Angela Merkel backs plan for EU aircraft carrier Angela Merkel has voiced support for some major aspects of CDU leader Annegret Kramp-Karrenbauer's EU vision. The proposals include a joint European aircraft carrier and a permanent EU seat on the Security Council. dw.com/en/angela-merkel-backs-plan-for-eu-aircraft-carrier/a-47860895 archive.is/2Xcyc
A joint European aircraft carrier
A single European seat at the Security Council
Some divergence from Macron
tl;dr >german (((politicians))) dismantle and destroy a beautiful and perfectly functioning armed forces
I just love my supranational overlords. Nobody wastes money quite like them.
Grayson Stewart
Boy I sure can't wait to build a big expensive aircraft carrier and then arm it with nothing but the most expensive version of the F-35
Brandon Murphy
Maybe start funding your armies and build a modern jet that you can afford to keep up first instead.
Luis Lee
So much for the economical alliance…
Ian Watson
my hellenic friend, do not fight the govt waste, ride the wave of EU pork, lobby and insist that they waste their money building the carrier in Piraeus
Evan Nguyen
...
Ian Clark
So it can join the Eurofighter and European Parliament as costly and pointless sacrifices to the great god Eee-Yuu.
Jaxon Rodriguez
Why, ferry immigrants of course. Just imagine how many poor refugees an aircraft carrier can carry.
Even Obama more trust worthy than Merkel. She will fuck up the plan on day one. I beginning to think she wants a collapse euro zone for some kind of reason.
Adam Foster
How suitable would an aircraft carrier be as a pirate vessel in CY+4? Assuming the entire crew is comprised of right-wing Zig Forumsommandos, and both the JewS+JewU are undergoing civil wars with their respective Navies to busy/dead to patrol in international waters.
Shit. Too large and not enough guns. What you want a as a pirate is speed (so you can overtake the victim), guns to frighten the victim, and stealth so the victim only notices you at the latest possible moment. An aircraft carries is quite possibly the least stealthy vessel possible, the guns it has tend to be attached to planes that are hugely expensive to operate, cutting into profits, and they're not that fast either. You may be able to convert one into a floating base for your pirate fleet though.
Grayson Perez
Do they expect France to give up her seat at the council? Or does France now get two seats (its own and at least a main voice in the EU seat).
A pirate vessel needs to be able to close on its victim and deploy boarders to take control of the target. I can't think of any design of aircraft carrier that would be classed as 'fast' (outside of comparisons to other carriers) and that has the hardware/facilities to deploy and retrieve large numbers of raiding vessels.
You'd get a lot more use out of a helicopter carrier than a full blown aircraft carrier. They tend to be lighter and thus not quite as slow, and their speed is largely irrelevant when you start deploying your raiding units by helicopter (although I understand that helidropping onto a moving ship requires a bit more training than using a boat for the same job). A good example would be the RFA Argus - a retrofitted merchantman in service with the Royal Fleet Auxiliary; top speed 18 knots, capability for up to 6 Chinook weight helicopters, room for ~500 crew, and carrying a couple of auto-cannons/miniguns in case you need to shoot something other than a boarders shotgun (your raiding helos could also, at least theoretically, carry ASM if you had the need and funds)
Well, can't rely on HMS Brexit's aircraft carrier.
Does one helicopter landing bay make a ship an aircraft carrier?
Elijah Phillips
No
Matthew Mitchell
Give me a single reason why Reichkomissar Macron wouldn't give it up.
Daniel Gonzalez
So I know dick-all about ships, though I understand the wheel was placed at the back because it was directly attached to the rudder, on wooden ships, what’s the reason for the steering deck of the ship to still be at the rear end of the ship instead of like your pic? Is it just tradition, or does having a view of the sides of your ship as well as the whole deck benefit the captain at all? Or is it just that the view from the front of the ship offers no advantage?
off-topic sage
Isaiah Thomas
I've designed it! It's orange to signify it's a good guy ship, it's got giant cranes to save refugees, and bumper stickers to show the values we care about.
Negrefied "france" is subject to Lebensraum clearance, tbh. You and Macuck are not Vichy material.
Carter Watson
Could a rogue carrier serve as viable mobile base for a PMC flying bombing raids on Bantu scum at the request of Afrikaner revolutionaries in a post-NATO world?
Gabriel Perry
Better take that out of there quick, that's not diverse at all.
Jackson Morgan
This is all muttmerica's fault.
Josiah Nelson
Come on guys don't joke like that, you might accidently meme it into existance
All I see are missile magnets. Do navies even matter anymore?
