Best subcompacts for concealed carry

I haven't shot anything. Gun laws here are weird. Unless it's personal defense I can only shoot on qualified ranges, but I need a license for that. The license process requires a basic training course, in which I'll shoot for the first time.

I'm only now seeing the 43X. Is slim+tall better than fat+short for concealment? Also, does the pinky in the air affect accuracy? Sorry, I'm really just starting to get into guns

I don't know anything, but that looks a bit masturbatory to me. I'd like something that looks simple, not something that I'd feel tempted to show off.

Hard to say what would be good for you if you don't know what you like. Slim is in general better (hence why you still see some guys CC a 1911), it's not like the 43X is that tall either. As for the pinky in the air, can't say but in general the more grip on the pistol the better you're going to be at recoil mitigation.

All I want is to comfortably conceal-carry without freaking people out. Having enough grip seems like the intelligent way to go. Slim is also sounding better. G43X is winning me over, I just wish it wasn't bicolor.

If it's anything like Ruger's LCP custom, I know it doesn't meet OP's requirements it'll be a great pistol to carry. I've been sitting next to someone on a sofa and no one in the room knew I was armed. You're right about small pistols not being pleasant to shoot with; they're small and light which makes it hard to get a decent grip on them and they have more kick than bigger heavier pistols. The lighter slides also necessitate heavier recoil springs which can make them hard to charge if you have weak hands.

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Hello am friendly CZ-52 here to maek your day. Would you like cartridge necked down to pistol, but still with power of AK-47? Then here I am. Please remember if you get me surplus to replace my firing pin with an aftermarket version. :)

P.S.: I am also a perfect ankle holster piece.

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I've recently been very tempted by a G26 Gen4 with a G19 mag and grip sleeve, but only because I can get it at a professional discount, definitely wouldn't pay full price, plus like all the pocket glocks it doesn't have a rail for any wort of WML. Honestly my go-to is probably the Taurus PT111G2/G2C because of Sig 226 mags and a lot of hands on shooting of different examples. The G43x also feels good, but doesn't point as naturally as the G2C or G26 for me. I know guys with trigger time on the Sig 365 that are fans of it but I'm leery of Sig-JewSA's quality and have concerns on long-term reliability.

Sig P226 (.45cal) from the late 80's was what I trained on and it functioned reliably despite being a beater without port&polish (completely stock). In USA you probably don't need more than to learn Reflexive Shooting or have a good level of "Time On Target." Any caliber will do, but I would definitely go for 10mm or .40cal (7.62x25mm is even more effective for superior wound channels, no joke).

How is the CZ 52? Been looking at it before and was wondering how well it handles.
How does it compare with the TT?

A defense gun must have several things you forgot to list.

- Front serration.
- Ambi safety.
- Night sights.
Night sights are self explanatory, it's night half the time.
If you're being attacked chances are you're gonna have to use one arm to defend/push back, so you need to be able to rack the slide from a non-optimal position (in case of malfunction) and to use the safety with either hands as you wont know which hand you're not using.

As a non-negligible additional option is either an anti-snag modification especially for pocket carry or a nice holster.

Debatable
Disagree completely, adds a whole other step to the presenting process. If you train on it that's fine but you can see plenty of videos where someone forgets to click off the safety.
Agree completely.

If you're a complete beginner you should shoot a normal gun until you're not a beginner, THEN pick a subcompact. You'll find a lot of advice on caliber and brand, so I'll instead comment on some more boring aspects:

Agreed. Night sights are a requirement. These days I'm against any safety that's not either internal or built into the trigger.

Whatever one gets, holster and belt matter a lot on concealment.

First of all: a "trigger safety" is an ambi safety, so any glock like gun have ambi safeties and are therefore suited for concealed carry.

Second I understand your position but I'm not a fan of "trigger safeties" because personally I don't trust myself enough to know for certain that in defensive situation I won't put the finger on the trigger while drawing and shoot myself at the same time I'm in a fight.

I fully understand why cops like glocks and glocks and glock-like because they are great guns but a self defense situation from CC and cop defense situation aren't the same. Either they will draw for threatening or have to return fire immediately to defend themselves from incoming fire, meanwhile in the most common self defense situation (someone jumps you) a cop will have:
-Armor
-CQC weapons,
-CQC training
-almost every time someone else to help them.

