Linux is a failure: Void edition

Define lean and what's the problem with systemd? Are you a troll? You are installing obscure distribution that is newbie unfriendly and then complain about it.

Me no habla espana gracias

He's scared of systemD. You need a really high IQ to fully grasp the purpose of an init and these alt-init ideologues just won't put in the effort of mastering a tool like systemD.

I wonder if Zig Forums will ever be mature enough to ignore threads like this and instead make insteresting threads or post their own projects. This is cuckchan tier at best

The Void Linux niggers forgot to renew their domain.

implying Zig Forums isn't full of LARPers

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how did you even find that distro if you dont know anything about linux systems? theres ubuntu and debian for brainlets like you.

If you don't want systemdicks, you sould have tried Devuan instead.

you think a simple text editor, network configuration, icons in file manager, "install" shortcut, automatic disk format, are bloat? those are basic things
Windows 3.11 had those and it uses few times less disk space than Void

some people managed to climb Mount Everest. doesn't mean it's easy and comfortable

how to download it when I don't have network connection? I need text editor to configure network connection, because this shit doesn't have utility to configure it

I downloaded version with desktop environment. but it doesn't have basic text editor or ability to configure network

operating system is a tool that should be invisible to user. it should just allow you to use software in easiest way possible, you should be productive and fast on it
operating systems made by unix idiots are not "for advanced users", they are simply shit, badly designed and badly implemented

lean = installer is small, contains basic software, without bloat. it has to contain tools to configure things (like network connection), one software to edit text files, one web browser, one image viewer. if user wants, he can later install additional software

it's bloat. it's made by corporation. it's malware with backdoors. it's too big to be audited. it's uneccessary.

unix idiots praised it and recommended it. but turns out it's shit. also it's systemd free, installer is small.

I didn't read that shit, I put livecd, run it, there was no Install on desktop or start menu

who said I don't know about linux? I investigated systemd free distros, read reviews about them, their FAQ

both have systemd, are bloat (few GB installer), are spyware (ubuntu sells your search data)

Devuan is bloat, installer is 4GB

Go back and fucking kys you retard brainlet faggot gorilla nigger

This thread is an obvious bait, idiots.

Holy fuck, it's baits upon baits. xD

1. Download Void
2. Install Void
3. Set pic related as wallpaper
4. Your're welcome.

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The ISO is not even 1GB, faggot.

Let's prop up the guy who let CoC into the kernel, threw Andrew Tridgell under the bus for telneting into (((BitKeeper))), is against reverse engineering of proprietary software, is for (((Tivoization))) and thinks hatred of Microsoft is a disease, instead of the man who started the GNU operating system and has fought for software freedom for 36 years.

/thread

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It doesn't come with nmcli? It does have a GUI for that. At the top right on the desktop screen usually.

...

I am a winner.

Even a white man would need to spend time researching unnecessary information to install it instead of doing more productive things. For example, instead of going to a wiki to find the command to run the installer, and typing the commands to bind mount the kernel filesystems (there seems to be a new one every year), etc., why not provide an ncurses installer that started up automatically? Slackware had that in 2002. There seems to be a lot of fa/g/gots here who think neding to type a lot of commands you read from a wiki = having ._..33t good quality distro. You are just proving the multicsfag right every time you open your big stupid mouth.

that's why unix is a failure and you will never get 1% market share

sledjhamr.org/devuan-cd/devuan_ascii/installer-iso/
CD version is 2GB, DVD is 4GB

wiki.voidlinux.org/Network_Configuration
niggers tell to edit some stupid text files, while not explaining how to edit them

also this botnet Void linux uses (((8.8.8.8))) as default DNS

Great question.

this
White, national socialist operating system should be perfectly designed, productive, should allow you to do big things like holocaust with one click
it should make you focus on doing big new things, not reinventing the wheel or waste your time on nigger manuals
unix philosophy is shit and anti-white, not surprised they attract SJW and CoC

That ISO includes a ton of stuff you may or may not need. The live ISO is ~1GB, and if it needs components not included, it will grab them online.

