Bread Pilling Zig Forums et. al

They don't care, as I mentioned they're atheists. They want the amazingly beautiful and rich Europe/World they imagine would be in place if Odinism or any other pagan religion of their approval had been dominant instead of Christianity.

You should also give Dialogue with Trypho by St. Justin Martyr a read.

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pagans are nothing but atheist larpers looking for meaning

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Your dumb ass has it all backwards.
You aren't showing them Christ, and then reasoning that the people that rejected Him are forsaken because of it, you are preaching antisemitism with a side order of Christianity.

The result would a racist version of those atheistic liberal faggots that embrace Buddhism, because it's "compatible" with their worldview, and either mutilate it into a joke, or get disillusioned it's a bit less "enlightened" than sipping soy lattes while practicing mindfulness.

Give them the real Gospel, not a spiritual window dressing for their atheism, as says. That is why they embrace atheism, paganism, islam and homosexuality.

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Sophism. You are taking the worst scenario. Of course you won't convert an atheist, materialistic typical homosexual with a meme view of history and an over-idealized view of Europe, etc…
With this argument you only destroy one of his main argument against christianity, which is unfortunetly an effective argument which works even on IRL people I know. You can maybe even convince some people that have not a definitive view on everything.

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You can apply that to most groups, from far-left adepts that actually wanna help people, to certain radfem authors.
But i don't see anyone wanting to evangelise Zig Forums with patristic quotes about charity, helping the poor, and christian communes throughout the ages.
Because that's absurd.

And your counter-argument is basically like that old Chapelle skit with the gay KKK chapter.
"We hate too, but we do it in a special way, with compassion"

Tell them God is no respecter of persons, but that if they are faithful to Him, their nations will likely live and prosper once more, just like before this modernist mess.
That's what they need to know.

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If it's the truth, why does it need to be shilled forever?
It's the only truth that requires this.

Everything else that is constantly shilled is false and people would stop believing it once the shilling stopped.
Like atheism, or if someone tried to make you believe that 2+2 is 5 when in reality anyone who would not be subjected to that mantra would find out, on their own, that two things + two things, is twice two things and not twice plus one.

This has not happened in any "Christian" nation on Earth.
Even America is very unchristian with its circumcision craze.
Japan still worships Amaterasu.
Mexico still has Santa Muerte and Day of the Dead.
Christian Africa still has its customs.
Christian Europe is teeming with heathenry, non ironic heathenry, in fact it is so heathen that its indistinguishable since it's everywhere.

...

I'm pretty sure if christianity were really fighting the jews, all of the jews would already be dead considering all of Europe was christian for over a thousand years. You people don't believe in exterminating the jews down to the last cradle, and thus you don't offer an actual solution to the jewish question.

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...

THISx100
That guy who said it is called AtmanBrahman so I assume he's hindu and thus an actual pagan and not someone like larping Varg.

You are preaching to the choir here, 75% of Zig Forums hate Jews, and 25% are Catholics. I try to breadpill Zig Forums whenever I see a religious debate there, but you are free to go and make a thread whenever you like. As I see it, either the Church or the Jews will prevail, but the future is too small for both.

This. Only Orthodoxy can save the West.

Who here does Wrath of Gnon? Despite being a goober when it comes to Protestantism, he's pretty solid with the bread pills.

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That's what you sound like right now.

...

I can confirm they prefer Islam, and it is true they allow themselves into mosques but not churches. The only hatred between Muslims and Jews is between Arabs and Israelis, for the most part. If there was no Israel, Muslims would like Jews a lot and both would hate Christianity together. Don't think that Muslims are based for their Jew hatred, they've preferred them to us for 90% of history. Judaism and Islam were both created after Christ. Judaism finalized in 500AD, Islam in 640. Mohammed was from a part-Jewish family, and the rulers of Saudi Arabia are all ethnic Jews too.
AMA about Arabs, Islam, and Jews

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Proofs?

But i tought we were already the Christian Zig Forums version

Catholic here. Hate the (((juice))). Actively redpilling my family and friends.

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(checked)
Exactly.