Nathan Bell
What sort of budget are you picturing there Krautbro? Considering that just to run the ship you're going to need hundreds if not thousands of well trained crew - depending on the class of vessel you're using - their wages alone are going to be significant, the USN Nimitz has a pay bill of ~$160 million per annum for comparison. That also doesn't account for the cost of parts and maintenance for the ship and for its aircraft, which adds up to approximately $240 million per annum. Add on jet fuel, munitions, and other sundry costs and you're looking at a cost somewhere around 1/2 a billion USD every year - remember that there are hundreds of governments out there that couldn't afford that cost.
You might be able to recruit a few hundred Zig Forumsommandos to work for the thrill, room, and board which would cut wages, but what are the odds of each of those Zig Forumsommandos has at least one critical skill? How many of us know how to run and maintain a nuclear reactor? How many of us could maintain even one part of one of the most complex machines ever built?
Unfortunately I think that naval warfare and even just peacetime operation has gone past the point where even a wealthy Zig Forumsommando could just buy a merchantman and set sail for Sarawak.
WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH HER AUTISM???? CANT SHE JUST PLAY IN HER FUCKING BATHTUB AND ACT LIKE LE GRAND ADMIRUL THERE????? I hope Bismarck rapes her at night
William Diaz
It's what he would have wanted; let the beast bleed and accelerate the collapse!
It makes sense from a stability standpoint to put the least dense part of a ship (the castle) right above the densest part (the engine), which is usually close to the back of the ship to make the propeller shaft as short as possible.
Connor Richardson
Pic related. Russia also has a version. Gib back Triest.
I still think that buying a second hand container ship and a Mi-24 is the best way to go; it mightn't be as power-packed but it can handle Africa and other remote off-shore locations pretty well. It would be fucking sick if it could have assault ship capabilities. Then again I know fuck all about ships so I'm sure there's some argument against how retarded the idea is.
picrel is half a million USD: s hip-trading.com/board/public/syousai
A challenge that can't be overlooked is building the helicopter platform. Roughly 2 million would buy both the boat, the hind, and the materials for the platform. Best part is we may have room for actual cargo and could turn a small profit without even pirating. Now all we need are some enthusiastic volunteers and a rich fag or two.
Jose Anderson
Then we hire only the most dedicated and necessary of autistic shitposters. Vodka, Ammo, black market tapestries, shitcoins, jewelry made from the remains of the enemy. We could also produce our own handsigned Zig Forumsmag to sell at port, grow crops on unused portions of the flight deck and catch a giant squid if need be. Fixed by cannibalizing F-35s for parts to service the small carrier wings consisting of pimped out Cessnas, DIY Autogyro gunships, COIN Stukas and secret stealth biplanes for when the enemy has actual anti-air, with any prewar F/A-18s having been sold to Iran once the parts ran out in exchange for a single F-14 lovingly maintained by a dedicated team of autists as an absolute last resort. Replace it with multiple Stirling engines/Steam turbines driven by cold fusion reactors and/or burning mudshit corpses.
I know it's all a big meme but a man can dream.
Austin Edwards
We could just chain a few lavs/apcs to the flight deck like the marines were if we ever need more firepower. couldn't we just work in the shadows to repair the Lexington or Texas to function and sail away in the dawn?
Brody Roberts
??
Hm.
I thought you said large ships were dirt cheap in Nippon?
Cameron Robinson
A Nimitz-tier supercarrier should be big enough to allow most small prop aircraft to take off without a catapultand land without needing to catch a wire. WWII carriers also don't have any preinstalled CIWS and AESA radars.
Camden Watson
If we're talking ~100 tonnes, yes, you purchase second hand fishing trawlers with large bows for well under $50,000. You're still going to pay a whole heap for a container ship weighing in at 1065 tonnes.
Jeremiah Evans
Sorry, my bad
Isaac Anderson
The Lexington could function as a heli carrier right? also the texas is a destroyer
Robert Butler
Well how much space do we need? I get it’s Zig Forums so naturally faggotry is drawn to the navy, but isn’t transport the only issue? I’d figure once we get to Africa we only need a boat for some logistics, I can’t imagine we’d need a ship for anything. Niggerrigged CAS Cessnas can be procured on site and just flow as we take new land.
You should know better, they even have sea access to the Adriatic sea, that’s right next to you.
Oliver Hill
If you can put up the cash to refit some scrapper merchant vessel for launching and recovering a Hind at sea then that would be pretty fucking awesome - the upkeep would still be significant and you'd still need a few navy vets to take senior NCO roles and train the Zig Forumsriegsmarine volunteers though.
