Jason vs Spencer

I agree. Jason seemed to ignore like half the inaccuracies Spencer or Strike said. But for debating against 3 other assholes I don't think he did that bad.

Spencer / Striker and so on are content generators and 90 percent of their audience are Nazis like themselves. You're not going to convince anybody by debating with them, you'll just give them free content while they have a drunken boot party on your ass. It's not like these guys won't throw you in a concentration camp at the first available opportunity. What's the point? Oh, it's because Jason is also just a content generator.

marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-2/mswv2_03.htm

This.

I'm 37 minutes into this thing, and Jason has thus far crashed and burned hard. He doesn't call out Spencer or Striker on their garbage like "capitalists supported Stalin" or "Hitler supported the Palestinians" or all the crap about the Haitian Revolution being a "black supremacist genocide" or whatever the fuck fascists like to claim. Spencer rightfully calls Jason out on how he's only able to debate through rhetoric, which is EXACTLY what I said in the previous thread (Jason never uses facts, he thinks he doesn't need to, all he needs to do is back his opponents into a corner; this time it doesn't work, because Dickie - unlike Roo - can actually read and present a decent argument).

This is going to be painful to listen to. I want to rage.

"What's the point?"
the point is to provide people with an alternative point of view and actually win people over to the idea of socialism as opposed to neoliberalism or fringe nationalism.

A long-established Marxist-Leninist party, the Workers’ Party of Belgium (PTB) has made a particularly notable breakthrough in recent years, hitting 12 percent of the vote in October’s local elections in the capital.

We were active in the universities and the youth movement to mobilize against the fascists. But the big lesson we took from the 1980s and 1990s was that, as well as mobilizing against such groups, we also have to talk to the voters for far-right parties, who are expressing their own anger and disillusionment. We have to work to offer an alternative: for while we do have to combat fascism, we cannot define ourselves only in negative terms.
jakkkobinmag.com/2018/12/belgium-workers-party-ptb-elections-left?fbclid=IwAR1DKUADOODY9N4KDDjLSuHho3ofBy8ybK8IrqVer0AMOX1sAcRhDnLChAQ

One problem with this is that Jason doesn't think actual politics is worthwhile in Klanada because of his bizarre reading of MTWism. Communism is not an alternative according to his own warped ideology and there is no first-world proletariat. The Workers' Party of Belgium according to him would be social-democratic revisionists or something.

"Useful idiot" is how I would describe him.

Press F to pay respects to Roo's career

His fans on youtube are saying he won. He won't go anywhere or even make a change.

I've always thought that his fans were a bunch of semi-ironic followers tbh. Maybe I was overestimating them.

...

He's lost all credibility, at least any remaining credibility he would have had. Spencer and Striker are clearly smarter than him despite being pieces of fascist human garbage, only because Spencer is literate whereas Roo isn't.

Fucking retarded.

I watched part of it. I know Jason is an idiot, but this was offensively bad, above all because he spends a decent amount of time basically trying to make friends with Richard Spencer and that other white supremacist.
It's only natural to make a personal connection with the people you come into contact with. But, as a self-respecting adult, you should avoid that tendency when interacting with one of the nastiest reactionary white supremacists in the world. Further, in a separate video Jason bitched about the criticisms he was getting from people on the left, and then literally complemented alt right white nationalists for being "mature," which is ironic coming from a piece of shit like him, who whines about anyone on the left that doesn't agree with him.
Jason is a stupid LARPing loser with authoritarian fantasies, who knows very, very little about political theory, statecraft, warfare, or economics. As a result, he's just really fucking embarrassing.

I'm at the 1:38:00 mark right now. Holy shit my brain feels like it's melting.

Spencer and Striker are proving they are not only cultured and well-read but eloquent, whereas all Roo can do is parrot the same arguments he's made ad nauseam in his videos. Spencer was even asked about his fiction book preferences; I doubt Roo has read anything on the past five years aside from snippets of articles on Marxist econ.

Can both of them retire from public life?

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but capitalists did support stalin, Hitler did support Palestinians, and the Haitian revolution was a ra.ce war. this is all objectively true.

do you people really just label all inconvenient truths "bad" and hope they just go away

Because those actions occurred outside of Marxist theory and can't really be explained away.

1:50:00 - did Jason just come out as anti-immigration?

...

Civilization: The Great Error or Literacy is Slavery or Marxists are the Real Reactionaries
newyorker.com/magazine/2017/09/18/the-case-against-civilization
archive.is/RRn2X

1:52:00ish, Dick mocks Jason's moralism.