If you cannot arrive at something on your own then it is not truth.
How likely do you think would it be for someone who has never heard of Christianity to recreate it verbatim from scratch, since it's the ultimate truth, as it is said?

It's extremely unlikely. They might come up with something that is somewhat similar, but it won't be 1:1 verbatim, the word of Dod would not be replicated in its whole, despite being the ultimate truth.

The fact that it's monotheistic makes it even less likely, since that's not the default thinking for people.
We call traffic lights and phones, stupid.
Printers are evil.
We give personality, even if it's just very very weak, to all sorts of things that aren't alive very easily.

In a world without missionaries, without propagation, etc, missionary faiths die out, but other things remain.

You know what true faith looks like?
Belief in a god or gods but having little to no written records of it, because everyone knows it's true and they don't need to write it down.

If you are a god and nobody needs to talk about you because you are intrinisically regarded as real, even without scripture and co, then you've made it into the big league.

If you need someone to day in day out attribute everything to you and remind people of you, then that's extremely insecure.

God. Sorry.

I am Catholic and i hate jews why are you trying to say we don't and most of the people at my church openly dislike jews and call them christ killers

just ortholarpers thinking that they are somehow relevant. catholics have historically hated the jews the most, we basically invented anti semitism.

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lmao, the Vatican Bank is a usurious organization beset with scandal. No need to hate the Jews when you've become them.

israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/204717
so it says jews have a chance to go to heaven but its up to god wow man you really got us nice misleading picture under the headline to make it seem like the pope said it that doesnt change the opinion of alot of catholics about jews you are making me dislike orthodox people right now i have usually had great relationships with them

jeez with all those scandals how has it lasted so long

Are you the christcom gang guy ?
And to answer the question that's because the premisses of the left are not christians, the communist are by definition anti-religious, the left of nowadays is by definition materialistic and progressive. In leftism what matter is not charity but a materialistic one.
But the right have it's principles on the proservation of the tradition (and the neo-paganism is a perversion of this ideal), so this principle is not anti-christian by essence.
You can see real christians are of the right.

You destroy anti-christian arguments, that's all. You introduce them to a better understanding of judaism and christianity. Those who are interested will come then.
And we could also destroy lefty-pol arguments, the fact is the propaganda of the left comes from the forces of powers themself, not from forums, etc… So a better deal is to stop the anti-christian rethoric doing damages on Zig Forums

He is.
No. We should tell them that God loves nations, but only if they are traditional, then he destroy them.

Now keep your force of inertia to you.

And yet we've gone over this before.

The pagans of today that are either not LARPers or not as LARPy are that way because of either being lucky enough to be part of an unbroken tradition, like the Mari people or Hindus, or have leaned heavily on written down academic research based on writings and research by Christians, historians and archaeologists. Pagans that just kind've do their own thing and follow their heart and don't rely on said writings tend toward the Liberal New-Age Wiccan Mystery Religion spectrum of "paganism."

You say paganism is more legit because it can just spring out of nowhere with no need for maintenance via handed down rituals and writings. Yet with the exception of some leftover traditions and habits here and there, European paganism, as anything cohesive, recognizable or significant, lied dormant for hundreds of years until a movement, starting in roughly the mid 70's began a concerted effort to consciously reconstruct said worldview via the aforementioned writings and research. Without this movement, based on recorded information, not just "gut feelings and instinct", boards and pages and groups like Zig Forums/asatru/, The Asatru Folk Assembly, etc. would literally not exist. Earlier movements and individuals of the late 1800s/early-mid 1900s that attempted similar revivals like the Nazi Occultists and Guido Von List's Ariosophy/Armanism, ultimately degenerated into Germanic-flavored Mystery Religions due to sloppier research and the need to syncretize with mystery religions due to the lack of structure and substance of pagan scholarly work at the time (It's no coincidence that the modern pagan movement started to flourish shortly after foundational classics in pagan research like H R Ellis Davidson's "The Road to Hel" and "Gods and Myths of Northern Europe" started being published in the 40s through the 60's) As I've said before, May poles, May cats, knocking on wood and kissing under the mistletoe is not enough to make a religion. You need a cohesive worldview or else the aforementioned are just empty meaningless habits.