Holy shit are you retarded literally how the FUCK can you mess this up, IT EVEN HAS A FUCKING GUI INSTALLER UNLIKE ARCH
next time:
go to the wiki
follow instructions and download the iso, best option is just live minimal
follow the instructions that appear DIRECTLY AT BOOT
i.e the root password etc,
so login as root, run void-installer, when youre finished, reboot and do xbps-install i3-gaps dmenu urxvt icecat
read i3 wiki
YOURE FUCKING WELCOME, RETARD
for networking install NetworkManager and use vim or nano (for retards like you), stop being a bitch as nigger cattle and man the FUCK up

Unix IS shit.
Now, if you don't wanna use it, don't use it, and there is no problem. xD

Dude, you've collected probably each and every meme about newbie trying to install Linux the first time, how are you not baiting?
To answer your question, there are actual installers that you literally cannot fuck up, with sane defaults etc, but they are probably 2bloat4you, because they carry the whole X Window System with some brainless DEs and GUI libraries. I think even if I got up and tried to put together the actual GUI LiveISO right now, I would be hard-pressed to squeeze it onto the CD, for numerous reasons. It's definitely doable though.

that didn't work - try again

Network Config is explained, it's a bit complicated but just follow it. Follow these steps and edit the areas in which I use ( here: ...etc... ) yourself.

Open up a terminal and dump this

(note: you need nano or gedit to attempt this)

sudo nano /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant-( here: you type the name of your wifi device ).conf

and add the following lines:

# Example default configuration file for wpa_supplicant.conf(5).ctrl_interface=/run/wpa_supplicantupdate_config=1ctrl_interface_group=wheeleapol_version=1ap_scan=1fast_reauth=1# Add your networks here.network={ ssid= ( here: you type the name of your device again ) key_mgmt=NONE wep_key0= ( here: you type the password to the device ) wep_tx_keyidx=0 auth_alg=SHARED}

After dumping and editing that, you "Ctrl + x", then "yes", then "enter".
If it doesn't load right away, restart your pc/laptop.

If nano doesn't work, try gedit. Both are text editors. If NEITHER of those work, my dude, snap in a CAT5 and get them.

Alternatively you can try nmcli.

sudo nmcli device show (shows you your connections)

or

sudo nmcli d wifi list

sudo nmcli connection edit type wifi (will give you the option to create a new wifi connection)

type "help" to learn how to set up your own, it's not rocket science from there on. Same with wwan connections.

sudo nmcli connection edit type gsm con-name (here: type your providers name exp: verizon, sprint, att, etc)

Assuming you have an active sim card and a compatible functioning wwan card inserted, this should allow you to configure the phone number and give you a connection instantly. Press "help" for for details after the initial command. Usually you only have to edit gsm.number for results.

Someone correct my post in case I've messed something up

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Adding this.

docs.voidlinux.org/config/network/networkmanager.html

Holy fuck what do you think OP's connection even is? Did he tell anything? He didn't. Why do you configure both wifi and gsm? This makes no sense.

Stop bullying OP, he is retarded.

Options.

In case people sperg out and go nuts I guess. Was more of a general dump.

I think I may have made a mistake on the first code bar, i think you simply have to add "wpa_supplicant-wlan0.conf" but I haven't confirmed yet. I believe that's all it takes. Gotta SSH into something and test. Could be wrong.

What do you propose?

No.

Install Gentoo.

Go to
>>>/d/

No bully, just saying. Some of these things are truly self explanatory. If you, for example type "print" after most of the nmcli commands, nmcli dumps your entire connection, plain as day. And you just kinda pick out the one you wanna edit, and you use "help" to find out how to edit them.

Most things you edit are like micro steps, adding one, exiting out, saving it, confirming it, and then bam, it says success.

I don't think they're memes about noobs. Noobs have no trouble installing Void, because they just follow the manual step by step and search joogle for how to exit vi and stuff like that, and in about an hour get a "working" system, and delude themselves into thinking manually partitioning and mounting filesystems and editing config files on vim and all the stuff they're looking up will get them a sysadmin job or at least bragging rights on reddit or /g/. But it's fun for them, it's like a game because they've never done it before.
On the other hand, experienced users recognize it for what it is, a waste of time because of the maimtainers being lazy or appealing to edgy script kiddies who believe they're l33t for editing fstab and wpa_supplicant.conf, and a sign that the distro is broken unusable shit.