So to me personally if you want to carry a gun with a round in the chamber (and I think we can all agree that's the only way you should carry. And I'm telling you that knowing that in Europe condition three is the standard for most police force, though the diversity and enrichment brought by those poor little refugees is leading it to change) relying on not to fumble while you're fighting for your life and trying to draw at the same time, rather than pressing with your thumb before pulling the trigger like you're used to seems way safer to me.

But I'll agree that it's a training/mentality issue.

You don't need these things. Night sights are the only thing that I would definitely recommend, but even those aren't strictly necessary.

In regards to which firearm you choose, OP, the G26 is a fine choice. At the very least, it's a safe choice. Glocks in general are the Toyota Camry of the gun world: they do everything you need them to, they're reliable, and they're inexpensive.

If you want to go cheaper without sacrificing reliability, give Ruger a shot. If you want to go fancier, get a Sig, but just know that the extra money doesn't mean that it'll beat the Glock standard in terms of reliability.

Just don't worry about trying to be too tactical at first. Get your Glock, get a good holster, and just practice the basics as often as possible:
- marksmanship at the range
- dry fire practice at home
- drawing quickly from concealment
You do that and you'll be better off than someone who practices less but has some fancy gun and practices unrealistic tactical scenarios. Reload and malfunction drills are absolutely necessary as well, but don't get hung up on them: the chances of you having to reload or clear a malfunction while under fire are low with a gun like a Glock, and if it happens then you're probably already dead.

Of note, your chances of having a malfunction go up significantly if you carry on an empty chamber. This should not deter you from carrying that way if that's what you're comfortable with, but you need to put a lot of thought into the risks vs. benefits of carrying both ways.

The most important advice I can give for a new concealed carrier is this: have situational awareness. If you can spot a threat before it's a danger to your life, you're already a step ahead, and your chances of surviving the encounter are much greater no matter what kind of weapon or training you have.

One more note on firearm selection; you might consider going with something that fits in your pocket for the following reasons:
1. Compliance - it's easy to just tuck a gun into your pocket and carry it with you every single day no matter what outfit you're wearing.
2. Faster draw - if you have the situational awareness to spot a potential threat before it's a deadly threat, you can put your hand in your pocket and get a full combat grip on the firearm without drawing attention. From that point, the draw is going to be much faster than drawing from appendix or most other concealed locations.
3. Though firearm capacity is a hotly-debated topic, you should know that it is overwhelmingly likely that you will NOT need 10 shots. Carrying something like a Glock 43 (6+1 capacity) will get the job done, and I personally know of many ex-police and ex-military who carry this gun. If this is the route you choose, carrying an extra magazine is advisable and practicing your reload drills becomes more important.

Okay, one more post and then I'm done.

You may also want to consider a small revolver in a caliber like .38 special, or even 9mm. Without wanting to get into a debate on the merits of carrying a revolver, it does offer several advantages (and disadvantages). For example, it makes failure to feed, failure to eject, and double-feed malfunctions non-existent, however catastrophic failure (non-remediable malfunction) becomes a higher risk. Look at all the options that are out there for semi-autos AND revolvers; read a lot of reviews; hold guns, ask to try on holsters, rent them to try them out if possible, select good ammunition based on gel-tests (Luckygunner.com has a wealth of information on this topic) and less-scientific tests (Paul Harrell on YouTube is fantastic).

Just learn as much as you can, form your own opinions, and make a decision that you're comfortable with.

Best of luck, OP.

The Glock 43X can be thought of as a Glock 43 with an extended magazine. You have better versatility if you get the regular 43 + a magazine extension (which are available in different sizes from +1 to +4 I think) so you can try different grip lengths to see what's right for you. There are also pinky extensions available to give you a better grip, but it does come with a pinky extension that I've found to be quite comfortable and allows me to get all my fingers on it.

I've decided to go for the G43 or G43X. Will post when I get my license and gun. Thank you all for your replies. I half expected to be bullied away for being new.

You only get bullied for being a nigger newfag who makes it obvious, you're just asking a no shit question.

Seconding the CZ RAMI.

Not my first choice but not a horrible one. If you turn into the stereotypical Glock fanboy, however, you will be bullied relentlessly.

Brand choice is limited in my country, that's the main reason why I've focused on Glock.