TBH the one thing I'm actually digging about Dickie is his use of Hegelian language and thought. I fucking swear he HAS To be a Hegeltard like Anal Water.

Aaaaaand they "outed" Jason as a real liberal. Swell.

Jason committed theory suicide. He's done.

Liberalism is just half-baked communism.

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serves them right, they trusted an eceleb

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Spencer BTFO the entire modern left supports immigration

if you want revolutions to happen in the third world you would cut the border but you don't, you want the borders to remain open therefore you are all capitalist shills to the last man

imagine if Russian peasants were able to just migrate in 1917 or Chinese workers were able to just migrate in 1949

if you support immigration of any kind you're capitalist shill par excellance actively harming prospects of revolution

1000 years gulag

The only one that could be kind of be argued as true is the Haitian revolution having a racial component to it, which would still be a reduction of the whole thing. Stalin had very little to no capitalist support and had to contend with nearly every Western capitalist country refusing to recognize the USSR and engage in gold based trade with it, and Hitler literally colluded with Zionists to establish a Jewish etnostate in Palestine. Hitler also had massive capitalist support in Germany and massive international capitalist support pre-WW2, even working with Jewish bankers like the Warburgs and given some of those related to then prominent committee positions.

Except that 99% of the pro-immigration liberals you're conflating us with aren't really interested in revolution in the first place

We'll get bogged down in a bunch of mutual threats and accusations here, but in terms of capitalists supporting Stalin, you could easily throw back the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, where the Nazis – who Spencer apparently claims are the most anti-capitalist – supported Stalin!

But you see how this is just a bunch of gotcha games, when the reality at the time was complicated geopolitics with different powers jockeying for a competitive advantage and trying to play different states off against each other. Stalin's actual perspective at the time, if you are genuinely interested in it, was an overriding goal to divide the imperial-capitalist powers and set them against each other, which he succeeded in doing. But this opens up Stalin to attack from the left, because this required Stalin to play games with these powers and make various compromises, and also open up a space for Nazi agitprop to attack communists for not living up to their own purported anti-capitalist standards.

Basically what I'm saying is that the Unruhe vs. Spencer "debate" is like the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact except retarded.

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Literally using liberal arguments to argue liberalism is communism.

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Have you ever talked to Liberals? They like Communism, but they find its details confusing and scary. Liberals are just people who are too dumb to be Communists. That's why so many became fellow travelers or anti-anti-communists.

no matter how much you make pretend you're not you're all just liberals who never quite moved beyond their sjw worldview

First as a tragedy then as a farce, errytime

Bad news for you comrade. White boons to society will also face the wall

Lmao, the anti-baboonposter wordfilter got me

Yes, this absolutely proves the Haavara agreement never happened.

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Anglos didn’t support Stalin until Hitler was at war with both of them Hitler didn’t support the Palistians until he was at war with the Anglos. Both of these occur out of oppertunism and “enemy of my enemy” alliances.

I’m starting to think Jason is secretly a fash trying to make the left look bad.

It gets worse. Spencer claims that the Bolshevik Revolution was financed by Wall Street because of the NEP. Than Jason starts talking about the NEP (he dons’t counter Spencer's ludicrous claim about the Bolsheviks getting money from Wall Street which is a lie). Than Spencer says that the NEP was unnecessary and the Five year Plans were better and the NEP was just free cash for capital. Spencer literally out-lefts Jason.

Please, don't respond to Zig Forums bait, Let this thread going on roasting Jason.

Someone being against fascists doesn't make them pro-communist, and liberals have always been the most virulent anti-communists. Before it comes up, reminder that every American political party is liberal and they are all and have always been anti-communist.

I'm afraid poor Jason has taken the nazbol meme quite to seriously. He never was a very smart boy.

When I first saw Jason's videos waaaaay back, like 2010ish, I thought he was a right-winger LARPing as a communist troll.

That part pissed me off, the 3rd white supremacist was outright lying and Jason didn't even say shit about it.

show us where karltural marx touched you

As I pointed out in the last thread. Jason even made a video debunking this point in 2015.

It always gives me hope to see how stupid and confused these polfags are. Purging them will be easy.

Nazi, Nazi maaannnn!!!
I've got to be, a Nazi man!!!
Nazi, Nazi maaannnn!!!
I've got to be, a Nazi man!!!

What up goys?
All the lads getting kiked up this weekend?
Gonna have few beers, smoke bit of baby foreskin? do a line of kike or two?
Maybe get stuck into a tranny?
Sup like?

