dwm or i3 Firefox or any of the popular text based web browsers (w3m, links) Terminal Mpv or cmus GNU nano or Vim FEH or sxiv mksh or dash st (simple terminal) or rxvt-unicode
They can't even write curl without vulnerabilities. Depends. Fair. Depends. Obviously? Reaching here. Hardly matters, because these idiots can't even write something like curl without critical security issues.
Colton Scott
Is it just one autist here that reposts this shit? They're lolcows. Go use surf as your only browser for a day and report back.
Lincoln Roberts
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Carson Cooper
In the OS list, what is "meme minimal" supposed to mean?
Surf is bloat. Posting this from links 2.16.
Joshua Hughes
I use Emacs, it is minimal editor that comes with a lot of extensions included.
Josiah Carter
text editor*
Alexander Gonzalez
emacs is practically an operating system. It's in no way minimal.
Caleb Green
Curl wasn't made by software minimalists, though. It's a big 3MB tarball.
No. There are a lot better candidates: bspwm and spectrwm, for example. Are you joking? Add netsurf. Could add vifm, rover and ranger (if pushing it a little). You should add emacs, too, while you're at it. Why? It's a 2MB tarball when sxiv is 47KB: bloated.
Nice lack of argument, fag.
Kayden Perez
Are you blind, i did add sxiv
Joshua Morgan
What I meant is: remove feh because it's bloated garbage.
Owen King
d
Kayden Jackson
r8 me r8 me debian dwm -dillo for general browsing -chromium for stuff that requires JS -w3m as html pager ranger, terminal when I feel like mpv mpd, mpc, ncmpcpp vim sxiv bash dash st
Gavin Turner
looks pretty sane to me, ever tempted to ditch for devuan? why dillo & w3m? I've never heard of a html pager.
Jacob Jenkins
Don't forget less visible/apparent stuff:
Carter Young
970117 I'm honestly done distrohopping. Couple months ago I was using Parabola and I couldn't hanlde rolling release concept so I switched to debian and I'm pretty happy. setting up my configs all over again (which would take me a day or so for a new distro since it will have many little annoying differences that I would need to troubleshoot).. forget it. because it's as fast as terminal browsers, or even faster than something like elinks. and it displays colors and layout sufficiently to make you make sense of the page. The only thing I'm missing in dillo is keyboard link following, but I'm not sure how someone can do that without javascript. and it doesn't display some pages that would be perfectly displayed in w3m, because, I guess the (or whatever it is) is not capitalized properly, they care so much about muh html standards. I would use netsurf but its configuration is very limited and you can't change keyboard shortcuts. maybe pager is the wrong term, but what I meant is that I use it to quickly display html pages, whether local or as extensions of other terminal programs (newsbeuter, mutt, etc.), or when I want to convert an html page to text for scripting purposes.
Jackson Jackson
Not the same user, but debian and derivatives are even more pointlessly user-unfriendly than the rest of unix.
Yet its still lighter than 90% of other IDEs... Also Emacs is not a text editor.
Jack Perez
surf is an interesting but useless idea, though I'd like a browser where viewing the web is an addon to uBlock Origin + uMatrix, instead of the other way round.
Matthew Baker
And Emacs' C code base is smaller than that of Vim.
Nathan White
Go into your settings pane of either µBo or µMatrix. You'll notice that your filters list, you'll notice that some of your filters reference something called a "hosts". Have you ever wondered what that is? It's a simple plaintext file that maps hostnames to IP addresses. A popular hosts hack is to take a list of malicious and undesired domains and redirect that to 0.0.0.0 or 127.0.0.1. In doing so, you effectively prevent your computer from connecting to the listed domains, thus making the hosts file a viable content blocker–or, as you call it, an adblocker. Suckless has more commentary here: surf.suckless.org/files/adblock-hosts. It's an effective, domain-blocking solution that makes in-browser domain-based content blockers such as µMatrix redundant.
Now that I've mentioned it, you've probably heard references to a hosts file before, possibly in a negative light. One of the most notable flaws of a hosts file is that it's not a pattern-based content blocker like µBo. It's sufficient for blocking domains based on patterns, but what about cosmetic alterations? What if you want to discriminate between content provided by the same domain? It's true that surf supports stylesheet files that can be applied on a per-site basis, but that's a lot of effort when µBo can express the same thing in a monolithic but really tiny file. Furthermore, a hosts file isn't meant to be used as a content blocker, so a big hosts file will make things significantly slower.
