Purpose This thread is to help all the Orthodox anons on this board to gather their thoughts, uplift each other, share edifying materials, and ask important questions. Glory be to God in all things. Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me a sinner.
I made this thread here but ive been reading into Orthodox the most. Something about it feels more legitimate than the other two, especially when it comes to topics like worldiness and death. Two things i ponder about often.
Ive watched and read some of Spyridon baileys works thanks to a Christanon on here. Still gotta get through the way of the pilgrim.
Neither do I understand it, but my interest in Cyrillic has been sparked for a while because of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic church I sometimes frequent. Besides it's just a psalm so translation is right in your bible.
Here's a Serbian Orthodox chant from Visoki Dečani, a medieval Serbian monastery now located in the illegal criminal "state of Kosovo".
Angel White
where my real calendar bros at? there's only 2 parishes on the old calendar in our diocese. the oca is a bunch of modernists honestly. the bishops council here keeps trying to change the liturgy.
Michael Garcia
Of course, I've been attempting to learn modern Greek, and I can read it phonetically so far, so that's progress. Thanks to how much English has borrowed from it, I can pick out little words here and there, but I'm a long way from being able to understand.
This is a great site, too. Can't believe I forgot to include it in the OP.
Is the calendar issue that big of a deal? I mean, I'd prefer keeping to the Old Calendar, but I don't think it's something to schism about. As for your bishops, is that true? If so, is there anything you could do, like contacting other bishops?
Isaiah Jenkins
Our long awaited thread is finally here!!!
Old calendar reporting in, part of OCA. Antiochian and Greek within the US can be pretty modernist as well.
Jose Sanchez
That's a funny way to spell "despotate of European invasion force with Albanians in it".
What's this old calendar stuff? Is it the calendar where Easter is a week later than the Gregorian one or is it yet another one?
Whatever you call it, it's a huge problem. Just last week a priest and his family almost got killed, and a church was attacked. b92.net/eng/news/crimes.php?yyyy=2018&mm=06&dd=01&nav_id=104301 It is clearly to intention of the West to eradicate Orthodox Christianity wherever they can, by any means possible.
William Harris
I can tell you with utmost certainty that the catholic Church is in no state to infiltrate anything at the moment. Maybe in 50 years or so, when our own infiltrators have been removed.
Well, it is filled with Albanians, muslim ones. Don't feel so special, they're trying to do the same with catholicism in that regard, only good goy evangelicals are allowed.
Andrew Edwards
When they expel 1.000.000 Catholics from their ancient homelands in the West, when they destroy 300 churches and monasteries and start murdering Catholics in random acts of mob violence, then tell me this again. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_Serbian_heritage_in_Kosovo
nobody is blaming catholics. but changing things for no reason? that's why the catholic church is suffering today. there is a reason for everything in holy tradition. you can't just change things "just because"
Christian Ortiz
Nibba that was the Balkans, all sorts of horrible shit happened there. Also did you forget the Reformation and Anglicanism? The problem with Kosovo is that the Serbians didn't remove enough kebab there. You a Serb per chance?
Who do you think is changing these things? Not us laymen, people up top.
Noah Torres
What is everyone's opinion on Western Rite Orthodox? I think it's a good idea to try and rehabilitate the Western Rite, since the priests rejoining us renounce any innovations from Rome.
Cameron Bailey
What is Orthodoxys view on race and ethno nationalism
Thomas Wright
If there was one close enough I would check it out just to see the variation in the rites. I enjoy the Byzantine liturgy, but the Western forms are impressive on a different level as well.
Isaiah Smith
It's good to love and cherish your people, but foreigners who soujourn in your country shouldn't be excluded because they're not x ethnicity. Granted, this doesn't mean we should support large-scale ethnic movements, especially if these new groups bring dangerous heresies and paganism with them. Ultimately, your race should be cause to praise God, not as an excuse to bar others from the Church.
I've seen a few videos of it, and there's a Western Rite monastery not terribly far from me relatively speaking. I'd say it's just as striking as the Byzantine liturgy.
Christian Wilson
My priest is black, and our parish is a pretty diverse one. We have some white converts (me), some Indians, some Greeks, and one or two Arabs I believe. What does it matter what color these people are or nationality, we are all Christians in awe before God.
The closest one to me is bordering on 3 hours away. I may journey to it one of these days. The Gregorian chant is something I would like to hear in person.