Real pagans or wannabe real pagan LARPers = unbroken tradition or reliance on reconstruction through recorded information.

Liberal (or otherwise) LARPers = Feelings, instinct, UPG, heavy syncretism with existing systems like Christianity and Mystery Religions, or at best playing fast and loose with the aforementioned recorded information. In other words, treating paganism like it will just magically spring up out of nowhere.

In regards to your reference to the Japanses "worshipping" Amaterasu - with the breakdown of maintenance and state enforcement that came after World War II, Shinto has been reduced to window dressing habits and traditions that have stuck around, but ultimately take a backseat to the materialist nihilism that has become the de facto religion of Japan (which honestly, considering that isn't that much different from paganism, you might have a point there after all.)

Once again, your theory of pagansim being able to magically spring forth without maintenance is proven patently false by the actually reality of the history of paganism itself.

Sadly no.

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I couldn't care less about you. The Pope watched as 1 million Orthodox Serbs were murdered or expelled from their ancient homelands in the 90s, so you already are my enemy.
The current political developments only hint towards a grand battle between Orthodoxy and Catholicism within the next century, true Christianity vs fake. One will prevail, one will be annihilated, and God will decide who his true flock is.

you keep getting angry at me for popes i do not like i am a tradtionalist catholic… also your ideas about Catholicism vs orthodoxy are delusional

I am not angry at you.
We'll see.

Go to self improvement general /SIG/ and post traditional Catholic teaching on virtues by Fr Ripperger

Did you arrive at that conclusion on your own? If I now believe this, will your statement stop being true because I didn't come up with it?

What do you mean "recreate" it? You clearly have no idea how truth works now why it is important to Christians. Besides, why try to recreate Christianity when you can repent and believe in the truth?

But people, including you, do know God exist, but suppress that knowledge with their, and your, sins. Besides, appealing to the majority never made a good truth detector. You took logic somewhere in your education, right user?

I would not call someone stupid or insane while making such an inane and nonsensical statement, and making such a crude spelling error

I agree, have you ever tried setting up Canon on Windows?

Christianity is more than spreading the Gospel. Go back to elementary school, or better yet, actually read the Bible.

Yes, "But the centurion replied, 'Lord, I am not worthy to have you come under my roof, but only say the word, and my servant will be healed. For I too am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. And I say to one, ‘Go,’ and he goes, and to another, ‘Come,’ and he comes, and to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.'" Trust and obedience unto Christ based on His Word and His work on Pascha.

Belief =/= faith, though the first is an integral part of the second

Non squiter, one does not follow from the other. And does your typing to me that statement make your statement unreal/untrue since you don't need to and won't tell me if it was?

If I was the sole reason for your existence and you have to rely on me for absolutely every good in your life yet you insist to rebel against me, constantly suppressing knowledge of me and glory to me through unrighteousness, and demand that I remove my good, holy presence and upholding power from you forever, I'd at least hope you would appreciate me reminding you every so often if not every day.
And if you repeat your beliefs enough to me, do they stop being true? Does one extra post count? I think we need to consult our inner demiurge just to be sure.

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What I mean by "recreate" I mean recreate it.

It is natural for humans to create thundergods and co pretty much every time, doesn't matter where you go, if it thunders then they have a thundergod of some description.
Or at least a spirit or something.

What does not happen is someone recreating Christianity just like that.
Nothing else needs to be said about this.

These things do not need missionaries, they happen to any people left alone to their own devices with their natural ability, their soul, to connect with the world.

You're going to have to put your back into it to get your fruity redefinition of what truth is to stick.
Zero. Ultimate truth can not be arrived at by non-ultimate beings. Christianity is revelation, not deduction or invention.

You're forgetting one tiny little detail: the Pandora's Box of science that has been opened and cannot ever be closed again.

