Organizing to get Power

where are the proofz billy

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Fill in where the neoliberal capitalism obviously fails the people and this creates a popular consciousness that a different way of socio-economic organization is not only possible, but also viable and beneficial to the 99%.

Food not bombs initiative, affordable housing projects, housing cooperatives, cooperative enterprises. When it comes to a housing cooperative, it would need to involve a construction company cooperative. The observation is following, the rent extraction from house ownership is an effective way of extraction and the difference between what goes from rent to maintenance and what is pocketed as pure profit to be further invested offers a possibility to make it viable to use people's crumbs to finance a housing solution where what goes beyond maintenance will be used for further capital accumulation in the hands of the cooperative.

The central thesis is that private property and capitalism are ineffective at managing the capital. I have no numbers to support it since I have no time to research this shit, but somebody else might research this and make an answer. It is all based on the observation of the parasitic lifestyle of the private property owners, and the observation that number of capitalists is decreasing. Obviously surplus extraction is the only source for capital accumulation, and if some of it is diverted into being non-productive wealth of capitalist, it is an obstacle to the capital accumulation.

So capital accumulation without the capitalist is one of possible weapons against capitalism. We could go further and even try that capital accumulation where the entirety of variable capital is extracted as surplus might also be a weapon against capital.

Accelerationism has a flaw, the existence of capitalists is the damping factor that has a stabilizing effect on the capitalist economy.

Not only dual power, but also dual economy.>>2628408

Bump

Bump

Why is "quickness" of essence here? You seem to be emphasizing speed, when you should be emphasizing long-term, permanent stability and sustainability.

because climate change and imperialism is destroying our planet too quickly

OP, I am completely serious when I say that we must have public discourse start associating communists with the working class labor movement once again. It's hard, but until we do so we're stuck with political impotence. That's why I say participating in the class struggle on a grassroots level is the most important thing you can do. Help local unions strike, help the homeless, provide support to struggling tenants, etc etc and advertise your actions far and wide. I think it is the best that communists in our current state can do, especially if you're American. It's one of the reasons I think infiltrating and subverting the Democrat Cops of America is so important. Their praxis is already pretty good, but it needs a more radical bent. Just my two cents.

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Just saying "socialism" instead of communism and using it in the same context to associate meaning may have a more positive effect in Burgerland. I don't think its possible in our lifetimes to wear off the Cold War propaganda (some of which was legitimate).

I think it bears mentioning that we must always be cautious around putting our revolutionary energy towards building orgs rather than building the strength and class consciousness of our fellow workers. Do I wish the Wobblies was a huge organization with millions of members? Yeah. I think this would be a good thing, since our goals of industrial unionism, the OBU, as well as industrial democracy would help build towards Socialism.

We must remember when it comes to revolutionary irgs vs revolution, which is the means and which is the end, lest the means become our end. Anyway, my long winded post of not-answering-your-question is over.

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To an extent the two goals are intertwined. The more members an org gets that also means more workers get class consciousness.

We can look at Spain to see how the ML org there, which was tiny in comparison even to the POUM let alone the CNT and other orgs, would come to dominate the Government. This was because they became indispensable, as revolutionary Spain desperately needed aid from the USSR. Also, they stabbed those aforementioned groups in the back. So somehow find a situation in which your org becomes indispensable, where even those who ordinarily wouldn't want anything to do with you (Liberals) are forced to come to you for aid. Get the other leftist orgs on board. Then when you're in a position of power, make sure to hold off on killing your allies until AFTER the fascists are dead. This is all hypothetical of course. What the fuck does an org of maybe a dozen people have to offer?

Now let's look at the real world as it exists now. The biggest hurdle with small orgs is to instill in its members that the situation isn't hopeless, that we can change the world together. Engaging in some direct action, however small it may seem, helps to stop the death of inaction.

After that, I'd say the next step would be introducing the basic concepts to people. Flyers, pamphlets, etc. Get the information out there. Insinuate your group at public events. Talk to people. Do informational shit, etc. Build a membership.

Class consciousness is not spontaneous. A trade-union type consciousness is, but it is up to the communist to instill that radical political character into the class struggle.

Honestly this just show how impotent the right wing is in 2018.

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marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1901/witbd/

Seems hypocritical after Barcelona.

Easy, offer a free skull mask, free U-Lock, free doc martin boots, free military jacket of random military origin, free bag of random iron on patches, free soy lattes from starcucks and a unicorn.

The philosophers have only ever changed the world in various ways, the point however is to interpret it.

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the police are the good guys in your picture

Bump

good catch. since OP is a trot, he probably does support Gusano fascists.

as an american i think one of the problems with organizations here is that they present an entire vision for society from economics to social issues. and that ultimately ends up diluting focus and actions. Not to say "lets organize with facsists" but that maybe the answer is to start smaller. Organize around a single issue and put focus on that while keeping aware that its more a loose coalition of people that agree to disagree more than a "unified left/worker pary"

perhaps a better way to say this is that, i get the impression that in modern left organizing, economics is the least developed and divisive aspect. Which is bad. PSL split from WWP over an issue of affirmative action right?

The notion of what socialism is has been spread too thin. A good idea would be an organization that focused on pushing a concrete definition of it, what exactly the plan would be(cybernetic com preferred). Which would necessarily make it more divisive but things aren't well when elon musk proclaims himself a socialist.

