What is fascism

ML got their support from the peasants and workers while Mussolini got his support from captains of industry.

- class collaborationism

- aesthetization of politics

- appeal to some mythical "golden past"

- radical anti-enlightenment

- anti-capitalism through emotional appeal for "the good of the state"

- anti-communism, anti-materialism, anti-liberalism

- (usually) anti-semitism

Correct answer

As per Dimitrov's definition (the one accepted by Communists more than 80 years ago and still recognized as the definition of Fascism):

open terrorist dictatorship:
Odessa massacre is textbook fascism: extralegal violence (not restrained by laws in any way) is publicly broadcasted and normalized. Police just stands there, as people are being tortured, burned and beaten to death. Survivors are arrested and held in prison for more than 3 years until it is established that they are not actually accused of anything. Then they are nominally released (some are immediately arrested afterwards "for reasons").

Basically, population knows that laws don't matter and gangs hired by Capitalists rule the day.

most reactionary, most chauvinistic and most imperialist:
Proper description would be long, but simplified version: most anti-Socialist, most emotionally charged, and most aggressive against the foreign Capitalists.

elements of finance capital
Part (not necessarily all) of Capitalists who control both banking and industry (that's how "finance capital" is understood, not just finance in modern sense; better explained in Lenin's "Imperialism").

NB: specific ideology (Nazism, Falangism, or whatever else) doesn't matter (can easily be changed) and exists only to justify Fascism itself.

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They were Marxist-Leninists who created a Vanguard Party and played the Capitalists into their hand and then used them, it wasn't the other way around like how everyone thinks it was.

Tell me one other way you can seize control of a 1st or 2nd World nation without paying lip service to Capitalists.

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Without Conquest like the USSR conquering Eastern Germany, Communists who worship the Proles have only seized control of 3rd World nations.

the aspect of finance capital is clearly outdated. The essence of fascism is to differantiate between "parasitic capital" and "creative capital".

They didn't "play" capitalists, they dropped on their knees and started sucking capitalist cock while purging anyone who questioned industrialists running roughshod over their country

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and i live in that country. sometimes i think ukrainian fascism have only one purpose - to find scapegoats on which blame failure of american(european) dream…

What does this even mean? Marxism-Leninism has only existed since the 1920s, the communist movement has existed for much longer.

You are deluded if you think that you can seize the MoP from Capitalists without either a near almost certain suicidal battle or sucking their cock hard.

Let's look at the Commies and Fash

Suppressed trade unions, even ideological allied ones, nationalizing them, violently if necessary: both, (Lenin did this, not Stalin)
- Destroyed opposition both left and right: both
- Antisemitic campaigns driven by anti-banker sentiment during 30's Depression: both
- "Class collaborationist": arguably, both (you were a "Worker" if you were a member of the "Worker's Party")
- Experimental with actual economics: both, see NEP, market socialism, Italian Fascisms development from liberalism, to Keynesianism, syndicalist bureaucracy, then almost full state ownership of enterprise
- Disdain for "social parasites" of the lower class: both
- Nationalistic sentiment: Stalin, Mao, Kim
- Obsessed with the future, creating a New Man, new forms of art and culture: both
- View of society transformed radically into an organic unity through the benevolent hand of a totalized state: BOTH

put your tripcode back on, butterfly fag

You have no idea what most of the words you're using mean do you

Fascism is an attempt to implement alternative to capitalism based on national sovereignty, traditional family, private property, meritocracy.
While Marxism stands for something exactly opposite - worldwide unity of people without borders, socialization of women and breakup of nuclear family, abolition of currency and property, opportunity of everyone regardless of merit, skill and education.

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Fascism is wrong, and I will punch anyone who isn't vocally anti-fascist.

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fascism is when you do violence and the violenter you are the fascister it is

Contrary to popular belief, fascism isn't "nationalistic socialdemocracy". Nazi Germany had universal healthcare before the nazis, and while supposedly they had like a 70% income tax, I doubt that money was used for welfare programs.

Well, they declare it to be so.

Marxism-Leninism is the only form of Communism that has worked so it's all that matters. Contrary to what people think it is not the Workers having the MoP but the Vanguard Party having the MoP. There hasn't been a single nation that has followed what Marx actually said.

Something that only exist because of capitalism
Why do you mongrels always cheer for this and not something that was more organic like the extended family or village/clan.

Arguments or fuck off with your apologia or Fascism.

You do realize that you are parroting Cold War propaganda that is not based on actual facts?

Faggots declare traps to be 'totally not gay', it does not make it so.