Eventually, on their own, humans arrived at the truth that snow is not the product of Mother Holle shaking out her bed set, but rather the ice crystals that precipitate in Earth's atmosphere. On their own, humans arrived at the truth that thunder is not the product of a bearded man throwing a hammer or a metal bolt towards the Earth, but shock waves caused by sudden bursts of thermal expansion in the clouds. Even if you theoretically got your hands on something like an Infinity Gauntlet and snapped your fingers and made all books and knowledge disappear and send all of humanity back into the stone age to prove your point, humans would eventually develop back towards arriving at this scientific model of the universe. And a scientific model of the universe, with multiple complex natural systems working together in tandem and harmonious order, does not point towards a bunch of personified natural phenomenon squabbling about.

Even modern pagans, whether they're trying to recreate their gods and worldview loosely or as tightly as possible from books and research, have fallen to trying to adapt their beliefs to the scientific model. Whether it be viewing their gods as Jungian archetypes, or deified ancestors, or tulpas/egregores, or trying to interpret the realms of ice and fire meeting over Ginnungagap as being a metaphor for The Big Bang, or just throwing their hands up and just saying "Heck with it: sure it's all a bunch of stuff our forbearers made up to explain what they did not understand, or to convey the worldview of their culture, but muh heritage!"

But do you know what is actually compatible with the scientific model? What could actually account for a complex network of systems working together in such beautiful harmony? A monotheistic creator. As the idiom goes: "take a sip from the cup of natural sciences and you will initially be an atheist. Drink that cup all the way to the bottom, however, and you will arrive at God. And wouldn't you know it. The Egyptians, Indians, and Middle Easterners were beginning to arrive at this truth by the Late Bronze Age.

All on their own.

No. I hate communism with a vengeance, but if you believe cozying up with the Atomwaffen Division is better, you got another thing coming.

And you believe occultists, pagans and atheists are better?

But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:

[b]11 For there is no respect of persons with God.[/b]
Romans 2:5-11

You aren't bringing them to a closer understanding of shit.
You are just showing them some theologians weren't big fans of the jews.
But given they already quote Luther and Calvin pretty often on the subject, but i'm not seeing any of them lining up to join those churches, so it wont change their hearts.

Yeah, no.
It's still humans that make this shit.
You can dismantle them just as well(personally, i'm keeping an eye on a certain far-left project that was popular a decade ago, to make sure it dies well).
No one gets a safe pass.

By being the channer version of that loser that tries to impress popular kids by imitating their clothing and sucking up to them, so maybe they will invite him to hang out sometimes?

And where is Christ in all this?
You have literally made our faith a spiritual window dressing.
Again, that traditionalism could be wrapped up in shintoism(like Japan), or the Imperial Cult, or atheistic reactionary larping, for all it matters.
The apostles didn't get sent to make sure we wear national costumes once a year, do some festivals to honor muh ancestors, and not let a lot of foreigners in.
They got sent to preach Christ, and baptise the nations.
Any cultural benefit resulting from that was incidental spiritual grace, like nice leaves on a vine.

Not really.
Most of those are copy-pasted off neighboring mythology, or imposed by invaders, in case of PIE cultures.

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You are just over-interpretating ONE of all the arguments against anti-christian rethoric of Zig Forums.

Now if you have better arguments feel free to use them, find quotes or make memes. It doesn't invalidate the validity of the argument of showing them the theological reality of the difference between jews and christians and hebrews.

Someone can do as Pius XII did, condemn modern deviations of nazism and condemning anti-racism in the same text, and even preparing a text against jews. I don't really see your argument against showing the theological reality.

Because, again, if this idiotic campaign had been effective, Zig Forums would have been filled with edgy calvinists and lutherans by now.

there is not only protie quotes first
then I don't really see a campaign.
and in the end I don't care if most Zig Forumsacks stay edgy, what matter is the fighting of error, it will lead the ones who want to Truth.

Ok.
Then the same answer. but with those quotes's denoms, as well.
Not officially, but it's
You are cuddling a highly influenceable snake, because you believe it has good intentions, and thinking it won't turn around and bite you, despite acknowledging they have loosed all their venom on us before, by simply being nudged slightly.

*but given how much they have been resposted, it's a lowkey version of it.

You see, you disagree with me.
But the beauty of my actual truth is, that I don't have to discuss it, since it has been happening, is happening, and will continue to happen.
Whether I post or not.