Never mind the sudo nano method, nmcli is probably much easier for most people. Besides, I can't even confirm if the code I typed is correct, pff. ' ^ '

That's why I said those are memes. Imagine a noob who makes every mistake imaginable, throws a fit about it and proceeds calling loonix out on how dogshit it is regarding user experience with deadly precision. xD
Speaking about fstab though, is there an actual distro out there who doesn't require you to edit it? Like, it will detect your root partition (from user-supplied data, I presume) and will do some UUID magic on partitions to set them up in the table? Or are you maybe saying that file editing is retarded in general and you should have a GUI tool for that, with all the checkboxes and shiet? I beg to differ, my man. IMO, it doesn't make much difference. You check the boxes/fill the forms or you just edit raw declarative file. No big deal (some dodgy shit with executable-like behavior in configs is pretty bad though).

Trust me, the last person who wishes OP was bullied about this is me. I went through hell trying to figure this out, even trying to install Void, I must have erased my SSD like 7 or 8 times with a boot and nuke CD and reinstalled before I just gave up and tried the virtual machine method.

Before that, I must have called verizon 10 times just to get my wwan connection up, even went to a store just to get a new sim card, i thought my old one was bricked, turns out, I just sucked at connectivity. So I found out about nmcli and realized I was doing it all wrong the whole time. I spent, time, money, gas on pointless junk, just to arrive at how stupidly simple this system is.. it's seriously painful how easy it is compared to GUI's. So I wish everybody knew how to use it, it's fool proof. It has a list of like 8 to 10 commands neatly explained in a row ("help") and you just follow each instruction in a series of steps that follow this pattern > "print" to display connection > "goto" (name of parameter) > edit information > enter > back > save.

You can also use

sudo nm-connection-editor
to display connections in GUI format and manually remove them if you created useless ones. But this only works on Ubuntu and similar distros I think, never tried on Void.

Not an expert either, just learning as I go with a lot of things.

man wpa_supplicant.conf
or
sudo wpa_cli
network={ ssid="home" scan_ssid=1 key_mgmt=WPA-PSK psk="very secret passphrase"}

Well good, most the other lines were obsolete. I tried something similar on my RasPi the other day, works great but I forgot where I read the original config online. Sadly I was using it on DietPi software and it kept erasing what I config'd. I was trying to set up a hotspot.

Fine, they might be memes, but they are not I-was-just-pretending-to-be-retarded bait, they are legit criticisms that just happen to generate a lot of "lel git gud negger" responses.
I meant editing it just to get a working install on a blank disk. But yeah, distros that are making at least a minimal effort to stop being retarded have a GUI or ncurses interface (which sometimes is more useful, like when not having a functional Xorg server or being on SSH) to set up basic partition schemes.
I don't remember the syntax for fstab off the top of my head. Do you? I know it maps partitions to mount points. But what is the order of the columns? Can I use spaces or do I have to use tabs? Does the amount of spaces matter? What was the syntax to set the flags for the filesystems again? I don't remember the command to get the UUID of my disks. Do you? How do I specify a device by UUID anyway? What if I'm on a console with no way of copying and pasting, do I have to type out the numbers by hand or is there a command that outputs just the UUID into stdout? Or do I have to roll my own with awk, sed and grep? What about a specific partition on that disk? What about the all the relevant flags for any filesystem you might use. I don't remember them. Do you? Was the name you have to use for the encrypted filesystem dm-crypt or dmCrypt? How do I specify the cipher and mode of operation for a headerless partition? How do I specify LVM partitions for dm-crypt? Are they scanned automatically on boot?
See, a well made GUI would make reading the documentation for all that shit unnecessary. It would turn a two hour job into a 10 minute job, because only the conceptual understanding of these tools would be necessary. An example of a good user interface (albeit not a GUI) is the menu used to configure the kernel. If you know a little bit about Linux you can build a functional kernel without ever looking at any documentation other than the short hints you can get by pressing H when you don't understand something. It's truly an exception in the Linux world.
On the other hand, memorizing all that fstab stuff enough that I wouldn't forget it afterwards, so that I could do it at any time without looking at the docs, would take me multiple hours over a period of days and even then I would have to review the material every couple months or so for the first year. Doing it one or two times per year just isn't enough to commit all that into memory.
I'm not saying settings should go into an sqlite database or something. I'm just saying have a good, complete user interface to modify the config files, and ideally only have a few formats that you choose from depending on which ones map best to your data and stick with them, like JSON, XML (despite the bad rap it gets), standarized CSV and so on. Tab separated files are not a good option IMO because of the aforementioned issue with spaces, some files accept it and others don't.