Why are fashies so obsessed with nuclear family? Like if you are a traditionalist, shouldn't you think that nuclear family is degenerate compared to extended family? Do they just not know what words mean and think nuclear family is just any family with a man and woman in it?

Your side had been claiming this for over a century, but had never provided it.

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Yeah so why should a Marxist defend these nations?

I'm not a fascist though.

because they're all burgers or yankeefied teens who live on the internet.

Officially fascism is corporatism. Corporations and government working for nation. According to leftism, fascism is when government blames other countries and people for the problems caused by corporations.

de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottfried_Feder

One of the main Nazi ideologues literally distinguishes between "parasitic" and "creative" capital. I do not agree with it. But it is one of the main tenets of fascism.

Faggot.

Please, go and stay go.

You are the faggot here. And retard.

I am not "believing" anything. The question of OP was what fascism is. I tried to give some insight. Gottfried Feder literally made Hitler join the DAP (later to be known as NSDAP). Clearly that worldview was influencing him a lot, and unless you are claiming that Nazis weren't "real" fascists, you'd have to agree with me here.

Then its come to war once again. So be it. From the ashes we will rise time and time again. Fighting as one body, one mind, one soul we shall smite you from our sky's. Never again will we live on our knees. Never again will we endure your oppression. Only then will you understand FASCISM IS THE FASCIST!!!

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You are literally quoting Nazis as authority on the question.

Prove it.

Hitler was the right-wing of the NSDAP and marginalized Feder once he made his pact with the bourgeousie (1931). Interestingly, the KPD, German Communist Party, held up the NSDAP as the lesser evil as they perceived them as anti-capitalist until 1932.

I only quote fascists (the Nazis) on fascism.

You can Google translate the Wiki article, I guess. It literally made Hitler join the NSDAP and made him develop his antisemitic worldview.

Are you retarded?

okay, super retarded

lmao

ah yes, the party hitler joined as *checks notes* a police spy

Communism- State owns AND operates means of production.
Fascism- State uses regulatory barriers upon private entities, to control the ownership and operation of the means of production.

Communism and Fascism are both socialism

Communism and Fascism were both introduced to their via talmud scholars. Moses Hess wrote Rom and Jerusalem in the 1860s and trained Marx and Engels in the critical points of their philosophy. The concept of socialism is derived from the torah and talmud. It has roots in the concept of the jubilee and the weaponization of Deuteronomy and the talmud.

It's difficult to talk about fascism as an economic system, because it doesn't really have an economic theory. Fascists will usually say shit like economics being irrelevant compared to whatever spiritual voodoo they believe in, and they can advocate all sorts of contradictory things without blinking an eye.

In general though, there's an understanding that class struggle can be reconciled by ethno-nationalist unity, and the idea that the state and private industry work together to create an organic whole. Fascists redefine the word "socialism" to mean something like this, so they can unironically claim to be socialists and even use similar propaganda like supporting common welfare instead of profit.

I don't think the financial capitalism part is exactly accurate. In fact it seems to me like fascism is national productive capital defending itself against both socialism and international financial capital. Look at how Hitler kicked out "jewish bankers" and gutted foreign trade while privatizing industry and selling his country out to Krupps.

IE, whatever we say is fascism is!!!!

fucking children you are

I think in 5-10 years Nazis will call themselves liberals.

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You degenerate shit-eater, stop sucking Hitler's dick.

What you got asked is to prove:
1) Hitler was actually influenced by whatever nonsense you quoted.
2) the definition of Nazism that supposedly influenced Hitler is the understanding of Fascism Hitler used.
4) Hitler was not delusional psycho and his "understanding" of the essence of Fascism is correct.

That is how you prove that your quote applies, not by correctly translating it from German. Did your shriveled brain process it, or did give you Error #404: logic not found?

stopped reading there

This is propaganda put forth by lolberts because NOT TRUE CAPITALISM
en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Talk:Benito_Mussolini#Fascism_should_more_properly_be_called_corporatism,_since_it_is_the_merger_of_state_and_corporate_power.

What do you mean by this
Lol what?

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SEIZE THE MEANS OF REPRODUCTION

He means that in communism, women would be shared by men, something Marx even debunked in the 19th century.

Okay, but what about the socialization of traps?

Giving them equal rights (not just no-fault divorces, but also economic, ex. maternity leaves).

where do you retards keep coming from?

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Makes Sense.

That is the only acceptable type of human socialisation. Commune owned bfs now

This is what I hoped, but the rest of it made me doubt if that's what he meant and it wasn't just a "community of woman" argument.

now we're fuckin cookin

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Tell me how the Communists didn't anesthetize politics with their Soviet Realism.