If you plan to make your money blowing up dindu rebels for Afrikaans farmers then you wouldn't need much more than WW1 tier aircraft. The main threat there would be small arms fire from the ground - and while you are likely to be low and slow enough that hostile fire has a chance of connecting there the old canvas and balsa wood airframes don't really mind being shot as long as the engines and crew aren't hit. Use modern materials once the money starts coming in and you can armour up the engine blocks and crew compartments so that they'd need to be taking sustained hits from a ZPU equivalent to be at much risk (modern turboprops should help you carry the extra weight without sacrificing speed, as you don't have much speed to lose there).
For ground attack jobs like that though they'd still be happier operating from a ground-based airfield (even with modern improvements to the design you're still working with a limited range) but something like the Zeppelin-Staaken R series heavy bomber would be ridiculously cheap by modern standards (especially if we're already buying cargo ships) and can happily carry around 2000kg of ordnance - position the guns for ground attack rather than air-defence and maybe swap out the MG14's it carries for something a little more like a 20mm or AGL while we're at it. You could disassemble the aircraft to transport them by ship when you needed to move them beyond their range.
Why add Helium to the supply chain when an old biplane heavy bomber will happily run on shit tier diesel? besides, you get the excuse for a much higher quality of uniform with the biplane
For added creature comforts. Why should a gentleman have to face even mild discomfort when fighting barbarians? We can add additional cabin space to the Zeppelin, enough to have a proper officers' club. A couple guys drop bombs, the rest sit in the club drinking while watching camera footage from hull-mounted cameras with good zoom. Switch out every two hours or so.
That would be a lot comfier I can't deny that. If your goal is maximum comfy then why not set up a rifle range instead of a bomb bay though, officers can take turns at a lane with a hi-calibre rifle and all the targets his spotter can call out. Set up a tournament in the mess and put together a blooper reel from the camera footage for …. morale purposes.
Italy, France and Spain should respond "fuck you, got mine"
Robert Carter
>ywn acquire a small fission warhead from a contact in North Korea, sneeki breeki yourself over a T*rkish population center in thick cloud cover, arm the warhead then have our resident Greek shitposter throw it overboard to kick off a joint Greco-Armenian Byzantine reconquista
Don't you dare. That city doesn't belong to Turkey. Besides the Hagia Sophia needs to be retaken and reconsecrated before his all holiness the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople reclaims his seat and it would be hard to do that to a pile of radioactive rubble. Can you think of a better long term client for Kommandos ohne Grenzen than the reformed Eastern Roman Empire? If nothing else you'd get a chance to shoot up some slavs that way, don't pretend you don't want that Germany
Hold up. I thought Anglos belong to the Anglican Communion?!
Aaron Roberts
Constantinople isn't the only densely populated city in occupied Byzantium. What's the most shitholey (e.g. few to no Greco-Roman remains) mid to large sized Roach nest of strategic value?
I'm not surprised, the low church is hemorrhaging it's base to other protestant groups and the high church is losing it's base to the Catholics.
Anthony Price
I'm a Catholic, but that doesn't mean I can't respect the Greek/Russian schismatics and what's rightfully theirs. At least they aren't heretics.
Every Turkish city/town I could find with more than 20'000 inhabitants was a Byzantine/pre-Byzanitine settlement originally. You're not expecting the Turkroaches to build something for themselves are you? If you're desperate to go for a AMD maybe stick with chemical/biological.
The CoE has been dying for decades and the rot set in at least a century before that. It makes more sense to think of it as a secular institution with a weird dress code now.
Chase Carter
Sounds like a great way to divert lots and lots of money into private accounts (you can bet there will be a different contractor for each and every piece, from the guns to chairs and each of them will just happen to employ good pals of politicians in power) while also virtue signalling about how EU is oh so integrated and united.
Project will likely be abandoned halfway through since the costs will keep constantly mounting and people will start realising it's a giant piece of shit anyway. Most likely, after one election or another, the new party in power will go "You see this expensive piece of shit the previous party started building? It's garbage! So we're scrapping it to save money. Now applaud us for being fiscally responsible."
There's nothing more classic that corruption in military contracts.
Isaiah Jackson
The city of Batman. Well, maybe not, but it'd be a good place to raise the fire.
Oliver Rogers
Nice bait
Colton Bailey
Today their ship, tomorrow OUR ship.
Take as our that motto.
Worse than a medium cargo container.
Caleb Scott
Are you suggesting that the French didn't come out of the kingdom of West Frankia? As far as I can remember France is just the Franks who got Latin'd and Germany is the Franks who got Slav'd after The Frankish Empire was divided by the treaty of Verdun. Is that not accurate?