The man page for wpa_cli is shit. It should have a simple example that you can follow to connect to a home WP* network. The first couple times I used it I was always confused when it told me there was no network when I tried connecting to a network, right after ap_results showed the SSID right there. It took me a while to remember that I first have to "add" an empty network for the rest of the commands to work. That's the first thing that should be on the fucking man page. Every man page should have an introductory section explaining the basics of how to use the command for the most common use cases, and an examples section with again the typical use cases.
Only half the problems with Linux are strictly functional, the other half are with bad UI and documentation that is merely a list of command line flags, especially the official documentation that's shipped with the system/program and not the ever changing and sometimes inaccurate wikis for various distros or even random blog posts which people are sometimes forced to use because of a lack of better documentation.
Sometimes there's no documentation at all, like for the allowed parameters to particular Xorg drivers and stuff like that.

OP, is that you? Get outta here. xD
This isn't the answer to my question, so I'm very upset.
I don't, but man fstab does. It's very short, you should check it out.
I don't use UUID scheme at all actually. I just happened to tinker with it a bit. Before our talk I thought that the only way to do it was to work with udev device files in /dev/disk, but it appears fstab supports it somehow.
Are you on the UNIX machine from the 80s? xD
Then you should know everything way better than me.
But even if you are, you could do something really quick and stupid, like appending the output of the command with >> to the fstab, then editing the rest out with an editor.
What about it? Is GUI any better? What the fuck?
man mount knows
And man mount will be much better for the reference if you "don't remember".
Never thought about it (I don't use it), are we still in the fstab scope? 'Cause I don't think so.
You don't use LVM at all. xP
A well-made GUI for that shit would include way too many moving parts and become a maintainance nightmare. Like, you have listed all the technologies that need to be incorporated yourself. I mean, we DO need a lot of validity checks and options here, right?
It actually wouldn't. The job is still 10 minutes alright, and you do need a rather deep knowledge if you do some non-standard shit.
This is kinda bullshit. I suppose it's better than editing kernel configs by hand (which I wouldn't do because of the dependencies), but I have spent literally a week at my computer once going through each option in make menuconfig, though I had rather ambitious plans at the time. The kernel configuration is huge and even walking through its options without reading much will take you a few hours. Well, for the first time, at least.
You know, man pages are written the way they are precisely so you can quickly peek at them and make a new config.
I wouldn't mind a uniform scheme for all the configs, but that's beside the point. The point was that GUI can go fuck itself, it's not simple, it's not easier to modify (take regedit), it has no fucking advantages other than you can check boxes and fill fields.
Shit like that is the pain in the arse to type, and again, if you wanna move every config to GUI, justify its usefulness first.

So, overall, while you do have some valid points (that config ecosystem on loonix is widely diverse and needs fixing, but hey, that's bazaar for you), your general standpoint is retarded. You either have some reading problems or you're just retarded in general. Like, fuck, how do you read 99 line man page (man fstab) for 2 hours? Get the fuck outta here.

…
Though I kinda feel you on the bazaar part. Linux ecosystem is very shitty, but I think it's tied into the bazaar model itself. Like, we cannot even have a uniform build system FFS. Autotools do not please everyone. And you want devs themselves to make their configs somewhat aligned. Well, good luck with that. Or maybe you propose to be a hero and make a tool to clean up the mess yourself? Don't you have anything better to do than meticulously parsing all possible configs out there to convert them into something else for everybody to use and back for the programs? Don't think so, buddy.

but why? why?

This thread you guys... LMAO

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What are you talking about? Something I'm missing?

Sorry op, I linked the wrong code, it was definitely this one. But by now I'm sure you may have figured it out. And yeah they should have a simpler example, is why I shared the whole nmcli method.

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Void is absolute trash, stop spreading false information you retarded ricer.

mistake

Sage

Why do people hate terminals?
Is it shitty hollywood movies conditioning them into thinking that terminals are restricted to hackers and touching one as regular cattle will blow up the computer?