The Walther PPK

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Funny, I'm currently in the process of getting a PPK/S, although for daily 22 rimfire training, not so much conceal carry. I've always thought about getting one in 380 for that purpose, but then again I don't like the cartridge that much and I carry full frame pistols and revolvers anyway. Still, its at least of mention in my rambling, if you live in a country where ALL you can carry is a 380 ACP maximum, PPK and PPK/S are still the kings in that regard. Respectable gun even if its got weak rounds.

I respect mercantilism. I suggest you carry a StG58 or an AUG openly, far greater firepower.

I have a MP 9C for a year but I have yet to shoot it. Will do so soon once I start working again and I'm looking for a holster but don't know what to get. I assume Appendix carry is probably the best.

CZ52 and TT are both great, but expect them to have a sharper recoil that feels like a snap/bite (until you get a feel for it) due to the 7.62x25mm cartridge. Also being that they are old surplus, you'll get much smoother performance and accuracy by simply taking them apart and very slowly polishing and smoothing out any rough bits. Just don't go overboard.

I don't get people who talk about weak rounds. You're in danger and you need something that shoots projectiles. Even a .22lr would do the trick

In a life or death fight, you can't end the threat fast enough. A round that is less terminally effective may fail to stop an attacker when a more powerful one would have ended the fight. This choice could prove fatal. Those of us who have a nice arsenal can make that choice freely, others in other places do not. I can freely carry a full size 357 Magnum, so I do, or a full 1911 in 45 ACP, so I do. If you have to settle for less, and are a good shot, take what you can. But a nice 22lr is still no 357 Magnum, or a 45 ACP.

If you have a horse and buggy, a quarter ton truck is a very nice thing. But, a 3/4 ton truck is a lot heavier duty, and a 2 ton truck can really do a lot of work. This isn't looking down on folks with the horse and cart or the light duty quarter ton truck, but I I've got the 3/4 and 2 ton trucks, I'm going to drive them.

Carry mine with one in the chamber, in an uncle mikes pocket sleeve modified to hold an extra magazine (13 total rounds on me). Never had anyone detect it and I carry it in my front pocket, and take it to many "gun free zones." It draws out easily, and I often have my hand on it while out and about. With the defense rounds I carry, it does a lot of damage given the compact size and light weight.

too small
enjoy your 890 fps 147 grain bullet that barely expands
the gun world today is gay. Everyone wants to have 10.5" 5.56 barrels and micropenis pistols for cc. Grow some fucking balls, build some muscle, quit being a pussy and carry a real fucking gun.

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better than a micropenis gun
Glock was the worst thing to happen to the gun world.

any weapon that shoots a caliber with the power of at least a 9mm is adequate for self defense. You aren't going to be firing across a 100 yard field at baddie hunkering down behind cover.

say what, you can get a concealed carry license in Peru? that's neat.

OP honestly you answered it in your first post, handgun manufacturing nowadays is good enough where it doesn't really matter what you get – get something that feels right to you

There's no concealed carry license. There's just a gun license. The concealed carry is implied. You'd probably get in trouble if you carried it openly.

still that's cool…do you have any caliber restrictions?

Yes, there are a bunch of restrictions. Up to two weapons at most, unless special permission is given. Psychological testing and basic training and testing. I don't think I can own an automatic rifle. The whole militia perspective doesn't exist here, so civilians are limited to handguns (I think .45 is also included) and hunting rifles (different license). Every gun must be individually registered.

There's also a limit to the amount of ammunition one can have at any one time.

Before, it was illegal to shoot an attacker that had a knife. Legitimate defense (legal term) demanded the force used to be in proportion to the attack. You had to be shot at first, for example. That was thrown away around 2003, since nothing good came from it.

Legitimate defense is a fundamental right as long as:
1) An aggressor puts at risk any of the following:
- Life
- Patrimony (property)
- Sexual integrity
- Liberty
2) You have need to defend yourself. This requirement values the following criteria:
- Intensity and danger of the situation
- The way the aggressor proceeds (his general behavior, basically)
- The means one uses to defend oneself (more on this below)
3) One doesn't provoke the aggression (big no-no is to escalate the situation in order to later take refuge under the legitimate defense articles)

Further comment on the means of defense:
"Because of the criminality in Peru, now it's taken into account the rationality of the action and not the proportionality. (…) [Before,] If one was attacked with a knife, one couldn't respond with a firearm: one had to defend oneself with a weapon of equal power."

