How legitimate was the 'reunification' of Germany, legally speaking? Doesn't it still exist in some Cuban island somewhere? There was a legitimate reason for Germany to be split in two, you know, the Nazis and all. How did the events take place exactly that led to the fall of the wall? Was it a early CIA/NATO backed color revolution or were Soviet Intelligence elements also involved? If the dreaded Stasi was so ebul, why didn't they intervene against them? What if DDR continued to exist today and went full Juche, somehow and like North Korea, aquired nuclear weapons? Would they be a rouge state? Even today, East Germans seem to be vastly different from West Germans, both culturally and even in ethnic/state terms if we want to get in the specifics and seem to be a lot closer to Eastern Europe then the West. There's even a quite large Russian minority present. The post-SED Die Linke Party and the far-right AfD are mostly popular in the former GDR which seems to lead me to believe most of the revolutionairy potential against Neoliberalism is in Eastern Germany. Does all this mean East Germany a victim of Western Imperialism from West Germany? Can National Liberation and East German Seperatists be memed into a reality, could it even spark a Donbass-style situation that Russian ☭TANKIE☭s could get involved in in case of a civil war? It seems like the only way to promote Communist political feelings again, a lot of West Germans, both Liberal and Reactionary look down on the East as da west german man's burden. There is even a term for pro-GDR feelings, Ostalgie.
Pic related, the far-right Chemnitz protests in Eastern Germany.
Another thing, unlike a lot of other post-communist societies ala Poland or Czech Republic, DDR seems to be poorer.
Cameron Ramirez
the DDR got the short straw during reunification, just like they did after WWII when they had to pay the most war reparations. it's been hard for them to properly reunify and to adjust to capitalism, and is why i fear the same thing happening if the DPRK ever reunifies with the ROK.
Ian Russell
I don't think the DPRK will ever truly reunify with ROK, simply because of geopolitics. Unless maybe the PRC collapses or something. None of the powers in East Asia want a strong re-united Korea under Socialism or Capitalism. The U.S bases in Korea would probably be put into question.
Mason King
A lotta questions there bucko. German reunification happened acutely because people kept on going to holiday in Czechslovakia and then entered into the BRD embassies. What the Issue government decided was "we will let some more people go but we will control it", those that couldn't get a visa to the west just continued doing the aforementioned thing. So one day, the SEE decides it will let far more people go. There is a press conference. They ask the bloke making it if they will need visas, he says no. They ask when it will start, he says "immediately". People are like WOAH that's pretty radical. 30 minutes later they realise "FUCK THE WALL IS MEANINGLESS NOW". The rest is history recorded up in shitty camcorders. My father worked a newsroom floor in the west (he isn't German, no) and saw the ticker come in with the press conference before he headed home. It was only when he was in the car he realise that the Berlin wall was about to come down. He knows the bloke that first reported it as such. Now all this occured due to increasing protests: especially in Saxony. However these protests weren't driven ideologically by anti communism (at a load of these marches one could see PRO SOCIALIST banners attacking the SED for not being socialist enough), nor by liberalism, nor by capitalism: but by nationalism, and by nationalism specifically cultivated by the SED. One of the common protest slogans was "Deutschland Einig Vaterland": a line lifted directed from Auferstanden aus Ruinen. The more I study the protests in the late 1980s, the more I realise that the people didn't want to kill socialism: they wanted to improve it. It is perhaps the great tragedy of the 20th century that it came to collapse rather than improvement. Regardless, socialism isn't tarnished in Germany like it is in other eastern bloc states: mostly since the Ossies still kinda support it. You see the DDR is remembered by most there as something positive, just with bad foundations. It echoes back to the reformist nature of many of the protest movements, the Ossies didnt hate the DDR, just its leadership. Wagenknecht was an SED member, she literally wrote a pro Stalin thesis and is pretty damn ossie, yet she is one of the most liked political leaders in Germany. You wouldnt see that in Poland.
Slightly more complicated than that: the East has had more investment, but not much economic restructuring. As such, all the buildings are nice and done-up and the transport links are great but unemployment is at 10% in some states. The only "success story" is Berlin itself but that has lots of different things going for it.
Henry Thompson
Why did they want to keep going to Czechslovakia for Holiday? Was it because it was a socialist paradise or because they liberalized and you could go to the west there by proxy? Also, the Nationalism you're refering to is German Nationalism, right? I think if East German Nationalism was promoted by the hardliners, the state could of survived. Did the DDR Establishment just get out of work after this shitshow? Continued to work for the Russians as agents in Germany? Like the CEO Nord Stream AG*, or maybe part of them just integrated in the new system.