What do you call this?

even unruhe the Internet's most famous third worldist who believes revolution can only take root in the third world supports immigration because anything else is "unconscionable"

y'all just confused, it's gonna be a yikes from me. do you understand immigration functions as a pressure release valve for the bourgeoisie of the third world and as a way to degrade conditions in the first world and drive down wages? ya'll just capitalist neoliberal shills and nothing else

yikeasroo who hurt you sweaties

So why didn't he speak?

Jason said he's anti-immigration on principle.

Dunno 🤷🏻‍♂️

Maybe he’s so much of a brainlet he can’t even remember a video he made three years ago.

I beg pardon sir, but you sound like my childless aunty who is most probably autistic with the benefits of a early diagnosis.
How do you expect such a vague question to possibly be answered?

Did you watch the same debate I did? He said that it’s unconscionable to try to regulated it.

Tbh, even if FinBol would end up getting stuck ranting on one topic, it would be a lot better then letting all the shit that went through slide. Hakim might have been good too, but he might not be assertive enough. Endymion would be good too, especially given his express dislike of historical moral claims.

The first mistake you made is to even consider Zig Forumsyps white in any shape or form

He said it's impossible to regulate BUT on principle he opposes Third World immigration to the First due to brain drain.

Yeah well it’s not like I disagree when there are more Ethiopian doctors in Chicago then in Ethiopia.

Spencer rightly said that it was unconsciousable to deprive a poor country of healthcare just so rich professionals can buy BMWs and live in McMansions

Jason said Immigration is bad, but he’s against banning it because to do so would be “immoral.” He had the most week position on the topic. == Make a fuking materialist argument Jason. ==

TBH it would probably do Roo some good to finally talk to A.W. given he needs a good philosophy punching.

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I'll concede to this only if you agree that the retarded opinions of 15 year-old youtube Nazis represents everyone on the far-right

I want to believe the Roo can get better, but I just don't know.
He lost muke.
MUKE

You know those bizarre Tempel ov Blood cultists who worship Satan and are tied up with Atomwaffen, the neo-Nazi fringe group? It's a long story. But 10 years ago the same cultists created a bizarre sect called the Rural People's Party (RPP) which worshiped Kim Il-sung and Jim Jones of the Peoples Temple, and was largely comprised of white supremacists.

Of course, Jason joined them:

maoistrebelnews.com/2013/05/13/beat-back-the-lies-of-nknews-org-and-nate-thayer/

I suppose to his credit he tried to push people away from a "pro-white nationalist line" but it's amazing to read. The back story is that Jason was first a member of a group called the Songun Politics Study Group USA, which was also led by a white supremacist – a former Aryan Nations guy – although Jason claims the dude gave this up and became a communist. Anyways, members of the RPP attempted to poison the ex-AR guy and take over the Songun group, which Jason had no problems with because the guy was "mentally ill and a crypto-reactionary to boot." Jason then came up with the bright idea to join the RPP, which provoked the ex-AR guy to send him death threats.

I guess the whole thing collapsed later. Most of the RPP people converted to worshipping the Hindu death goddess Kali and then went to join Atomwaffen.

But anyways the whole time, the ex-AR guy was posting the most vile neo-Nazi shit on the Songun Politics Study Group's website for about seven years (while Jason was a member), celebrating Timothy McVeigh and forging various alliances with white-power extremists:

nate-thayer.com/white-power-and-apocalyptic-cults-pro-north-korean-americans-revealed/

He's a flaming idiot, that's why.

Again, he's like a robot who can only regurgitate a handful of talking points. Every time he faces something which requires facts and fluency to debunk he starts getting angry and attacks his opponent thinking he can back said opponent into a corner. I can't believe I'm saying this (again) but Dickie came out the clear winner in that debate.

I've encountered high school kids with better understandings of history and philosophy than Roo.

Also finally have a reason to post this again

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He couldn't comprehend it.

He can't read. He can't write (it was revealed his better theory vids were all ghostwritten). Even Muke is superior to him in these regards.

Like, talk to Jason about Hegel and see what he knows. Probably nothing aside from the ass tier shit from The German Ideology.

Talk to him about Postmodernism and he almost sounds like Peterson. Does he understand Foucault? Could he tell you how Foucault goes against Marx and Marxism? Could he tell you about Althusser and his ISA theories? What about Gramsci?

Roo isn't the guy we need. HE needs to be tossed in the trashbin of history.

Link related
msz.gov.pl/resource/e7497fea-f446-4f82-80b1-169d609d697a:JCR

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I don't think I'm ready for this kind of knowledge. This Unruhe lore is too esoteric for me.

