The Transgender Question

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Who cares what Stalin would have wanted? And no one "does this" to kids. Some people know they're trans in adolescence and should be allowed to take blockers and mones if they want to lessen dysphoria later in life. Gatekeeping is just one way the medical-industrial complex gets used as a tool of cisheteropatriarchal social control, and a necessary part of revolution will be taking the means of producing mones (as well as abortion and the pill) out of the hands of rich white dudes. Complaining about gender and sexual variance being acknowleged and validated more in the mainstream these days is plain homophobia; we'll always exist, and that prevalence has been good in terms of helping us understand ourselves and navigate a hostile world.

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Personally I'm against people indoctrinating children but
If Stalin told you to kill yourself, would you do it?

QUEER HOMELAND WHEN

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If there's going to be a Gay Kingdom I only want to live there if I get to be the queen

In the Gay Kingdom we'll ALL be queens.

That's what they say at first, but then the truth comes out that some queens are more equal than others

Gay? fine. Lesbian? alright. Queer? not my problem.
just don't do this mentally deranged shit in front of developing children.

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Combined with the "post-left" image, I can't tell whether your post is meant to be real or satire.

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I hope this is fucking bait. Either way, anyone who thinks children, especially younger children who have not even reached adolescence, are mature or mentally developed enough to make decisions relating to their "gender" are retarded and should be sentenced to either labour based rehabilitation or dealt with permanently.

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If a kid wants to delay/alter puberty and go on hormones that's fine imo, just no surgery until 18 shits not as reversible

I 100% support LGBT+, but they need to cool it with public acts of sexuality
Like I won't die defending your right to fist eachother in public and crawl around in BDSM outfits in public (although I'd like to think the pride videos I've seen are cheap picked to make hats look bad)
And don't dress up like a fucking demon and read to children, holy shit what is the person in op thinking. Stop giving endless fuel to the right

The terminology reveals everything. In order to transition away from one gender into another, you have to ascribe an essential quality to gender itself, laying claim to some vague feminine ideal or vice-versa I don't think it's intentionally reactionary, but it's at odds with material reality and serves to undercut legitimate protections that women have fought for.

It goes without saying that transgender-indentified people deserve our compassion and support though. It's clear that they're trying to assert their sexuality through a narrow framework dictated by a society that still punishes gender nonconformity. Most manifestations of gender dysphoria stem from an internalized homophobia or misogyny. If we can address those issues and foster healthier understandings of manhood and womanhood, the behavior will largely correct itself, and only the most deliberate fetishists will hang on to it.

Billionaire CEO's of pharmaceutical companies have literally spent hundreds of millions on trans activism groups

Socialism and being a socialist requires discipline, so acting like that regardless of orientation would not only be extremely looked down upon, but most likely prohibited. Public decency in regards to everyone doesn't just disappear because same-sex intercourse not longer punishable, in fact workers control and socialization of the MoP probably means that proper decency will be even more critical just to get through and live in society .

Also this tbh

Children are part of the dialectics, brainlet.

Nonsense. It's a Pride parade. Straight people do the same thing at Mardi Gras and on Spring Break weekend and no one bats an eye, but when gay people do it people lose their minds. It's a rigged game and I'm not playing it.
I don't think that has ever been a successful strategy for the LGBT movement. Ever. The enemy isn't even the "right," in my view. I'm gay and grew up in Texas so I've encountered a lot of homophobes, and I decided pretty early on (after reading gay writers and coming to grips with myself) that the main enemy was not the Religious Right but the closet – which serves as a mental prison which constrains behavior and allows the right to shape public perceptions of gay people. Shatter that, then it doesn't matter what people think of the go-go-boy dancing in his undies at the parade (which is not my thing, but more power to him) because the right will have lost control of our own thoughts – which is a far more effective method of control than anything else they have in their arsenal. The guy dancing in the Pride parade like that doesn't care what anyone thinks of him.

Stuff like "same-sex marriage" (which you might think are being held back because of these displays) are not the main focus; they are second-order consequences of gay people coming out in mass numbers because their minds are no longer controlled. I'd like it to the Black Power movement which was about changing black people's own perceptions of themselves, as opposed to the mental prison of arbitrary double-standards that white society had created for them.

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Gender Dysphobia is a misdiagnosis of homosexuality that originates from the DSM-III during the Reagan era, back when America stlil refused to acknowledge that homosexuality was a choice.
Speaking of children, Reagan was also responsible for lifting puritan regulations on advertising kids toys and many other commodities that resulted in the Spectacle we call a country today.
Reagan really did more damage to this country than Trump or the 10-year-long Clinton oligarchy ever could have.

*dysphoria
*wasn't a choice

Depends how old.
If the science is behind transitioning in early puberty, I don't care. Earlier is dodgy, and any actual transition needs a diagnosis.

Children knowing that trannies exist is a non-issue. Same for gays. Like, ok, I turned out badly but there's a ton of other shit that happened to me as a kid.