They went to Czechia as a means to get to the west, sorry should have clarified. I mean German nationalism: Wir Sind Ein Volk was another major protest slogan. Ossie nationalism was a joke: literally the Westerns trying to take down old traffic lights did more to create and sense of common eastern identity than the SED ever could. Most of the SED establishment got let off the hook. Honnecker was done for corruption but was let off because he was basically dying. No one got done for "crimes against humanity", the only thing that came out were the STASI files but that was about it. A lot of former issues went into politics, as I mentioned a young Wagenknect (she was in her early 20s when the wall fell). What do you mean keep working for Russia though?
David Rivera
Tbh I wouldn't mind reviving it, they kept homosexuality out and allowed for the formation of beautifull families that followed a strong tradition shaped by the catholic catechism.
I should have said christian, you would be correct , still they provided a great foundation for a traditional lifestyle away from the decadence of the west.
Damn this really sounds like a place I would love to be in.
Is that as far as you've read that section, incel?
Grayson Taylor
What else is there to read? I have seen it! The solution is neither fascism nor "liberalism", if tradition must be saved it will be through communism.
It is the fault of the lack of a spine to stand out against the western decadence that lead to such writings being banned, like Castro once said you can not be a communist and a homosexual.
Chase Brooks
they legalised homosexuality in 1968 and were one of the most sexually progressive countries in the world but sure if imagining socialism as some le based traditionalism helps you sleep at night whatever
Brody Rodriguez
Hmm…I guess I thought the Socialist patriotism of the DDR would of been above petty german chavunism. Kinda like the DPRK's extreme commitment to socialism but nowhere as strict. International Socialism and Socialist Patriotism don't contradict. And as I said in the OP, National Liberation type of Nationalism is more legitimate and less toxic. All these right-wing nationalist stooges working for Israel complaining about muh muslims, while their far-right ideology is just as oppressive. Socialists actually know the problem is Porky and his lack of regard of upsetting the balance, getting more slave wage labor, also chaos is good for business. Yeah those traffic lights are pretty cool. I'm pretty sure Honnecker died in Chile, and joined the KPD so the KPD would probably be the most legitimate claim to successor of SED ideologically unlike the Succdem Idpol-pandering Die Linke. I meant working for Russia because Russia was the driving engine of the Soviet Union and the Socialist World in general. The Eastern Bloc/Warsaw Pact states are generally accepted as being sattelite states. Not exactly puppet states since they had more or less autonomous elements. Russia is also seen today as the successor of the USSR, and maintains it's anti-US, anti-Imperialist stances. The Stasi was intertwined with the KGB, whose successors are in Russia.
Actually they're one of the most Athiest places in Europe and the world in general.
castro also later apologised for his statements about homosexuality and blamed himself for their persecution
Jonathan Flores
Of course, when you have the western media depicting that event has something bad and you need to save face you can hide your true intentions and say how it is your fault.
Dylan Rogers
that's stupid 4D chess bullshit and you know it
Anthony Gutierrez
It is called being smart, do you think any Stalinist would actually feel bad if 10 million kulaks had actually died by their hands?
Jason Garcia
Socialist progressivism is neither oppressive and backwards traditionalism nor is it neo-liberal third-wave feminism. Why is it so hard for Zig Forums-types to understand? Actual feminism as followed in the GDR and other socialist states were pro-women rights, while modern-day SJWs are all about whoring themselves out, lack any revolutionary disipline to a cause, and enjoy their Porky degenerate pass-times like Weed etc, all the while claiming to be Leftist by promoting CIA 'New Left' garbage. They don't care about actual workers rights at all, which is why people are voting for the crooked right.
Angel Baker
Oh can you explain to me a bit better about the feminist stance on the GDR? Actually interested and a bit on the line.
Yes I will drop the shitposting for now but for once in my lifetime I am actually considering communism as the only way out to actually be able to have a happy family and not slave myself under a wage.
Carson Green
Tolerance towards homosexuals is different from LGBT Identity politics of the 21st century.
Connor James
yes and? i never said this. i'm saying they were more progressive about homosexuality than any other country at the time.
Liam Thomas
The only real progressive stance on homosexuality is to not care at all, what was practiced in most socialist countries while the West went from GOD HATES FAGS to the idpol nightmare we have now
Noah Howard
I just wanted to add that because right-wingers like to conflate it with muh gay agenda and libtards. They seriously think all this idpol stuff is the end-game of gommunism.