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What the fuck did I just read

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tbh Jason's involvement with these people is more incidental to the whole thing. I got into a big hole reading about this group, because the ToB cultists caused a lot of infighting on the alt-right by worming their way into the Atomwaffen Division. So anyways I was digging into their backstory and saw: "Is… is… that Jason Unruhe?"

See this: thedailybeast.com/satanism-drama-is-tearing-apart-the-murderous-neo-nazi-group-atomwaffen

Same people Jason was involved with about ten years ago. ^^^

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Jason is far too stupid for esotericism. You have to have a creative and innovative mind for that shit which Jason clearly lacks.

There’s no way he has read even that.

Ask him this and he'll pull a generic "FOUCAULT IS IDEALIST, MARX IS MATERIALIST" terse statement without backing it up.

Dickie was correct in pointing out how often Roo begs the question, because he's too ignorant to back his bold assertions up with anything of substance.

Indeed. He joined admittedly not knowing much about it. If he had looked into it more, he would've noticed that the whole thing was a creation of a Satanist husband-and-wife couple who lived out of their "commune" in the form of a trailer in rural South Carolina. They were also trying to infiltrate black churches in their area to teach the congregations about Jim Jones in the hopes of pushing them into committing mass suicide, and they traveled to the old People's Temple complex in California on a pilgrimage.

Meanwhile they were selling cassette tapes of Jim Jones speeches on the website with titles like LET THE NIGHT ROAR.

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Aren’t ONA just people who intentionally try to destroy radical groups in order to further their spooks or some shit.

Now this is a fucking plot twist

Honestly, what the fuck is going on with this guy?

My life was objectively better before I knew he existed.

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That's the idea, yes, although their main book of doctrine and practices says that white supremacists are more vulnerable to this kind of infiltration/push-into-violence strategy, so attempts in this area will likely prove more fruitful. As for why they do this, it's all about arcane religious reasons about blowing up the world and killing everyone in which a new being will arise and conquer the galaxy. You know, normal stuff.

Useful to whom?

Based. Even batshit insane satanists know what's up. Also, Nazism is so filled with esoteric bullshit anyway that I'm not sure being infiltrated by literal satanists will make much of a difference

Yeah pretty much. You could easily flip this around as well and say that this is Nazis attempting to infiltrate the esoteric / occult / Satanist scene.

All of these bad people we're talking about.

Does Porazzo try to worm his way into every group possible? He pretends like he’s a leftist but he s consistently fat-right and hates leftists far beyond the bantz you see from sectarianism

Old fake screenshot. From what I remember of AWs "contributions" on Zig Forums is that he thought that saying that hens come out of eggs and eggs come out of hens is a logicial fallacy and makes you a hypocrite. He also thought that economic exchanges are just expressions of the wills of people or some shit like that. Completely anti-Marxist and a really dumb person.

I see. More of a Francis E. Dec fan myself but I appreciate your thunkful post.

Do you know if he's still around? The Thayer article has him dated up to 2013: "On March 16, 2013, the far right Russian Defense League named Porrazzo its 'Ambassador' to the U.S."

It wouldn't surprise me though. I think there is a statistically significant number of people who are attracted to fringe/radical/extreme groups not because of the politics so much but because they're fringe and so they will bounce around a lot. This is why you see this weird case of someone going from a extreme fascist organization to a "communist" group and back and forth, and then they convert to Islam or something but adopt the most radical takfiri/jihadi elements of it.

his bank account

While I'm thinking about this, Jason seems like that in a way, but he bounced between various radical MTW and pro-DPRK groups, as if he's positioning himself within a "radical" space but this is more of an expression of personal identity or like a suit of psychological armor. He dresses up in these outfits, cuts his hair into a mohawk and dyes it red. Part of that is also presenting himself as a theorist, as Marxist movements tend to do, but he hasn't read much about the theory behind any of this stuff. Underneath all of that there is a deeply sad person.

Yes, he was a mod on a pro-Russian FB group called “Center for Syncretic Studies” he was still shilling his National Resistance group then and also talked about “Kali Yuga” and tried to meme this campaign called “No Lives Matter”

Not a very pleasant person, he would fly off the handle at the slightest criticism. Of course I didn’t really know his history and was still kinda naive about politics. Most of the Russians in the group (split between ☭TANKIE☭ gran-dads and Putin fans—largely in favor of the later) didn’t really seem to give a shit about the bullshit he was pushing.

Don’t know what else has happened to him since I left the group. He hates Jason’s guts with a passion but he never really explained why; I didn’t care to ask.

The hilarious thing is that the DPRK had close ties with Jonestown through the Guyana embassy and Jones tried to get the people of Jonestown to North Korea

Is this the group that runs the joy of satan website? What a fucking trip.