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This is a misquote, the actual quote is:
"We know that an unskilled labourer or a cook cannot immediately get on with the job of state administration."
t. Lenin

Socialist realism is political art. The soviets did not base their politics on aesthetics. Fascism and general reactionaries take inspiration from artwork of the past. They see their political goals as replicating the beauty of old paintings and sculptures, and put actual theory behind. This is why online reactionaries usually have greco-roman style busts as profile pics.

nice misquote dumbass
"We are not utopians. We know that an unskilled labourer or a cook cannot immediately get on with the job of state administration. In this we agree with the Cadets, with Breshkovskaya, and with Tsereteli. We differ, however, from these citizens in that we demand an immediate break with the prejudiced view that only the rich, or officials chosen from rich families, are capable of administering the state, of performing the ordinary, everyday work of administration. We demand that training in the work of state administration be conducted by class-conscious workers and soldiers and that this training be begun at once, i.e., that a beginning be made at once in training all the working people, all the poor, for this work. "
marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/oct/01.htm

MLs and Fascists are both just social democrats who hate abstract art

stop

Here is another quote:

Regarding the Lenin quote - yep, it's a misquote. But the point stands, the goal is to remove barriers and let everyone to govern, not only the privileged ones.

The Bolsheviks were Social Democrats, but not like the 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧Fabians🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧 that nowadays are called Social Democrats.

yeah
through merit and being taught how
it's not just throwing unqualified people in, it's giving everyone the tools to be qualified if they so desire

why do you people talk like everything is a fucking fantasy novel?

Because they think they live in fantasy novel. Or computer game (given recent NPC meme).

Imagine religious fundamentalism, only not traditional, but with modern characteristics (MMORPG and the like). That's what you are seeing.

When communism is finally achieved qualification would seize to have it's importance. People would become truly equal and all kinds of privileges including privilege by qualification would be erased.

Is this what Zig Forumsyps actually believe?

oh my fucking god you retards never read communists at alllllll
"By political equality Social-Democrats mean equal rights, and by economic equality, as we have already said, they mean the abolition of classes. As for establishing human equality in the sense of equality of strength and abilities (physical and mental), socialists do not even think of such things. "
marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1914/mar/11.htm

It doesn't necessarily have to be social democratic economically
Mussolini and Pinochet did plenty of free market shit for their elitist buddies, von Mises literally got his start as an economic advisor to the nationalists in charge of Austria before Hitler took over and the majority of lolberts and ancaps end up becoming fascists with hayekian characteristics.

Ba'athism is just Arab social democracy. People who pretend it's fascist or socialist are braindead.

So social democracy, but less gay? Excellent.

He was an Authoritarian-Libertarian.

Dumb post. Fascism rejects democracy, is fiercly nationalistic, believes in class-collaborationism, hierarchal with things like the leadership principle, etc. They couldn’t be farther apart

Without that classes would start to form again. We need true equality.

Go eat some glass.

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Same as ML's?

Billionaires in Chinese Communist Party isn't?

Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Kim?

Galaxy brain

nigga do you think classes are formed from merit? lmao

In society with any kind of distinction between "our" and "their" and measurement of people as "bad" and "good" formation of class hierarchy is inevitable. "Betters" would inevitably seize control over "inferiors".
Therefore we need to deconstruct the very foundation of meritocracy so that certain people won't be able to justify their oppression of others by the right of merit.

holy fuck this is nuclear

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I tend to disagree with standard Marxist line a little bit and think fascism is a kind of "organic" and palingenetic form of ultranationalism.

Key features include:

+ Ultranationalism

+ Class collaborationism (workers and capital united against threats both foreign and domestic)

+ Palingenesis and national rebirth. Fascists believe modernity is decadent and has destroyed traditional societies, thus the fascist "revolution" will pave the way for a New Order that contains the essence of a lost, mythical past. This is why fascists hearken back to ancient times in their imagery but combined with a futuristic style. It's both radically "progressive" (in a sense of moving forward: they want to create a new kind of society) while also radically reactionary.

+ The state is an organism and to regenerate the nation requires purging it of "decadence" and foreigners, Jews, etc. – in the fascist mind these elements are like parasites. Relatedly, fascists tend to prize healthy eating, organic foods, clean living, etc.

Would really recommend Roger Griffin's books on the subject.

Yeah I agree with this.

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No, exactly unlike ML.

China has not been ML for decades

None of them had absolute power on par with Mussolini or Hitler, nor was Fuhrerprinzip enshrined constitutionally like in Nazi Germany. Even Stalin was repeatedly defied by the Party

You literally did the October Revolution because you were mad that you didn't win enough votes.

*snap*

Kek