Now that PEP 572 is done, I don't ever want to have to fight so hard for aPEP and find that so many people despise my decisions.I would like to remove myself entirely from the decision process. I'llstill be there for a while as an ordinary core dev, and I'll still beavailable to mentor people -- possibly more available. But I'm basicallygiving myself a permanent vacation from being BDFL, and you all will be onyour own.After all that's eventually going to happen regardless -- there's stillthat bus lurking around the corner, and I'm not getting younger... (I'llspare you the list of medical issues.)I am not going to appoint a successor.So what are you all going to do? Create a democracy? Anarchy? Adictatorship? A federation?I'm not worried about the day to day decisions in the issue tracker or onGitHub. Very rarely I get asked for an opinion, and usually it's notactually important. So this can just be dealt with as it has always been.The decisions that most matter are probably- How are PEPs decided- How are new core devs inductedWe may be able to write up processes for these things as PEPs (maybe thosePEPs will form a kind of constitution). But here's the catch. I'm going totry and let you all (the current committers) figure it out for yourselves.Note that there's still the CoC -- if you don't like that document youronly option might be to leave this group voluntarily. Perhaps there areissues to decide like when should someone be kicked out (this could bebanning people from python-dev or python-ideas too, since those are alsocovered by the CoC).Finally. A reminder that the archives of this list are public (mail.python.org/pipermail/python-committers/) although membershipis closed (limited to core devs).I'll still be here, but I'm trying to let you all figure something out foryourselves. I'm tired, and need a very long break.
Second largest paragraph is his defense of a CoC, good riddance. The fact that he didn't choose a strong womyn of color to be his successor speaks volumes about Trump's America; python is clearly deeply rooted in a toxic white supremacist masculinity. Hopefully a intersectional solution can be provided, which is why the new core devs must all be LGBT, preferably T minorities. Let's move forward together.
Thomas Young
If even one woman or person of color is helped by what you call "feature creep", then it is worth it. How dare you, as a white male try to remove features that make it easier for historically marginalized people to get ahead. Shame on you.
I'm sorry, but who's that person? What does he have to do with Python? He stepped down from what?
John Flores
PEP 572 should never had been accepted. For a language that strives for readability why would you add a feature that obfuscates assignments. Everywhere else assignment is done in the format of variable = expression, but now we also have to watch out for assignments being done literally anywhere? How did they even think this would be readable?
Jose Brooks
Guido created Python, then oversaw several stupid decisions over its lifetime such as splintering the language into two mutually incompatible versions that are both still in use a decade later, and the global interpreter lock which has permanently gimped Python's parallelism, or PEP 573 which yet again introduces another incompatibility to previous versions of the language. He's now stepping down as leader without appointing a de facto replacement while inviting the blue hair brigade to splinter the community as a final "fuck you" to everyone.
Samuel Harris
Hopefully this will kill python once and for all and we can be free from one more entryist POS language
"Won" in the sense that the guy that annoys anons (aka Guido) is gone.
Noah Thompson
how exactly is this a good thing? there's nothing wrong with being annoying I found that link in the meantime but thx.
Zachary Brooks
Are you the kind of retard who hated BASIC when it was the thing?
Kayden Ortiz
Is this actually good?, if python dies doesn't that mean everything will be written in node.js now? (if it wasn't before).
Camden Price
He's got C envy I think. It makes no sense to do that in python rather than just call a function twice as it's a trade of simplicity for performance in a language that already abandoned performance.
Brayden James
Node.js is only for web pages. (I'm not sure never used it and never will)
Blake Rogers
Wrong, you can use it for anyeverything
Andrew Hill
Ask OP or ask whoever cares.
Next time find it beforehand, sweetie.
Anthony James
node.js literally does not work in browsers. It's for servers and scripting, not webpages. Javascript is for browsers.
Jace Young
And how do you put node.js into a vidya game? Not that I would want to pozz my vidya Also there are slower alternatives like Lua and if you want to go faster you can just use C for the pros or C# for the faggots).
Parker Murphy
node.js sadly gets used for more than webshit. If you have Adobe 'Creative Cloud' (subscription DRM Jew they forced on their ecosystem) you'll find it running 24/7 on your desktop doing god knows what with tons of ram.
Isaac Moore
I thought it runs serverside and builds the page.
James Barnes
who do you call sweetie homo?! stop with that bullshit or else!
probably in Ruby or Lua or Dart or… js. half of these are shit… fucking russian roulette.
but maybe someone reasonable will fork python and take care.
