Who was in the wrong here?

Who was in the wrong here?

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No one, it was God's plan all along.

Heretic! Samefag!

Clearly, Eve, the snake, and Adam. That's why they all got punished.

Was the snake punished?

So God's plan of redemption was made as He went, implying He isn't omniscient?


Had to crawl on its belly and eat dust. Also Christ squishes its head

Didn't say that your heresy was:

Just because it was within the bounds of God's plan didn't mean they had to choose to sin. God had a plan that worked regardless of what they choose, but the choice was still their's.

So it was a Plan B? That'd imply there was uncertainty in a being who knows all

Is the choice really theirs if He knew the outcome?

Omniscient is a broad term. Some people think it means knowing what will be, others think it means knowing all things that could be.

Yes. You're sounding suspiciously materialist for a Christian. If the soul/will isn't bound by physics, this is an easy answer to accept.

All knowing is all knowing, if He knows all possibilities, He knows which shall come to pass.

So He doesn't know where you're going afterwards? Not exactly feeling the "omni"

Not if the will/soul isn't bound by physical laws which are calculable. You've got some big assumptions in there.

Again, depends on how you define "all"


Maybe he does. Doesn't change personal responsibility for choice if your will/soul is ruled by physics that God made. If you actually have free choice, independent of the universe, then it's irrelevant that God knows your choice before you conceive of it- as long as when it is made it is made independently.

You might ask why God doesn't save people from themselves- because then their would be no free will.

Can it not be all parties involved?

No God. Because He is God. Literally, that's how it works. If you presume to judge God, go read Job, there's a book about it.

God didn't explicitly interfere with the decision, therefore I don't consider Him involved any more than He normally is in any other human decision.

>Genesis 1:31 And God looked upon all that He had made, and indeed, it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning— the sixth day.

Neither is God, what's your point? That He can only know certain things? Doesn't sound omniscient

Limitless knowledge.

Is that biblical or man-made?


He interfered by making the situation in the first place.


So God didn't know his creation would rebel, despite having knowledge to the contrary?

Predestination and free-will are not at odds. God knows what you will choose. Indeed, because you will do it, it must be done. There's only one possible path. What exists at the intersection of predestination and free-will is destiny.

If I'm wrong, prove it.

So God knew we'd fail? He knew that His wprld would degenerate into sin and death, and created things with that in mind. Sounds like God set us up, and that doesn't sound very benevolent.

He knew it would, but he didn't create it to. Just like how Satan wasn't made to enslave humanity.

So He set us up

free will.

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Jesus was weeping about all this, such things must come, but you'll find out a bit more when you give up the ghost

Yes but He didn't force us to

He offers salvation and eternal life; that's what we were created for. You can choose sin and death if you prefer it.

See the 2nd answer

...

Every time when some mentions free will I know for certain that there will be at least one retard who would say exact same words as you. Does my foreknowledge caused your retardation?

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If you tell your kid not to touch the flaming stove, and he does, he is in the winnie the pooh wrong. Now, if the kid is irreparably burnt, you might also be a negligent parent… but God offers to heal those who repent so, no harm remains if you trust Him and if you don't… well, it's your own fault.

Have you read Job? Your whiny, judgmental attitude to a being leagues beyond your comprehension is like a toddler screaming because he isn't allowed to eat the whole cake without feeling sick. FFS man your answer is to obliterate everyone and start over? I mean, He kinda went with that with the flood (though, obviously, for different and specific reasons- in my opinion, to get rid of the Nephelim).

No one says that. The worst idea is held by those that believe they're in limbo, and that's not hell. I personally believe they have the opportunity to accept Christ, as does everyone from all time, how that functions- I have no idea, but certainly God is beyond time, and in God all things are possible.

When God confronted Adam,
Adam blamed Eve.

When God confronted Eve,
Eve blamed the Serpent.

When God confronted the Serpent,
the Serpent winked.

You missed the point of God didn't create sin. What God made was good, it was we who choose to disobey.