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...

most people think spatially. evolution has made us really good at navigating different environments, but not that great at recalling and entering different abstract texts into boxes. It's much easier for most people to process "I move the mouse to this menu, click it, then move it to this button and click that."

Terry made templeos really easy to install if i remember correctly. tbh fucking around in a command line to install a OS is pretty annoying. (Although OP is a nigger because he could used a UI) having to read shit to install it is also pretty shit. I dont want to waste time trying to install an OS when i could be using it and enjoying using it. Seems more like a hobby sort of thing to install arch or other operating systems where you have to do a bunch of commamds and shit.

Graphical interfaces are discoverable, you can just click around and figure out how things work. Text interfaces are not, you have to learn a list of commands to do anything. And most people don't like reading manuals.

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no
the only case it's true is when you choose static network in installer

shut up your stupid unix mouth. I don't know what that stupid words and symbols mean. on Mac or Windows I just click on GUI button and it connects to everything I want, those OS also have GUI text editor, not some atari/commodore-like shit
I have a life in opposition to you, so I won't waste my time for memorizing some stupid unix manuals and shit. if you want to waste your time then go ahead. but I bet that you don't even have a girlfriend. get a life, get a girlfriend, get laid. start doing real things, not wasting your time looking at stupid black screen with some magic words. after 5 or 10 years you will look back at your past and you will cry that you lost your life staring at stupid black screen. you will be miserable, you probably already are.

no. the first picture was correct, this one is wrong. I am setting cable connection, not wlan

no, I don't. looking for better OS that Void shit

void should tell how to edit a file if they tell me to edit file
or just provide GUI and tell what to click on it

because they are shit, unproductive
you have to spend 2 hours to learn nigger commands that you will use only once and forget them anyway
on GUI you don't learn anything you just click on creator and it does everything for you. you are productive

how?

No, but I might be installing fucking Arch since it doesn't give you Xorg with the installer.
Would be unnecessary if there was an ncurses interface that just let you choose the damn UUID.
Of course it is. I wouldn't have to output anything, just pick the thing off a list.
How about not needing to waste my time reading stuff that I don't care about before going on with my life?
Isn't the purpose of fstab mounting filesystems? Why should each user have to write a hacked together script to do what should be basic OS functionality?
I do, actually. It's the only way I know of that allows you to make the kernel recognize an arbitrary range of a block device as a set of partitions, which is useful for deniable (headerless) encryption.
Oh, is "maintainance nightmare" code word for "only putting the absolutely bare minimum effort"? Because if so yes, it's a "maintainance nightmare".
Weird. The first time I compiled a kernel I only took like 2 hours. Of course you don't have to read every single hint, some things just aren't relevant to the hardware you're using and you can tell just by looking at the name.
They wouldn't be designed to have to type shit in. Besides, CSV is not harder to type than TSV.
Why do you expect regedit to be easy to modify when there's no source for it available?
Because whatever nook and crannies of systemd that read from fstab are easy to modify? Have you ever done such a thing?
GUI programs aren't necessarily much harder to modify than command line programs. Maybe you're scared of it and thing it's a big deal because you've never done GUI programming. And don't present a strawman, I'm not saying programs should be exclusively GUI. I'm fine with GUI, TUI (ncurses) and readline programs, as well as APIs and web daemons. Ideally a program would have different kinds of interfaces for different situations, but as long as your program doesn't require to edit config files by hand with a special snowflake syntax you're ahead of the curve in the Linux world.
Research the concept of "discoverability". GUIs certainly do have advantages as well as some downsides.

You can't do everything on Windows without having certain knowledge. For example you can't create an extended and logical partitions from GUI, you have to use a tool called diskparted (on GNU/Linux a similar tool is called fdisk, thing on your list). Half of names on this list are things someone having basic CS knowledge should know, for example UUID, ssh, kernel. Sure if the only thing you must do on your computer is opening an 'app' or a browser, you don't have to know these things, but hey, we're on Zig Forums. On MacOS there are things you can't do with GUI either, because if you didn't know it's an unix-like OS. And professionals rarely use GUI's because they're often buggy or give you less control over what you're doing.

I mean diskpart

All the commands have help files. They're just as "discoverable". You've clearly never seen regular people use a computer. They don't just click around. They just give up and do things the longest possible way.

Terry also hated MITniggers and their fixation on hobbyist Linux distros. CLI is good when it's implemented correctly and TempleOS is actually pretty intuitive.