Ryder Howard
It's unironically is. Socialism will lead to less d*generacy and less divorce.
Jaxon Torres
son of anarchy broke
Samuel Rivera
It is the best way to achieve it.
Capitalism will fall and only then will we finally get rid of everything that has been breaking apart families for the last 100 years.
You guys will solve the alcoholism, the wage slavery, the prostitution, the divorces. Hell what is not to like in socialism when you can contribute to the collective while having a lovely family that is not under the threat of being run out of a house by a greedy landlord?
Ian Fisher
According to studies one of main reasons for divorce is economic related. Biggest reason for what Zig Forums considers d*generacy is profit. Shortly put tits are shown on tv, because it earns money. There will be far less emigration.
Jordan White
Pretty similar to the Soviet model in a nutshell. Sexuality was not taboo in the repressive, conservative way. Nudity was a thing, but not in the perverted way like the West, more of a naturalism. I feel like western feminism promotes sexual fun instead of freedom, and pagan-style sexism like 'Goddess worship'. It also seperates Man and Woman from each other, Porky likes to Divide and Conquer this way, through psychological means.
This actually sounds quite fantastic in a way, it directly allows a woman to take a job but at the same time leaves her with the possibility to actually take care of their child and create a beautifull family.
What were the stances in terms of religion? I guess they allowed abortion just like in the USSR right?
Chase Hughes
Abortion in somewhere like Romania had a complete shut-down. They practiced a kind of National Communism with those natalist policies. Kind of like North Korea. But those policies were extremely unpopular. The DDR was the crown jewel of the soviet bloc, and like most socialist countries it was generally legal with some neccesary restrictions.
I guess the biggest war I will fight for now is with myself and in what to believe, damn you guys and your appealing socialist countries
Benjamin Martin
Read Engels' Origin of Family and Private Property (it isn't what you expect)
This is pretty on point, sexual hedonism =/= sexual freedom. We can already see how sexual "liberation" in the West has looped back on itself creating a new generation of preachy prudes who think all sexuality is sexist, homophobic and rapey
Andrew Garcia
Well you shouldn't really trust anyone ultimately at the end of the day. But the benefits of a socialist society are as clear as day, the stats back it up. Usually propagandists on every side will give you a simplified way of seeing things and won't get nitty-gritty deep into anything as doing so destroys the propaganda value. Anti-communist propagandists lose with anyone armed with a fucking book. There is a real conspiracy out there to hide inconvinent information through any means neccesary. Our world is fucked beyond imagination.
People talk about the differences between socialist and capitalist cultures, but I dunno. German socialism is going to be very… German. And American socialism is going to be very American.
Russians are gonna act like Russians. Marxists are prone to thinking of culture as something that can be socially engineered and maybe you can do it a bit on the margins, but I think we overestimate our ability to do that.
Do you think Russian, American and German cultures appeared out of thin air or they were shaped by the material conditions those people lived in?
Lucas Davis
'American' culture is an oxymoron tbh. And if it does exist, it's an abomination of a culture that is uncompatible with socialism and is fundementally capitalist at it's roots. Yes, culture can be socially enginneered. The CIA has shown us that, they've been behind the vast majority of supposedly organic and grassroots cultural changes in America. Heck, the urge to eat fucking bacon and eggs is social engineering, look it up.
The proper Marxist answer would be the material conditions. But still…
Good point. The immense amounts of cheese in the American diet too.
Hunter Phillips
if you speak german check out mfs-insider, the KPD on youtube and Kurt Gossweilers works on revisionism and subversion
Jonathan Ramirez
oot but since you posted this image did you know that americans actually threw this pest of potato bugs into east german potato fields to ruin the harvest? it's why those bugs look the way they do, it's not just an american flag for the sake of it just some trivia thought i might share polite sage
don't have any good one, sorry for that there's only a few articles crying "propaganda!", and i don't know where i'd look for english sources since it's more an issue for the socialist sphere at least i'll give you the wiki en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_against_the_potato_beetle
Ryan Parker
i fucking kidding me? The DDR had more women rights then even modern day Germany. take your incel autism elsewhere.
Gabriel Wood
People in first pic are fucking reactionaries who unironically buy the Burger memes that the BRD is a Communist state and da wyatt man needs to fight it
John Nelson
lmao there was a higher divorce rate in the DDR then in west germany. fantasy is fantasy i suppose
Grayson Lee
Shut up and prepare for your public evisceration.