Wyatt Myers
That's not a core function of node.js. That's just something that people have built using node.js. Either way it's still not run in the browser.
Juan Wilson
Holy shit that's awful. KILL THEM ALL REEEEEEEEEEE
Tyler Mitchell
you can't pozz what's already 99.9…% pozz.
Jaxon Gutierrez
I never claimed or believed that. I'm sorry you misinterpreted my words.
Michael Gonzalez
No, there was no misinterpretation, only you being wrong. This is like saying Java is for webpages because of jsp.
Tyler Cruz
Okay. I accept that I phrased it wrong. When I said web pages I meant web servers which host websites. English is not my native language and sometimes I phrase things in a wired way.
Kayden Phillips
And I have no idea about nodejs but I remember a thread about it where nasa hired pajeets who build a website with it and pajeets where like "NodeJS is going to space! This proves JavaScript is actually good!"
The writing is on the wall, Python's days are numbered as Julia creeps towards 1.0. Guido is wise to quit while Python is still king. It's all downhill from here.
Dylan Cooper
It's okay that you don't know who he is, but it's not okay that you decided to open your cock holster before finding out. Learn to use a search engine, you useless motherfucker.
Did this place become reddit while I was absent ? He should have said thank you and read it instead of this.
Python is a good software for newbie training in simple logic imo. Problem is that it was so massively used (to the point of replacing lecture 6.001 at MIT) that it become a shitfest of code and whatnot, simplest example of it is how much malware was discovered this year in it's packages.
Adam Harris
What are people going to migrate to from Python?
Cameron Watson
Another meme language
Brody Collins
python was good for quick scripts and its libraries for everything and the last decade has superseded perl but i know what you mean regarding the larpers who will learn basic python and suddenly are software devs. the blue hair brigade will kill the language now that its anarchy. realistically what options do we have for simple lightweight scripting languages? lisp of course but its lacking in libraries. maybe move to nim which as a bonus also rejects coc's.
Dylan Ward
matlab is shit and so julias syntax is shit too. i will stick with c++, lisp, erlang, and nim.
Carter Long
There's no competitor, yet. Go was supposed to bridge the gap between shitlangs and goodlangs but it ended up so trash that it's struggling to replace Ruby. Rust shit the bed so thoroughly that even C++ programmers say it's overly complicated with slow compile times. And Perl 6 is everything that was wrong with Perl 5. The rest are memes: lisp, erlang, nim, julia, haskell, scheme, brainfuck, D
Nathan Barnes
that means those are the good languages
Levi Hill
Javascript probably, and you always know a moron when they call it node.
Jayden Edwards
BASIC was actually a good language, much closer to the hardware than any of the modern shit languages that want to abstract everything into OO or other lame constructs. Also, PEEK and POKE, motherfucker! That's your gateway to inline machine code.
Isaiah Ortiz
This but unironically.
Grayson Jenkins
BASIC was a million miles away from the hardware. The existence of a primitive "unsafe" to escape the language does not make it a low level language.
Adrian Edwards
Actually I worked full time in Erlang for good buck some time before. And I've seen unironical job postings for D and Haskell, too.
I would like Guile to gain more traction, it is the canonical GNU extension language after all, but I fear Andy Wingo is an even bigger cuck than Guido.
Brayden Roberts
No you nigger, it gave you direct access to the entire memory and I/O ports. That's miles away from modern nanny OS and their related languages that try very hard to hide the hardware from you, because only Intel and cianiggers are allowed full access on the botnet.
Julian Myers
How is giving more people unsafe access is good? Do you want every run of the mill program to be able to re-flash your BIOS or something?
Leo Wilson
The problem I have with this is that a copy of SICP was wasted on someone who was completely hopeless.
Blake Lopez
If you like the taste of shit then I'm not going to stop you from eating it, but I won't allow you to contribute to any meal I'm making.
Jason Nelson
Welp, I did a small backend in Python with minimal import as an exercise. Will have to replace it but I'm not sure with what.
Daniel Edwards
C
Benjamin Turner
Python 3.7
Carter Bell
Why?
John Rivera
If you're convinced it's appropriate for your application you're fine.
Well it's working, but I need to leech some data somewhere and import it. For now I set it aside and I'm on another personal project.
Thanks, I'll put that in the infinite to-do list
Henry Ortiz
Julia. Don't listen to . Nim is one-man spaghettifest that's slow as hell even though it compiles down to C due to poor, throw everything into it without thinking design which makes its compiler output hard to reason about.