Yeah obviously the word discoverable refers to reading manuals. They needed a new word to describe reading manuals. Thank you user you sure do know a lot.

Now, I'm not sure about Arch, but there are probably distros that include gpm daemon. Meaning, you can copy/paste in loonix console.
Yaknow, if I installed 10+ new systems every day, I might think about it. Or maybe I just would write a script for it once, because it's easier than interfacing with some program to lookup possible block devices and make uuids out of them. We're working hot garbage bazaar here.
How about you shut up your stupid mouth? Are you telling me right now that with some mount options given to you in GUI without reference, you're gonna magically know what they do? That shit isn't self-explanatory, yo. Are you gonna squeeze that shit into pop-up hints? Get outta here, seriously.
Some encrypted block of data isn't exactly a filesystem. It could be anything, and mount would rightfully choke up if not for some other program to make actual addressing available. That's why you use crypttab or whatever.
I don't use disk encryption, because if glowers will come for me in my country, I will be just tortured to say all keys, and I am not sure about yours either. I mean, if there is a lot at stake for them, they might just torture you.
But AFAIK disk encryption is not really "hacked together" in loonix.
Also, what mainstream systems support full disk encryption as a part of OS functionality? Real mode: without strings attached? xD
Deniable, my ass.
The thing with that is that it's going to become continuous ongoing effort to incorporate all features, and the gain seems a lot smaller than the effort to put in. It's like with a Pareto principle.
I took my time to read as much as I could on every feature online. It included some hardware too, but not much. It wasn't the best use of my time, but now I know to a great degree how much shit I can actually disable.
So, 2 hours for something as "trivial" as incorporating SATA/FS/vidya drivers into the kernel? (well, that's what you could use it for in general) Sounds like waste of time for me. And, like, can you quickly pinpoint these features in that mess to toggle them, without any extra documentation, like online wikis? Guess not.
Whatever. CSV is fine, I guess. I legitimately don't care about format that much, and I don't see why you would. Typing various kinds of braces ()[]{} can suck it though.
I meant that configuration files themselves are not exactly easy to modify. Like, even when you use a GUI tool, it is actually NOT as easy as you make it out to be. There will be a lot of context switching, its purpose is kinda defeated if you have to put strings over there anyway, etc.
So, to make a better counter-argument to that, I think it's mostly the actual DESIGN of configs that is at fault here, not the fact that they are text files to edit.
One thing about Linux is that GUI (X Window System) is absolute shit here and I don't wanna waste my time coding for that. Well, outside of bare minimum. xD
Also (((freedesktop))) efforts to unify this mess somehow have failed too. Like, there are some good things to come out of it, I guess, like font rendering stack is pretty decent, but most user experience shit is concentrated in GTK/QT platforms, and they are both bad. There is still no uniform way to do screensaving/locking. The list is expandable.
It's bullshit if not entirely, then by degree you make it out to be useful. Well, for config editing, not in general. In general there are applications (not as in "programs", but as in "applying to something") where texting is either impossible or has much worse learning curve (though with greater potential in some cases, like, I think honestly inventing a mouse was a mistake, but inventing vi was great).

>>>/g/
See? You're learning how to design good user interfaces! Good boy!
It mounts the LVM pv after it's opened with dm-crypt you mong.
That's why you put your encrypted data into the free space of a Windows filesystem and say you filled the disk with urandom before creating the partition you fucking drooling nigger.
None, that's why I said disk encryption on Linux is a hacked together piece of shit. See? Even with brain damage you can figure some things out. Good job!

Laptop niggers can fuck off honestly. You fags are just a precursor to the touch screen retards who in about 3 years will be telling us all their great ideas about UI.

Get outta here with that nonsense.
There is only so much you can put into hints without turning your UI into shit. man mount is fucking huge though, so you would have to redesign mount interface too, which was mostly the point of the previous post.
That means if you took your time to configure a lot of other shit for that, it shouldn't be a problem for you to do a final step in fstab.
That looks like a recipe for failure TBH. I wouldn't have anything of importance on some traveling system, and if glowers come for you to your home, they will seize everything if they are not retarded. Thus, no sensitive data at home, period.
It has kernel support, so whatever.

Nice one.

kys brainlet