Cameron Reyes
Not even an AnarchoCunt but seriously read Stirner
Nathaniel Martin
Abrahamic Family structure is an anomaly throughout history and it matters little if the institution of Marriage ceases to exist
Levi Foster
indeed people are naturally inclined to leave relationships they are unhappy with
Anyway the Idea of Basing a National Identity on the "Idea" of the DDR as a Separate Nation from Germany is silly because even the goverment of the DDR recognized germany as a Single Nation divided between two states the Issue wasnt guaranteeing East German Independence from West Germany it was just a question of what form the Re-Unification should take
Honecker attempted to Change this in the 80s with the Basic Treaty and attempting to create a "East German" Identity Separate from German Identity but it ultimately failed The only other groups that promoted East German Supremacy were the East German-NDP and the "Socialist Reich Party" which was funded by the DDR / USSR to act as a Nuisance in the BDR
The fact the DDR falls before the USSR croaks is telling.
Without Big Brother propping it up, nobody gives a shit.
David Reed
the DDR fell because Gorbachev literally intended it to and supported the ousting of Honecker and the Old-Guard in favor of Pro-NATO SocDems
Michael Lee
Yeah, because Gorbachev is God and can will something to happen.
What are they going to do? Force the army to stop the mob from destroying the Berlin Wall?
Brayden Phillips
This has more to do with people in the east marrying earlier then in the west in the beginning due to programs revolving around reconstruction and raising the birthrate. People married out of convenience to both support their families by qualifying for programs and for stability. It was only after things stabilized did people leave each other as quite a few were in unhappy relationships (not all, a significant number)
Not that guy, but this has little to do with divorce rates. The extended family model is the one that has been in use for the majority of modern history.
The DDR actually paid up more in reparations then the west and contributed more to the Warsaw pact military wise then it received. Though I'll agree that without USSR support it opens up the west to making more direct demands and involve its itself more in East German politics thorough direct interventionist methods and through aid and assistance to more "liberal" movements without fear of retribution. The activists who participated in demanding the fall of the wall were actually quite few in number and more of your hippy, idealistic, liberal "peace and love" types rather then your hard-line "up in arms" types and only really began tearing down the wall after the now moderate government declared it defunct which led others to gather to witness.
Camden King
The annexiation itself was legally correct (the GDR voted for a new parlament which voted for the reunification, although there might have been collusion because the campaign was heavily financed from the West) what was the dubious part of it was the fact that they declared Germany "reunified" after it, which would have demanded a national assembly for a new constitution (on the other hand they couldn't not declare it reunified because the regions in Poland and France could not be claimed because of political reasons [Nazi past]). The Grundgesetz (German constitution) was specifically designed for a transitional period and there was an article that clearly stated that if Germany is to be reunified, a constitutional assembly is to be elected like in 1919 that would make a new constitution. Obviously, the political class was afraid of that, especially with all those Ossis now being able to vote. So what they did was to just scrap the article and make an international agreement (2+4 agreement) that declares Germany as unified and independent. This was betrayal. If you bring this up in Germany today, they declare you a tinfoil nutcase despite most law professors agreeing on this.
As for the Treuhand (the organization that was supposed to redistribute the GDR's people's property), there is no law against being a cunt. They dismantled most plants because they "weren't profitable", caused the economy to go down the drain with skyrocketing rates of unemployment. Most East German assets went to cronies of Kohl (chancellor of Germany, known for his corruption and embezzlement of party money). After that German porky did invest in the new market of East Germany, and every state would be required to pay the "Soli", to build up East Germany again. Of course this is the logic of capital, to dismantle things only to build them up again in its own fashion (for heavy industry Germany is imperialist to take care of that, that's why the GDR's productive forces were scrapped), and there was definitely also a notion of humiliating the former enemy in the East by destroying the Palace of the Republic for example, a great building in Berlin that would host the parlament and also entertainment, bars, theatres, etc. - in its place they are currently building a literal feudal castle to bring back some Prussian nostalgia to Berlin to remind the people never to question their masters again.
I am a (East-)German leftist and I thought about bringing a GDR flag on the next demonstration, but I swear I would get shut down for this cause muuuh authoritarianism and muuh nationalism and muuh Stasi. Instead of doing something that would really recruit the "normal people" the left is constantly renouncing the DDR and waving "Die Linke" flags which will impress noone. But when you hear what the people say quietly and in private most of them here know that life in DDR was better than it is now. I am the guy who is singing the soviet anthem in the first row btw, Freundschaft
Jonathan Reed
Go for it. Attitude seem to have changed dramatically during last 4 years. KPD had been getting far less flak for Stalin lately.