Jace Gray
There was a point in time when you could walk into a Roman Catholic church and here Gregorian chant all the time. Unfortunately, those days are long gone, save for a few enclaves of FSSP and SSPX. But the Western rites had other kinds of chant, too, like Ambrosian.
Jaxson Young
I miss the old Roman chant to be honest. Gregorian is too complex at times, I've heard our parish go out of tone or rhythm many times with the choir because we don't know which antiphona is when. The old Roman chants are very much akin to the orthodox ones nowadays, much easier to sing along.
Ayden Anderson
Yeah, Saint Gregory the Great did us a service with his chant, but it overshadowed other chants.
Jace Nguyen
90% of which happened to Serbs, because the West hates us, because we are Orthodox and we will not budge from our faith. This is not a question of choice. When you have NATO sitting above your head like a hawk, just waiting for an excuse to start a war, you don't get to make choices. Even then, when they had nothing, NATO fabricated the evidence for the so called "Operation Horseshoe" and started the 78-day bombing campaign. Still we are denied our peace, but instead Western NGOs are pushing for homosexual rights, putting muslims, gypsies into the public spotlight, denigrating our history. We are being surrounded by EU and NATO. We are going through hell again and again, but as the Lord said, martyrdom is the most direct path into paradise. So I guess martyrdom is the Orthodox way, and we Serbs shall yet again not budge; may God grant us victory one day. That was many hundreds of years ago.
Leo Reed
So is it only the Western Rite parishes in the US that perform Gregorian chant, or are there other parishes that perform the older chants as well?
Landon Russell
I'm fairly positive the other liturgies in Orthodoxy don't employ Gregorian chant, only the Western liturgies. Also, it should be noted that there aren't any Bishops who primarily celebrate in any of the Western liturgies, and every Western rite parish is under the jurisdiction of an Eastern rite bishop. Perhaps one day it might be possible to see Western rite bishops again, but we'll have to wait and see. Some people aren't fond of the idea in general.
Good to see you Ordodogs got your own thread. t. Prot sage for off topic
Adam Thomas
I do not wish to see other races mistreated wgen their individuals are sojourning wihin my nations land but i dont want my nation to be made a minority in its borders. In heaven, the perfect world to clme there will be no race but in tjis fallen world it is a reality and one which must be recognized and worked around not in spite of or ignorance of. Thats my stance
Evan Jackson
Catholic, all nations are saved in Christ.
The concept of a country without an ethnicity is nowhere seen in the Bible or tradition. To even ask that question is due to a degeneration of language. The country is not formed of people with the same legal passport, it is formed of families delimited by God and their interactions with the world. To say what makes a japanese man is his passport, puts the government in the position of the Word and definer of Absolute Truth. It's the same thing as calling a man a woman because the government says so. It's satanic.
Of course it's not a Schism. But know that the only reason for the change was to slippery slope us into ec*menism.
Jaxson Myers
This. Ethnic nationalism in Biblical times was as a matter of course. Self-hating modernists like to cherry-pick Bible verses in order to justify their race-mixing fetishes, but of course this is completely moronic. God loves all faithful Orthodox peoples, but every people should live in their own country.
Zachary Davis
As much as i am a fan of ethnic nationalism in general, literally every state that has the word "empire" in it's name in history has been a multicultural podge-hodge by definition(though with a hegemony by the ruling ethnicity) You realise St. Paul being so efficient in his ministry was due to being a hellenized and romanised jew, right? And that he once successfully trolled the roman centurion that tried to arrest him by reminding him he was a natural citizen of Rome, born in Tarsus, Anatolia(and raised in Jerusalem), while his accuser was some greek-speaking nobody that had to buy his citizenship?
We never would have if a freaking ethnic didn't act like an ethnic
Evan Morales
And what do you mean by "act like an ethnic?"
Angel Harris
They always have to push their ethnic clubs and crap on the parts of the Church in America that are actually connecting with the well adjusted citizens and welcoming average Americans into the Church instead of holding their culture as a criteria of joining. They can't just allow the OCA to exist and evangelize, they need to scoff at them in Slavonic from behind their solid wall of an iconostasis with nailed shut royal doors
Joseph Hall
Whats the difference between OCA and ROCOR? Which is more traditional?
Adrian Jones
It depends. In the South, ROCOR and OCA are hard to tell apart in most places. On the West Coast, ROCOR would be the more "traditional" one.