What you've basically proposed is an econ think tank. Well, that'd be great actually.

well yes and no, i think. I'm reminded of the chapo episode 2 weeks ago
>s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/patreon-posts/1PdDlHmLX6kFnlZEkp3d97mIm9QfzvtRX1fDOncjW8hqcIltD30oMNH-LRKjM1hq.mp3
at about 23:20 is the clip i'm going to describe, basically this socdem started a thinktank funded by patreon and now managed to get big media outlets like cnn to issue a correction about a story they ran against bernie sanders and universal healthcare. He says all he really spends is 5 dollars a month for the website and just having the appearance of a serious institution got him the power to do these things.

I'm not a socdem so I don't really care for the thinktank itself. But what could be an interesting debate is #1 is such a thing is even beneficial to them, is it making an impact, getting them closer to their goals. #2 would some marxist equivalent ever be able to have even that impact, I very much doubt it. Think it would be ignored if it could even find any opening from which to attack mainstream publications(unlike socdems who can disagree with bourgie analysis of capitalism on the level of nitpicks, a communist think tank would have the same reply to all of "abolish capitalism")

What I think socdems(and others that believe in elections) have that revolutionaries don't is markers of progress. You go out and campaign and know that what you're doing is working towards getting votes for whatever candidate or issue is on the ballot. Results are tracked in polls, there are clear reasoning behind plans of actions, focusing on specific areas or demographics.

there's a lot of theory, a lot written about and a lot discoursed about why capitalism is bad and why communism is good(and also why every other idea of communism except yours is wrong), speculations on a com future. But there's little on the middle point between those two. I want the same level of analysis that you can find on capitalism and communism but about revolution. On how specifically it happens, today.

like okay dual power but where and why. there has to be places where its more beneficial to work on some things than others. Receptiveness, etc. and how do you know those things are working? can you measure class consciousness?

to answer my own questions, I saw this video
youtu.be/GeE5WnTUsF8
which depressed me greatly but at one point he mentions talking to a group of workers that voted sanders in the primary but trump in the general. Because they perceived NAFTA as a betrayal by the other Clinton so they weren't going to vote for another one. This is the exactly the kind of thing i think we need more of. That precise information as an "in" to begin a conversation with these people about their situation and relating a socialist solution.

A part of what he says here(and someone else that did the touring the country thing), is that everybody is tired of things being the way they are. Everyone has a problem with the current state of things. And it reflects what I see when I go online. Twitter, Tumblr, Here to an extent, anti-capitalism is prevalent. We shouldn't underestimate that trumps campaign had a lot of undercurrent of anti-capitalism(all of which he ignored once in office obviously). And now the other day with Fox News airing segments about how jeff bezos is exploiting americans by underpaying his workers(again by the end of that segment the solution given was "stop welfare to force him to pay more" but still).

The youtube channel PhilosophyTube made a video on this the other day, the "liberal communists" that are critical of capitalism while still being capitalists. Yet I'd also count that channel and all this whole crop of new anti-capitalist youtube channels among them. I'm not the only one thats noticed that right? Even muke getting in on the action. What i'm saying is what is the response when anti-capitalism is the main ideology of the day. Shouldn't tactics change a bit?

If handing out flyers is good isn't there some way to do that better with the internet? It costs almost nothing to build something here on the web so why isn't any? Is what we're going through right now building consciousness? because it doesn't feel like it. I participate in these things and seeing you know people share, reblog, etc things about the failings of present and better ways but it doesn't seem to lead to anything. Like its all supporting the continuation of the system at the end of the day.

I don't want to come off as defeatist but it just seems there's something missing. That thread we have here about watching the stock market prices is a good symptom of what I mean. People there want something and the closest they get is watching the lines go up and down, even though someone in there(and in other places) have mentioned that recession is more likely next year going by other indicators.

It feels like those old threads on /v/ where someone wants to make a video game and there are a bunch of ideas but no one wants to do the work. Except I don't know if we have that much. The other day that jason unhrue video about deeply triggering and problematic rhetoric "splitting the movement" or whatever. Motherfucker what movement? Show me the split, wheres group A and group B? what were they in the middle of doing when they got split?

Believe it was Alenka that said "when people imagine the end of the world, its not our world they imagine ending but some idealized version of it". I think its the same with complaints about hurting the movement and all that. We'd be in a better position if there was something to be split than we are now. I come here not because i'm anti-pc but because its relatively dogma free. If something new, something that could get all these people that are already anti-capitalist working towards some marker closer to communism, i think it'll come from here.

A kind of intermediary, someone or something that can reach out towards both jason and the type of people that dragged him, (and for that matter all the conflicts within anti-capitalist thought) and without any judgement just put forth like "here's where somethings happening, why it should interest you, you participating or not?" maybe even "how others help you with what you want to do?". I might just be dreaming of something that can't exist.

To not be a hypocrite, here's an idea I had for the person that said
alright so a way to translate cybercom into a legislative goal would be to propose aiming for a constitutional convention, where we'd change only the one thing, where it says to create a mint/federalbank to handle money. Change it to say the mint now handles the economy through labor vouchers. Done. Polish up the language obviously but thats the idea.

I don't expect that to happen obviously, but its a way to present cockshotts ideas to people who are adverse to armed revolution. And perhaps then when a majority of people have this concrete vision of another way to live after capitalist, they'll be disappointed when its not allowed to happen legislatively.

DEATH TO AMERICA

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good posts.

To update on what I wrote there. I've since decided the current best thing I can do is spread awareness of cybercom. The thing I most end up coming back to is the failure of occupy wall street. And there the problem more than anything was no concrete demands so i'm doing this in hopes of not having that repeat. Maybe if there's enough success, cybercom will come to be seen as the default communist position.

Need help though, im actually not good at writing or things like this, if anyone from this thread is interested.