Also, you are completely ignorant to OBL, his ideology, and his reason for being there.
First off, bin Laden wasnt that big of a deal back in the 80s. This is sort of like thinking Hitler was a big key figure in World War 1 since he is an important historical figure who took part in that event, although his importance wouldnt come until later on. Plus his role in the Soviet-Afghan war wasnt really that big. He mostly used his dads construction equipment to build bunkers and shelters and also some islamic schools in the area.
Also, bin Laden was a millionaire. He didnt need money or US support. And that was his whole ideology. He didnt like the fact that these rebels were taking support from the US or any western power because he saw them as their slaves. Thats why he and Azzam formed Al-Qaeda, to act as a purely islamist funded group for the sake of Islam. Theres also the fact that the US support for anti communist fighters was limited soley to local Afghan forces, so a foreign arab like bin Laden couldnt get it even if he wanted to. Again, the key part to why he formed Al-Qaeda was for it to be a group of islamic fighters completely free to pursue islamist goals.
no, see my post.
The thing is that there actually was a piece of shit who the US actually did support, Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. But he isnt as famous as the Taliban or bin Laden so no one ever talks about him since he wont make as big of an impact in your Chomsiest lies. Btw, why do you guys think Al-Qaeda assassinated Ahmad Massoud the day before 9/11?
Also, try articulating an actual point instead of falling back on boogeyman name calling.
William King
They were trying to bait the Iranians into doing something srupid, like shooting at US ships.
Nolan Butler
all middle east petro states support some terrorism (mostly just war/proxy wars for their interest), and US support a lot of terrorists as well, they're the ones that started with the talibans.
Hezbolla and revolutionnary guard are closer to a people army than to terrorist
I guess FBI does browse 4chan
Cameron Murphy
you'd have a lot more credibility linking to something else than US printed toilet papers to counter a renowned scholar
Landon Nguyen
That's just another reason to support them.
Andrew Phillips
This.
Easton Nguyen
if you're talking about Zig Forums, I got news mate, Zig Forums oldfags are anti-war in genereal, wich is why Ron Paul was so big back in the day over there, as he was the only non-neocon candidate.
tfw voting for trump to ACCELERATE didn't work because he went full de/acc
Jeremiah James
FBI poster, you're not fooling anyone. The USA is currently funding terrorists in Iraq and Syria and around the globe.
Jason Ortiz
The US state not only sponsors terrorists around the world, including al-Qaeda right now, it also perpetrate terror directly.
Asher Sanders
I know you're just a retard, baiting, or a literal FBI troll, but come on.
Juan Collins
Can we stop scrubbing posts when people are banned please hotpocketeers?
Nolan Garcia
when it's literal FBI posters like the guy who got scrubbed ITT, of course they will ban evade. so to waste their efforts, their posts have to be scrubbed.
Ethan Flores
That's a massive slippery slope towards creating a censorious torture chamber. I wish you could understand that.
Chase Rodriguez
[citation needed]
Do you actually know what you're saying? You sound like Fox News or some hard-line right wing Israeli/Neo-Con.
Iran hasn't attacked anyone in like 200 odd years. The US has been at war for something like 222 years, 93% of it's existence since 1776. Remember the leader of Iran before the CIA had him replaced with a dictator, something they admitted in 2013.
You probably already know this and wont be swayed by the truth, sliding the thread into 911 shenanigans was disingenuous.
It's pretty clear to everyone who the hostile power was and still is.
Logan Hill
Fuck the feds. If I wanted to read that shit I would go on twitter or reddit.
Also another reason is the bait/troll posts always get the most replies and distract from the posters actually making intelligent points.
Jacob Price
there will never be a war with Iran, its just something liberals use to fear monger over since the Bush Admin.
James Foster
What kind of person would come here, to 8ch, to Zig Forums, to argue that "Iran sponsors terrorism" and that they are the evil scary bad guys? It's a CNN-tier take. Only Feds come here with that kind of garbage, just like they posted in that Zig Forums thread trying to convince everyone that Russia was behind the Tarrant shooting (when it's really the CIA, Ukraine fascists, and Mossad).
That poster would be banned regardless of whether they're a Fed, but let's face it. They were a Fed.
Yes, that too.
Camden Martin
I still enjoy reading their retarded takes though. Personally I would just put big red fuck you fed text under their post rather than delete them. Similar to how somethingawful used to have banned/probation avatars back in the day.
Landon Miller
Thanks comrade
Jace Lewis
You'll still be giving (you)s, though, which is the point.
Adam Torres
Juan Foster
...
Christian Roberts
I don't think it's necessarily the FBI proper, the US military is well known to have shill farms operating. I remember a Reddit survey a while back that announced the "most addicted" cities, 7/10 were air force bases. There are also interested think tanks that may employ shills, he may have come from the Council on Near East Peace through Strength for a New American Century.
Aaron Clark
It's incredible how war-hungry the MSM is.
Joshua Ward
I feel like Trump is just going to make a deal with Iran that's very similar to the one Obama made and MAGAtards will see him as a great statesman who avoided war unlike those warmongering Democrats.
Landon Stewart
...
Ethan Ross
The question not whether or not that poster was in fact a hired government spook attempting to spread propaganda on an internet forum. The question is whether you have the infallible capacity to identify that. It's the same problem as the old "no trolling" rule that was so abused on 4chan. These kinds of justifications about poster intent lend themselves to subjective interpretation that can lead to bans merely for wrongthink. As a matter of fact that's exactly why this place bled users for over a year while the previous BO was out of control. Do you want us to go back to Zig Forums?