Colton Perez
I'm a west german, born shortly after the German reunification, but looking at our history I can't help but think that the the collapse and annexation of East Germany wasn't for the better. The DDR had massive deficits when it came to democracy and justice but with some reforms it could have become something much better than the national-capitalist nightmare the countries heading towards under the watch of liberals and self proclaimed "moderade" conservatives like Merkel who seem to be perfectly fine with Nazis taking over the country.
Joshua Adams
Is speaking positively about the GDR really such a taboo even in former GDR territory? Do people get into trouble with the government for supporting the GDR apologetically or is it more a case of Ossis trying to avoid backlash from ignorant Western liberals? I would say to bring the flag next time, but then again I'm not the one who would be getting shit for doing so. Maybe if more GDR symbols were present in modern leftist groups it will stir something in the population. As you say, Die Linke's leftist iconography is not exactly up to par and will inspire no one.
… definetly not, it's very common even it's more of an issue in the west a party such as the PdL worries about their representation there, so "communists" who are left in there are being suppressed
well, we even have a "revival" of "Marxism Leninism" and even suggestions to read Stalin in the DKP it seems things turned to our favor to some degree
East germany was more progressive than the west. Including decriminalizing homosexuality, it did it years before the west did.
Josiah Cox
they also didnt allow the church to rape orphans or have women be under the thumb of their husband in all matters, from picking a job, refusing sexual favors or simply demanding a divorce
Chase Scott
Repeat after me.
First-world countries possess no revolutionary potential.
If you guys can manager a DDR revival I might just move there from swampland, genosse.
Also sacking of berlin when?
Evan Bailey
I just looked this up and apparently the steel from the building was sold to the UAE to help construct the monstrous Burj Khalifa (with borderline slave labour). Pretty disgusting.
well, besides being completely wrong in your assertion, the eastern areas are depopulated, deindustrialized, far poorer than the west and pretty much our very own backyard third world federal states so eat my ass
where?
Andrew Hall
East Germany was part of the Eastern Bloc during the Cold War therefore it is technically still a Second-world territory so you're actually factually wrong there buddy.
The "official" reason was asbestos in the was, but under the hand everybody knows it was a political reason. Even the people in charge back then admit that.
Chase Sanchez
Here is the thing about the GDR flag: It's socially acceptable as a meta-ironic "Ostalgie", I see GDR flags at stuff like music festivals, people come to festivals with their old Trabbi, etc. - but once it becomes an actual political statement (like going with it to an actual demonstration) it becomes a huge deal. But yeah, bring it. It's not illegal as long as you don't bring a over a dozen US military bases in Syria flag (that shit gets you arrested).
Ro.java, Y-P-G, flags etc. are outlawed in Germany since last year.
Eli Jenkins
I bet a lira the eternal T*rk was behind this.
Ian Kelly
Offical reason was their association with the PKK which is listed as a terrorist organization, which is legally dubious because the US has given material support to the Y'P'G which would mean that we should now also ban the flag of the US.
Of course, everybody knows it was just to creep into Erdogan's anus, so he won't open the refugee floodgates (which would probably crash the ruling coalition).
Isaac Rivera
Yeah, after they demolished it they tried to get rid of other stuff and the Ossies successfully stopped it. To this day Karl Marx and Fridriech Engels look towards the Brandenburg Gate, the Applemen guide people on the roads, and Marx looks over Chermitz.
Hudson Ward
Never thought I'd say this: based Ossies.
Zachary Myers
There were two options for reunification: One being the one you mentioned which entailed drafting a new constitution, and the other one being a workaround, that any state can join the FRG by a vote. So technically what happened was that the GDR dissolved itself into 5 states, which then joined the FRG. This was of course done so that the Ossis could not influence the course that Germany went. If there were a new constitution, Germany would probably be a permanent Soc-dem or Dem-soc lite state which wouldn't go well wit the CDU or with NATO.
Zachary Morgan
Does the modern FRG not count as socdem?
Xavier Mitchell
not so much since Schröder, but compared to burger standards, probably still
Brayden Cook
What I mean by permanent soc-dem is that even if a neoliberal party like CDU is to come to power, they couldn't easily destroy the social welfare provisions like they are slowly doing now with austerity measures and that the SPD would still be a genuine socdem party, not the neoliberal monstrosity it is now.