I can and will completey agree with you here, because it literally doesn't matter.
Amen. I love the God of the Bible.
I can say this all day, but it doesn't matter. If I don't go out and be a missionary, and this applies to heathen faiths as well, a missionary faith WILL crumble away.

Provided I would be trying to convert some people who don't believe in it to it.
Sure, you'll have your stragglers, but if the vikangz would have gotten to the aztecs first and "converted" them then we'd still end up with some weird mish mash xipe totec simulacrum.

Because missionary faiths can't reach everywhere nature can.
You cannot cover all the things nature has to tell.
This might sound like new age babble, but its the best compression I can deliver not to write huge essays here.

Not even science can truly help, can you imagine a series of fully and truly coincidental lightning strikes at some rational science thing that also talks about gods?

Like really close strikes.
Sure, at first it would be "just ions" and "a natural discharge of electricity" but every additional bolt would force "doubt" into at least someone.

The actual, non ironic scientific nature of the event would still instill spirituality in the people.
Because it is a veneer painted on top of us, there are places within us that cannot be reached with cold hard science and rationalism.

Mate, you aren't a missionary.
A missionary tells people about God, Christ, sins, repentance, and all that.
You have yet to mention any of those words(yes, i checked) in your ramblings.
You explicitly reject any attempt at trying to actually convert them(just "God loves traditionalism"), and just want to add a couple of more antisemitic infographs to the mix.
You just feel slighted they associate you with jews.
That's it.
You don't them to change or repent in anyway way, you just want them to see you as their guy.

Indeed, that's easy theology, I don't think can do much more here. Yet it's still this.

you just have to contradict their argument and expose the truth about jews and the Church. It's simple to anderstand. No snake kissing or something, stop over-reacting like a women.

Yes, the process of humankind moving towards a monotheistic view of the world, backed by science has been happening. For a long time.

So the key to a faith being eternal is to NOT go out and tell others about it, and to just remain static and in one location in perpetuity? Didn't seem to work out too well for the European and Native American pagans when they encountered a more aggressive proselytizing faith (Nor for the Middle Eastern pagans against the Mohammedans, for that matter.) Doesn't seem to be working out too well for Hinduism either, as it's caste system and other aspects of it's worldview are crumbling away to the point of being a rural phenomenon in the face of increasing modernization and urbanization:

mahavidya.ca/2008/04/14/changing-attitudes-regarding-the-indian-caste-system/

Also, leftover Shinto habits don't seem to be protecting Japan from crumbling into ever accelerating rates of degeneracy that make the West look like a theocracy in comparison:

youtu.be/qpZbu7J7UL4

In fact, some of the worst aspects of leftover Shintoism and paganism in general (i.e. Animism - the spiritual "aliveness" of inanimate objects, that you referenced in the tendency of humans to call traffic lights "stupid" sometimes) encourages stuff like this:

youtu.be/RYNdiLrvwzA

youtu.be/lrgCjeXrmD4

Not to mention the fact that if you just compare, for example, Iron Age paganism to Bronze and Stone Age paganism, you're going to see quite a few differences that won't be particularly kind to the "Eternal non-Missionary Religion" thesis.
Even other non-missionary pagans crumbled in the face of more aggressive "missionary pagans" as referenced here:

Also, notice that virtually all of the reconstruction efforts of the modern European pagan movement have exclusively focused on the Iron Age. Why? It's as I've already said here: : not enough information due to said earlier forms of paganism crumbling away over time. And, as also said earlier, reconstruction efforts without diligent research produces frankensteinien chimeric worldviews that barely resemble the original.

Because it is a veneer painted on top of us, there are places within us that cannot be reached with cold hard science and rationalism.

Oh yes, science has indeed been inspired and informed by spirituality and the other way around. Just not the kind of spirituality you're hoping for. In fact, it's even been encouraged and flourished under the missionary religion that you loathe. Forthcoming pics related.

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eh, not really. most of the killings done against pagans had a political animus under them.

For example, charlemagne subdued and converted the saxons because they were border raiding and threatening his empire.