Camden Thompson
Charles Martel and Charlesmagne were both franks i.e. germanic invaders who conquer Gaul, not the niggerfied celtic cucks nowadays in France.
Charlesmagne was a fucking jew puppet anyway, rather killed pagan saxons rather helping the Kingdom of Asturia re-conquering Spain against the muslim occupation.
Charles Martel is a true man though, even hired/teamed up pagans to help against the muslims.
Carson Cooper
There is your problem.
Thomas Parker
But Germany will not build the nuclear parts, the french will.
Robert Reyes
It is. It's just burger education at it's best. France was mostly empty in late Roman time which is why the Franks and Visigoth were allowed to settle, (Franks settled the Somme and Meuse valleys, the Visigoth settled the Garonne valley, the Burgundians settle the Rhone valley. The gauls controlled the Seine and the Loire valley. The Mediterranean part was directly under a roman pro-consul as Narbonensis province) when the empire crumbled the Franks quickly dispatched what was left of the Gauls (the franks and burgundians were allowed to settle because the Gauls couldn't defend the Rhine, as heavy taxation, widespread slavery for latifundia, etc… collapsed their numbers almost completely. Gothic people weren't subjected to the same level of taxation as they were foederati) took most of France save Brittany while Narbonensis went to the Visigoths (which back then had resettled most of Spain save Basque country).
The result of this is well known, save Britons and Basque no fucking one in France (or northern Italy for that matter) is a descendant of "gauls" or "celts". Nearly everyone is descendant of franks in Northern France, nearly everyone is descendant of Visigoths in southern France except for a few of greco-roman lineage near the Mediterranean coast and Burgundian lineage in Rhone valley.
Which is what shaped language and internal conflict for the millennia to come.
Leo Morris
Neat history, I’m pretty much illiterate beyond early Renaissance, recommend any good Roman history books? I have SPQR by Mary Beard, I haven’t read it yet but I assume it’s mostly factual (even if she’s a woman).
Kayden Hill
Get a good translation of Tacitus's works. the majority of books you find are going to be using him as a source anyway.
Ayden Jackson
As says Tacitus is the best place to start. There are a few other primary sources worth looking at though.
If you want to start reading up on the eastern empire then start with the official histories written by Procopius and look up his 'Secret History' for shits and giggles when you're done.
Jose Ward
Could you tell us about how the French language came to be?
Hunter Powell
What about Commentarii de Bello Gallico? Its written by Julius Caesar and it's pretty Zig Forums tier too.
Easton Cox
How the fuck did I forget that? Thanks for the save m8.
Brandon King
Adrian Goldsworthy's books are a pretty great and comfy read in addition to primaries britbong and magyar posted.
Aaron Edwards
And don't forget Caesar's Commentaries on the Civil Wars. Also Suetonius's Twelve Caesars for all the juicy gossip about the early emperors.
Camden Hernandez
Because .32ACP guns don't cost billions of dollars.
Thomas Phillips
Because 1 man is enough to staff any .32ACP firearm unlike a carrier. also what said
Jordan Collins
Now that you mention it, maybe it is a way to get around the treaty on a technicality by having a client state manufacture the components and it technically not owned by Germany. Next step: EU nukes, stored in missile silos spread around Germany. Then the liberation of the Poles from their evil bigoted government begins, and the EU (read: Germany) can administer the country until a new puppet government can be formed.
Jordan Gray
French is a mix of "langue d'oil" and "langue d'oc". Langue d'oil is a mix of vulgar latin ("Gallo-Roman" which was the latin spoken in the north west roman empire. Spoken latin was never standardized to begin with, so NWest Latin was mixed with Gaulish. Gauls were indigenous to Northern Italy not just France) for the vocabulary roots but lots of frankish for the rest, "langue d'oc" however is a relatively pure evolution of NW Latin.
It can be traced back to the visigoth/frank split. frankish lords, unlike visigoth (litt. the wise goth), didn't read and wrote. Visigoth having conquered/settled the much more romanized and populated area of Narbonensis and Hispania read and wrote Latin which resulted in langue d'oc largely surviving and mixing with frankish/latin long after they lost control. The result of this is that old spanish, old italian and langue d'oc were extremely inter-intelligible. Langue d'oil not so much… despite being the language of the rulers of West francia then France. France being more or less always centralized this posed problems, has you had basically an educated bourgeois elite in the south of France that traded with spanish and italians, they themselves being largely cities states rules by the same elite VS a uneducated government/nobility in power trying to centralize the country, that's the root of a shitload of revolts and wars (including: the 100th year war, the Albigensian Crusade, etc, etc…). Therefore there always was a political push to unify the two into one monolithic bloc which happened pretty much the minute printing became a thing and was fully standardized with the creation of the Académie française in 1635 and since then french has changed very little.