That is why I use a web proxy called Privoxy. It's made for content blocking and thus significantly faster and more reliable than a hosts file. And, in addition to domain blocking based on an explicitly labelled domain, it blocks domains according to regexp. You can have specific behaviors for certain domains (which doesn't sound significant until you realize you can redirect css to custom stylesheets, disable js, block incoming and outgoing cookies, and specify what types of cookies are incoming all from Privoxy) and whitelist patterns in blocked domains, too. It can also modify web page data and HTTP, much like how µBo can alter web page data. It can be used individual or an a multi-user network (e.g. your router). It can be used as a http wrapper to your Tor socks proxy. It's completely browser-agnostic, portable, and much easier to deploy than having to augment a whole browser.
Basically, you're a meme.
Jaxson James
Goddamnit, I'm sick of idiots like you. Nobody is going to say someone is being minimalist because they decided to use proprietary garbage like Chromium, so what makes you think three redundant browsers makes you minimalist. I could literally use Chromium exclusively and be more minimalist than you. You use multiple shells for the sake of contrarianism, and you use multiple image viewers when you could easily use mpv to view images without the complexity. Because complexity is what you're trying to get rid of, right? This thread is about minimalism, isn't it?
Adrian Brown
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Landon Mitchell
Yes? It ignoring the fact that a hosts file is practically identical to uMatrix, you can actually just write a simple cron job to fetch and cat a bunch of blocklists from actively maintained hosts files at desired intervals. In fact, you seem to be ignoring the fact that uBo uses hosts files to do their own content blocking. Using a browser extension also makes the assumption that "multiple determined persistint adversaries" are only going to distribute their "sophisticated" content from one specific, highly-anticipated platform. Like I said, hosts files are really inefficient and kind of impotent, though, compared to Privoxy.
Hunter Jones
The issue is that the bare minimum standard for content blocking is nothing less than the best available, which is currently uBlock Origin + uMatrix. This is an arms race. This is a deal breaker on using surf for me.
Asher Cook
I do, however, use and like dwm, dmenu and st.
Thomas Rivera
Except that Privoxy is a superior solution in all respects?
Jordan Torres
I disagree, and I'm not alone on that.
Asher Diaz
I disagree with your disagreement, and I'm not alone on that.
Owen Wood
H-hai... e-eto.. I like maximum contrast so I have black on white! I can reverse the colors during night with xcalib, so I can sleep tight with normal melanin levels!
I used to think like you and stayed with Firepozz, but since I switched to Qutebrowser (which uses a host based adblocker), I've not had any problem with insufficient adblocking.
Isaac Williams
Why are you using a 32bit kernel on a 64bit CPU, tard? Don't tell me you fell for the x32 ABI meme.
Colton Lopez
Omg, I have the same exact setup. Hello, fellow dwm user!
It minimal editor that comes with a lot of add-ons to make it useful out of the box.
Christopher Rivera
lol I probably didn't even check that when downloading the iso. There are too many iso s to download from on the debian page, it's too confusing :-< Everything just works tho, and I don't want to risk fucking up my system so it should be fine like this right?
hello friendo.. wa-wait!! 58440 packages!!!!! have you fucking installed everything on the repository?
you're fucking retarded. I'm not sure if bait or not, anyways, I'll bite it
those shells are default for debian, nothing contrarian. Dash is good for writing and executing simple scripts while being POSIX compliant, and bash works just fine as interactive shell so I've never bothered changing it. Next time make sure that you put #!/bin/bash instead of #!/bin/sh at the beginning of your script to not be a pseudominimal contrarian that uses two shells! first, chromium is not proprietary no matter how much you screech, second, I don't like using chromium, but I have to use a browser with JS in order to access my school stuff. Doing my general daily browsing with chromium (uses 15% of my cpu) instead of dillo (uses barely %1 of my cpu) would unnecessarily use my cpu by doing useless shit other than rendering a page. I like how dillo displays pages so it has the same benefits as a terminal browser but also easier on the eyes. and I need to use w3m for displaying html shit on my terminal, but I don't want to use it for browsing, god dammit how is that complex? this is certainly a bait. maybe I should also stop using mpv, because, you know, you can also view videos and images with chromium. let me just fire up this bloated piece of software to view a video, see how much sense that makes? It's similarly retarded to use a powerful video player to view images instead of using a simple ass image viewer. Hold on, I think I found the pinnacle of minimalist softwares, we should all go and get the latest Chromebook!!! No need other softwares, chrome does it all anyways!!