Tryggvason and fairhair's pagan holdout enemies were holding out mainly because they didn't want to lose their autonomy by being subsumed into united kingdoms under a high king. Basically, paganism was their way of being obstinate against conquering kings.

When presented with no political coercion, the germanic peoples usually warmed up to and adopted christianity voluntarily (this is much better than genocide – it shows that the truth always prevails over lies).

The lombards christianized basically as soon as they walked into southern europe.

The goths became arians by way of persuasion on the part of ulfilias, and though arianism is shit, it is more true than odinism.

Iceland voted to adopt christianity, and let paganism stay legal. The pagans simply withered away within a generation.

England was converted, more or less, by monks making appeals to their kings and community leaders.

Germany was converted by showing that god-trees could be cut down.

Truth kills lies, regardless of whether men kill men. Our god is truth, and even without killing men or the threat of violence, our god puts the lies of the devil to death in men's minds after careful consideration.

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And just in case those aren't enough, here ya go:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christians_in_science_and_technology

In other words, show me where science has encouraged a revival of polytheism and a faith in bearded men throwing crap from the sky, rather than encouraging the view of an all-encompassing intelligent designer of the entire cosmos.

wtf I'm Orthodox now

your choice. I was just saying that origen should never be trusted because he's an anathemized heretic and augustine don't constitute the whole of the apostolic witness and their divergence means they need to be understood in light of the rest of holy tradition, and not as the end-all be-all representation of it.

Dude, it was just a joke. I'm not even Roman Catholic.

and I just wanted to roast the orthos. mine was a joke too, I just deliver in dead-pan.

My friend, do you really think that your dying churches with their contraception and divorce will really save the West?

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I don't understand Zig Forums's allergy to Christianity. I remember that board being full of Christian Identity people and next level super antisemitic Christian boomers. Now Vargism is being artificially pushed like mad. This happened around the same time as the plebbit invasion too.

I think all the CI Zig Forumsacks went to The DailyStormer when they got sick of sharing a board with Vargrents.

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Zig Forums's ideology and worldview aren't compatible with Christianity. It was only a matter of time. Ironically they did exactly what the (((leftists))) they claim to hate did: worshipped man instead of the Lord.

I agree with you. There are people who've made it to this board from pol etc from some outreach. Not everyone on pol is a diehard pagan LARPer, or some people just jumped on trends because they don't know much about Christianity other than what they hear from (((their))) media.

We want to evangelize them, we just have to know the "in" for them. For some people it's the beauty of art, for this group of people it might be something else. These are just ins, then we teach them more about Christianity and what it entails and requires. We show a fruit first and then show them the tree.

and nothing of value was lost.

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That's murder and dishonor.

user, I'm sorry but you are legitimately mentally ill from your false religion. I'm not joking or trying to mock you. I really do think your cognitive abilities have been impaired. Your response post is nothing like what a normal, rational would write, just rambling and repeating what you have said earlier without any reference to my post except one question which you answer inadequately. I'll pray for you, your mind's health, and your salvation because you need those desperately.

Not an answer. Does the person recreate merely a list of doctrine similar to Christianity or particular denominations? Is the liturgy the same? Is the god the person "creates" the self-same God of Scripture, or ontologically different despite similar names, metaphysics, and systematic theology? Is "recreating" even the right word describe this illumination?

Man's sinful nature pushes him to sin thorough idolatry, who knew?
And how, my gnostic neighbor, does this prove "If you cannot arrive at something on your own then it is not truth," "If you are a god and nobody needs to talk about you because you are intrinisically[sic] regarded as real," or "These things do not need missionaries, they happen to any people left alone to their own devices with their natural ability" Man does not naturally seek God (See Psalm 14:1-4, 53:1-5; Romans 1:18-23, 3:9-18). Seeking an object of worship is not the same as seeking the One, True, Living God of the Bible, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Man needs help, first from God, and then from other humans who have been redeemed, preaching the Word.

And? Not once have you said or shown anything to prove that your god demands, needs, or gives no communication to transmit truth to other humans. Please seek help because this is the language and reasoning of schizos. I'm not trying to put you down, you really do need professional help.

Nice, mind if I borrow this?