9mm in a full size gun is barely adequate thanks to huge capacity like with the g17.
In a subcompact it's very, very weak, and you have much less capacity.
Much better to use a real gun.

Those are some pretty solid self-defense laws, and it's nice to see that someone's government actually changed them to be more effective.

good on you strelok, make sure to train with it like crazy. shoot it as much as you can, pistols take a lot of practice to get good with

No they aren't.

Thank you, I will.

No. Intensity and danger of the situation matters. You haven't read my post.
Liberty here means a free roam deal. Not being kidnapped.

Be honest with me m8, how many other zipperheads/GI did you kill with one.

Anyone got the updated version of this?

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CZ RAMI is such a handsome little piece, def on my list

Get with the times grand pa

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I carry a 6 1/2 inch barrel S&W N frame regularly. It can be done if you just do it. Better to carry a small gun you will carry, but at the same time its good to encourage people to not just focus on small size alone.

S&W M&P shield 40 Gen 1 no safety and this stuff
tr-enabling.com/product-p/ba-p-mps-40-357c.htm
>rcsgear.com/vanguard-2-kit-for-s-w-m-p-shield-9-40/
underwoodammo.com/products/357-sig-65-grain-xtreme-defender

Gotta agree with the user above me. I have an M&P Shield Gen 2 and it's pretty fun to shoot innacity at 2AM when I want to be an asshole.

Manlets, when will they learn?
At the very least a Grizzly could work as a CC handgun but PTRD is optimal in case your shopping goes sour and you need to fight an APC or two.

Those eXtreme defenders are tacticool trash. The effects in ballistics gel are not replicated in living tissues and create no permanent stretch cavity, they basically were invented to effectively cheat the gel test. They are bullets that don't expand and are inferior in every way to JHP, especially in high power combat handguns like the 357 Sig. Kids today.

''"Many of our testers wondered if vectoring real compressed tissue sideways into
tissue would actually destroy that adjacent tissue that is not directly in the path
of the projectile. For those who think this will only work in a non-compressible
fluid like gel as we initially did, we can confirm that this technology works
extremely well in actual animal tissue with or without barriers. Remember that
hollow points expand because tissue which fills the hole in the hollow point is
compressed to such a point that the outward pressure inside the bullet pushes and
tears the metal and forces it outward where friction then takes over to complete
the expansion. If tissue can be compressed to the point of tearing metal (hollow
point) then tissue can certainly be compressed to the point of tearing tissue. The
Phase 4/5 tissue tests confirmed that in over 100 shots the measured wound
channel was not only larger than that of an FMJ but in most cases was the largest
wound channel produced in that caliber compared to all other rounds to include
fully functioning hollow points."''

actual carcass testing begs to differ, boomer. another cool point, it's velocity dependent, so the faster it goes the more it fucks.

Pure bullshit, where's the actual proof other than what the label on the product page says? Hollow points and soft points deform out of stress plastic deformation, not compression. If you ram a car with another car and smash up both of them that's plastic deformation from force and resistance, not pressure and compression. Hollow points and soft points expand the same exact way, plastic deformation, just like a bumper bending against another bumper. Soft lead basically stretches and smears against tissue when the energy/velocity/dynamics are correct. Copper jackets on lead core bullets, or copper alloy bullets do nothing more than bend under the high stress of impact and force. Hollow points only act as a weak point for the lead and/or jacket to begin deforming, this is essential in handguns because the power and velocity are too low to achieve much expansion without a weak spot to begin and guide it.

Even then, metal does't so much tear as it bends and stretches. Notice that jacketed hollow points today have striations in most cases as, yes, weak points to help the jacket BEND and control its bending through creating weak and strong points. Soft lead cores of hollow points, or soft lead hollow points, smoosh and mushroom, they stretch first and only tear after its plastic deformation is either too fast or too much. When hollow points fill with debris and the bullet refuses to expand its not because of a lack of "compression", its because the shape of the bullet essentially changes because now the weak parts of the inner rim are now protected by debris. Notice that with superior designs that even a filled hollow point will often expand because there is still enough force and the weak points in the bullet well enough designed to still achieve expansion and deformation DESPITE having the cavity essentially filled, without all that magical compression the horseshit marketeers are trying to lie to you about.

Fact is a wadcutter is still better than these retard screwdriver bits made for the kids who dont' know any better. There are good reasons why hunters still use soft points and any serous security forces still use hollow points when they can use something better than FMJ.

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