The first point is reasonable; however, Chromium is proprietary. It has unlicensed code and downloads proprietary blobs. I was actually going to mention that, but I felt like it was implied. The difference between mpv and Chromium is that the former is a specialised application for rendering images with relevant functions and settings that would inevitably overlap with other image viewers, thus making other applications redundant.
Elijah Cook
I think you're a moron, and I'm not alone on that.
Anthony Kelly
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Jayden Thompson
Ok. Your argument makes more sense now, but even if mpv can get to sxiv's efficiency I would still use sxiv to view images. Having different software for different tasks is better in my opinion. Change these keywords (Chromium, web browser, video player) with (Konqueror, file manager, web browser), and I think it's still stupid. Konqueror is "specialized" as both file manager and web browser, so having another program for those tasks when you have Konqueror would be non minimalistic, in your opinion, am I right?
Cameron Price
Privoxy is useless if you're visiting an encrypted website or if you use Tor, unless you want to MITM all your connections and use privoxy to redirect all connections through Tor..
But that's literally the whole point of Privoxy. Don't drop buzzwords in a sentence when you yourself know that you mean significantly less than what you connote. Proxy applications like Privoxy will help prevent some kind of leak as DNS requests that don't go thorough Tor.
It's true that Privoxy won't be able to properly filter HTTPS, but my point isn't to shill for Privoxy specifically but moreso to illustrate that they don't have to be slaves to shitty, non-portable plugins. For many people on many devices, Privoxy is the one and only means of protecting themselves, making your statement about uBo very ironic. And Privoxy is necessary in order for applications to interact with Tor over HTTP. There are SSL proxies that effectively alters HTTP headers as you implied, but Privoxy isn't one of them.
However, you can stil block specific HTTPS sites with Privoxy. It's not very sophisticated, but it does everything within the capacity of an action file, which includes regexp, blocking, and redirects, making filters kind of redundant. Admittedly, Privoxy was never as graceful as uBo as far as pattern-based content blocking, and in the context of this note, it's even less graceful, but it's not impossible to achieve the same end with a custom stylesheet.
And while what you've said so far--ignoring the ironically contemptuous with no discernible argument--are valid points, how can you say that local sort-of-a-proxy service sort of MITM'ing traffic when you yourself are implicitly toting a bloated, hulking Golaith of a program with a bullshit plugin framework where people can write extensions to do arbitrary things? You know how often an extension gets pulled from the FF/Chromium repos? Pot, meet kettle.
Ayden Long
I'm sorry for being adversarial before. Thank you for being patient with me, but the difference between Konqueror and mpv is that the former combines two impertinent (not to mention inherently redundant) applications, file browsing and web browsing; whereas, videos are just images interpolated over time. Konquerors' multitasking is just the artifice of a developer trying to appeal to the kitchen sink crowd; an amalgam of two simple applications into one complex application. The role of mpv as an image viewer is a deconstruction of its single intended purpose as a video player which reveals that it's actually, in principle, a glorified image viewer, and, at both points, it's a single simple application.
Jack Jones
what web browser is that?
Gavin Lee
surf.
Jace Collins
Just use a 20 line bash/dmenu script for mounting/unmounting drives
Kevin Cooper
I wish sl hackaton reports were a bit more elaborate than "yeah, we had one." OpenBSD ones too. At least conferences gave me some videos to watch.
Also this Apple keyboard attached to notebook is triggering me.
In other word software minimalism = good software.
Blake Watson
I think you (((work in advertising))), and I'm not alone in that.
Ryder Bell
Usually wrong Usually wrong
Daniel Peterson
Pls no. I don't want that huge CoCk in my face. Use OpenBSD or NetBSD instead. They are better than FreeBSD anyway, since FreeBSD has no unique advantages over other *BSDs or Linux. In other words, there are zero reasons to use FreeBSD. pls recommend neovim or something. Is elvis (The editor) still alive? NO!! That's a big dumpster fire. Use the OpenBSD fork of ksh (or even bash) instead. Also, pls add Net Surf (not the same as suckless surf!) and dillo to the list of web browsers. And mention that lynx has gopher support. Finally, I recommend irssi for IRC.