Did I stutter?

There is literally nothing more to say about it.
If evangelizing stops.
If sermons stop.
If Bible distribution stops.
If missionarywork stops.
If the propagation, aka, shilling stop.

Christianity crumbles away and is not recreated naturally by humans.
This principle is the reason why you have all the above in the first place.

Don't project your mental illness on me.

...

God save you. There's no convincing you with sound arguments.
You need help. You need Christ and a good counselor.

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Circular reasoning is not a sound argument.

Is that you speaking or copypasta speaking?

Unfortunately, it's not a mental illness.

This poster's posts:

…are the product of a worldview that is fundamentally nihilist.

You see, what said poster is trying get across is that he thinks that if a scenario akin to man being set back to the stone age (i.e. all books, knowledge, technology, etc. being wiped out, and mankind has to start all over again completely from scratch) that Christianity would die out due to not having the recordings and precise rituals and precepts that it has now. That since mankind might try to cobble something pagan up again based on experiences in nature and trying to explain what they don't understand and inventing new "gods" based on said observations and guess work, that paganism is more "true and eternal."

What he doesn't realize (or perhaps what he embraces, unwittingly or not) is that this belies a disbelief in a supernatural Ultimate Truth that can only be the product of a monotheistic God. He does not believe that an Ultimate One True God would lead mankind back to reconstructing Christianity in exact preciseness. He does not believe this, because such a thing occurring would be far beyond the natural. For Christianity to rise from the ashes of such a scenario and be rebuilt to precisely back to where it is once again, would require a literal supernatural God to intervene and directly guide us.

But for the aforementioned poster, only nature and mankind's interaction with it is plausible. Under his logic, not even precise Iron Age European paganism would be perfectly reconstructed. There would be no Odin, or Thor…. or Zeus, or Hera…. Or Susanoo… etc. There would probably be A thunder god of some kind like Thundarozorca, or some sort of love goddess for people desperate for relationships, like, I don't know, Thotslutius. They wouldn't be the exact same gods as before, but pagan poster does not care about that. The poster only cares that the same basic templates based on man's baser instincts would pop up again, and that's good enough for him.

For pagan poster, mankind's base sinful nature is ultimate truth, simply because it is the mean we regress to due to our fallen nature: Ancestor worship; revenge blood feuds; "Might is Right"; human and child sacrifice; "he who dies with the most toys to be buried with to take with them into the afterlife (which is just a continuation of mundane life) with him" wins; petty conflicts of status and resources; indulging in sexual and sensual gluttony; those on the bottom being trash, and those up top being blessed (no matter how crooked they may be) due to some sort of karma or birth caste or Rig womanizing; one's petty little tribe/race is best and all the rest can die in fire for all one cares; moral relativity in relation to one's tribe/culture: this is ultimate truth for the poster.

(cont'd)

Asceticism; extreme self-sacrifice; self-denial; a view of life beyond the here and now in this physical plane of existence; renouncement of materialism; love for strangers and enemies; meekness and humility; forgiveness; absolute moral truths; an abstract supernatural realm that exists and goes beyond nature: these things can occur in man naturally from time to time due to God designing us as good from the beginning.

Even "pagans" like Plato and Aristotle were beginning to stumble upon the Truth of a One True God in their philosophizing, which in turn influenced the science that flourished under Christianity:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmological_argument

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unmoved_mover

Even Norse paganism almost, but not quite, grasps such a concept in it's belief in Wyrd: a natural force that orders the cosmos to the point that everyone, even the very "gods", are subjected to it's whims.

But such good tendencies are extremely dulled and made rare by our corruption by sin, and can only be brought to full fruition by a relationship and obedience to the One True God. This can only happen under Christianity. Other monotheistic or abstract faiths like Islam, Buddhism, and even some esoteric sects of Hinduism attempt to approach these dizzying heights, but ultimately end up as bizarro corruptions of the Ultimate Truth in Christianity.