Oh, also - there's a problem with capitalism and spectacle and sheeit. I'm not saying rich fucks just want to turn the kids gay, but it's always a preferable issue to class and pushing it as more controversial and big and new than it actually is also sells papers and stuff. Picture it as some Jungian bullshit: rainbow capitalism is a myth with business and finance as the heroes of the common man and pissy conservatives as the arch villains seeking to hold them back.

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you're implying my ethics are objectivist, which they're not. go read some child development psychology.

yawn. wake me up when you can reproduce your experimental results.

As a bisexual, you have no idea how often I get to scoff at this exact fucking sentence. Because recular hedonism isn't shoved down our throats, right? Because your shitty kid can't turn on a radio and hear "stroke me stroke me、" You know how much fucking sex there is on tv and in our media that's either hetero or asexual (where there's no sexual act in the image but it's still a model in top shape from an angle that everyone who's interested will look at)? Fuck you.

peek whataboutism

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Like this stuff. Not even strictly following the OP, but caught my attention.

I marched degenerate-esque in a parade once and pic related is why. I'm not even saying I'm against that stuff - frankly, I think public celebrations of sexuality are great. Wild parties are great. And in reality, there are loads of different people at these gay events and a lot of them are wearing suits or casual dress or whatever. But weird and wild stuff makes for better pictures, better publicity - I'm not saying none of that's organic or everybody who goes to pride half-dressed is on a forced march to promote their employer's business… but it's part of the equation, and knowing that makes me wonder about how much of it isn't down to profits and advertising. I think that these things amplify certain aspects of LGBT culture.

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that's still whataboutism

So are we actually going to have a discussion about gender, or was this thread meant to be a vehicle for "gay people are fine but I hate faggots"-style homophobia from the first post?

Gender should be abolished now that it's causing big-ass fires and shit.

The actual dialectical approach to LGBT is to come out in mass numbers, because quantitative changes become qualitative changes over time.

Homophobic ☭TANKIE☭s can be mad that we're applying the Marxist science of dialectical materialism better than you, but it will make no difference in the end. The avalanche has already started. It is too late for the pebbles to vote.

The main enemy has always been the closet: the number one enemy. There are aspects of gay culture that may be personally disagreeable and so on, but that doesn't really matter, as to me the biggest problems in my experience are drugs (particularly meth) and excessive alcohol consumption. But I would blame the closet more than anything for those problems. I don't think that the guy in his undies necessarily = drug user in my experience. He might have a perfectly normal bourgeois job or whatever you like.

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Discrete genders are a lie. Nuff said.

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marxists.org/archive/zetkin/1920/lenin/zetkin1.htm
All of this decadent and indulgent capitalist culture dies in socialism, period.

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Honestly, we already had a better discussion about it a month ago.
Archive link: 8ch.net/leftypol/res/2687809.html

Do gays hate trannies? Gays from others board of this chan say yes, but what about this board and where you come from?

cockshott has got articles on this

gay metal drag queen communist dinosaur church when?

Well if you say so…!

But you know you're selectively quoting Lenin on the "Women's Question," since most of the article was him writing in very sympathetic terms to sexual experimentation at the time, and the corruption of the old ways, based as they were on "freedom for the man [and] its enslavement for the woman, the repulsive hypocrisy of sexual morality and relations [which] fill the most active minded and best people with deep disgust." I see a lot of repulsive hypocrisy in the treatment of LGBT people by many purported "socialists."

Am gay. Where from: Texas, like I said. Do I hate trans? Nope.

That's the spirit!

Generally no.
Why, even?

That whole thing was a product of really massive misrepresentation of everything around the time Jenner did whatever the fuck he was doing. Transsexuality was not new - nor drag queens, none of that. We knew about it as kids, and even then most people gave few fucks because there's a romantic aspect to transgender stuff that gay stuff lacks. And then it was all these eyes on Jenner and Milo, who, respectively, were throwing gays and trannies under the fucking bus and both presented as representatives of their groups when they really weren't. There was this period of manufactured bullshit antagonism, around retarded stuff like who owned "tranny" and whether "twink" was a slur.

Don't care. It's irrelevant

Also, for what it's worth, when I've encountered ML groups in the flesh, they have been disproportionately trans people, at least where I live – and they really understand Lenin from front to back. A lot of trans people I've met have been pretty radical. And I think generally communist movements have tended to be pretty androgynous in appearance as opposed to the extreme sexual dimorphism of the right.

Just compare the Soviet Komsomol to the League of German Girls, or as I like to call them: the Blitzmadels squeezed into uniforms showing off their bazookas. *whipcrack sound*

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I don't give one flying fuck. Why do I need to feel one way the other about any of this?

You are right Lenin had no sympathy for bourgeoisie culture and morality, as he said "“The constraint of bourgeois marriage and the family laws of bourgeois states accentuate these evils and conflicts. It is the force of ‘holy property’. It sanctifies venality, degradation, filth", but in no way he support the actions of the newly emerging youth who treated the abolition of marriage and bourgeoisie laws as an excuse to engage in debauchery and promiscuity, and he viewed such things a as wholly un-Marxist. He was "sympathetic" because he understood where they were coming from, but that doesn't mean they should do such things or that such things were conducive or beneficial to a socialist society. Read the whole thing again.

what's his general opinion?