Jeremiah Watson
OCA is generally stereotyped as being modernist, while ROCOR is generally stereotyped as being reactionary. I believe that OCA has a greater proportion of converts, and their churches typically serve in English. ROCOR are more Russian on both counts.
John Jones
I'm a fan of Western Rite. Being, of course, Western myself, I feel a closer bond to it, since it's closer to the Christianity my ancestors would have practiced. It can be argued that it sometimes takes too much from Roman Catholicism or Anglo-Catholicism, but as long as it's still Orthodox, and as long as the faithful remember that they are Orthodox, it's fine. I'd say that it's wider use could draw in those disillusioned with RCC or the Protestant Churches.
That reminds me, there's a practice among individual Orthodox to venerate, with a priest's blessing, non-Orthodox individuals as saints. How acceptable do you think this is?
Adrian Thomas
I am genuinely interested in how do Orthodox people from countries say, Ukraine deal with the fact that they are religious brothers with Russia but have difficult relations between countries because of foreign policy and so on.
Also, I understand the Russian Orthodox Church has no theological claim to global leadership or anything, but is it seen as the 'leader' because of its size?
Nathaniel Myers
Both are very similar as they come from a Russian background. The OCA was descended from the first Orthodox clergy to reach the Americas during the time of Russian colonization in Alaska. ROCOR is a much later creation dating from Russian immigrants fleeing Russia shortly after the Russian civil war. Due to the longer history of the OCA, they have the oldest monasteries and seminaries within the US, and generally all their services are in English. ROCOR being an immigrant reaction has their services primarily in Church Slavonic.
Nathaniel Reyes
Russia began to view itself as the "Third Rome" after the fall of Byzantium. It's the de facto leader partly because of it having the largest population of Orthodox people but more so because the See of Constantinople is perceived as being impotent due to suppression by Turkish authorities as well as more modernist and ecumenical in the pejorative senses.
Is that a legit practice? If so, I would imagine most clergy would be prudent and only allow veneration of legitimate saintly figures. Otherwise, it might be something to bring to a bishop.
Oliver Russell
I think it also depends on what side of the pond you are on. It seems like in Europe, the Western Rite bodies are able to utilize a bit more rites than what is seen in the US. The US Western Rite either uses the liturgy of St Tikhon made for the Anglicans, or the liturgy of St Gregory (pre-Tridentine) for the Roman Catholics. ROCOR-WR I think uses the Sarum Rite depending upon the parish, but none (so far) use the liturgy of St John the Divine in the US. orthodoxwesternrite.wordpress.com/a-liturgy-general/
How is everyone's prayer life? Do you have any set rules or do you pray as often as you can? For those of you more experienced, do you have any advice for novices regarding prayer and what pitfalls to avoid?
Charles Williams
the feeling when you want to convert to orthodoxy but aren't man to do it…
It's the first time i hear such a thing and i can imagine it happening anywere. Can you give me an example?
Christian Thompson
Can we inquire as to why?
Nolan King
Going to a random church full of strangers and trying to convert just sounds like really intimidating to be honest.
Kevin Morgan
Over here in France, nobody hesitates to say Francis of Assisi, Joan of Ark, John of the Cross… are saints. Stuff like Lourdes is widely believed among the Orthodox too. I don't know about personal veneration though.
Adam Bell
Considering what poor spiritual state France is as a country, I'm not surprised that something like this has spread among the laity. Not to mention the deeply-ingrained cultural Catholicism. If you haven't contacted a bishop to speak on this, I'd highly advise to do so.
Brody Jenkins
Wouldn't that be with any church though? Many of us were in the same shoes as you. I know I was. You don't arrive trying to convert, but to inquire. The people that you meet there will understand this and will be eager to say hello and share their experience of the faith, especially if they themselves are converts. If your nervous when arriving, just fix your gaze on Christ on the iconostasis.
John Perry
There will always be the stumbling block, but imagine how it would have been in the early Church. Not only would you be in a church full of strangers, but the authorities of the day would consider you dangerous. Conversion isn't something to take lightly, but fear is no reason to stay away from the faith.
Logan Morris
I seems really strange to me, something like this here would be totally unacceptable Among the clergy too? I've only heard strange stories about some priests in America who are hardly Orthodox anymore. I guess ecumenism is starting to bear fruits in some countries.
Isaiah Smith
I don't get it. What's intimidating?
Joshua Powell
… My own bishop said Francis of Assisi is a saint. So does my catechism, "The Living God."