Julian James
Not anymore. SPD introduce Agenda 2010 under Schröder, which resulted in massive reduction of the welfare state, we have austerity programs and low wages, increasing homelessness (higher than 1% now), every fith child lives in poverty, unions were neutered recently with the Tarifeinheitssgesetz in 2015 (brought in by the SPD, again). It's still better than burger standards like explained, and probably better than the majority of Eastern Europe.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_reunification#German_Reunification_Treaty The reunification contract was done between the GDR government and the FRG, not between the five new states, but the GDR joined a five new states which was decreed half a year earlier. The reunification went via article 23 of the Basic Law, but the problem is that they have duped the Basic Law by not forcing the GDR to accept the GDR, but rather made an amendment to the Reunification Treaty that the GDR itself declares to adopt the Basic Law just before the unification is realized. It's foul trick that doesn't fly when put under scrutiny.
Secondly, and this is more important: Even if the joining of the GDR by article 23 was correctly performed, there is no way a claim to the German areas within the borders of 1937 is completely unfeasable, politically and geopolitically. Germany is de facto reunified, which is the decisive factor in constitutional law. If you'd ask the Federal Constitutional Court (BVerfG) they would have to straight-up tell you: Yes, Germany is de jure and de facto reunified. Yet, article 146 still exists - the Grundgesetz (Basic Law) has outlived its transitory character and needs to be replaced by a new constitional assembly. What has the government said to this? This is completely nonsensical. The Basic Law is crystal clear in it's formulation, and even when we do a teleological reduction (a method in German jurisprudence to interpret a law), the authors of the Grundgesetz, like Carlo Schmitt, have stated that the Grundgesetz is transitorial. Furthmore, God is in our preamble, so to think that the preamble has any legal effect is completely preposterous.
Nicholas Davis
is not completely unfeasable*
Benjamin Hill
Sorry if I am being a brainlet, from what I understand from your post is that they amended article 23 so that the GDR could as a whole accept the Basic Law and reunify that way, am I correct? Or did they bypass the amendment by stating in the treaty that the GDR as a whole accepts the basic law? If it is the second one then that is extremely deceptive and contrary to the spirit of reunification. I was not arguing with the fact that the Basic law is outdated and Germany needs a new constitution or with the fact that Germany is both de jure and de facto unified. Also the part about the preamble is not me.
Jaxon Bailey
The unification contract states with article 3 that the GDR accepts the Grundgesetz, and at the same time, article 23 in the Grundgesetz is to be abolished. Technically the GDR would had to join first and then adopt the Basic Law, but that was not done and the article was erased from the constitution. There was no article 23 anymore so the question quickly became irrelevant. They also changed the preamble and the article 146, and this is deceptive because the article 146 would probably have been proteced by the "enternity clause" that you can not change the basic organization of Germany and the character of the Grundgesetz. To think that 146 is just some joke article, as it was treated by the authorities, is disgusting.
They replaced the article 23 with a complete different one (about EU stuff). By changing the preamble and agreeing to the Two Plus Four Agreement Germany is officially reunified and legally forbidden to raise any claims to the areas which belonged to the German Empire in 1937. Accordingly, 146 was overhauled as well.
You'd think somebody would file a claim against that, and yes, they did. But guess what, the BVerfG in 2000 didn't even make a decision about that! They rejected the entire case as something that "only federal institutions can sue for". In 1993 the court said "there is no indication that 146 would entail the duty of the state to organize a national assembly or a referendum, from a historical standpoint". It's quite a joke, "historical standpoint", what is meant by this?
Dylan Martinez
Wait, so if they abolished article 23, by what constitutional basis except for article 146 can they justify the reunification? Also, did they overhaul the constitution so that they would not have to call an assembly like they needed to? Wow, the reunification is even more scummy then I thought. Also the historical standpoint argument is a meme, if they never used the article, how could they claim a historical standpoint. It is hilarious, angering and saddening at the same time that the FRG went this much to deny the Ossis their right to influence Germanys path.
Matthew Martin
By changing the fucking preamble out of all things, not allowing the BVerfG to properly decide over the case (although it has already signalled it won't touch it) and by completely changing 146.
It still calls for an assembly but it's a bit more murky, "only declatorial" according to politicians and judges. I assume you speak German, so check it out yourself: The old 146 The new one