It really seems like he's trying to make a practical case, like promiscuity being akin to drinking too much alcohol. I dunno. Stalin had a lot of late nights drinking Georgian wine when he was running the show. And Lenin is talking about fitness and exercise and "healthy bodies" – he could take a cue from the men in these Pride parades! They go to the gym all the time.

But I think Lenin is really making too much of a mountain out of a molehill, and his thoughts are veering around, though I agree that one shouldn't be having sex with different partners every night, or drinking to excess. Maybe this is my incipient anarchism but there's a kind of no-fun militarized socialism in some quarters that thinks we should all be taking emotion-deadening pills like in that Christian Bale movie. As cool as the martial arts in it were, I think it's demanding too much from people to enforce those measures throughout the whole of a society.

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Honestly public displays of sexuality, gay or straight, are absolutely vile and shouldn't be permitted or idolized. I'm probably kind of jaded but the way everything in this world is about sex is honestly genuinely depressing to me

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He's TERF gang
paulcockshott.wordpress.com/2017/03/31/critique-of-the-social-construction-of-sex/
paulcockshott.wordpress.com/2017/12/12/genders-or-sex-stereotypes-part-1/

I can say that is a consistent position and I don't have a problem with it

good, why don't they spend more lobbying to ban conversion therapy and force insurance companies to pay for srs. all hail S O R O S

You seem to be missing the point. Stalin drinking was still very unhealthy and the government mad many pressing attempts to establish multiple programs to curb alcoholism in the USSR. There is no problem with exercise and fitness, but there is a problem with people people streaking around half naked in parades.
Not emotional deadening, but definitely more of an adherence to discipline and decency.

This

*made

Bring back sex negativity
Kill yourself.

I agree. It, of course, should extend to hetero sexual depictions and public displays as well..

yep. they way I see it, sex briefly escaped puritanism only to jump straight into becoming repulsive consumerist spectacle.

I think this is what most of us are saying.

I would add though that the attempt in the 80s to do this was deeply unpopular and contributed to the state's revenue crisis.

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youtube.com/watch?v=mLkujLC_Wzk
LMAO

Alcoholism was rampant and large problem in many households, so you can't really blame them for doing so. Also, by the 80s the revenue problems the USSR was going through were already malignant, the programs would have made little difference. Tbh, the USSR should not have relied on Vodka and other spirits as much as they did for trade and consumer consumption and the only reason they did was because it was cheap to make.

I agree with your points but that picture is really gross and bad.

how much longer until you fucks start to "critically support" nambla

you guys make being a nazi so easy you do all of the heavy lifting or us

Imagine being in the 1950s and thinking PDAs should be a crime

Trot sects beat everyone to it in the 70s
lmao as if Zig Forums isn't filled with pedos

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While I'm at it some Nazi came here to post about James Mason, not mentioning the guy was convicted for child sexual exploitation – the same thing which blew up the National Alliance which was the largest American neo-Nazi group probably ever RIP

Anytime I look at some far-right stuff I see a bunch of loli avs and so on. It is what it is

And while I'm at it, these drag-queen storytime sessions are only sexual if you see drag queens as a sex thing, but I don't see it that way.

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Almost forgot this one

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Wtf does the second post have to do with Ernst rohm?

yeahhhhh you're really stretching it there, and nobody actually gives a fuck about reinstituting child bride practices (except for those muslim new arrivals your camp loves to sacralize so much) but yeah keep on digging your own grave with your disgusting bullshit, none of you trannies reach middle age anyway you are all gonna kill yourselves within a decade thank wotan

No one here is saying that 11 year olds should be forced to have gender reassignment or some shit but if someone wants to they should do it under their own volition

And yes they aren't in the same ballpark
The first isn't even happening ("telling" preteens to take hormone blockers) and ones literal pedophilia (Marrying an 11 year old)

Unsuprising. Also, read the fucking thread, majority of the anons here stated clearly they are against giving kids hormone blockers you dishonest faggot.

Just a joke on gay Nazis having sex with younger boys, the screenshot was taken from /cuteboys/.

Gross for what reason? I'm a trans post-leftist and find it funny. Actually Muslim too

This had better be a falseflag or bait.

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I swear the more you fuckers shitpost the more I'm driven to unironic nazbolism. At this point, I hope to heaven Labour in the UK wins the next election and Comrade Corbyn just starts purging just like the nazbol memes.

this board his so homogeneous that everyone thinks my existence is bait lol
I actually used to post on here and earlier 4/pol/ a lot but tolerating the chans becomes a lot harder if you read theory and are actually oppressed irl

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I'm a convert, for context. But still, people here don't know shit about Islam, or transphobia for that matter

Are you a Shia? I know those guys are ok with it because Iran has som many sex change operations. You're still as spooked as any other religious person though.

if you REALLY didn't give a fuck about sexuality, you wouldn't care that "teh gays" are "forcing" other people to normalize their gayness.

I hate indoctrination with a burning passion, but kids should be aware that gender dysphoria is still a problem in America.

Or bypass the dysphoria talk completely and teach kids modern understanding of sex and gender so that they can recognize what dysphoria actually is.

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