In short: our God tells us that he will not allow the gates of Hell to prevail against our church; and we believe him. We believe that even if all our books and rituals and recordings would disappear in a snap, that God would remain. That Truth would remain, and that God would guide us back towards it and Him. Because he is beyond nature, and not just something made up by mankind to explain the unexplainable and to fill the void in meaning in our existence. God is and always was, and always shall be

Pagan poster believes we would shrivel up and blow away like dust in an apocalypse of our books and rituals. He does not believe that an Ultimate One True God would intervene and guide us back to reconstructing the Ultimate Truth. He only believes in the "truth" that man makes up for himself when interacting with God's creation: nature.

Man-made meaning derived from interaction with nature is his "god": making him a nihilist.

No, Christianity or any missionary faith would die out in favor for that which people arrive at naturally.
I specifically added the stipulation that not even heathen faiths work very well for missionary missions.

I'm not being nihilistic, I'm being realistic, because I am describing the exact reality.

If a missionary faith stops missionarying, it declines because if it didn't decline without missionarying, then it wouldn't have to be a missionary faith in the first place.

All that blabla about child sacrifice (I give my only son) or might is right, etc are completely and utterly meaningless, but it's the only recourse you have because, as I have pointed it out.

The discussion ends at the ultimate reality of "missionary faiths die out because they are makebelief to those that do not arrive naturally at them".

It's literally as simple as that.

Actual things happening do not require belief, they merely require observation.

Christianity, and other missionary faiths are the only "truth" that relies on your kind of apologetism.

No other truth needs this since only falsehoods have to be constantly reiterated. It is self evident.
If you need to repeat something forever because you very bloody well know that reality is different and people will be left with this reality if you stop trying to distract or detract from it, then your idea of "what is really there" is, to put it mildly, somewhat warped.

Wrong, media, including written and spoken word tells you this.
If you grow up without Christianity then you will not arrive at Christianity.
The only way you are arguing that "god will lead us back toward Christianity" is because you know about Christianity.

If you didn't know about Christianity then you wouldn't know the goal, the aspects the anything about it.
You were "missionaried", without that, you wouldn't be saying any of this, you are arguing backwards, whereas I am arguing forward.

And you know it.

You're just repeating the same thing over and over again and confirming my point. That you think "truth" needs to be arrived at "naturally", not supernaturally. That God has not guided us to this point and that only our base instincts and make believe inspired by nature is "truth" and "reality." in spite of the Bronze Age Egyptians; the theories of Plato and Aristotle; the triumph of Christianity against Roman paganism while being severely persecuted; this same exact reality playing out in China as we speak; science, civilization and the West prospering and flourishing under the Christian worldview. All while paganism has crumbled away into habits and fringe cults.

Your denial of the supernatural and abstract,and your exaltation of man-made meaning inspired by the natural and your elevation of leftover hollow pagan habits as paganism's "triumph" is the only way you can process and deal with the cognitive dissonance caused by the cold hard reality of the defeat, decline and continued irrelevance of paganism, in spite of revival efforts.

And you know it.

You're a nihilist with a heart as hardened as the Pharaoh of Exodus, who continues to furiously plug your ears against the Word of God.

And you know it.

The difference is that I don't NEED to post any of this because what I describe is happening, has happened and will continue to happen to any missionary faith, Christian or not.
You are making it more complicated than it needs to be.

But let's talk brass tax here.
Do you consider Christianity, in its whole, globally, prominently pure or not pure.
As in, do you consider the world actualy more Christian than heathen or not.

I claim the following:
There is not a single Christian nation out there that is 100% pure Christian.
For reasons I have stated many times now.

I am not overestimating heathenry, you are underestimating it.
Severely. I cannot blame you, though, because it is simply that ubiquitous.
This is, again, because missionary faiths are paintjobs over things that are already there and also grow from things that are already there.

Remember, Christianity is the ultimate truth, it therefore needs NO SUPPLEMENT WHATSOEVER.
I am not the one with the low standards here.
You are. You allow any impurities and just call them Christian, you allow Christianity to be watered down into almost nothingness while also claiming that it's the ultimate hard truth that shines above anything and will find its way to the people in its true form eventually every time.

Or even a double digit.
Not even Orthodox countries are.
Slavic countries, especially have double faith, they are some of the more highly heathen observing places on earth.