Both the clergy and the laity are like this. As someone said, "France was Orthodox for 1500 yeas." I was honestly weirded out when I went to an Antiochian parish in the US and everyone I talked to was so hostile to Catholicism.
Landon Collins
I beg your pardon, your bishop said this? Just out of curiosity, does your church have a website? What patriarchate are they under?
What, you're gonna call a foreign bishop because not everybody agrees with a fringe view that Catholic saints are automatically in prelest? Both my bishop and one of my 2 priests said this, and the main catechism in France - "Dieu est vivant" - calls him a saint and compares him to St Seraphim of Sarov, as they both lived in harmony with nature. Him being a saint is obviously no dogma, especially as he didn't live or die in communion with the Church, but it's not anathema and at least a common opinion.
It has nothing to do with hostility man, it is just so wrong… I can imagine Bartholomew is somehow related to this
Ayden Ortiz
You'll have to blame His Holiness Patriarch Daniel too, as the priest who called Francis of Assisi a saint (and in a homily too) is under the Patriarchate of Romania.
Samuel Brooks
I'm not saying foreign bishops should come in, but it's a bit strange to have post-Schism Catholic clergy and figures be considered saints proper in the Orthodox Church. Pre-schism saints from the west like shows are completely understandable, though. Now, I don't believe every post-Schism Catholic saint is in prelest, but one can't help but note that Catholic theology is intimately, or at least supportive, of imagining things during prayer and meditation.
May I ask for a source, user?
Parker Brooks
Well i don't know him but generally patriarchs and people of hight status are the first ones to jump on whatever new the spirit of age will bring. Thank God we still have spiritual leaders.
Carson Ward
Guys, guys, the thing with Francis is definitely weird, but there's a reason he pops up.
He allegedly appeared to a german woman that was torn between catholicism and protestantism. After praying to God, Francis appeared to her, and told her to convert to Orthodoxy.
If you are baffled that it doesn't make a lot of sens, don't worry, a lot of people in orthodoxy are(and let's not even mention what the catholics think about it)
For a source for what? That my priest called Francis a saint?
Propaganda aside, Francis of Assisi was also much more aligned with Orthodox spirituality than later nonsense "Jesus is my boyfriend" spirituality.
Chase Ross
No, about Patriarch Daniel.
Alexander Butler
Oh, no. What I meant is that blaming Patriarch Bartholomew is as silly as blaming Patriarch Daniel. Assuming that what the Orthodox do around me is heterodox (which I do not believe as this is the only Orthodoxy I know and the one I fell in love with), going straight to putting the blame on primates is dumb.
Wyatt Bennett
Oh wait, I wasn't going to blame the patriarch for this, I was just merely curious about who you all were under. From what I understand, the Orthodox Church has had a rough time in France, what with splinterings and such.
Zachary Bell
What can i say, i haven't even heart about Francis of Assisi until very recently. Maybe there's a reason they make an exception for him.
Most parishes are either under Moscow, either under Romania, either under Constantinople. Among those under Romania, a good part comes from the schismatic Orthodox Church of France, which had a major crisis in the 90s. Among those under Constantinople, some are part of the Exarchate of Russian Orthodox Churches in Western Europe.
So parishes in France are divided between Moscow, Constantinople, and Romania for the most part.
Sometimes I feel like we don't have the same religion.
Adrian Nelson
I think it would be prudent for us to pray for the Church in France. You'll all going on the list, user. May God bless you.
Dylan Turner
...
Angel Phillips
90% of us priests really shouldn't be priests, they only learned about orthodoxy through books. they haven't lived it and therefore don't understand it. that's why we have so many lukewarms and modernist bishops.
Owen Bell
usa
Isaac Bell
Are you sure? Most of the priests I know are hieromonks…
Benjamin Bailey
Ok, found a record of the event. Again, weird, vague and baffling, imo, but whatever.
It isn't really for me to say that Francis should be recognized as a saint no matter what feelings I have about him. That quote may sound harsh, but it is because it lacks the ecumenical spirit we find ourselves in now. If we reject ecumenicalism then we must reject post-schism western saints. If we agree to ecumenicalism then we can debate if they should be added. Ecumenicalism doesn't have to equal modernism, however, when the others are more modern than you it best to forget about it.
So even if the story is false, the italian has a special place closer to Orthodoxy.
Alexander Gonzalez
I suppose we'll just have to wait and see, as laity. Granted, I'm not fond of the way he focused so much on the body (a la the stigmata) and the imaginary exercises aren't prudent.