The author is a retard. That benchmark is garbage as it includes the time it takes for the runtime to start (this applies to even C which has to run some initial code). What it really should be doing is measuring the time from inside the program itself and also looping over what you are benchmarking many many times. Additionally, I'm skeptical about the claims he is making under the libraries section. In C it's simply just calling snprintf, but with the other language it is also showing both the call and "snprintf" itself. It also don't give any evidence that it doesn't reuse the same conversion code if you were to use it somewhere else in the codebase.
Jaxson Hughes
lol at all this retarded e-drama surrounding some piece of shit PL. I just started two new projects that are compromising by using an existing piece of shit PL instead of writing my own, and was going to go with Python, but then when I started having to subclass shit to call a function I noped the fuck out and went with SML. Fuck your stupid PLs that have all kinds of complex dynamic semantics because someone in the programming memester community came up with a "problem" that "needs to be solved" last week. Something like SML or C (if C wasn't a complex piece of shit in practice due to loose specs) in contrast is how PLs should be. They just do what you say. Once in a while you have to say 2 or 3 things instead of 1 thing, but big fucking deal, at least you know how the PL works. I'd even put Go in this list even though half of its mechanics are retarded (and it's a product of masturbation by programming memesters).
It should be well-rounded for Django, SciPy, Machine Learning and cryptocurrency applications.
Perl 6 is too damn slow, until anaconda help them it is worthless.
Python should always be faster, just like Perl 6 except they suck
Ruby, JS, PHP, Typescript, Kotlin (scripting) vs Lua, Go, Rust, D, Ada, Nim (compiled) Anyway the world just got worse
Wew and Make it happen then
Exactly
Christopher Collins
It's a MATLAB replacement, not a good general-purpose programming language.
Xavier Cox
There are a number of other existing assignment syntaxes. import ..., from ... import ..., import ... as ..., from ... import ... as ...with ... as ...for ... in ... (both for loops and generator expressions!)except ... as ...def ...(...) I'm probably forgetting some.
Camden Flores
Lua
William Anderson
It is depressing how far Python has fallen since the mid 2000s. I still use it on a daily basis, and am slightly embarrassed about it. The only languages that will still be worth knowing in 15 years are C, Lisp, Java and maybe Haskell. Also, Julia a shit.
Angel Torres
Please kill yourself.
Angel Hughes
...
Jonathan Clark
...
Samuel Rodriguez
Lua is good for embedding in another application written in C, but it is not meant to be used standalone.
Brayden Hernandez
What do you mean Python has fallen?
James Lopez
He wants everything to run in ring 0 as God intended
Daniel Davis
Seriously, people freak out about ME and PSP in their CPU's, which was designed intentionally to provide businesses with hardware level remote access to their devices, but then likewise freak out about anything that doesn't forbid users from accessing their hardware at its fundamental levels. Really boggins the noggins.
What did you think? They are either soyboys or corporate/ABC shills. Anyone who has a problem with low level languages like C is either one of them. It does not imply C is irreplaceable. But these shills does not point out any alternatives that are improved version of C. All they want is people to use their hipster languages. That's why I go extra length to ensure that their platforms are not supported in my machine. If I find it installed or enabled, I remove them or gimp them deliberately.
Ada is really shit. There's reason why the military ditched it for C++.
Henry Bennett
Yes, because C++ programmers are easier to find these days; and work for less. Ada has all kinds of excellent features that are still not used today (subtypes). GNAT is a great compiler too... I feel the language is underrated.
Carson Reyes
What I don't understand is who was the bozo that thought it's the language that makes hardware secure?
Robert Harris
Ada is the most verbose piece of shit ever made. Even the government found it too expensive to use. Stop LARPing and try to (properly) port something small to Ada and compare.
Justin Gutierrez
The verbosity doesn't distract from readability like, say, Java. Porting a C program to Ada is very hard; because while they have a focus on performance, Ada focuses on security and reliability just as much. The compiler errors can be annoying; and it does seem like a bondage and discipline language at first, I agree. But, don't forget that C makes you do a lot of boilerplate crap if you want to harden your program.
Evan Rivera
The verbosity doesn't distract from readability like, say, Java. Porting a C program to Ada is very hard; because while they have a focus on performance, Ada focuses on security and reliability just as much. The compiler errors can be annoying; and it does seem like a bondage and discipline language at first, I agree. But, don't forget that C makes you do a lot of boilerplate crap if you want to harden your program.