Simple code != fast, simple code != low memory usage. In fact optimization INCREASES complexity in most cases. Fast code is anti suckless.
Daniel Hill
See also gopher://bitreich.org/scm/sacc/files.gph Irc is such a simple protocol that you can roll a usable client in ~60 lines of shell code. Now that's minimal.
Seems that slcon is just an excuse for the NEET to MEET, but OpenBSD releases detailed hackathon reports on undeadly.org.
Sebastian Hernandez
I am trying out plan 9 right now, it's pretty interesting. The one thing I am convinced on is acme, this editor is absolutely god tier.
Why did you get so mad? I'm not the user you were originally arguing with. I only pointed out that you literally can't use Privoxy to filter encrypted connections with Privoxy unless you sslstrip yourself, that would cause your broswer to complain about invalid certificates, so that Privoxy can filter crap.
Jeremiah Gomez
Sorry. It was just kind of annoying. I was sincerely trying to give good advice, and the only thing he said was "I disagree" without a rebuttal. Actually, and this is true of any web proxy, but you can actually just add the necessary certificate to your browser if that's what you want to do.
Blake Lewis
I'm using debian and thinking about switching to gentoo. Mainly because of the extreme customizability.
I want to debloat the linux kernel (don't know how) I want to know how useflags work(don't know how) compiling from source also seems like a benefit (forgot the benefits)
But yeah, if any long time gentoo user can convince and tell me it will be worth it, i'll use it.
Landon Garcia
Is cloudfare bloat? What should i use?
Grayson Allen
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Oliver Reyes
The issue is not with privoxy itself here, but with where it sits in the pipeline.
Easton Sanchez
I really like it, but I wish it had more software, because there really nothing you can do in it other than edit text files and maybe play doom. It is also hard to take advantage of it's networking capabilities, when you are running it alone.
Yes, and you don't need to have anything like cloudflare
Kevin Kelly
use a fucking radio and paper then
Ryan Long
Not a bad suggestion, honestly.
Chase Ross
I wonder how functional is Wine on Alpine. Would it be possible to run old games on it?
Jaxon Cox
I don't see why wine wouldn't be functional on Alpine. They use musl as their libc but if they can get wine compiled and working in their repos then it should be fine.
Easton Turner
best wm for me sleek minimal, no poz keys = text, so simple and precise keys = maybe text, such a paradigm shift of elegance text text text what's more minimal than parsing text to parse text to parse text, nothing Suck but less, so minimal and to the point. like don't be good just suck less, words to live by fucking cat bloat disgusting makes me want to vomit
Lincoln Wood
I think you are confused
Andrew Brown
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Samuel Ortiz
How is life without your appendix?
Parker Robinson
I have the following set up as "external browsers" in my w3m options, they allow me to asyncronously view images, pdfs, audio, & video with a painless hotkey. nohup mpv --ytdl-format=webm+bestaudio/720p --slang=en $1 &nohup viewer.sh $1 & Imgur gets special treatment because their website is popular and especially shit, but the script is still exceedingly simple because mupdf is amazing. #!/bin/kshtmp=$(mktemp -d)trap 'rm -rf $tmp' EXITif [[ ($1 = *"imgur"*) && ($1 != *"i.imgur"*) ]] then url=$(echo $1/zip | sed "s/gallery/a/g") else url=$1ficd $tmpftp $urlmupdf * Asfar as future work goes, I'm considering switching over to emacs inoder to get a bit more of a unified interface and additional scripting options for my cli applications. w3m is my only browser for a few months now. The reason I use it is that I tend to focus a bit better with it, I'm not sure why considering the content for the most part is the same. I've found myself read quite a few more books rather than doing whatever I was doing before, which I like.
This is the end user's argument for software minimalism: heavily mediated computer interfaces condition/program the user like a Skinner box. Minimalist and textual interfaces tend to do this less as they require the constant use of discursive reason.
Logan Young
This is the issue I have with firefox, where they add your "top sites" to about:newtab. Even worse when they add their cancerous suggestions. Other browsers do this as well I guess. It really enables mindless browsing. Anyway, changing it back to a blank page makes for a much more pleasant experience.