Carter Perry
Bohemia
Thanks streloks.
Very interesting, the evolution of languages is really fascinating with the centralization of languages I wonder if I’m another few hundred years the whole planet will speak some bastardized English mix. I hope that doesn’t happen, but it seems likely.
Gabriel Rodriguez
what it will achieve is getting germany's NATO contribution up to the amount they have promised without having any effect on the countries defensive capabilities.
Jace Walker
What a natzi! borders = BAD
What could go wrong…….
Hahaha this bullshit is going to fail so hard
Carson Perry
Merkel: Germany will meet pledge to spend 1.5 percent of GDP on defense by 2024
She told me that we would be completely off coal- and nuclear power by 2020 too, so meh.
Hunter Rogers
POLITICIAN SAYS A THING!!!! Well, that's definitely going to happen then. Besides, I thought the NATO commitment was 2%?
I wonder if I’m another few hundred years the whole planet will speak some bastardized English mix. I hope that doesn’t happen, but it seems likely I think we're more likely to see a range of (increasingly) Anglicised dialects of various languages that slowly grow, co-opt, and take over their host language pretty much what the French are trying to prevent with their Académie française. They'd likely have some overlap from the English influence, but I doubt we're likely to see a 'world language' as in everyone brought up speaking exactly the same language from birth though.
Cameron Allen
It is.
Joseph Brooks
If we followed Merkels dumb cunt logic further down that rabbit hole. All the EU seats would be consolidated into one seat with one vote on the council. At which point the UN becomes a running joke that passes the most retarded measures. Which would be about the time the US stops paying for and disbands the UN.
In a way she would be helping everyone out if she did this.
Joseph Wright
Yes, something that only really the UK, France, America and us + a few other smaller nations have bothered to aim for. Germany has been depressingly underfunded for ages so it's good news in any case.
Luke Young
UK stopped since 2008, France around 2012 (with peaks as France actually uses it's army so when they start cutting to the bone problem ensue a budget rise next cycle. But that money isn't "invested" in defense, it's burned in operations). They think that it's a great commitment for Germany because Germany has been below 1% since 1993. "European defense" is a long running joke.
Logan Hill
That’s only vaguely better, shill a shit future though.
That’s the UN today, bud. Not going to happen without radical political change in the US. Just like American withdrawal from Europe or other countries it doesn’t need to be in: not going to happen.
So odd that a trade union need not only laws and polical authority but a military force.
Though say this did happen, just who’s interest will be represented on the UN Security Council? The entirety of the EU cannot have the same goals or concerns.
Anthony Wilson
Protip: That money will find it's way into the coffers of external coultants from McKinsey and Accenture where the children of several politicians have had meteoric careers.
Anthony Bailey
It'll still take centuries if not millennia to get half way there, and that's plenty of time for a trend to be bucked.
It's almost as if …
Hush, if you point this out to the EUrophiles they start crying. But you're entirely correct, just as a single central bank cannot hope to set the one, continent-wide, interest rate/fiscal policy that will serve both the richer parts of Germany and the poorer parts of Eastern Europe there's no way in hell that the entirety of the EU could agree on what they wanted the EU representative at the security council to do.
Best case scenario he needs authorisation from the parliament to do anything - in which case he turns into a guy who is paid very well to sit down, drink coffee, and keep his mouth shut. It's much more likely that they'd make the position an appointment by the commission, which would then always go to the biggest globalist scum-bucket that they can find in all of Europe.
Thomas Watson
IIRC UK has spent 2% for the past 2 years now. It appears as if spending is up for them, even slightly.
Jackson Cox
ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_national_defence.php The GDP %age has been dropping for the last few years, but as the total amount spent has increased for the same amount of time that would likely be because the economy has grown faster than the defence budget has. Then again it's been dropping fairly significantly since the high point - but as that defence spending in 1945 that's not unsurprising.
Andrew Lee
You spend even less now than you did in 2010 (so after the 2008 cuts). In 2015 you changed the way the MoD budget is calculated to include provision for war pensions, UN subsides, pensions for retired civilian MoD personnel and a large part of the MoD’s various "income" (which is largely in fact BAe & cie income). NATO let you get away with it because it needs to pretend that the good students (France, UK, Poland) are doing their best when the others (Germany, Denmark, Belgium) are bad students that can't follow the rules. Also out of those 2%, at least 20% must be for equipment procurement, currently no-one except the US is really at 2% GPD/20% procurement. The best students are at 20% procurement for 1.6 to 1.8% GPD.
