Should we declare a meme war? Is there any candidate that lines up with our ideology? Should we just be neutral? Trump is a porky right wing bourgeoisie faggot, so he's out. Any suggestions?
Who should we support in the presidential election?
Luke Cruz
Other urls found in this thread:
plp.org
iww.org
twitter.com
Charles Ramirez
trumpbecause he is destroying the american empire and isolating the usa from the rest of the worldunless somehow bernie becomes candidate then go ahead and vote bernie
.t eurocomrade
Jace Gonzalez
Its not very clear cut which candidate is best for the left imo. It all depends on when the inevitable crisis hits. If it hits a while before the election, then Trump is out, no matter who runs against him. If a regular Dem gets in before the crisis, the Dems will take a heavy hit while the left and radical right will get stronger. If Bernie (the 'left' candidate in the normie mind) gets in and then the crisis hits, the media will blame it on socialism, retarded masses will eat it up and that will be the end of socialism in America.
So with that in mind the meme war should focus on pointing out that Bernie is a porky and sell-out.
Jordan Smith
This is true but obviously we shouldn't actually support Trump. Communists taking to the streets wearing KAG hats is just… not good PR. And I personally believe the costs of Trumpism far outweigh the benefits anyway. Our climate situation is simply too fucking bad to afford another jingoist clown ramping up tensions everywhere. All nations need to cut back their military budgets ASAP.
Bernie is a militarist too but at least he hasn't made antagonizing other nations a central part of his campaign. I mostly say he's still the best choice because his rhetoric is a 100x more radical than his actions, and normalizing that kind of language is what we desperately need right now.
Brody Thomas
Support the Trump-Sanders dialectic. Burgers need to see the position they're in.
Kayden Watson
It's looking like crisis will hit by the end of this year, early 2020 at the latest. They might be able to delay it with plung protection gang or something, but it's doubtful that it will be delayed until the next president assumes office.
Justin Ramirez
Sebastian Roberts
Nobody. All of them will serve imperialism and capitalism.
If you want to vote Bernie *personally* because you want free healthcare, yeah I guess that wouldn't be the end of the world.
Even though I do not in anyway support voting, I hate the people that say that if you vote, you're "legitimizing" the bourgeois system, that's just so stupid. Your vote does not matter, capital controls the candidates, the winners, and the abilities of the system, so yes while this means that voting doesn't change anything, it *also* means that not voting changes nothing.
If you slightly prefer one candidate over the other, fine vote for them, but do NOT go campaigning for them, we need to be putting ourselves way beyond the electoral struggle, you need to be doing mass work, work with anti-racist orgs, worker unions, etc. Start building connections, etc.
Tl;dr if you want one candidate or the other, sure vote for them, but its HIGHLY pertinent you remember the phrase "if voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal"
Bentley Fisher
No. This is wrong. Trump will cause poverty for the workers with his 'pro-business' approach and will continue the repression of immigrant workers (not saying other candidates wouldn't do this though).
Accelerationism is wrong because, even though we want revolution as our primary goal (of course), and the construction of socialism; We need to remember WHY we want this, we want it to better the conditions of the working masses that are exploited under this unjust system. We are for the betterment of the working class, that is why we always oppose when the capitalists lower wages or the police murder the working class, even if struggling against this isn't directly revolutionary, it helps us build a mass base to where we can eventually launch a revolution AND we fight for justice, communism is about justice. So therefore we should never 'strategically' support the repression of the working class. This is unacceptable.
Chase Adams
reminds me of the patriots
Nathaniel Ross
I'd say the opposite, if Bernie becomes president, he will:
1. Support the bourgeois system
2. Support American Imperialism (he wouldn't be allowed in office otherwise)
etc.
When Bernie eventually reveals himself as just another representative of the bourgeoisie, the workers will be mad that a few social democratic programs doesn't solve the inherently exploitative nature of the capitalist system. And now, because of this, people will associate 'socialism' with capitalism.
For example, people in China all think 'communism' is dengism (capitalism). So all the sweatshops, the exploitation, the slums, the wealth inequality, all of this is now being associated with 'communism' because of the revisionist dengists.
We need to have our rhetoric COMPLETELY separated from these traitors.
Michael Turner
Bernie, because unions
Jonathan Morales
Yes, honestly. In my opinion it'd be best to ignore the election entirely, because turnout rates among Americans is abysmally low, the workers know intrinsically that this capitalist system is not theirs.
If we are to say anything about it, it should be about how futile electioneering is when the state is owned by the bourgeoisie.
Focus our energy on base building with the working class.
I think the Progessive Labor Party had a good article on this in their newspaper: "Heads they win, Tails we Lose"
plp.org
Nolan Myers
Howie Hawkins will be the first open and principled socialist I think the Greens have ever had run for president, if he wins the nomination.
Evan Hughes
What did you just say? Say it to me, you chronic football failure.
They can't even get the IWW's name right, lmao
Brandon Wood
it looks similar to the image of the patriots from metal gear solid 2
Charles Howard
Would Tulsi or Yang be good candidates? Neither of them have corporate ties, both support UBI, both are people first. They may be capitalists at heart, but we can influence them nonetheless.
Jace Bailey
anyone in the US what are the chances trump wins again?
Michael Gomez
Colton Flores
Impending economic crash lowers his chances, but the dems putting up someone horrible increases his chances more. Biden, Warren, Harris, Booker, etc can't beat him. They'll implode in debates.