I think your setup mimics more or less exactly what "browsing the internet" should have been.
Adrian Nelson
All you kidfags are too young to realize that nothing compares to epic/epicssl with the LiCe5 script. Too busy with your Cascade of Attention-Deficit Teenagers disorder that pretend the novelty of irssi is somehow superior to what came before it.
I haven't quite finished "In the Beginning was the Command Line" yet, but I enjoyed the other two reads, thanks. I think I agree with the assessment overall, the following particularly resinated:
wow, thanks dude. It certainly still has implementation issues of sorts but conceptually I like it.
Connor Hughes
Anyone else here use vis instead of vim? Lua plugins are much more comfy than vimscript and it is way less bloated.
Also how bloated is qutebrowser? I can't handle firefucko anymore and I need a JS capable browser quite often. Been messing around with qutebrowser and it feels great to use.
Anthony King
i hate retards
Joseph White
firefox quantum is literally god tier what's wrong with it?
Leo Perez
I use vis, but I think I can go for something simpler, since I don't really use all of it's features. Didn't even touch lua parts, outside of configuring color theme once.
qutebrowser is webkit based, and as webkit-based browsers go, you might as well go use suckless's surf, imho. Webkit is rather unstable though, at least for me.
>theody.net/elements.html That's UNIX weenie propaganda, appealing to people who want to be considered smart. Nothing in that article is about what you can actually do in UNIX or what makes UNIX better, it's all about being able to feel intelligent because you can use shitty "tools."
"Regional telephone company" means a Baby Bell, which was split from AT&T.
If this article was satire, he couldn't have written this any better. He might as well say the manager took an IQ test before and after UNIX and it went up 100 points.
It's because computer scientists had a different goal than UNIX weenies. Computer scientists wanted to increase the productivity of programmers because they wanted to make their own OSes and hardware. UNIX weenies wanted to increase the licensing fees AT&T could collect.
UNIX is a weenie culture, which is neither populist nor highbrow. UNIX weenies feel superior to these highbrow academics and populist PC users because the UNIX weenies have to do more work to get inferior software. Knowing too much about Multics or another non-UNIX culture is considered a bad thing among UNIX weenies, which makes no sense, but it's true.
On one hand, UNIX weenies "came from schools with small or absent computer science departments" and on the other hand, "UNIX was the lingua franca of computing's upper crust." It only makes sense when you understand that this is meant as shill piece rather than an opinion piece. What you are supposed to get from this is that using UNIX makes you part of a privileged group that makes the rest of the world jealous.
This is more shilling because it's presented as a positive. UNIX is "difficult and time-consuming to learn" so you must be intelligent if you can learn it. You're supposed to come away from this article thinking that if you can remember hundreds of system calls and commands and all that other bullshit, you must be smart. It makes you less productive because it all sucks, but that's also a positive in UNIX culture.
This is an example of UNIX weenies taking credit for hardware technology, in this case PDP-11 terminals.
What sucks about UNIX weenies is that they only care about people who worked at AT&T. UNIX weenies have never even heard of at least 99% of what's out there or the people who made it just because it didn't come from someone at their favorite company, and it sucks.
I was interviewing with an info tech strategy/managementconsulting firm yesterday. The interviewer asked me why Ithought Unix wasn't catching on the way "it was supposedto." We had a discussion about weenie-type cultures. Hisconclusion, as an outside non-techie observer, was that Unixweenies scare off real programmers and anyone who would wantto do anything useful on a computer.I hadn't realized it was THAT obvious...
Thomas Gonzalez
That shit isn't really minimal.
Carter Reed
Just to update anyone who used my settings, I switched my video "external browser" with the following: nohup mpv --ytdl-format=webm+bestaudio/720p --slang=en --ytdl-raw-options external-downloader=axel $1 & It really improved performance but requires the exta package axel. I've also started work on a simple text editor in C (atm ~200 sloc) which in time I hope to transform into a sort of universal interface with understanding of sixel, forms, and links. After I do that the plan is to write a browser backend for it, or borrow someone else's, not sure how that's going to go.
Actually, according to a bug report, the only thing mpv uses youtube-dl to do is scrape the video information, but it's mpv that actually downloads the video, meaning that --ytdl-raw-options is basically placebo in all respects except fetching the video faster.
