Lefty liberals are weak and unaesthetic

Well what happened to the masculinity in the movement? The strength of male figures leading the working class? The physical power of a factory worker carrying his family onwards?

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good thing we are not liberals

I agree, there's nothing wrong with looking like you can actually hold a fucking wrench without collapsing. All this shit on social media about "not everyone can work out, what about the disabled, etc" is designed to encourage the idea that health is unimportant. What I'm saying is that those who CAN do those things, SHOULD do those things. I'm not holding anything against the legit disabled and such, of course they have their own roles to play on how to help.

I was purposefully attempting to sound edgy but in all seriousness fitness,aesthetic, high standards and high work morale are desirable. This doesn´t mean we should not be emphatetic to those struggling with weight issues or who are generally incapable of fulfilling these standards.
I just think we´re ought to uphold them and with the true equality of socialism, anyone has the true equal playing field for trying their best.

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Can you tell me which period in time you're refering to that we've moved past in the labour movement?
When was there some extraordinary focus on masculinity and (male) factory workers carrying their families forwards?
You post a picture of Lenin, but I don't remember him giving any special to the philosophy of masculinity.

I picked Lenin because he is a masculine, symbolic and religious(lol) face of scientific socialism. Something we dont have today.


While not in theory, this was de facto the realiy under socialism.

Blatantly untrue. Any communist leader considdered it crucial to include women into the proletariat, particularly the industrial proletariat.

”Large-scale machine industry, which concentrates masses of workers who often come from various parts of the country, absolutely refuses to tolerate survivals of patriarchalism and personal dependence, and is marked by a truly ’contemptuous attitude to the past’.

“It is this break with obsolete tradition that is one of the substantial conditions which have created the possibility and evoked the necessity of regulating production and of public control over it. In particular, speaking of the transformation brought about by the factory in the conditions of life of the population, it must be stated that the drawing of women and juveniles into production is, at bottom, progressive. It is indisputable that the capitalist factory places these categories of the working population in particularly hard conditions, and that for them it is particularly necessary to regulate and shorten the working day, to guarantee hygienic conditions of labour, etc.; but endeavours completely to ban the work of women and juveniles in industry, or to maintain the patriarchal manner of life that ruled out such work, would be reactionary and utopian.

“By destroying the patriarchal isolation of these categories of the population who formerly never emerged from the narrow circle of domestic, family relationships, by drawing them into direct participation in social production, large-scale machine industry stimulates their development and increases their independence, in other words, creates conditions of life that are incomparably superior to the patriarchal immobility of pre-capitalist relations." (The Development of Capitalism in Russia - V.I. Lenin)

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I swear this board is leaning more and more to unironical fascism with the day

What about the power of a prole rejecting the proliferation of prostitution that is capitalist marriage?

For real. This board must be close to 50% ex polyps that refuse to solve their daddy issues.

The CIA really did a hell of a job didn't they?

There's your answer, OP. Lefties today think that a man being able to actually do shit for himself and support a family is Problematic Gender Norms, Nazism™ and Should Be Eradicated, and won't stop until every man is either a whimpering pansy or a tranny. The left will continue to fail simply because it sees strength and the ability to actually do anything as a problem.

No we don't see it as a problem, we just don't see "strenght and the ability to actually do anything" as exclusive to men.

Please, go and stay go.

Marriage and the nuclear family is nothing more than a relic of preindustrial society. Beyond reinforcing the ideals of inheritance to reproduce a capitalist society, it serves no purpose and will die without inheritance thusly.

Pretty sure the nuclear family was invented in the early 20th century to sell more houses.
Extended family has been around for ages.

No reason why women can’t also project an image of strength, bravado, or even masculinity.

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Most people in general in the western world aren’t like that anymore (e.g. fat, weak). To some degree you’re falling for idealized conceptions and are spooked on the concept of “masculinity”

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broke: lantern jaw
woke: lightbulb jaw

If this passes for fascism then we're unironically reddit, not fash.

you know nothing.

Im not for exluding women btw, never really tried to say that. Liberation of women is good to an extent but we must give credit for great masculine figures and inspire men of subsequent generaions.

Well not really. I oppose fascist ideology and im not even a ☭TANKIE☭, rather I am actually quite libertarian leaning as a socialist.

but ofc liberals like you dont know what fascism is, you just use it a slur for those men looking for identity and role models.

Seems to me you are, but I'd like you to elaborate then.
When does liberation of women become too much for you?
And what about women of subsequent generations? Do you also not think any women can be inspirational for a man?

the socialist role models of old just aren't realistic anymore. machinery has gotten so easy for both men and women alike to use. back then most women couldn't even drive cars because the levers and wheels required several dozen pounds of force.
I see nothing wrong with role models in general but the workers today are much different from what Marx predicted, and what was represented in 1927's "Metropolis".
what's inherently fascist about this statement is "his family", as if the worker is implied ownership over his own family, which is decadently akin prostitution. a women whoring herself out of material interest to satisfy the immortality of the man's last name is simply capitalistic (and feudal) in nature.

Given this, let me propose in alternative: Instead of advertising workers as le strong hammer-wielding metal-men trying to assure his legacy through his family, we should try to represent ourselves as members of a community. One's immortality should be introduced by celebrating the feats of his own engineering which have brought a positive impact to the whole of society's self-reproduction.

yeah, fuck those men who want to have wife and kids! fascist!!! you dont own your wife!! she can do what she wanttss to youuu

maybe im just projecting though. You´re correct about the times changing but is that a reason for leftists being physically weak and completely out of any desire of masculinity?
Ofc masculinity is a concept constantly in flux but what do we have when we denote it completely and eradicate any sufficient and healthy identity?

Can women be inspirational? Yes but a masculine inspiration is of specific interest for men. Is that something we can or should do away with?

I can´t answer that tbh. Perhaps when men dont matter to them.


Well I mean I wouldn´t go and deny the existence of problematic norms. I just think this type of liberalism that preaches men that women are the shit and men dont deserve love and their desires are shit….it kinda drives me mad.
are you even a leftist btw? just wondering if im the only one who hasnt entirely bought into the dogma of liberalism. as much I acknowledge the dangers of traditional masculinity, theres good characteristics and weak leftists seem to have given up to striving towards and looking up to any masculine figures these days.

Oof.
Firstly, I agree that a level of strength is needed to be put back in the left, and if it was tried, you could bet the idpol liberals would try to rant and rave about it being ‘toxic masculinity’.
But here’s the thing, doing the reverse, and claiming to ‘assert your manhood’ and encourage masculine figures and aestheticize the masculine in a gendered way? That’s literally an identity politics of its own.
The Marxist answer is to build a new universalist form of masculinity, that isn’t such.
That is taking the useful and good values it does hold, and divorcing then from gendered constraints. Encouraging men and women to be strong, courageous, intelligent and intellectually engaged, etc.