Do modern leftist anarchists realise that Mikhail Bakunin – one of the founders of modern anarchism – was a race...

Do modern leftist anarchists realise that Mikhail Bakunin – one of the founders of modern anarchism – was a race realist? Do they realize that virtually no one prior to the 1960s, whether left or right, believed that all races had equal abilities?

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What is a 'race'?

Race is simply a specific grouping of shared ancestry, identifiable by simple haplogroup analysis. Nothing more, nothing less.

A spook

Even IF races had “different abilities” and varied slightly in intelligence, dumb stormfags will never convince me that the solution is to eternally close the borders and genocide everyone darker than #ffffff

It’s a spook

Pick one

...

A group sharing common ancestry.

Humans and boons to society share a common ancestry.

Obviously, but the shared ancestry is much more recent for a race than it is for the human species or humans and other apes.

Attacking Bakunin based on his historically determined prejudices is missing the point of his lack of dialectical theory.

Is there really no difference though?

Many 19th century leftist thinkers have said things that didn't age well because science in their times was understandably limited. Like Marx making Incas out to be some realized communist society, when with modern archeology we now know they had a fairly standard pre-feudal command economy with a stratified class/caste system.

Also Bakunin is a shit dialectician and anarkiddies can ligma balls lmao. But his personal opinions on race and anything that isn't political economy have no bearing on his theories whatsoever

On an unrelated note, what surprises me is that ideas of “race realism” comes up so infrequently in Marx(if at all). It seems like he was too autistically concerned with social relations to really consider it but then again eugenics was a fairly embryonic field around his death

Before the development of modern genetics the concept of "race" was even more vague than it is today. When Bakunin uses the word he's not making a strict distinction between genetic and environmental influences, since that distinction wasn't developed yet at that point. Therefore it's bullshit to call him a "race realist." He most probably believes racial differences in intelligence can be overcome through changes in living conditions, if so necessary.

Exactly, in Bakunin's times Slavs or the Irish would also be called different "races", hell even Britishmen and Frenchmen could be distinguished as separate races.

This paper goes into some of Marx's racial views from an unbiased perspective. Some of the stuff is really fucking bizarre.
At one point he was really into this French guy who believed racial perfection was determined by the kind of soil people live on. If the soil is new a people will turn out smart and handsome, if the soil is old they gradually turn into dumb ugly niggers.

Sorry, forgot file.

Retarded. By this definition me and my siblings are classified as a "race".

no dumbass, you and your siblings are part of a race or can be classified as being of it unless you're so inbred and isolated you are you're own separate evolutionary branch.

But that isn't part of the definition, is it? "A group sharing a common ancestry" says nothing about the size of the group, evolutionary branches, or anything else. A family group would be classified as a race, according to that definition. Ergo, it's a bad definition.

There is almost no limit to how many races you can divide the human species into.

today we have genome wide association studies that show that Bakunin was wrong and that genotypes which effect intelligence are distributed equally across all corners of the earth
;)

oh wow I guess anarchism is absolutely finished now, there's no turning back holy shit

Do right wingers realize that everyone is wrong about something, and that believing something idiotic that is unrelated to your primary body of thought that you're praised for doesn't mean everything you ever said was wrong?

low energy.

It literally would. Remember that when stormfags are whining about "haplogroup analysis" "finding" a number of "races", they literally mean feeding an algorithm with genetic information and telling it to organize that information into 5 groups. You can tell the same algorithm to organize the same information into millions of clusters and it would literally start picking out families, or even people within a family as distinct groups.

It's worse than not specifying the size of the group. The racist pseudoscientist is literally telling a program to give him 5 groups, and the algorithm starts cutting groups at the joints or uniting them arbitrarilly in order to make 5 groups. It arbitrarilly specifies the size of the group to as big as it needs to be to return the required number of groups.

perhaps you should read the man's paper before tossing around labels.

lmao

That is what makes contemporary race denialism so infuriating. We are literally living in the golden age of genetics, with ever more precise and cheaper forms of analysis available, but large swathes of our "intellectuals" simply choose to deny reality.

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Yup, *exactly* what I said. He set k in STRUCTURE and then got the corresponding number of clusters. Pro-tip, since human genetic variation is clinal there is literally no other way to produce clusters at all

No, it's not me - it's the entire contemporary bio/genetic establishment that's shaking its head. No wonder China is taking over. Lysenkoism doesn't help anybody.

He also obviously didn't believe that there should be a massive state apparatus to oppress people from other groups.
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