Zachary Price
What weird smear are you referencing here?
Sebastian Ross
Pretty high since even that cowardly piece of shit Bernie Sanders jumped on board the Russiagate hysteria. Now that the game is over the Democrats are going to pay for it big time in 2020.
Xavier Reyes
Maybe a Libertarian candidate would work? Like Adam Kokesh or Vermin Supreme? Maybe John McAfee?
Carter Barnes
Grayson Evans
Fuck no, the landlords and capitalists would just raise rent/prices exactly to that UBI increase, it would do nothing for the working class and is just to try to simmer working class anger
Isaac Walker
You're probably right.
Sebastian Carter
Simmering working class anger could start a revolution, though.
Dylan Phillips
id vote yang honestly neet life baby
Ayden Ward
Same here bro. Yang could be good for the left because human-centered capitalism is basically socialism.
Samuel Williams
Is this a joke?
Both sides are controlled by Jews/AIPAC and serve you Communist pieces of shit either way.
Both promote anuddah shoah, open borders, suck Jews and Israel off at every opportunity and can't get enough of destructive Jew capitalism.
Literally all you commies have to do is sit back and hope that nothing ever triggers a DOTR and you've already won.
Owen Robinson
Gavin White
Based and historical inevitability pilled.
Zachary Morales
Woah dude don't badmouth the TOTALLY "communist" perfect country, they might ban you from entering the country
Jonathan Lewis
Who are we supporting? We just have to agree.
Dominic King
Summerfags detected. Deported to redditberia for 10 years of hard labor.
Tulsi is the way to go imo. Pretty much the only democrat at this point who doesn't fall back on idpol whenever providing real answers becomes too difficult, also not in favor of bombing third world countries for oil. Not ideal but still relatively good considering what we've had to work with for the past 20+ years.
Justin Gray
Tulsi would probably be the best choice. Can we all agree on Tulsi? Yes or No?
Lincoln Scott
It should be Bernie v Biden, and then Biden stealing the nomination and losing to Trump.
Levi Morris
No, don't support any democrat.
Gavin Morris
I didn't say she was good, I just said she was better than Trump and therefore the best choice.
Easton Long
Sanders would only ever be another FDR.
Andrew Turner
Why? Look at how incompetent he is, he makes Americans go crazy when they let others get away with everything.
Nathaniel Cox
Boycott the elections and burn the ballot boxes
Jonathan Hall
The Democrats don't want another FDR
Grayson Gutierrez
We need to think hard. This could determine the fate of the USA.
Aaron Peterson
Brayden Ward
I'm just kidding man. We all know that we're just a bunch of retards on the internet.
Jace Mitchell
I'm not for the betterment of the working class, I'm for the betterment of humanity. Accelerationism is the only position that makes any sense because otherwise the workers get lazy and complacent when the bourgeoisie give them handouts. The problem is that the proletariat place far too much trust in the bourgeoisie and/or the government. We just need to push capitalism harder so that it's true nature is revealed and the illusion broken.
Dominic Peterson
I want Bernie Sanders to win just so that I can have 5 years or so of a decent young adult life until we go full cyber capitalist fascism. Is that too much to ask for?
Lucas Baker
how fucking new do you have to be to ask all this
Luis Phillips
the elections are a charade. if Bernie Sanders even makes it to the final 3 I will it a hat.
presidential elections are worthless. get that through your skull.
Evan Howard
You and every other autist on this board are retarded LARPER's.
The 1930's aren't coming back, ever, as Mark Blyth pointed out.
Austin Baker
Andrew Yang has supported Andy Ngo. Bernie Sanders has gathered imperialist views in order to gain popularity, and I'm pretty sure Mike Gravel and Tulsi Gabbard will be the same. The Greens won't get anything done while the MIC is a dominant force in politics. Everyone else who is running is literally Porky's bitch.
Sorry, user, but a revolution is a much better option. Just do that instead.
Ryan Watson
go to
Robert Moore
It seems like everybody on Zig Forums has a different ideology, what would we fight for?
Robert Torres
That doesn't appear to be Howie Hawkins.
Ryder Jenkins
How is this an even remotely bad development? It seems like the Greens can never be good enough to make people happy.
Charles Brown
Came here to say exactly this
Jonathan Williams
Trump is better than those two tbh
William King
The crash might take longer to hit than we can imagine
Adam Lopez
Poor fella, I just want to hug him. Not a big fan of petty sectarianism either.
That user was just making fun of the Greens guy for not getting IWW's name right though.
Nicholas Long
oh no no no
Read a fucking book you brainlet.
Brandon Bennett
^^^^^^^^^^
Sebastian Cox
He was against WW1, but he wasn’t an anti-Imperalist. Most socialists pre-Lenin were supportive of Imperialism seeing it as a progressive force against slave and feudal societies. It wasn’t tell Lenin that stuff like anti-Imperalism and Self-Determination of nations was popular among the left.
Brayden Lopez
Supporting reactionaries leads to fascization, and eventually even to fascism. And that would create the worst conditions for communist struggle, as liberalism/legalism allows communists to be able to struggle and propagate better
Also by supporting reaction, workers could be coerced into supporting it.
And 'workers get lazy' so we should support repression of them? This makes no sense.
Levi Torres
considering the whole migrant kids in cages i think more people are waking up and realizing he is bad
Landon Scott
There were migrant kids in cages under obama tho